Islam

[Booklover]

Muslima:

God Almighty said in Quran:
49:10/11: " Make peace among your brothers and fear Allah, so that you may be shown mercy. Believers, let no man mock another man, who m ay be perhaps be better than himself. Let no woman mock another woman, who perhaps may be better than herself. Do not defame one another, nor call one another by foul nicknames.

What about calling Jews pigs and swine? You consider that all kaffirs are no better than faeces, urine, blood, semen, dead bodies, pigs, dogs and animals that eat filth!

This idea is very near to the concept of war in Islam, as Moslems beleive they carry the word of Allah, they do not fight to subdue people to Islam, they fight when they feel that another corrupting power is threatening the Supremecy of the Word of Allah. So, when Moslems say that Jihad or fighting is an obligation on every Moslem, we here do not mean that Moslems carry their weapons and go to fight peaceful people, but Moslem are obligated to fight those who threat the Word of Allah, or who attack them as a nation.
I can not get why you see this strange, any nation in this world has an army, it makes it obligatory on its citizens to go to the army in war time, and it goes into war if someone attacks its security, why this is not considered terrorism.
The verses talking about war in Quran covers all aspects of battlefield better than any ministery of Defense in this entire world. It acknowledges the rights of civilians, it states clearly the rights of POW (prisoners of war), it states clearly that when you are fighting for a justice case and then your enemy surrenders, you should stop fighting at once. Any nation throughout its history is likely to face time s of war, the verses of war and jihad tackles what should be done at these times. This does not mean that Islam is a religion that advocates for war and blood sheding.
Peace be upon you
Muslima

You don’t take me in! All this is nothing but propaganda to lull us to a false sense of security! Any little thing that offends Muslims calls for war as we’ve seen about those cartoons! Your universal plan is to take over the whole world and force it to convert to Islam by force if necessary! There is no difference between Islam, communism, nazism or any other totalitarianism! It turns rational human beings into irrational robots programmed to do everything they’re told! Muslims have no free will at all! Mohammed was the master of Hitler and an expert at mind and thought control!

The Islamic heaven is nothing more than an orgy that lures foolish people to kill others with its promise of unlimited sex!

 

[freesoulhope]

Whats going on in this forum? peace be with you all

 

[JOHNYJ]

Islam like other beliefs is judged by what its adherents do,not what they say.Thats where Islam comes up very short.

 

[Muslima]

inJESUS:

we believe in God, not the islamic allah.

we do not follow this .

we dont embrace islam.

what is left? muslims must fight ALL Christians and jews and make them SUBDUED TO ISLAM. So either we live like slaves under sharia or ?

agaisnt the law??? what law??? which society treats you like this if you don’t obey to its deity? ONLY ISLAM.

YES, if you commit crimes agaisnt the law and humanity! if you kill, if you robb, if you rape, not if you dont believe in allah!! or if you drink alcohol ! or if you eat pig meat!!

in conclusion, muslims should fight all Christians and Jews ( coz obviously we apply nothing of what this verse talks about) untill we are all SUBDUED to muslim sharia.

THANK YOU…ALL SHOULD SEE WHAT ISLAM’S GOAL IS…SUBDUE OR…

Dear brother In Jesus,
You are so prejudiced, the interpretition here of this verse is according to what was really practiced when there was a real Islamic Nation, throughout 1300 years, we never saw any khalifa , except in the late ages treat non moslems badly because they are just non-moslems. All the books of history that talked about the Golden Ages of Islam never talked about any bad treatment to non moslems, no body humiliated them, or forbidden them from doing their rituals. When Abou Bakr (the 1st Islamic Khaliva and the companion of the Apostle peace be upon him) was giving a speach to the army that was going to fight with Romans in Jerusalem, he told the soldiers, : You will find in these countries monks and priests in their monstreis, don’t forbid them from doing their rituals, never burn plants, don’t ever attack a woman, achild, or an oldman, don’t harm your prisoners of war".
" Prophet Mohammad May God’s blessing and peace be upon him" said in a hadith: "He who will insult or be unjust to a jew or christian, I will come on Judgement day as the defender of this jew or christian till I get his right back from the Moslem.

I know that you are capable of bringing 70 other Hadiths that talk about hating christians and jews, but I reviewed all these hadiths and their origins with many shiekhs and I found that all these hadiths are fabricated and Rasoul Allah never uttered them, they were added even in Bokhary and Moslem by either radicals or haters of Islam.

Peace be upon you
Muslima

 

[Muslima]

inJESUS:

wrong…we know that if we believe in Jesus and follow his teachings, we are saved; but we do not condemn others to hell…we leave it to God’s wisdom and grace.

Dear brother
Peace be upon you,
We do not condemn anyone, its forbidden even for any Moslem to say about any one else that he will be in Hell in the life hereafter, the only creature that we condemn is Satan. But it is Allah Himself that states clearly and firmly that corruptors, pegans, killers and any one who does not beleive in Allah will be condemned to hell in the life hereafter. I beleive this is fare beacuse if God said to us in the Quran do whatever you like and at the end you may not get what you deserve then life would have get spoilt. Allah promises the virtous with Heavens, with forgiving their sins, he asks any sinner whatever his sins are to repent to him and that he will accept him immidietly, but also he promises the followers of Satan that they will have great torment. I beleive any ligalization or religion in the whole world is the same.

Peace be upon you
Moslema

 

[inJESUS]

Muslima:

inJESUS:

Dear brother In Jesus,
You are so prejudiced, the interpretition here of this verse is according to what was really practiced when there was a real Islamic Nation, throughout 1300 years, we never saw any khalifa , except in the late ages treat non moslems badly because they are just non-moslems. All the books of history that talked about the Golden Ages of Islam never talked about any bad treatment to non moslems, no body humiliated them, or forbidden them from doing their rituals. When Abou Bakr (the 1st Islamic Khaliva and the companion of the Apostle peace be upon him) was giving a speach to the army that was going to fight with Romans in Jerusalem, he told the soldiers, : You will find in these countries monks and priests in their monstreis, don’t forbid them from doing their rituals, never burn plants, don’t ever attack a woman, achild, or an oldman, don’t harm your prisoners of war".
" Prophet Mohammad May God’s blessing and peace be upon him" said in a hadith: "He who will insult or be unjust to a jew or christian, I will come on Judgement day as the defender of this jew or christian till I get his right back from the Moslem.

I know that you are capable of bringing 70 other Hadiths that talk about hating christians and jews, but I reviewed all these hadiths and their origins with many shiekhs and I found that all these hadiths are fabricated and Rasoul Allah never uttered them, they were added even in Bokhary and Moslem by either radicals or haters of Islam.

Peace be upon you
Muslima

sure, the hadith that portrays mohammad negatively is corrupt! even the sahih which is acknoledged by muslims! but what about the quran, muslima?

Torment to non-believers:
4.56: (As for) those who disbelieve in Our communications, We shall make them enter fire; so oft as their skins are thoroughly burned, We will change them for other skins, that they may taste the chastisement; surely Allah is Mighty, Wise.

If you dont accept Islam :
3.85: And whoever desires a religion other than Islam, it shall not be accepted from him, and in the hereafter he shall be one of the losers.

No friends from outsiders
3.118: O you who believe! do not take for intimate friends from among others than your own people; they do not fall short of inflicting loss upon you; they love what distresses you; vehement hatred has already appeared from out of their mouths, and what their breasts conceal is greater still; indeed, We have made the communications clear to you, if you will understand.

Friends with Jews, Christians…
5.51: O you who believe! do not take the Jews and the Christians for friends; they are friends of each other; and whoever amongst you takes them for a friend, then surely he is one of them; surely Allah does not guide the unjust people.

No friends with non believers
4.144: O you who believe! do not take the unbelievers for friends rather than the believers; do you desire that you should give to Allah a manifest proof against yourselves?

No friends with non believers
3.28: Let not the believers take the unbelievers for friends rather than believers; and whoever does this, he shall have nothing of (the guardianship of) Allah, but you should guard yourselves against them, guarding carefully; and Allah makes you cautious of (retribution from) Himself; and to Allah is the eventual coming.

Fight non-believers
9.123: O you who believe! fight those of the unbelievers who are near to you and let them find in you hardness; and know that Allah is with those who guard (against evil).

Kill non-believers
4.89 : They desire that you should disbelieve as they have disbelieved, so that you might be (all) alike; therefore take not from among them friends until they fly (their homes) in Allah’s way; but if they turn back, then seize them and kill them wherever you find them, and take not from among them a friend or a helper

Smite the neck and cut fingertips of unbelievers
8.12: When your Lord revealed to the angels: I am with you, therefore make firm those who believe. I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off every fingertip of them.

 

[inJESUS]

Muslima:

inJESUS:

wrong…we know that if we believe in Jesus and follow his teachings, we are saved; but we do not condemn others to hell…we leave it to God’s wisdom and grace.

Dear brother
Peace be upon you,
We do not condemn anyone, its forbidden even for any Moslem to say about any one else that he will be in Hell in the life hereafter, the only creature that we condemn is Satan. But it is Allah Himself that states clearly and firmly that corruptors, pegans, killers and any one who does not beleive in Allah will be condemned to hell in the life hereafter. I beleive this is fare beacuse if God said to us in the Quran do whatever you like and at the end you may not get what you deserve then life would have get spoilt. Allah promises the virtous with Heavens, with forgiving their sins, he asks any sinner whatever his sins are to repent to him and that he will accept him immidietly, but also he promises the followers of Satan that they will have great torment. I beleive any ligalization or religion in the whole world is the same.

Peace be upon you
Moslema

muslims, the quran condemned Christiasns and Jews to hell…who are you to say otherwise?

 

[inJESUS]

Let me clarify one thing Muslima, if you are here to claim that quran/mohammad/allah respect Christians and promises them heaven or whatever, i’ll keep refuting you coz you obviously do NOT recognize the difference between nasara and Christians in quran coz mohammad himself failed to recognize them…so either there are contradictions in quran, or Christians are NOT the nasara…so any claim that the quran respects us will be refuted badly…but if you are here to say that you as muslims respect us regardless of quran, then you are welcome, but you’ll be negating the quran teachings ( out of humanitarian feelings)…yet if this is your view, then you are most welcome…if not, am afraid i’ll keep refuting your claims.

 

[Muslima]

inJESUS:

sorry for my intrusion… is he adressing non-believers as well? or just “believers”…it’s late here and am lazy right now…tomorrow God willing i’ll show different verses about treatment of non-believers.

These words goes for both, we are ordered to behave in well manners with every one, either Moslem or Non Moslem. When Islam spread in Syria, Egypt, Jerusalem, Iraq and all the Islamic countries since 1400 years. The rule of these countries turned out to the Muslims instead of Romans or Persians but the people were left every one to beleive what he likes, but the people of these countries embarced Islam gradually when they trated Moslems and saw the manners of Islam.
Prophet Mohamed Peace be upon him had a jewish neighbour who used everyday to bring dust and dirts and throughit at his doorstep. One day the Prophet came out of his house and did not find this dust, he went to visit his neighbour fearing that he is may be ill at that day or in need to something.

God Almighty said in Quran:
6:108: “Do not revile the idols which they invoke besides Allah, lest in their ignorance they should spitefully revile Allah.”

109:6: “You have your own religion and I have mine.”
Peace be upon you
Muslima

 

[freesoulhope]

musima, When jesus comes back and is proved to be by the father, son of god and god as apart of the holy trinity, will you except him. Cant you see that you need jesus to be saved. we are all sinners, jesus commited no sin and was the only human to keep the law and so through him we can reach the father, through him we can be saved, he is the second adam, as in, he chose obedience to the father, and kept the law of the father while adam did not. Adam brought deaf for all humanity, and jesus brought life. The people of isreal where waiting for the son of god, they where the chosen people, how come islam do not except the son of god?

 

[pleaseanswer]

Booklover:

**What about calling Jews pigs and swine? ** You consider that all kaffirs are no better than faeces, urine, blood, semen, dead bodies, pigs, dogs and animals that eat filth!

Dear Booklover,

I too had the same objection, as you had. But when I read the Koran, there were few interesting things in this regard about "Jews being pigs and swines in particular and regarding the whole class of Jews, Christians and Sabaens:

First the Koran respects all Jews, Christians and Sabaens as** The People of the Book. **
And it is the only non-Christian holy religious book that recognises Jews as God’s Choosen people and were dearest to God as long as they follow the Commandments of God given to them through their national Prophets.

Second, it clearly tells us that NOT ALL THE PEOPLE OF THE BOOK are alike.

Third, it clearly even give examples of some groups among THE PEOPLE OF THE BOOK. One of them is ONE who is on right path, pray to God with sincerety and this will be saved.

Fourth, among Jews there were some people who went against the Law of God and they were asked by God to be like apes and pigs. Here, The Koran is not telling that all Jews are pigs and apes nor it is telling all Jews to be like apes and pigs.
It is simply addressing a specific group among Jews who were nasty.

Fifth, this address of Koran, reminds me how Jesus Christ addressed the Scribes and the Pharisees with his so many WOES, as “woe to you Scribes and the Pharisees…” in the Gospel of Matthew atleast seven times. And ofcourse this does not mean that all Scribes and Pharisees were bad guyz nor does it mean all Jews were evil.

Sixth, just like how Jesus’s repeated addressing Jews with his condemnation (with the usage of Woes and serpants, fools etc) does not mean all Jews are condemned by the Christ because the very disciples of Christ and Christ himslef was a Jew. In the same way Koran’s address to a specific group among the Jews who were transgressors, does not mean all Jews are condemned by the Koran.

Seventh, lot of Jews and Christians embraced Moslem religion, later. If all Jews were condemned by the Koran or Mohamet, then there was no way that these Jews would have become Moslem, as to be a Jew someone actually born as a Jew.

Booklover, you need to be careful when raising any objection. You must first see the whole context or ask a learned Moslem scholar for explanation because the Moslem forum members of this site may or may not be knowledgeable enough of their own holy book just like not all Catholics here are learned enough to answer all questions.

Otherwise no Moslem will take you seriously. In their eyes you will be an ignorant or trouble maker for no valid reason.

 

[inJESUS]

Muslima:

inJESUS:

These words goes for both, we are ordered to behave in well manners with every one, either Moslem or Non Moslem. When Islam spread in Syria, Egypt, Jerusalem, Iraq and all the Islamic countries since 1400 years. The rule of these countries turned out to the Muslims instead of Romans or Persians but the people were left every one to beleive what he likes, but the people of these countries embarced Islam gradually when they trated Moslems and saw the manners of Islam.

first, you are very indoctrinated with" Islam spread with peace" stuff and i’ll keep your info as such so far; second, this verse talks about BELIEVERS dear Muslima…are Christians and Jews believers as well? nop; so the verse applies to muslims.

Prophet Mohamed Peace be upon him had a jewish neighbour who used everyday to bring dust and dirts and throughit at his doorstep. One day the Prophet came out of his house and did not find this dust, he went to visit his neighbour fearing that he is may be ill at that day or in need to something.

and he also knew a jewish poetess who he killed with cold blood coz she mocked him in her poetry.

God Almighty said in Quran:
6:108: “Do not revile the idols which they invoke besides Allah, lest in their ignorance they should spitefully revile Allah.”

109:6: “You have your own religion and I have mine.”

i do not expect different verses written in MECCA where mohammad needed all non-moslems…but we all know what the quran says about “filthy” pagans and about “kuffar”.

Surely pure religion is for Allah only. And those who choose protecting friends beside Him (say): We worship them only that they may bring us near unto Allah. Lo! Allah will judge between them concerning that wherein they differ. Lo! Allah guideth not him who is a** liar, an ingrate**.

O ye who believe! Truly the Pagans are unclean

;“those who invoke a god other than Allah not only should meet punishment in this world but the Penalty on the Day of Judgment will be doubled to them, and they will dwell therein in ignominy”

didnt the quran revile them already? or is it a contradiction?

 

[inJESUS]

pleaseanswer:

Dear Booklover,

I too had the same objection, as you had. But when I read the Koran, there were few interesting things in this regard about "Jews being pigs and swines in particular and regarding the whole class of Jews, Christians and Sabaens:

First the Koran respects all Jews, Christians and Sabaens as** The People of the Book. **
And it is the only non-Christian holy religious book that recognises Jews as God’s Choosen people and were dearest to God as long as they follow the Commandments of God given to them through their national Prophets.

Second, it clearly tells us that NOT ALL THE PEOPLE OF THE BOOK are alike.

Third, it clearly even give examples of some groups among THE PEOPLE OF THE BOOK. One of them is ONE who is on right path, pray to God with sincerety and this will be saved.

Fourth, among Jews there were some people who went against the Law of God and they were asked by God to be like apes and pigs. Here, The Koran is not telling that all Jews are pigs and apes nor it is telling all Jews to be like apes and pigs.
It is simply addressing a specific group among Jews who were nasty.

Fifth, this address of Koran, reminds me how Jesus Christ addressed the Scribes and the Pharisees with his so many WOES, as “woe to you Scribes and the Pharisees…” in the Gospel of Matthew atleast seven times. And ofcourse this does not mean that all Scribes and Pharisees were bad guyz nor does it mean all Jews were evil.

Sixth, just like how Jesus’s repeated addressing Jews with his condemnation (with the usage of Woes and serpants, fools etc) does not mean all Jews are condemned by the Christ because the very disciples of Christ and Christ himslef was a Jew. In the same way Koran’s address to a specific group among the Jews who were transgressors, does not mean all Jews are condemned by the Koran.

QUOTE]

read this link:

memri.org/bin/articles.cgi?Page=archives&Area=sr&ID=SR01102
​

​

 

[Eden]

gambinosyn:

Since Christianity has done many, many horrible thinks in the past…

I disagree with this sentence. Christianity has not done many horrible things in the past. People who call themselves Christian but do not live the faith have done horrible things in the past.

and since most modern christian societies are deep rooted in drugs, alcohol, and sex, which go against God and his teachings.

I also disagree that modern Christian societies are rooted in drugs, alcohol and sex. We do not have theocracies in the West. Secularism has taken root in the West and it is secularism that is rooted in the culture of drugs, alcohol and sex. It is the rejection of Christ and his teachings, not Christianity which you are describing.

 

[inJESUS]

109:6: “You have your own religion and I have mine.”

**
Fight those who do not believe in Allah, nor in the latter day, nor do they prohibit what Allah and His Apostle have prohibited, nor follow the religion of truth, out of those who have been given the Book, until they pay the tax in acknowledgment of superiority and they are in a state of subjection ** (9:29)

contradiction? oh no…109:6 is a Mecca verse and 9:29 is a Medina one…allah/mohammad changed his mind.

 

[pleaseanswer]

Dear inJesus,

The site that you are referring me to read is of staunch Zionists who are anti-Arabs and anti-Moslems for political reasons.They are not honest while translating the Arab, Persian and Moslem sources into English. It is besically a false propaganda site to deceive ignorant people who cannot read Arabic and Persian and other languages of Moslems.

You recommendation to this bias site is like if I recommend you a Seventh Day Adentists or Jehovas Witnesses’s staunch anti-Catholic group to know about Catholicism. Would it be fair with you?

You should know first anything, from it’s own perspective. If you want to know what Catholicism is, you need to first ask Catholic learned scholars, then compare with what all others say and then make up your mind from your own.
And also remember there are plenty of anti-Catholic sites on the internet who call Rome a whore…and blah…blah…!

.

 

[Muslima]

inJESUS:

Muslima:

inJESUS:

sure, the hadith that portrays mohammad negatively is corrupt! even the sahih which is acknoledged by muslims! but what about the quran, muslima?

Torment to non-believers:
4.56: (As for) those who disbelieve in Our communications, We shall make them enter fire; so oft as their skins are thoroughly burned, We will change them for other skins, that they may taste the chastisement; surely Allah is Mighty, Wise.

No friends from outsiders
3.118: O you who believe! do not take for intimate friends from among others than your own people; they do not fall short of inflicting loss upon you; they love what distresses you; vehement hatred has already appeared from out of their mouths, and what their breasts conceal is greater still; indeed, We have made the communications clear to you, if you will understand.

Friends with Jews, Christians…
5.51: O you who believe! do not take the Jews and the Christians for friends; they are friends of each other; and whoever amongst you takes them for a friend, then surely he is one of them; surely Allah does not guide the unjust people.

No friends with non believers
4.144: O you who believe! do not take the unbelievers for friends rather than the believers; do you desire that you should give to Allah a manifest proof against yourselves?

No friends with non believers
3.28: Let not the believers take the unbelievers for friends rather than believers; and whoever does this, he shall have nothing of (the guardianship of) Allah, but you should guard yourselves against them, guarding carefully; and Allah makes you cautious of (retribution from) Himself; and to Allah is the eventual coming.

Fight non-believers
9.123: O you who believe! fight those of the unbelievers who are near to you and let them find in you hardness; and know that Allah is with those who guard (against evil).

Kill non-believers
4.89 : They desire that you should disbelieve as they have disbelieved, so that you might be (all) alike; therefore take not from among them friends until they fly (their homes) in Allah’s way; but if they turn back, then seize them and kill them wherever you find them, and take not from among them a friend or a helper

Smite the neck and cut fingertips of unbelievers
8.12: When your Lord revealed to the angels: I am with you, therefore make firm those who believe. I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off every fingertip of them.

Dera Brother,
Always wrong interpretations, and iwill always say to you go back to the history of Moslems and see how they treated Non Moslems.
Concerning the torment for non beleivers: God does not order us to torment non beleivers, He promises them that he will torment them Himself in Hell on Doomsday, (I beleive christianity says the same). This is his judge upon them because they do not beleive in Him.

Concerning being non friends to the un beleivers, the Ayat about this clearly means pegans, and those with no religion, and Islam order us not to be Awlia with them (Awlia means intimate friends) but it does not order us to kill them.

As for the verse of not to be friends to jews and nasara, I beleive that as long as you know arabic you now what Asbab Al Nozoul is. This tells us about the reason why every aya was delivered for, because their are some ayas that came for very specific reasons.This aya was delivered fro Allah because Proghet had a treaty with the people of scripture who where living with him in Madina, but they ignored this treaty and conspired to kill him, the Moslems had two opinions, an opinion says they were on a treaty with them, and that they have some benefits with them like buying and selling and so on… Another opinion said that they betrayed the treaty with the prophet and tried to kill him and accordingly they should be banished or killed. The aya came with the judge of Allah, it asked the Moslems to stop being Awlia the book of scriptures which means stop dealing with them for that particular situation, not for all jews and christians, and if this is true as you claim, how can you think of all the Moslems who lived for 1300 years with christians as neighbours and friends, of course they were not disobeying God all of them. Even the Khaliva Salladin who fought the Crusades when they tried to invade the East, his Chief Commandor and best friend was a christian.
The Aya of killing the non beleivers it was also about a special tribe that fought the Prophet, they were like the outlaws in today’s society.

The last aya you mentioned was delivered from Allah while they were fighting pegans, Allah was urging Moslems during the battle to be brave and not to fear pegans and to kill them as they are the enemies of God. I beleive that during any war, the commandor or chief asks his soldiers to be brave and to fight well against the enemy.

Peace be upon you
Moslema

 

[inJESUS]

pleaseanswer:

Dear inJesus,

The site that you are referring me to read is of staunch Zionists who are anti-Arabs and anti-Moslems for political reasons.They are not honest while translating the Arab, Persian and Moslem sources into English. It is besically a false propaganda site to deceive ignorant people who cannot read Arabic and Persian and other languages of Moslems.

You recommendation to this bias site is like if I recommend you a Seventh Day Adentists or Jehovas Witnesses’s staunch anti-Catholic group to know about Catholicism. Would it be fair with you?

You should know first anything, from it’s own perspective. If you want to know what Catholicism, you need to first ask Catholic learned scholars, then compare with what all others say and then make up your mind from your own.
And also remember there are plenty of anti-Catholic sites on the internet who call Rome a whore…and blah…blah…!

.

sure bro…the evidences they gave are not the truth? if not, can you provide them in arabic please?

 

[Eden]

We had a Muslim poster here months ago who told us that in Islam the world is divided into two parts: The Theater of Peace (Islamic countries) and The Theater of War (infidel countries).

Perhaps we as Westerners are confusing the meaning of these two theaters.

It seems to me that dividing the world in this way creates the West as an enemy or a place of confrontation. Can someone of the Muslim faith better explain the two halves of the world in a way that does not seem so confrontational to a non-Muslim like me? I would really like to understand this idea better.

 

[inJESUS]

Pleaseanswer : you mean that indeed allah turned some jews into apes or you are arguing whether it is metaphorical?