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Onesimus
Guest
Not at all.
If something is evil now, why would the same thing not be evil then?
Christianity has no teaching like that.
Islam and Heaven or paradise, do women go where men go when they die?
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If something is evil now, why would the same thing not be evil then?
Christianity has no teaching like that.
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paarsurrey
Guest
Hi
The PromisedMessiahImamMahdi has cleared the true Concept of Heaven and Hell in his treatize “The Philosophy Of The Teachings Of Islam”
I given hereunder an excerpt from the book: alislam.org/books/philosophy/2q3.html
"All this shows that according to Islamic principles, for the soul to act perfectly it is necessary for it to enjoy the Companionship of a body at all times. On death the soul departs from this mortal body, but in the intermediate state every soul is invested with a body in order to enable it to react to the conditions of that state. That body is not like this physical body, but is prepared from light or from darkness, according to the quality of the person’ s actions in this life. As if a man’s actions serve as a body for the soul in that state. In the Word of God it is repeatedly mentioned that some bodies will be bright and some will be dark. They will be prepared from the light or from the darkness of human actions. This is a fine mystery but is not opposed to reason. A perfect human being can enjoy an illumined body in this very life and there are many instances of this which are experienced in a state of vision. This may be difficult of comprehension by a person of average intelligence, but those who have some experience of the state of vision will not regard such a body as is prepared from human actions as a matter of surprise and improbability. But will duly appreciate this phenomenon.
In short this body which is acquired according to the condition of one s actions. Becomes a source of the recompense of good and evil in the intermediate state. I have experience of this. I have often had experience in a complete state of wakefulness of meeting some persons who had died. And I saw that the bodies of some evil-doers and misguided ones were so dark as it they had been made of smoke. In short, I am personally acquainted with these matters and I affirm emphatically that, as God Almighty has said, every one is invested with a body after death which is either bright or dark. It would be a mistake on the part of man to seek to establish these fine insights through the more exercise of reason. It should be realised that as the eye cannot discover the taste of something sweet, nor can the tongue behold anything, in the same way the knowledge of the life after death which can only be acquired through holy visions Cannot be explained fully on the basis of reason. God Almighty has appointed diverse means for acquiring knowledge in this world of that which is unknown. Therefore it is necessary to seek everything through its proper means. It is only then that it can be discovered.
Another matter that must be kept he mind is that in His Word God has described as dead those people who are involved in vice and error and has declared the virtuous as alive. The reason for this is that the functions of the lives of those who die in a State of neglect of God, for instance, eating and drinking and indulgence of their passions are cut off, and they have no share of spiritual sustenance. They are truly dead and will be revived only for punishment. As God, the Glorious, has said: The portion of him who comes to his Lord a sinner is hell; he shall neither die therein nor live (20:75). But those whom God loves do not die with their physical death, for their sustenance is with them.
After Barzukh there is the state of resurrection. In that state every soul good or bad, righteous or disobedient, will be bestowed a visible body. That day has been appointed for the perfect manifestations of God, when every person will get to know the Being of his Lord fully, and everyone will arrive at the climax of his recompense. This should not be a matter for surprise for God has every power and does whatever He wills, as He has said: Does not man know that we have created him from a mere sperm drop injected into the womb? Then he becomes a persistent disputer."
Unquote
Thanks
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Greg27
Guest
With all due respect, I think this is a warped caricature of Islam. It is a bit like saying that in Catholicism:
- You are not allowed to think or ask questions
- The Pope is God on Earth and you must bow down and worship him
- God will send you to hell if you violate 1) and 2)
- In the past, the Church has ruthlessly exterminated anyone who dared dissent.
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Greg27
Guest
We could ask the same of Catholicism in the past when during the Crusades, Crusaders sacked Jerusalem and killed at least 40,000 Jews, Muslims, and Orthodox Christians, or the sacking of Byzantium itself by the Crusader armies, or the pogroms against Jews, the Inquisition in its various nasty forms, witch crazes, and so on.
Both Islam and Christianity have very bright and beautiful episodes of flourishing during the medieval period and beyond as well as very dark episodes. With Islam we can look at the invasions of India for example, where Hindus and Buddhists were killed, monastaries and temples destroyed, and ruthless theocracy imposed. But there were also more tolerant Muslim leaders who allowed philosophy and inter-religious dialogue to flourish, particularly in Baghdad in the 12th century and also Spain. Likewise, in medieval Catholicism we can look at the Crusades as well as the wonderful flourishing of philosophy and theology, particularly in Germany and France, with people like Thomas Aquinas, Duns Scotus, William of Ockham, Bonaventure and St Francis, and others.
Human history doesn’t completely exonerate or condemn every civilisation, as civilisations achieve great heights of advancement but also often have a dark underbelly of vice, corruption and brutality. This applies equally to Christianity and Islam, in the past and also now.
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Eden
Guest
With all due respect, by their fruits you shall know them. I stand by my characterization of Islam. If you choose not to see the imprisonment of the mind, body and soul that is Islam, so be it.
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Eden
Guest
With all due respect, it is the Catholic faith that champions the cause of the poor, the sick, the weak and fights against the culture of death be it abortion, war or the death penalty. Catholic charities are the most generous and effective charities in the United States. By your fruits you shall know them. If you choose to believe Protestant rewriting of history, such as with the Inquisition, so be it. You certainly won’t have to go into hiding like Salman Rushdie for writing anti-Catholic posts.
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Greg27
Guest
Well, in my view it is a characterisation clearly based on some rather nasty personal prejudice and religious hatred, rather than a fair and balanced analysis and detailed knowledge of Islam, its history, and its contributions to history, as well as its periods of barbarism, decline, and the causes of its modern turmoil. If you are going to make arguments they need to be supported by decent evidence, rather than simply assertions of personal opinions and hatreds.
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Greg27
Guest
I agree it would be foolish to ignore the valuable work the CC does, but Islam, Judaism, Buddhism and other religions, as well as many secular organisations such as Oxfam, Doctors without Borders, Amnesty International and many others do exactly the same things you say the CC does above. In Islam it is obligatory for people to give a certain percentage of their income for charitable causes (the zakat tax) and also Islam is very concerned for social justice and fair protection of widows, orphans, and the poor. Islam, like the CC, is also very conservative morally and opposes contraception, abortion, and homosexuality, and firmly defends the notion of marriage and stable families. Both religions actually share much of the same moral thinking and base it on similar assumptions about divine commandments and law.
Clearly your hatred of Muslims and Islam is blinding you to the good that exists in that faith, just as the hatred of Islamic jihadists blinds them to the good in the Christian faith and in other religions.
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dolphinlove
Guest
this was the first thread i clicked on today and didnt read the other one, then i saw a few of the responses from duba5 and i got that feeling of
:banghead: :yawn: and :doh2: all combined and just knew it was him, then i saw the other thread and thought here we go again!!!I really think deep down he wants to become a christian.
he knows what a sham he has become and is trying to correct himself.
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moozo
Guest
all these haddiths are not complete ,and taken out of contextHi All
In reference to the inequality of male and female within Islam let me quote ‘ONLY SOME’ on what Mohammad (and the early biographers) had to say about women and paradise. (quotes from thereligionofpeace.com and prophetofdoom.com)
Bukhari:V1B22N28
“**The Prophet said: ‘I was shown the Hell Fire and the majority of its dwellers were women **who are disbelievers or ungrateful.’ When asked what they were ungrateful for, the Prophet answered, ‘All the favors done for them by their husbands.’”
Muslim:B1N142
"‘O womenfolk, you should ask for forgiveness for I saw you in bulk amongst the dwellers of Hell.'
Abu Dawud At-Tayalisi recorded that Anas said that the Messenger of Allah said,
<In Paradise, the believer will be given such and such strength for women.>
Anas said, "I asked, 'O Allah’s Messenger! Will one be able to do that? He said,
<He will be given the strength OF A HUNDRED (MEN)> At-Tirmidhi also recorded it and said, “Sahih Gharib.” Abu Al-Qasim At-Tabarani recorded that Abu Hurayrah said that the Messenger of Allah was asked, "O Allah’s Messenger! Will we have sexual intercourse with our wives in Paradise?" He said,
Bukhari:V3B48N826
"The Prophet said, ‘Isn’t the witness of a woman equal to half of that of a man?’ The women said, ‘Yes.’ He said, ‘This is because of the deficiency of a woman’s mind.’"
Ishaq:584
"Tell the men with you who have wives: never trust a woman."
Bukhari:V4B52N143V5B59N523
“When we reached Khaybar, Muhammad said that Allah had enabled him to conquer them. It was then that the beauty of Safiyah was described to him. Her husband had been killed, so Allah’s Apostle selected her for himself. He took her along with him till we reached a place called Sad where her menses were over and he took her for his wife, consummating his marriage to her, and forcing her to wear the veil.’”
Tabari IX:113
"Allah permits you to shut them in separate rooms and to beat them, but not severely. If they abstain, they have the right to food and clothing. Treat women well for they are like domestic animals and they possess nothing themselves. Allah has made the enjoyment of their bodies lawful in his Qur’an."
Finally, you may not have read this one regarding Mohammad wedding the Virgin Mary in paradise, well read this from Ibn Kathir, to see for yourself:
“The Messenger of God … said, **‘God MARRIED ME IN PARADISE TO MARY THE DAUGHTER OF 'IMRAN **and to the wife of Pharaoh and the sister of Moses.’ (Tabarani)” (Ibn Kathir, Qisas al-Anbiya [Cairo: Dar al-Kutub, 1968/1388], p. 381- as cited in Aliah Schleifer’s Mary The Blessed Virgin of Islam [Fons Vitae; ISBN: 1887752021; July 1, 1998], p. 64; bold and capital emphasis ours)
The late Iranian Islamic scholar, Ali Dashti, wrote:
… According to the Cambridge Tafsir, the word thayyebat (widows or divorcees) refers to Pharaoh’s wife Asiya, and the word virgins (abkar) refers to Jesus’ mother Mary, both of whom are waiting to be married to the Prophet Mohammad in heaven. (Dashti, 23 Years: A Study of the Prophetic Career of Mohammad [Mazda Publishers, Costa Mesa, CA 1994], p. 138)
(bold, underline and Caps emphasis mine)
answering-islam.de/Main/Shamoun/mary.htm
God bless
thats really idiotic ,go to any islamic site and search for the completion of every haddith
(Link removed by moderator)
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moozo
Guest
i think its enough for hiroshima to show your fruits ,
oh i missed something ,by their fruits is talk about false prophets ,while prophet muhammad characters contradict that of false prophets
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BelFarfalla
Guest
The Crusades were a justified war against a Muslim state that had been attacking, killing and enslaving millions of Christians for centuries. The problem with the Crusades is that they were not well organized and hence were often close to a free-for-all. What transpired, such as the slaughter upon the capture of Jerusalem was not unlike the acts of Muslims up to the time and afterwards. It was definitely how wars were fought and won in those days. IMHO, European Christendom lost an opportunity to do good and turn the situation around… we are all still paying for the sins of the Crusaders who did these horrible acts. Just think of how the world might be different today if they had taken a more ‘Christian’ approach to the capture to Jerusalem.
As for the Crusades that attacked the Orthodox Christians… those were NOT at the command of the Pope. Since the Crusades were mostly funded by private citizens, they ran out of money. So the Crusaders who owed huge sums to the merchants of Venice paid off their accounts by fighting the battles for the merchants of Venice. Then they took up the cause of an exiled Orthodox ruler… they did this again for financial gain. When the exiled ruler could not or would not pay the renegade crusaders for their mercenary services, they turned on the entire Orthodox community. This to the horror of the Pope who envisioned that by protecting the Orthodox from Muslim invaders would go a long way to heal the schism between the Orthodox and Rome. The Pope in Rome excommunicated every Crusader who participated in the attack on the Orthodox. This is another horrible sin committed by thousands of Crusaders turned mercenaries… and we are still paying for those sins too.
There is nothing in Christian doctrine or biblical scripture that justifies the slaughters in Jerusalem or of the Orthodox Christians.
The issue is that all of the things you mention are in direct opposition to the teachings of Christ.
Most Christians speak out against these things today. We acknowledge the mistakes and sins of our ancestors.
Now try to find Muslims who will speak out against the atrocities of their ancestors… good luck. They will justify it by the laws of Islam.
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BelFarfalla
Guest
You are right that good and bad had been done by both. For example in Spain… said to be the golden period of Islam… the Muslims still had bloody pogroms killing thousands of Jews and Christians.
The lessons here are that all parties have done good things and horrible things. No one today is responsible for what our ancestors did. What we are responsible for is what we do with the knowledge we can learn about man’s inhumanity to man by studying this history. All religions need to remove from their theology and laws anything that supports the killing, subjugation or enslavement of anyone… that’s the bottom line.
I have spoken out against some aspects of Islam on this forum. There is a lot of good things is Islam… it is after all a form of Christianity/Judaism. I do not speak out against all Muslims or all of Islam but instead against things like their laws of the lesser Jihad… a perpetual war against all non-Muslims to spread Islam. The laws of Islam that call for the subjugation of non-Muslims under Islamic rule, the laws allowing for wife beating. Those are the things that I am concerned about. I would argue against any Christian (such as the KKK) that advocate similar things.
There is truth in this.
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BelFarfalla
Guest
oh i missed something ,by their fruits is talk about false prophets ,while prophet muhammad characters contradict that of false prophets
Hiroshima… After a battle Muhammad had 900 men beheaded and all of the women and children sold into slavery after he and his men raped the women. The only reason it was only 900 men is that the population was much smaller in those days in that area.
The USA was fighting a defensive war against an enemy who had attacked us, who had already brutally raped and slaughtered millions of people. The stated intent of the Japanese people was to destroy us… we did what people do… it is our obligation to protect ourselves. Our leaders had the choice of allowing the fight to continue at the risk of losing a projected million or more of our people and at least that many Japanese. The bombs at Hiroshima, etc, ended the war with far fewer deaths.
It’s so easy to sit here as arm chair critics at our terminals and second guess the people who had to make some pretty hard decisions. When you are faced with such decisions and you make better choices I’ll give your criticism more credence.
As for Muhammad… did he follow the teachings of Christ? No … the threw out the teachings of Christ. He was as false prophet who used religion to gain power, personal wealth and women.
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BelFarfalla
Guest
Don’t you have a better explanation then this? If they are taken out of context then explain here what the context is that makes those hadiths justifiable. don’t just give us a link to read.all these haddiths are not complete ,and taken out of context
thats really idiotic ,go to any islamic site and search for the completion of every haddith
answering-christianity.com/bassam_zawadi/deception_of_craig_winn_revealed.htm
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BelFarfalla
Guest
ahmadhassan is this you again??? Don’t you get the hint?
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BelFarfalla
Guest
ahmadhassan is this you again??? Don’t you get the hint?
Your choice of names is definately going downhill.
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BelFarfalla
Guest
ahmadhassan is this you again??? Don’t you get the hint?
Your choice of names is definately going downhill.
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BelFarfalla
Guest
ahmadhassan is this you again??? Don’t you get the hint?
Your choice of names is definately going downhill.
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BelFarfalla
Guest
ahmadhassan is this you again??? Don’t you get the hint?
Your choice of names is definately going downhill.
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