It is NOT immoral to vote for Democrats

[Augustinian]

The Democrats gerrymander districts when they get a chance as well. Here in Pennsylvania, the Democrats took control of the State Supreme Court and the governor’s chair, and re-worked all the districts into their favor for today’s elections.

And that’s even with the state legislature in the hands of the GOP.

 

[MikeInVA]

What if you believe the position of the Republican party makes the problem of abortion WORSE, as historical statistics show?
What if you think ending birthright citizenship will increase abortions?
What if you think being pro-life also means being against the death penalty?
What if you think being pro-life means affordable health care for all people?
What if you think being pro-life means supporting the less fortunate rather than giving money to the rich and hoping they eventually give it to charities that aren’t corrupt?

I could go on and on.

Sounds like the seamless garment argument, which generally ends up supporting the decision to vote for a pro-abortion candidate.

 

[LateCatholic]

I’m really offended. I’ve studied demographic and social trends in the US for decades. The current President is an uncivilized anomaly.

My point is to simply show that Trump uses know psychological techniques to trick people, and he focuses on those groups that are most susceptible to those tricks.
Not everyone that votes for him falls into those categories.
But, it is well-known that Trump is using techniques used throughout history.

Attacking the media. Demonizing your opponents. Lying. Lying. Lying.
Trump lies so much, when he tells the truth it actually shocks people. This is by design.

As I said, right out of the history books.
The good news is these techniques only succeed in the short term.
Eventually people see through it.

 

[LateCatholic]

Sounds like the seamless garment argument, which generally ends up supporting the decision to vote for a pro-abortion candidate.

I’ll give you a simple example. Do you think ending birthright citizenship will increase or decrease abortions?
It certainly isn’t a pro-life position now, is it?

 

[phil19034]

@LateCatholic

sex education - very few Republican politicians (except ones from the Religious Rite) are against sex education. However, most Republicans do believe that sex education should NOT include how to engage in sexual sin, and that parents should have the right to excuse their children from anything that violates their religious beliefs.

contraception - I’ve never heard a Republican politician go against contraception. Very few Protestants (even Religious Rite protestants) view contraception as sinful. And Catholic Republican politicians know that there is zero political will in either party to seriously attempt to make contraception illegal. However, AGAIN, Republicans do believe in parental rights. Most of us do not believe that it’s OK for doctors, schools, sports, etc to give contraception to our children (who are minors) without our consent.

adoption and foster care - we Republicans are totally, 100% in favor of these. Not sure where you get the idea that Republicans are not.

equal women’s rights in the workplace – not sure where the idea comes from that Republicans are against equal rights for women in the workplace. What we are not in favor of though, is broad, blanket regulations that hurt small businesses which cannot afford the same kind of paid maternity leave as big corporations. You want to place paid maternity leave laws on large companies, I’m all for it. But don’t put regulations on small business that they cannot financially afford. And if you want the maternity leave to be paid for by taxes, then get your state to offer it. Don’t do such a thing on the federal level.

healthcare you want more govt health care, then get the states to do it. We have 50 states, plus DC and the territories. That’s a lot of laboratories to experiment and figure out what works the best. The United States is too large and too diverse (ideologically, state laws, values, etc) to effectively execute social and domestic polices at the federal level.

support of the poor - Yes, Republicans support the poor. I’ve read statistics that show that Republicans donate more money to the poor and to groups that help the poor than democrats do. Democrats often donate to the arts, universities, etc. Again, we believe that the local level: non-profits & Churches, with support from local, county and state govts are far better at helping the poor than the federal govt.
– btw - I grew up poor. At one point in my childhood, my parents qualified for food stamps. But my parents refused to go on food stamps and my dad worked hard to make more money, while my mother stayed home to rear me and my siblings. At one point, my mother did work for a little during nights at a department store when I was in Kindergarten & First grade. But then eventually stopped when my dad got a better job. And I even was part of the free lunch program for a while. Yet during that whole time - my family was conservative and still are today. So don’t say we don’t support the poor, because I grew up poor. If it wasn’t for my grandparents, we would not have had nice clothes.

God bless

 

[edwest]

I hope so. I saw through it during the election campaign.

 

[LateCatholic]

Keep in mind Trump did not win the popular vote

This was in response to a comment that “Trump resonates with so many people”.
My point - less than half.

 

[MikeInVA]

I’ll give you a simple example. Do you think ending birthright citizenship will increase or decrease abortions?
It certainly isn’t a pro-life position now, is it?

I think the decision will have no effect on abortion. Please feel free to provide any evidence otherwise. My wife works with young unwed (and probably illegal) immigrant mothers through Project Gabriel. They are not having babies to anchor themselves to the U.S., they’re having babies because they have relations out of wedlock.

 

[ChristMyLife]

seems too much of a southern US, Gulf Coast symbol. Like something you’d see on a sign for a yacht club

The pelican represents the Passion of Christ and the Holy Eucharist.

Pelican - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

 

[KMC]

LateCatholic:

The Republican party is the official home of bigots, racists, sexists, war-mongers, neo-Nazis, anti-science and anti-education, and anyone who hates the poor and down-trodden. They just don’t want to admit it.

Viewpoints like this are why Trump won, honestly. Democrats have spent years dehumanizing, labeling and demonizing repilublicans and then someone like Trump came along and stood up against it, no matter how crudely, and democrats are shocked that he resonates with so many people? Keep dehumanizing and labeling, if you want republican support to just keep growing.

I’ve seen Democrat leaders defend the humanity of MS-13 and attack the humanity of Trump.

 

[Augustinian]

The pelican represents the Passion of Christ and the Holy Eucharist.

The pelican also represents the Great State of Louisiana, because of the high population that have traditionally lived there.

 

[LateCatholic]

Before going further, thanks for the reasonable response. As I mentioned earlier, I have voted Republican in the recent past. So I don’t say all Republicans are like this. A moderate Republican is better than a radical Democrat. Unfortunately, I really doubt moderate Republicans now exist. Thus…

sex education - very few Republican politicians (except ones from the Religious Rite) are against sex education.

This was tru in the past but the far right now dominates the party.

contraception - I’ve never heard a Republican politician go against contraception.

The most effective way to stop unwanted pregnancy is first free contraception and real sex education. Studies have shown that sex education promoting only abstinence increases teen pregnancy, whereas legitimate education reduces it. Maybe you agree.
Note also that free contraception provided by health insurance is actually cost neutral. It is the same way with your flu shot. Giving a free flu shot saves insurance companies in the long run. So does free contraception.
So why are Republicans against it?

I’ve read statistics that show that Republicans donate more money to the poor and to groups that help the poor than democrats do.

I’m sure there are good people on both sides. The most generous people in history are atheists: Gates, Buffet, Zuck.

adoption and foster care - we Republicans are totally, 100% in favor of these. Not sure where you get the idea that Republicans are not.

I am directly involved in the abortion and foster care programs in my state. Saying you are in favor and then cutting funding is hypocritical.

healthcare you want more govt health care, then get the states to do it.

This is fine but then why don’t Republicans push that, instead of total anarchy which is their current proposal.
Even Republicans are now panicking because they think their lawsuit in Texas will actually win and totally destroy healthcare in this country. Note how Trump asked that the ruling be delayed until AFTER the election.

 

[phil19034]

phil19034:

The Democrats do that too with their identity politics. The Dems today closely follow Saul Alinsky’s Rules for Radicals. Trump on the other hand is just borrowing from the Democrat’s play book.

That does not make it right. I am just pointing out the techniques that Trump is using. He loves the religious, the uneducated, and the bigots. That is a FACT. You are certainly welcome to bring similar criticisms against the Democrats. They certainly do leverage and identify politics. That’s a fair point.

What bothers me about Trump is how is LIES. Nearly everything his says is a lie to trick people, especially those susceptible to lies like the uneducated, bigots, and religious.

I NEVER said it was right. I have a lot of issues with what Trump says and the dirty politics he engages in. Again - I didn’t want him. And I still cringe when he does/says something stupid or wrong.

However, what bothers me more is when people say all Republicans are racists, bigots, neo-nazis, etc. I pinched my nose and voted for Trump over Hillary (would do it again too, can’t stand Hillary). But it makes me upset when I hear people on the news call all Trump voters racists. It upsets me when I hear liberals say that women will die if a pro-life person is appointed to the Supreme Court. it upsets me when I see videos of people walk up to pro-life information booths and sidewalk prayers and punch them, kick them, rip up their signs, etc.

BTW - Maybe Trump learned everything from the Democrats? After all, he was a Democrat for most of his life and was friends with all the NYC Democrats for all those years.

 

[MikeInVA]

The most effective way to stop unwanted pregnancy is first free contraception and real sex education.

No, teaching children to wait until they are married is the most effective way, but a lot of people don’t want to have that talk with their kids.

 

[DENNYINMI]

Again - there are total dirt bags in both parties, but what the do the parties officially stand for? Republicans are not neo-nazis because we stand by Israel. Who shot up the synagogue, a life long democrat who just switched to the Republican party and who hated Trump. My thought, he switched to vote against someone in a primary. Who vandalized the synagogue in NYC? A democrat activists who used to work for the NYC Mayor’s office.

God bless.

Swinging the hand bag at a very ill person who shot up a synagogue is/was no different than a very sick individual that shot up a children’s classroom in Newtown Conn. leaving 28 people dead, 20 of them CHILDREN, and if we did little to nothing to remedy the situation then…How, in heavens name are we to believe America will do anything to prevent these further types of tragedy’s now? Shame on us.
We enforced massive laws to the detriment of anyone who believes he can get behind the wheel of car while under the influence, and rightly so!~ Yet, we do nothing to tighten laws concerning common sense gun laws. The holier than thou “I’ve got my Gun Rights” Wild West crowd has taken precedent over other rights to “life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness” because those in the line of that gun fire are dead.
Excuse those of us that are finding it more and more difficult to find the needed compassion because it has become common place in our country. The NRA rhetoric is more important than those children were and as of late the Temple massacre. We watch certain members of our society and government officials worship at the alter of Guns along side the heretics (NRA and manufacturers)$$. Where were their rights and the rights of those 20 children, babies at that!~

We have a lot to say about the rights of those unborn and have done nothing to protect the rights of those already here, dying in the line of gun fire in an American school system, seemingly forgotten after all the “thoughts and prayers”………

And as for your comment regarding “Stand by Israel”, they do indeed have a right to a country, safety, and life. They can thank the U.S. for many of their weapons of war that allow for it. Yet many “Israelis’” themselves do not want to be identified as Zionists, they believe their common ground is their religion, not a state! The Orthodox and the Ultra Orthodox especially reject the concept of the State of Israel.
Point: We can stand by Israel in the same way we should stand by Mexico or any other refugee, without a special preference based on religion and a consideration for those escaping persecution within their homeland. I believe that was the plight of the Jews at one time. Unfortunately we put hold on their migration at one time too, which proved detrimental to millions of them.

 

[Augustinian]

Giving a free flu shot saves insurance companies in the long run. So does free contraception.
So why are Republicans against it?

Republicans are against MANDATING that employers provide free contraception or abortion as part of health care.

It violates people’s religious rights under the Constitution, and that trumps any considerations of bean countery.

 

[edwest]

Regarding contraception. No amount of sex education will stop the current STD epidemic in the United States.

 

[phil19034]

The most effective way to stop unwanted pregnancy is first free contraception and real sex education. Studies have shown that sex education promoting only abstinence increases teen pregnancy, whereas legitimate education reduces it. Maybe you agree.
Note also that free contraception provided by health insurance is actually cost neutral. It is the same way with your flu shot. Giving a free flu shot saves insurance companies in the long run. So does free contraception.
So why are Republicans against it?

AGAIN - We are NOT against it. What we are against is violating parent’s rights.

 

[MikeInVA]

We can stand by Israel in the same way we should stand by Mexico or any other refugee, without a special preference based on religion

We stand by Israel because it is the only stable country in the region, not because it is the Jewish state.

 

[ChristMyLife]

Gates, Buffet, Zuck.

None of them are atheists.

Bill Gates is a Catholic Christian.

Warren Buffet was raised Presbyterian Christian and is now agnostic.

Mark Zuckerberg was raised Jewish but now identifies as a Buddhist and has shown Christian sympathies.

Just thought I should point that out

Oh and while we’re talking about super rich people, the richest man in the world, Jeff Bezos, is a Christian.