Islam - an insulting request.

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Hi all,

Now I am a reasonable guy who believes we are called to love even our neighbors. But I just found out that a group of Muslims have requested to build a mosque just 2 blocks from the sight of the twin towers in New York. This makes my blood boil. It was muslims who destroyed them and over 2000 innocent lives to begin with, and now they want to crown the sight with a mosque. That would be a complete victory for Islam: destroy the symbol of infidel economic power and top off the sight with an Islamic Mosque. That would be like destroying St. Peter’s in Rome, the symbol of Catholic power, and replacing it with a mosque. Oh, hey, isn’t that what was done in Jerusalem? They found the temple mount and built a mosque on top of it. Now they restrict the Jews from even visiting the only wall part left of the former Jewish temple in Jerusalem. I would think out of respect the Muslims would not place a mosque anywhere near the sight of the twin towers in New York. Yet they are quite persistant. I wonder what for?

God Bless,

Jack Catholic
 
As offensive as this situation is, I think it is more a political argument than religious. 🙂
 
Dear SteveVH,

I do think it is nieve to think that this act of putting a mosque so near the sight of the former world trade center towers and the resistance to it is political. Read the quotes from the Holy Quran below:

Remember this as you read these: the believer is one who can say with full integrity that there is no god but Allah and Muhamad is his prophet. The disbeliever is one who cannot, including Christians, Jews, and others.

Surah 8:12
[8:12] Recall that your Lord inspired the angels: “I am with you; so support those who believed. I will throw terror into the hearts of those who disbelieved. You may strike them above the necks, and you may strike even every finger.”

Surah 8:55
[8:55] The worst creatures in the sight of GOD are those who disbelieved; they cannot believe.

Surah 8:59
[8:59] Let not those who disbelieve think that they can get away with it; they can never escape.

Does this last Surah not seem peculiar to you? Is it not enough that the Muslim warriors (those who are in league with Osama bin Ladin) who attacked us in such a strategic place and tried also to get the Pentagon would then want to plant a huge Islamic cultural center, so close nearby. It seems like an overgrown victory marker, much like what you would find on a battle field placed by a nation whose soldiers had won a great victory. But believe me, this is NOT political. It is religious. Muslims want to mark their victory so as to encourage other Muslims of like mind to follow suit. The Holy Quran clearly states that non-Muslims cannot escape. It clearly permits cutting off the heads and fingers of non-believers. This is not the only place in the Holy Quran where such religious statements are made. I don’t see any peace in these statements in the Holy Quran for us non-Muslims, nor do I see any political peace for us in this country with people who embrace this book and live their lives by it. Let us turn a loving heart toward them, while retaining a strong sense of reality always simmering in our minds and hearts.

God Bless,

Jack Catholic
 
**I would like to know why did CAF delete my request to pray for that situation?

I am appauled by the entire ordeal and I am praying that they will not allow them to build anything anywhere in the country, especially at Ground Zero.**
 
My two cents: Building a place of worship two blocks away (on a narrow island for goodness sake!) is hardly “crowning the site” with a mosque. Would you also endorse a moratorium on building protestant churches near the Murrah building in Oklahoma City because McVeigh was protestant? Do you have any evidence at all that the community looking for a location to build their place of worship in any way support terrorist activity?
But love ye your enemies, and do good, and lend, hoping for nothing again; and your reward shall be great, and ye shall be the children of the Highest: for he is kind unto the unthankful and to the evil. Be ye therefore merciful, as your Father also is merciful. Judge not, and ye shall not be judged: condemn not, and ye shall not be condemned: forgive, and ye shall be forgiven: Give, and it shall be given unto you; good measure, pressed down, and shaken together, and running over, shall men give into your bosom. For with the same measure that ye mete withal it shall be measured to you again. - Luke 6:35-38
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Jack_Catholic said:
Now I am a reasonable guy who believes we are called to love even our neighbors. But I just found out that a group of Muslims have requested to build a mosque just 2 blocks from the sight of the twin towers in New York. This makes my blood boil. It was muslims who destroyed them and over 2000 innocent lives to begin with, and now they want to crown the sight with a mosque.
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Now I am a reasonable guy who believes we are called to love even our neighbors. But I just found out that a group of Christians have requested to build a church in Srebrenica. This makes my blood boil. It was Christians who destroyed over 8000 innocent lives to begin with, and now they want to crown the site with a church.

Followers of all religions have killed members of other religions. If you follow this through there are going to be very few places on the earth where any church, mosque, temple or whatever can be built.

rossum
 
MyzTek said:
My two cents: Building a place of worship two blocks away (on a narrow island for goodness sake!) is hardly “crowning the site” with a mosque. Would you also endorse a moratorium on building protestant churches near the Murrah building in Oklahoma City because McVeigh was protestant? Do you have any evidence at all that the community looking for a location to build their place of worship in any way support terrorist activity?
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I understand that as christians we must love one another; does that also mean that we forsake Jesus and His Church? Remember that this country was built on Christian laws and beliefs. Do a little research and see for yourself how Muslims treat christians on their turf.
They are many law abiding muslims here, and I wish them peace, but moreover I pray for the Lord’s mercy to let them see Jesus for who He is and that He is the Son of the Most High. They have their rights in this country, but so do we.

If they want to build their mosque then let us build a church right near them; this way we can truly be neighbors and show our brotherly love as Jesus taught us(just a thought). Do you think they would mind?

Jesus is King of kings and Lord of lords. Alleluia!
 
Building a mosque so close to ground zero is in effect raising a victory flag. When ever there has been a Islamic battle and territory won they have built a mosque.

It is a political move - Islam is more then just a “religion” it is an ideology-as cancerous as communism-more so because Mohammad added an allah to the mix.

rossum there is a huge difference. Killing is not condoned by Jesus or the Gospel.

Islam, Quran and Mohammad condone killing for allah.

“Islam wishes to destroy all states and governments anywhere on the face of the earth which are opposed to the ideology and program of Islam regardless of the country or the nation which rules it. The purpose of Islam is to set up a state on the basis of its own ideology and program … the objective of Islamic jihad is to eliminate the rule of an un-Islamic system and establish instead an Islamic system of state rule. Islam does not intend to confine this revolution to a single state or a few countries; the aim of Islam is to bring about a universal revolution.” (Sheikh Maolana Maududi 20th Century Islamic Scholar)

9.29 Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, (even if they are) of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued.

The only sure way a Muslim can reach paradise:
9.111 Allah hath purchased of the believers their persons and their goods; for theirs is the garden (of Paradise): they fight in His cause, and slay and are slain: a promise binding on Him in truth, through the Law, the Gospel, and the Qur’an: and who is more faithful to his covenant than Allah? then rejoice in the bargain which ye have concluded: that is the achievement supreme.
 
schaick said:
rossum there is a huge difference. Killing is not condoned by Jesus or the Gospel.
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Joshua 6:21 21 “They devoted the city to the LORD and destroyed with the sword every living thing in it—men and women, young and old, cattle, sheep and donkeys.”
Islam, Quran and Mohammad condone killing for allah.
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Christianity, the Bible and Joshua condone killing for YHWH.

I might also cite the troubles in Northern Ireland where different sects of Christians were killing each other in the name of religion. Have you any evidence that the Moslems you quote are more representative of their religion than those Christians in Northern Ireland?

All scriptures come with standard interpretations, and there are a few who go against those standard interpretations. For example I cannot accuse Christians of cannibalism because the standard interpretation of Jesus’ words about eating His flesh and drinking His blood does not involve cannibalism. You have to show that violence is the standard interpretation of Islam, and not the interpretation of a Jihadist minority like the violent minority of Christians in Northern Ireland. All religions have their violent minorities.

rossum
 
The concern I have of Islam is that when it conquers, it stakes…and the terrorists did not imagine the World Trade Center would fall as it did.

We are already having problems in this country of hearing and being told this form of Arabic means this, but another form is in use…like at the Saudi Muslim school in Virginia, whose use of Arabic was seditious and incendiary.

Did the Japanese Americans insist on building a Shinto Temple at Pearl Harbor?

We are dealing with a different culture of people who have quite a long history…

The videos showing the buildings coming down had images of demons in the dark clouds, and when it was all over with, what stood above the hubble was a most clearly defined cross of iron beams.
 
Jack_Catholic said:
Hi all,

Now I am a reasonable guy who believes we are called to love even our neighbors. But I just found out that a group of Muslims have requested to build a mosque just 2 blocks from the sight of the twin towers in New York. This makes my blood boil. It was muslims who destroyed them and over 2000 innocent lives to begin with, and now they want to crown the sight with a mosque. That would be a complete victory for Islam: destroy the symbol of infidel economic power and top off the sight with an Islamic Mosque. That would be like destroying St. Peter’s in Rome, the symbol of Catholic power, and replacing it with a mosque. Oh, hey, isn’t that what was done in Jerusalem? They found the temple mount and built a mosque on top of it. Now they restrict the Jews from even visiting the only wall part left of the former Jewish temple in Jerusalem. I would think out of respect the Muslims would not place a mosque anywhere near the sight of the twin towers in New York. Yet they are quite persistant. I wonder what for?

God Bless,

Jack Catholic
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Muslim extreemists may have been responsible for 9-11…BUT these Muslims who wish to build a house of worship WERE NOT. It is a broad brush to paint the over 1 billion Muslims responsible for a few terrorists who happened to be Muslim that destroyed the WTC.

We live in a land of religious freedom…at a time when many Catholics decry the enroachment of government upon the free expression of religious belief…this would seem to be a…dare I use the term “hyocritical” position to take toward another faith tradition that as a whole had nothing to do with the tradgedy of the WTC on 9/11.
 
rossum said:
Joshua 6:21 21 “They devoted the city to the LORD and destroyed with the sword every living thing in it—men and women, young and old, cattle, sheep and donkeys.”

Christianity, the Bible and Joshua condone killing for YHWH.

I might also cite the troubles in Northern Ireland where different sects of Christians were killing each other in the name of religion. Have you any evidence that the Moslems you quote are more representative of their religion than those Christians in Northern Ireland?

All scriptures come with standard interpretations, and there are a few who go against those standard interpretations. For example I cannot accuse Christians of cannibalism because the standard interpretation of Jesus’ words about eating His flesh and drinking His blood does not involve cannibalism. You have to show that violence is the standard interpretation of Islam, and not the interpretation of a Jihadist minority like the violent minority of Christians in Northern Ireland. All religions have their violent minorities.

rossum
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You didn’t read what I wrote- Jesus and Gospel do not condone killing.

A true Christians holds Jesus actions and the Gospel close to their heart.
 
rossum said:
Joshua 6:21 21 “They devoted the city to the LORD and destroyed with the sword every living thing in it—men and women, young and old, cattle, sheep and donkeys.”

Christianity, the Bible and Joshua condone killing for YHWH.

I might also cite the troubles in Northern Ireland where different sects of Christians were killing each other in the name of religion. Have you any evidence that the Moslems you quote are more representative of their religion than those Christians in Northern Ireland?

All scriptures come with standard interpretations, and there are a few who go against those standard interpretations. For example I cannot accuse Christians of cannibalism because the standard interpretation of Jesus’ words about eating His flesh and drinking His blood does not involve cannibalism. You have to show that violence is the standard interpretation of Islam, and not the interpretation of a Jihadist minority like the violent minority of Christians in Northern Ireland. All religions have their violent minorities.

rossum
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Note that these statments demonstrate not only a lack of understanding of Christianity but a warped view of it as well. Please quote from the New Testament where Jesus advocated the killing of another. I believe that you will find the exact opposit. That there is no greater gift that one can give to give ones life for his brother. Note further, this did not mean go down fighting. Jesus demonstrated on the cross exactly what he taught, for you to claim otherwise is utter nonsense.
 
Publisher,

I live in an area that has a history of anti-Catholic bigotry of which it does not wish to repeat. It impacted the faith of believers here as well, people to this day afraid to open up.

I live within 3 miles of what was considered the most violent mosque in the USA…

I live in a place where the city government refused the FBI to further protect this area. The locals bragged how they used their car lights to ‘blind’ the security officers monitoring this mosque before the arrests…the locals who have the voice and power here are still living in 1969. Even the alternatives across town could not understand this local government’s insistence to thwart protection that the rest of the country enjoys.

There are reports that many, many mosques across the country have another agenda. Furthermore, the Muslim Brotherhood has its forces in just about every single college campus and students are afraid of them and now to say anything against Islam.

It is this manner of encroachment I am concerned about.
 
KathleenGee said:
Publisher,

I live in an area that has a history of anti-Catholic bigotry of which it does not wish to repeat. It impacted the faith of believers here as well, people to this day afraid to open up.

I live within 3 miles of what was considered the most violent mosque in the USA…

I live in a place where the city government refused the FBI to further protect this area. The locals bragged how they used their car lights to ‘blind’ the security officers monitoring this mosque before the arrests…the locals who have the voice and power here are still living in 1969. Even the alternatives across town could not understand this local government’s insistence to thwart protection that the rest of the country enjoys.

There are reports that many, many mosques across the country have another agenda. Furthermore, the Muslim Brotherhood has its forces in just about every single college campus and students are afraid of them and now to say anything against Islam.

It is this manner of encroachment I am concerned about.
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So let’s deal with the fact about THIS PARTICULAR mosque. I too live just a stone’s throw from two mosques…one of those mosques was also under FBI investigation because of things those who attended worship were involved in…but we live in a nation of law…not “maybe they’re violent”…or “All Muslims are responsible for what happened on 9-11.” These Muslims that wish to build a house of worship in a specific location are well within their rights as US citizens to do so…on this board I read over and over how government prohibits the free exercise of religious beliefs and I read many Catholics and other religious traditions play “Ain’t it awful.”…but when Muslims wish to exercise their free expression of religion WITHIN THE RULE OF LAW…our prejudices show very plainly…we are called to be better than that…if we are no better…what do we have to offer our world?
 
No.

We have a right to protect ourselves. Our borders, our every day citizens being searched, our internets monitored.

American, law abiding citizens are now the most monitored in the world.

It is about the use of reason and good judgment.

Every time people want to defend themselves, we are being called racist or hypocritical bigots.
 
KathleenGee said:
No.

We have a right to protect ourselves. Our borders, our every day citizens being searched, our internets monitored.

American, law abiding citizens are now the most monitored in the world.

It is about the use of reason and good judgment.

Every time people want to defend themselves, we are being called racist or hypocritical bigots.
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So, what has this mosque done…other than exist and build a house of worship in a location you do not approve of…that causes you to want to “defend yourself”? Are you suggesting that those Muslims are not “law abiding citizens”? If so…what proof do you offer? Or is it that they are Muslim…the WTC was destroyed by Muslim terrorists…so it naturally follows that these Muslims are up to no good as well…

Where is the “good judgement” involved that deny US citizens the right to free expression of religious beliefs…other than one’s dislike for Muslims as a whole…“racist” and “hypocritical bigots” does seem, at least on the surface, very good commentary on the subject.

Have we given into fear of those different from us to make our decisions instead of rule of law? Is such beliefs and behavior in keeping with the teachings of Jesus of Nazareth? I realize as a Friend, I believe such beliefs that deny people their basic rights to even exist in an American city and build their house of worship where they are able to secure land to be very much against the teachings of Christ…and the ideals of a free society.
 
It’s a fact that there are many Muslim extremists, but it’s also a fact that the media twists things to wind people up.

My Muslim friend said that at the mosque, the leader will preach to everyone that terrorism is wrong etc… so they accept that the religion promotes terrorism, but are trying to correct it (well most I hope).
 
No, we are talking about two different issues, and I am afraid you are getting into the politically correct ‘mouthspeak’ so prevalent here with those who have power over the rest of us, you don’t realize your hypocisy in delegating the rest of us to non-citizen status.

As a Catholic American citizen we hold up every day life, pay heavy taxes–my house alone is now $5000 a year, we are law abiding, always patriotic, tolerant, but our concerns are, like the rest of the country --moot – to the point, we are not citizens. We have been ignored for over 40 years now. We opposed abortion, premarital sex, adultery, pornography, biased anti-Catholic indoctrination in public schools, euthanasia…and so we Catholics, like so many other middle class Americans are not being heard…and then to speak our concerns, the same as countless other Americans, on our own site no less, we are also now hypocrites??

The Jewish population here is well aware of the ongoing but hidden prejudice and bigotry towards Catholics.

It is not intolerance, Brother, the issue is there are too many forces now at work destroying the integrity of our country…and the power base doesn’t get it.

People have a right to be concerned about the mosque near the WTC…and the Muslim Brotherhood in America…and the other activities these so - called moderate Muslims do. There is great intolerance in these communities that if we were in their countries of origin, these same individuals would deny us the same liberties.
 
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