Islam and the Virgin Birth of Jesus

[Isa_Almisry]

I do not make God do anything as I like. The christians have a belief that God can do anything, absolutely anything. That is to show the maximum power of God. But too much power can be wrong too. And I would definitely need a proof of that belief “God can do everything” in those exact words from the bible NT please.

Then I will present the correct version of this subject as it is taught in Islam. Thanks.

We don’t beleive He can do anything. We don’t beleive He can act illogically, since He is His Logos. John 1:1.

We know the Islamic version on this subject: we saw it two years ago.

 

[planten]

I’ll let your fellow Muslims argue with you on this one.

Ditto

Yes.

Borrowed from the Protoevangelium of James and Church Tradition.

Accusation to avoid the problem. In those days there were no libraries in Arabia that Muhammad could copy anything. Moreover Muhammad did not read and write as Jesus also did not read and write. So please do not assume things to avoid the issue.

“Full of Grace?”

“Mother of My Lord?”

“Blessed among Women?”

** Good words. Who said these things? Surely not Jesus. Where is reference? Are you saying it?**

We’ve already dealt with this. Do keep up.

That is another way to avoid the admission of any good thing.

Look above.

Look above.

There was no reference there. Good words but who said them?

She wants you to meet her Son first.

You mean Paul was working on the theory to meet Jesus first that is why he completely ignored Mary?

Jesus said “Behold your mother.”

. He did not say that to his mother and he did not say " Behold my mother." Did he disown his mother before going up on the cross? And what do you say about those words “O Woman”?

As the Foster Father, Jesus legal genealogy is through Joseph.

That is good. We will trust and go by the legal geneology only and we will leave alone any illegal geneology. Won’t you agree? That is to be simple and straight and not to beat about the bush.

Since you prophet abolished the foster relationship among you because he coveted (and took) his foster son’s wife, I understand why you don’t understand that

.

**That was to forget that there can be any supposed (adopted) son or supposedly begotten son. The prophet finished that belief by marrying the divorced wife of his earlier adopted son. That was a good step towards reality. Prophet knew that some people were playing havoc with the son business in a bad way.

Now coming back to the topic, Almisry please try to prove the virgin birth of Jesus from bible and do not take any help from the very good words of the Quran. Thanks.
**.

 

[Psalter]

I do not make God do anything as I like. The christians have a belief that God can do anything, absolutely anything. That is to show the maximum power of God. But too much power can be wrong too. And I would definitely need a proof of that belief “God can do everything” in those exact words from the bible NT please.

Then I will present the correct version of this subject as it is taught in Islam. Thanks.

Actually there are a few things even God cannot do. God cannot lie, according to the Bible (contrast this with the way God is depicted in the Quran).

 

[Psalter]

Accusation to avoid the problem. In those days there were no libraries in Arabia that Muhammad could copy anything. Moreover Muhammad did not read and write as Jesus also did not read and write. So please do not assume things to avoid the issue.

** Good words. Who said these things? Surely not Jesus. Where is reference? Are you saying it?**

That is another way to avoid the admission of any good thing.

There was no reference there. Good words but who said them?

You mean Paul was working on the theory to meet Jesus first that is why he completely ignored Mary?

. He did not say that to his mother and he did not say " Behold my mother." Did he disown his mother before going up on the cross? And what do you say about those words “O Woman”?

That is good. We will trust and go by the legal geneology only and we will leave alone any illegal geneology. Won’t you agree? That is to be simple and straight and not to talk about the bush.

.

That was to forget that there can be any supposed (adopted) son or supposedly begotten son. The prophet finished that belief by marrying thye divorced wife of his earlier adopted son. That was a good step towards reality. Prophet knew that some people were playing havoc with the son business in a bad way.

Jesus didn’t read?? The Gospels depict Jesus as reading the Scriptures in the synagogue. Some of the things you say, Planten!..do you actually hear about them first from other sources or do you just make them up as you go along?

 

[planten]

Jesus didn’t read?? The Gospels depict Jesus as reading the Scriptures in the synagogue. Some of the things you say, Planten!..do you actually hear about them first from other sources or do you just make them up as you go along?

**No I do not make up things. I would rather follow the truth if found. Now that you pointed it out, there may be an obscure reference (or just one word) in the whole bible. But otherwise we do not see Jesus reading and writing. Surely he must be educated person.

So that one sentence in whole bible would not suffice to make him reading and writing person. Otherwise we believe that he was a teacher too, a Master. like Budha sahib or Muhammad, or Moses a.s. Would you agree with me?**

 

[Isa_Almisry]

Accusation to avoid the problem.
Statement of fact that creates problems for you.

In those days there were no libraries in Arabia that Muhammad could copy anything.

Your Muslim tradition says that he met up with a monk Bahira, and Khadija’s relative was a Christian.
It seems that you do not read the Bible, but repeat what you hear. This explains both your posts and the Biblical material (and its condition) in the Quran.

** Good words. Who said these things? Surely not Jesus. Where is reference? Are you saying it?**

I do say it, but I’m just repeating.

“Full of Grace” Gabriel, sent by God. Luke 1:28

“Mother of My Lord” God the Holy Spirit, by Elizabeth Luke 1:41-3

“Blessed among Women” God the Holy Spirit, by Elizabeth Luke 1:41-2

That is another way to avoid the admission of any good thing.

No, it’s to avoid repeating myself.

There was no reference there. Good words but who said them?

Look above.

You mean Paul was working on the theory to meet Jesus first that is why he completely ignored Mary?

I’m sorry. I screen those who meet my mother. I thought everyone did.

. He did not say that to his mother
Duh.

and he did not say " Behold my mother."

Sure did. John 19:27. And we know its true. John 19:35.

Did he disown his mother before going up on the cross?

No.

And what do you say about those words “O Woman”?

Genesis 2:23, 3:20

That is good. We will trust and go by the legal geneology only and we will leave alone any illegal geneology. Won’t you agree? That is to be simple and straight and not to beat about the bush.

We’d have to teach you first what Messiah means first, because the Quran doesn’t know.

That was to forget that there can be any supposed (adopted) son or supposedly begotten son. The prophet finished that belief by marrying the divorced wife of his earlier adopted son.
He finished the belief in the sanctity of marriage, family life and the father-son relationship. That’s all.

That was a good step towards reality.

First step on a broad path. Matthew 7:13.

Prophet knew that some people were playing havoc with the son business in a bad way.

And sleeping with your daughter in law doesn’t play havoc.

It’s SOOOO improved Muhammad’s image.

Now coming back to the topic, Almisry please try to prove the virgin birth of Jesus from bible and do not take any help from the very good words of the Quran. Thanks.

.

Have you ever SEEN a Bible, let alone read ANY of it?

Matthew 1:18-25; Luke 1:26-38; 2:1-7; Isaiah 7:14.

 

[Psalter]

**No I do not make up things. I would rather follow the truth if found. Now that you pointed it out, there may be an obscure reference (or just one word) in the whole bible. But otherwise we do not see Jesus reading and writing. Surely he must be educated person.

So that one sentence in whole bible would not suffice to make him reading and writing person. Otherwise we believe that he was a teacher too, a Master. like Budha sahib or Muhammad, or Moses a.s. Would you agree with me?**

Huh?? I have NO IDEA what point you are trying to make.

 

[Angelos]

Planten, please stop digression and stick to the topic of this thread!

 

[inJESUS]

I still do not see any answer…

 

[Psalter]

I still do not see any answer…

Nope, still waiting…

 

[bpbasilphx]

The entities that Mahometans call “Maryam” and “Isa” bear no resemblance to the true Mary and Jesus.

I confess there is NO GOD but Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, and Jesus is God Incarnate risen from the dead.

 

[planten]

Actually there are a few things even God cannot do. God cannot lie, according to the Bible (contrast this with the way God is depicted in the Quran).

**Now you are coming to some reality but by using your own mind. I wish you had something on the subject from your bible… I feel that you do not have any words there in bible (exact words) that you are telling.

We can leave Quran now because you have not shown anything from the bible. The teaching of the Quran is perfect and in very clear words.**

 

[MarySee]

The entities that Mahometans call “Maryam” and “Isa” bear no resemblance to the true Mary and Jesus.

As far resemblance, read this first:

**1 G Ah, you are beautiful, my beloved,
ah, you are beautiful!
Your eyes are doves
behind your veil.
Your hair is like a flock of goats
streaming down the mountains of Gilead.

2 Your teeth are like a flock of ewes to be shorn,
which come up from the washing,
All of them big with twins,
none of them thin and barren.

3 Your lips are like a scarlet strand;
your mouth is lovely.
Your cheek is like a half-pomegranate
behind your veil.

4 Your neck is like David’s tower
girt with battlements;
A thousand bucklers hang upon it,
all the shields of valiant men.

5 Your breasts are like twin fawns,
the young of a gazelle
that browse among the lilies.

6 Until the day breathes cool and the shadows lengthen,
I will go to the mountain of myrrh,
to the hill of incense.

7 You are all-beautiful, my beloved,
and there is no blemish in you** .

8 Come from Lebanon, my bride,
come from Lebanon, come!
Descend from the top of Amana,
from the top of Senir and Hermon,
From the haunts of lions,
from the leopards’ mountains

Do you know from which Holy Bible you will find the above verses?

My question here is do you think in verse 7, there is no blemish in you is same thing Paul is talking in Ephesians 5:2:

**that he might present to himself the church in splendor, without spot or wrinkle or any such thing, that she might be holy and without blemish. **

Does this verse also applied to ‘Our Lady’-Mary?

Further, is there anything in these verses which is metaphorical or everything here has to be taken in literal sense?

 

[inJESUS]

Nope, still waiting…

and still waiting…

 

[dolphinlove]

and still waiting…

getting those gray hairs yet??

I see marysee, aka americanrevert aka 50 other names is under review…

 

[Psalter]

**Now you are coming to some reality but by using your own mind. I wish you had something on the subject from your bible… I feel that you do not have any words there in bible (exact words) that you are telling.

We can leave Quran now because you have not shown anything from the bible. The teaching of the Quran is perfect and in very clear words.**

Actually, the Bible says “It is impossible for God to lie.” You don’t believe the Bible is accurate anyway–what difference does it make to quote it to you or not?

 

[Psalter]

getting those gray hairs yet??

I see marysee, aka americanrevert aka 50 other names is under review…

Deo gratias!!! Or should I say, Alhamdulillah!!! :dancing:

 

[Isa_Almisry]

Deo gratias!!! Or should I say, Alhamdulillah!!! :dancing:

should say almajdu lillaaah Glory to God.

 

[planten]

Actually, the Bible says “It is impossible for God to lie.” You don’t believe the Bible is accurate anyway–what difference does it make to quote it to you or not?

There is no harm in telling me the reference. I want to see where it is written: “It is impossible for God to lie.” These exact words in the bible, I would like to see please.

 

[Psalter]

There is no harm in telling me the reference. I want to see where it is written: “It is impossible for God to lie.” These exact words in the bible, I would like to see please.

“Wherein God, meaning more abundantly to shew the heirs of the promise the immutability of his counsel, interposed an oath: that by two immutable things in which it is impossible for God to lie, we may have the strongest comfort, we who have fled for refuge to hold fast the hope set before us. Which we have as an anchor of the soul, sure and firm, and which entereth in even within the veil: Where the forerunner Jesus is entered for us, made a high priest for ever according to the order of Melchisedech.” (Hebrews, ch. 6)

“Paul, a servant of God and apostle of Jesus Christ, in accordance with the faith of God’s elect and the full knowledge of the truth which is according to piety, in the hope of life everlasting which God, who does not lie, promised before the ages began.” (Titus 1:1,2)

“God is not man that he should speak falsely, nor human, that he should change his mind.” (Numbers 23:19)