I've snapped

[Della]

Dear all,

Firstly I would like to apologise for encouraging you to follow my example. I should never seek to lead anyone astray no matter what I am feeling inside.

I have been moved by the generosity of some of your replies to what was a very angry OP. There is no excuse for what I wrote, but it was written in the middle of a very low point when I was feeling very angry and upset. I thank those of you, who prayed for me, and if I could be so bold, I would ask you to continue to pray for me.

Of course you have our prayers. We’re all in this together, after all. It’s why St. Paul called us “the Body of Christ.”

Your kind comments made me ashamed of what I wrote. I forgot that our Lord Jesus Christ was tempted in every way that we are, and remained without sin. Even more than that, he allowed himself to be taken prisoner, scourged, mocked and put to death in the most agonising fashion whilst all the while praying for sinners. To quote Isaiah “and through his wounds we are healed.”.

This kind of shame is a good sign–it shows that you have a tender conscience open to correction. Keep it. It’ll be your salvation. :yup:

My faith is very weak. I haven’t been to mass for months, and to be honest I am now nervous about returning to the same church and having to explain to people where I have been. Even when I was attending mass, I did not pray on a regular basis because I don’t know how to. I end up saying some set prayers like Hail Holy Queen, the Our Father, Hail Mary and the Apostles Creed, then just kind of reel off a wish list which I’m sure is not how it’s supposed to work. Then when the things on the list don’t happen, I start to question if my prayers are being listened to which is completely unfair on my part. Any advice on how to pray properly would be appreciated.

One of the things I appreciated so much when I became Catholic was that people weren’t ready to judge my every action as sinful or not sinful. No one is going to judge you for being away from Mass. With so many Masses we can attend who is keeping score as to who is at what Mass? No one.

As for prayer, the best prayer routine is: the Liturgy of the Hours/Divine Office. Morning and Evening Prayer are easy to follow and all you need as a basis for a healthy, fruitful prayer life. The LOTH goes through the Church seasons, solemnities, feasts, memorials, etc., keeping us in line with one another in prayer. Each office only takes about 10 minutes to pray. You can add your own intentions–your own private prayers just before praying the Our Father. Catholicism is practiced not merely believed, so practicing the faith by joining in the Daily Prayer of the Church is the best way to be steady in prayer, whether you’re up or down or anywhere in between. You may also want to get one of the versions for lay people called Shorter Christian Prayer. It can be found at any Catholic bookstore/gift shop or look for it online.

[edited out because of word limit.]

Finally on the topic of mortal sin, that someone mentioned. I am confused by it all. Because through a previous thread on this forum, I decided to stop receiving the Eucharist until I had confessed my sin of masturbation and non procreatal sex with my wife. I was in a difficult situation because my wife was threatening to leave me if I insisted on only having sex that was open to procreation. So it seemed to me that I was going to go against the church no matter what I did. I went to see my Parish priest for advice, and he told me that my marriage was the most important thing, and if certain church teachings were harming my marriage, then I had to question whether those teachings were right for me. Furthermore he told me that it is virtually impossible to commit a mortal sin, as for a sin to be mortal, it had to be considered grave, committed with knowledge of it’s seriousness and committed with the deliberate intent of hurting God, even if all those conditions were met, there would be reasons that drove you to that in the first place that would mitigate it. So he encouraged me to always receive the Eucharist no matter what. But people here seem to have different views on the matter.

I addressed these issues in my other post, but I’ll repeat a bit of it here and add something in the light of your added information. Masturbation is indeed a mortal sin, but if it is habitual and you are addicted, your culpability for it is lessened to that of venial sin. So confess it and be at peace as you struggle with this problem. As for having “non-procreatal” sex with your wife. If she is taking contraception that is her sin (mortal or venial depending on her knowledge and intent) not your sin. Having sex with her under this circumstance is not sin for you. Nor do you need to break up your marriage over it. Instead, be a good witness of God’s love to her, pray for her, and continue to be a faithful husband to her, and hopefully, in time her fears will dissolve so that she will, of her own free will, give up contracepting. Do receive the Eucharist in your situation because it will strengthen your faith by giving you God’s graces. Satan wants nothing more than to keep you from Christ and to make you and your wife miserable in your marriage. You are not responsible if you wife contracepts–that is her decision, although I can see how it would be painful for you. Love her and be patient–that is the way to win another person over to the truth.

Sorry for boring you all with this long post. But if anyone could offer me advice on any of the above, then please do.

Don’t worry about it. :console: We want to help you, our brother in Christ, in all the ways that lie open to us. God bless you and your wife. You both have my prayers.

 

[Mystical_Seeker]

Remember that while many people quote the account of the woman caught in adultery, they tend to forget the very end where Our Lord tells her, “Go and sin no more.” He didn’t say, “Go, adultery isn’t really a sin anyway as long as you were sincere and had good intentions.” He said point-blank don’t do it again.

Nobody forgets what He said. She knew she had sinned. Everybody knew it. There was no “gray area” here. He was not using any super-powers to figure it out. It was public knowledge.

The fact remains, she did not ask for forgiveness, and He didn’t offer it, because He hadn’t condemned. It was man that condemned her for her sins, not God.

Next you’ll tell me about “binding and loosing” and how the Church has the authority to say what sin is and isn’t. And you’ll be right but that doesn’t reduce my point.

 

[AKDee]

Nobody forgets what He said. She knew she had sinned. Everybody knew it. There was no “gray area” here. He was not using any super-powers to figure it out. It was public knowledge.

The fact remains, she did not ask for forgiveness, and He didn’t offer it, because He hadn’t condemned. It was man that condemned her for her sins, not God.

That’s not how I read that story at all. She may not have asked for forgiveness (it’s unlikely she knew Jesus was God incarnate) but Jesus did offer it. He said “then neither do I condemn you. Now go and sin no more.” He chose not to condemn her (thus offering forgiveness) and gave her a command not to do it again (thus confirming that He Himself saw it as a sin).

 

[BobCatholic]

Suddenly it’s become clear to me, that the issue is not with me, it’s with the archaic backward thinking dogma that’s been rammed down my throat.

Actually it is the other way around.

The modern society has rammed down the throat the idea that the dogma is “archaic” and “backward”. You have the media, the government, the schools, the colleges, the politicians, the talking heads, the universities, shoving this idea down your throat.

So no wonder you snapped. Now, get back up and come home.

 

[Scottgun]

Nobody forgets what He said. She knew she had sinned. Everybody knew it. There was no “gray area” here. He was not using any super-powers to figure it out. It was public knowledge.

The fact remains, she did not ask for forgiveness, and He didn’t offer it, because He hadn’t condemned. It was man that condemned her for her sins, not God.

Next you’ll tell me about “binding and loosing” and how the Church has the authority to say what sin is and isn’t. And you’ll be right but that doesn’t reduce my point.

If you are just going to skim until offended and ignore everything else, please don’t respond because helping the OP is more important than logic-chopping one passage of Scripture (which I used merely as introductory material and not really directed at you in any case). Now if you have any suggestions on help the OP stop rationalizing the grave sin of masturbation and how he can stop it altogether, by all means let’s hear it. Otherwise, don’t be a stumbling block please.

 

[Mystical_Seeker]

That’s not how I read that story at all. She may not have asked for forgiveness (it’s unlikely she knew Jesus was God incarnate) but Jesus did offer it. He said “then neither do I condemn you. Now go and sin no more.” He chose not to condemn her (thus offering forgiveness) and gave her a command not to do it again (thus confirming that He Himself saw it as a sin).

Yes he confirmed it was a sin to commit adultery. That is directly against a commandment and was known by all.

The way you are describing is entirely fair; our differences lie in the way I’m looking at the term “forgiveness”. The reason I was making such a big deal out of it was that I see “forgiveness” as a remedial measure for someone having been judged and I see “not condemning” as even more profound than forgiveness. So yes for humans who can hardly fail to judge it is about forgiveness, but God chose not to condemn once the humans retracted their judgment, therefore no need to formally “forgive” her. To me this tells a story about men who wish to judge and condemn in the name of God, when God Himself has no desire to condemn at all. I consider this extremely profound, but not entirely from this one incident but since this one is often discussed it is a familiar story.

If you are just going to skim until offended and ignore everything else, please don’t respond because helping the OP is more important than logic-chopping one passage of Scripture (which I used merely as introductory material and not really directed at you in any case). Now if you have any suggestions on help the OP stop rationalizing the grave sin of masturbation and how he can stop it altogether, by all means let’s hear it. Otherwise, don’t be a stumbling block please.

My intent was to spread light on the extent of the goodness of God, who fails to condemn while humans do and unless Jesus intervened would have killed her. It is not about Jesus being a judmental moralist, as story after story and parable after parable backs up.

I’m sorry you find that opinions that don’t match yours are unhelpful. If you wish to get into who is sidetracking whose point, here is what I was responding to, after I had been the only one to mention the story.:

Remember that while many people quote the account of the woman caught in adultery, they tend to forget the very end where Our Lord tells her, “Go and sin no more.” He didn’t say, “Go, adultery isn’t really a sin anyway as long as you were sincere and had good intentions.” He said point-blank don’t do it again.

It’s kind of funny that you claim that “people who quote” [what I had just quoted] don’t “tend” to know what we are talking about, and “tend to” conveniently leave out part of the story. I challenge you to find me where the woman either asks for forgiveness, where Jesus told her specifically “your sins are forgiven” (like he did the woman who was washing His feet) and I will retract my comments. Until then I will simply be amused at your making blind claims about other posters’ lack of Biblical knowledge, and then lecture me about sidetracking your point, which was in fact to poo-poo my point.

But I know that was not your intent. Your intent was to help the OP, but also to control what others [such as the “many people” like me, who would mention the account of the adultress in this context] were contributing. Prove me wrong in my claims and like I said I will retract it. Until then if you continue to make random snipes about ‘people who bring up this story’ then I will reserve the right to opine on it. If you don’t want to hear more from me, then either tell me where I am wrong or leave it be instead of making it into an egoic argument.

It is Catholics being judgmental and legalistic that leads people into scrupulous behaviors and not that I’m saying the OP is an example of scrupulosity, the insistence that we should judge and condemn in the name of Jesus is IMO a problem in and of itself, that confuses the Word and distorts truth.

Jn 18:23
Jesus answered him, “If I have spoken wrongly, testify to the wrong; but if I have spoken rightly, why do you strike me?”

Now unless you have other issues with me, you are welcome to return to ministering to the OP instead of minimizing others’ efforts to do the same. Even if you think I’m scum please consider what St. Paul said about the “less honorable” members of the Body of Christ:

1 Cor 12:22-27
Indeed, the parts of the body that seem to be weaker are all the more necessary, and those parts of the body that we consider less honorable we surround with greater honor, and our less presentable parts are treated with greater propriety, whereas our more presentable parts do not need this. But God has so constructed the body as to give greater honor to a part that is without it, so that there may be no division in the body, but that the parts may have the same concern for one another. If [one] part suffers, all the parts suffer with it; if one part is honored, all the parts share its joy.

 

[PhilXavier]

I’d like to thank everyone again for their kind words of advice. Mystical Seeker, I shall seek out that Prayer guide on audible. I have a subscription to Magnificat which contains amongst other things, the morning and evening offices of the church each day. I am endeavouring to say these each day as a way of starting a prayer life. I have a rosary and am going to try to work that in also. I have also resolved to make a firm commitment to stop masturbating, although I am not confident that I will shed this sin indefinitely as I have only gone 20 something days in the past before the physical and mental torment causes me to lapse. So please pray for me that I will be able to resist temptation and stand strong in the face of suffering.

Does anyone have any advice on how I can handle the situation with my wife? In the past when I’ve started praying and ceased to masturbate, she has gotten really defensive with me and tells me that I 'm turning into a religious maniac again. She isn’t a bad person, I know I have painted her in a bad light, but she is really quite loving and kind. She just isn’t religious and tries to limit my religious involvement. I suppose it might scare her a bit. She’s always scornful when I fast and abstain from meat on Ash Wednesday and Good Friday, and I end up praying in secret when she is asleep so as not to worry her, and as for stopping masturbating I can rely on no encouragement from her as she actively encourages me to do it and will be quite angry if I tell her I have stopped. I feel it’s foolish to cause conflict in a marriage over stuff like this, and I can be quite selfish at times and am certainly not the perfect husband although I have never been unfaithful , but I don’t think I’m the one being unreasonable on this matter so any advice would be greatly appreciated.

 

[Scottgun]

Well Mystical Seeker. Gr8 B8 M8 and God bless you.

Phil, glad to see you have resolved to stop. I wife that isn’t very supportive I imagine is a hard road to travel and I don’t have any experience in that. I suppose try to keep communication open and that she knows self-mastery is important to you.

 

[AKDee]

Does anyone have any advice on how I can handle the situation with my wife? In the past when I’ve started praying and ceased to masturbate, she has gotten really defensive with me and tells me that I 'm turning into a religious maniac again. She isn’t a bad person, I know I have painted her in a bad light, but she is really quite loving and kind. She just isn’t religious and tries to limit my religious involvement. I suppose it might scare her a bit. She’s always scornful when I fast and abstain from meat on Ash Wednesday and Good Friday, and I end up praying in secret when she is asleep so as not to worry her, and as for stopping masturbating I can rely on no encouragement from her as she actively encourages me to do it and will be quite angry if I tell her I have stopped. I feel it’s foolish to cause conflict in a marriage over stuff like this, and I can be quite selfish at times and am certainly not the perfect husband although I have never been unfaithful , but I don’t think I’m the one being unreasonable on this matter so any advice would be greatly appreciated.

I struggled with this sin (and still feel tempted daily) - yes, even women have this problem. I began asking Our Lady to help me with resisting and would say a Hail Mary when I would feel tempted. It’s helped tremendously.

With your wife, I think because she is a loving and good person, I would explain to her how important your faith is to you and that while you respect her decision to not be religious that you need her to respect your need for prayer, fasting, and to avoid sin. I’m sure you already do, but pray for her also, that God will soften her heart and draw her to Him. I’m always touched by the passage in John 6:44: “No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him; and I will raise him up on the last day.” - to me, that’s a reminder to pray constantly for non-believers that God will draw them to faith in Christ. My fiance is agnostic, and while he likely thinks I’m a bit of a kook with my faith, he is fully supportive of it. And that’s critical.

 

[Here_For_Donuts]

I’m not religious, though I’ve been considering becoming Catholic for the past decade or so.

That being said, I quit porn and masturbation when I found a website called yourbrainonporn.com. It offers a purely scientific explanation as to the harm porn/masturbation causes. Yes, quitting is extremely difficult during the first couple of months, but the brain does balance itself out. You just need to have will power. (If I can do it as an unbaptized guy without the grace of God or the Sacraments, you can do it!) I can remember a time when I was constantly desiring sex/masturbation, but I promise it goes away eventually–not completely, but it becomes much easier after the initial months of quitting cold turkey. The whole “perpetually horny abstinence” thing is a Hollywood myth.

The “trick,” if you can call it that, is to simply not think about it. If you find yourself thinking or dwelling on it, just…stop.

Saint Augustine talks about sexual temptation at length, and he’s far wiser than me, so I’d defer you to him.

Regarding the Church’s teaching on homosexuality, you should be clear on it, but your Church teaches that discrimination against homosexuals is wrong. I can’t recall the exact passage in the Catechism, but find it and figure out a way to state it simply in your own words.

I suppose that to follow Christ is to be an enemy of this world. I know it’s easy for me to offer these words without having experienced it, but each time you face public rebuke for being Christian, feel fortunate that Jesus invited you in that moment to carry your cross and follow him, and that you’re able to bear witness to Christ as a member of His Church and…

Please pray for me so that I might make up my mind to become Catholic before I die. I’m only 26, but with my luck I’d get hit by a truck the day I finally decide to go to a church.

 

[AKDee]

Please pray for me so that I might make up my mind to become Catholic before I die. I’m only 26, but with my luck I’d get hit by a truck the day I finally decide to go to a church.

It sounds to me like you already are convinced. Call your local Parish. RCIA just started in most Parishes- you’re only a couple weeks behind. Take the classes. They are not a commitment in themselves, but most Parishes will want you to take the classes before you can be Baptized (if you haven’t already been Baptized) and Confirmed.

I started at this time last year (two weeks late!) after discerning for about 3 years that I felt that Catholicism was probably the true faith. The classes were absolutely worth it, I would do it again in a heartbeat, and not only did I learn the fundamentals of the faith but also made what I think are lasting friendships.

I will pray for you, but encourage you to just step up and start RCIA.

Edit to add: I wish I’d converted at your age. I made most of my biggest mistakes in my 20’s and early 30’s. Oh, the trouble (and sin) I would have saved myself!

 

[1990Domer]

Dear all,

I’ve been struggling to conform to the teachings of the church for many years and have mostly failed. I was thinking on this recently and I realised that the sins I struggle with most, I don’t actually agree that they are sinful in the first place. I mean if I choose to masturbate, who am I harming? If my wife and I choose to engage in non-procreative sex acts who are we harming? I realise that these practices are deemed sinful because they are entirely lustful. But I reject that argument. It is possible for a non-procreative sex acts to take place within the context of a loving relationship, just as much as sex that’s open to procreation can take place in an entirely lustful context. I imagine you might mention masturbation being entirely lustful. So what I don’t see why that’s wrong as long as no one is harmed.

I have lost friends and been called a bigot for blindly preaching the churches teaching on homosexuality and same sex marriage. Again I find myself questioning why I did this as they don’t appear to be harming anyone. Worse than that, I’ve felt like a hypocrite due to my own struggles with masturbation, and having non-procreative sex with my wife.

Suddenly it’s become clear to me, that the issue is not with me, it’s with the archaic backward thinking dogma that’s been rammed down my throat.

Henceforth I am going to continue all my supposedly sinful practices, only from now on I won’t feel guilty about it. When I choose to attend church, I will still receive the Eucharist without any guilt because I haven’t done anything wrong.

I encourage everyone else to do the same.

Having not read the replies, encouraging this is a mortal sin.

 

[808Catholic]

I’d like to thank everyone again for their kind words of advice. Mystical Seeker, I shall seek out that Prayer guide on audible. I have a subscription to Magnificat which contains amongst other things, the morning and evening offices of the church each day. I am endeavouring to say these each day as a way of starting a prayer life. I have a rosary and am going to try to work that in also. I have also resolved to make a firm commitment to stop masturbating, although I am not confident that I will shed this sin indefinitely as I have only gone 20 something days in the past before the physical and mental torment causes me to lapse. So please pray for me that I will be able to resist temptation and stand strong in the face of suffering.

Does anyone have any advice on how I can handle the situation with my wife? In the past when I’ve started praying and ceased to masturbate, she has gotten really defensive with me and tells me that I 'm turning into a religious maniac again. She isn’t a bad person, I know I have painted her in a bad light, but she is really quite loving and kind. She just isn’t religious and tries to limit my religious involvement. I suppose it might scare her a bit. She’s always scornful when I fast and abstain from meat on Ash Wednesday and Good Friday, and I end up praying in secret when she is asleep so as not to worry her, and as for stopping masturbating I can rely on no encouragement from her as she actively encourages me to do it and will be quite angry if I tell her I have stopped. I feel it’s foolish to cause conflict in a marriage over stuff like this, and I can be quite selfish at times and am certainly not the perfect husband although I have never been unfaithful , but I don’t think I’m the one being unreasonable on this matter so any advice would be greatly appreciated.

WRT your habit/addiction to masturbation and your relationship with your wife, I suggest you don’t say anything to her unless she broaches the subject first. If she does, one tactic may be to explain to her “Honey, I’ve heard some advice from friends that I’d like to try out. They tell me it works wonders for them personally and their wives love it.”

The focus of any marriage is God and through Him our spouses. By choosing to not masturbate, you can focus your physical intimacy on your wife better; she becomes your primary partner and not just an actor in an impersonal act. When you focus on her, she will feel the difference in your actions because it will be driven by your love of her not just a physical need to release chemicals/hormones into your brain. If she’s hesitant and think that you’re going all “religious” on her, ask her to bear with you because you want to do this for HER. Ask if she’s willing to put up with this “temporary” change so you can see what your friends were talking about. If it doesn’t work and she still hates it after the “temporary” trial period, you can always go back to the way it was before and try something else. If it works, you’ll have taken one step (and that’s all God asks of us at any given time) forward and your wife may follow your lead.

God Bless you.

 

[808Catholic]

I’m not religious, though I’ve been considering becoming Catholic for the past decade or so.

That being said, I quit porn and masturbation when I found a website called yourbrainonporn.com. It offers a purely scientific explanation as to the harm porn/masturbation causes. Yes, quitting is extremely difficult during the first couple of months, but the brain does balance itself out. You just need to have will power. (If I can do it as an unbaptized guy without the grace of God or the Sacraments, you can do it!) I can remember a time when I was constantly desiring sex/masturbation, but I promise it goes away eventually–not completely, but it becomes much easier after the initial months of quitting cold turkey. The whole “perpetually horny abstinence” thing is a Hollywood myth.

The “trick,” if you can call it that, is to simply not think about it. If you find yourself thinking or dwelling on it, just…stop.

Saint Augustine talks about sexual temptation at length, and he’s far wiser than me, so I’d defer you to him.

Regarding the Church’s teaching on homosexuality, you should be clear on it, but your Church teaches that discrimination against homosexuals is wrong. I can’t recall the exact passage in the Catechism, but find it and figure out a way to state it simply in your own words.

I suppose that to follow Christ is to be an enemy of this world. I know it’s easy for me to offer these words without having experienced it, but each time you face public rebuke for being Christian, feel fortunate that Jesus invited you in that moment to carry your cross and follow him, and that you’re able to bear witness to Christ as a member of His Church and…

Please pray for me so that I might make up my mind to become Catholic before I die. I’m only 26, but with my luck I’d get hit by a truck the day I finally decide to go to a church.

Hey Donuts, welcome home! I know you haven’t committed to becoming one with the Catholic Church yet but you really SOUND Catholic! Thanks for your encouraging post; I’m sure it will help many including the OP. BTW, as the Pope says, not everyone in heaven will be Catholics. I truly believe this as well. There’s a lot of Church doctrine backing the salvation of those not baptized in the Catholic faith or even Christian belief so don’t sweat getting hit by a truck tomorrow! God has your back!

Please continue to pray on whether you’d like to enter the Catholic Church. Our prayers will be with you and anyone else who is discerning whether the Church is their “home” or not. God Bless you.

 

[Here_For_Donuts]

@AKDee and 808Catholic:

I don’t mean to hijack the OP’s thread by talking about myself here. I’ll just say that the little bit I do know comes from casual reading of the Catechism and other stuff. In fact, I’m completely undecided between becoming Catholic or Orthodox, so that’s more reason not to put too much weight to my words. (I actually posted a lot on here several years ago under a different name. I was a bit hot-headed back then, though. I was even a bit hot-headed in a post I made a few days ago questioning the papacy.)

My family is traditionally Catholic. However, they haven’t practiced it since my mother was a little girl. I’ve never even stepped foot in a church, and I have no idea how I’ve come this far except by God.

Oh, there’s one interesting incident I recall happening to me. When I was about 19 I worked up the courage to visit a Catholic Church. I’m asocial and shy, so this was a big deal for me. Anyway, I walked up the steps, only to realize that the building had been condemned and boarded up. When I turned back down to walk home, a pure white pigeon landed on the sidewalk before me. It stayed put as I walked past, seemingly unafraid. (Maybe it was a sign? I don’t know, but it’s nice to think so.)

Ok, I’m done hijacking the thread.

 

[808Catholic]

@AKDee and 808Catholic:

I don’t mean to hijack the OP’s thread by talking about myself here. I’ll just say that the little bit I do know comes from casual reading of the Catechism and other stuff. In fact, I’m completely undecided between becoming Catholic or Orthodox, so that’s more reason not to put too much weight to my words. (I actually posted a lot on here several years ago under a different name. I was a bit hot-headed back then, though. I was even a bit hot-headed in a post I made a few days ago questioning the papacy.)

My family is traditionally Catholic. However, they haven’t practiced it since my mother was a little girl. I’ve never even stepped foot in a church, and I have no idea how I’ve come this far except by God.

Oh, there’s one interesting incident I recall happening to me. When I was about 19 I worked up the courage to visit a Catholic Church. I’m asocial and shy, so this was a big deal for me. Anyway, I walked up the steps, only to realize that the building had been condemned and boarded up. When I turned back down to walk home, a pure white pigeon landed on the sidewalk before me. It stayed put as I walked past, seemingly unafraid. (Maybe it was a sign? I don’t know, but it’s nice to think so.)

Ok, I’m done hijacking the thread.

The Church is a community; we, collectively, make up the Body of Christ so we should welcome all who are interested in God, not just the Catholic Church.

 

[Mystical_Seeker]

One problem I’ve found is that if I am in a very “needy” condition, somehow even if I’m trying to be patient and calm, it transmits to my wife and turns her off. It could be a “normal” thing, but it also seems to have roots in a time period before we met when she was actually attacked.

It wasn’t easy to recognize this, but I figured out that if I become aroused and feel “needy” and she has not already indicated consent or is leading the action, but my best bet is just to get up and move somewhere else. Anywhere. The couch, whatever.

This was particularly hard for me because I think a lot about how Paul says it is better for a man not to marry, unless he burns with passion. So it would seem like these “needy” times is when “being married” should come into play and the strategy of avoid “overly compelling situations” would actually be against his advice – which I finally decided is too bad because it is simply not good when she is defensive and I’m there with a sense of need.

Maybe it’s like if I pound on a door instead of knocking “modestly” it scares those inside because they think I’m coming to take advantage of them. Which, in fact, I am … but since it is Paul giving his own personal opinion rather than speaking on behalf of TRVTH, that makes it less binding to me so I do not feel guilty about it (nor a desire to “enforce” this teaching by controlling her). I just do go somewhere, do a chore, post on CAF or Facebook, or whatever, and maybe tomorrow things will be different:

1 Cor 7:1-11
Now in regard to the matters about which you wrote: “It is a good thing for a man not to touch a woman,” but because of cases of immorality every man should have his own wife, and every woman her own husband. The husband should fulfill his duty toward his wife, and likewise the wife toward her husband. A wife does not have authority over her own body, but rather her husband, and similarly a husband does not have authority over his own body, but rather his wife. Do not deprive each other, except perhaps by mutual consent for a time, to be free for prayer, but then return to one another, so that Satan may not tempt you through your lack of self-control. This I say by way of concession, however, not as a command. Indeed, I wish everyone to be as I am, but each has a particular gift from God, one of one kind and one of another.

Now to the unmarried and to widows I say: it is a good thing for them to remain as they are, as I do, **but if they cannot exercise self-control they should marry, for it is better to marry than to be on fire. **To the married, however, I give this instruction (not I, but the Lord): A wife should not separate from her husband—and if she does separate she must either remain single or become reconciled to her husband—and a husband should not divorce his wife.

 

[808Catholic]

One problem I’ve found is that if I am in a very “needy” condition, somehow even if I’m trying to be patient and calm, it transmits to my wife and turns her off. It could be a “normal” thing, but it also seems to have roots in a time period before we met when she was actually attacked.

It wasn’t easy to recognize this, but I figured out that if I become aroused and feel “needy” and she has not already indicated consent or is leading the action, but my best bet is just to get up and move somewhere else. Anywhere. The couch, whatever.

This was particularly hard for me because I think a lot about how Paul says it is better for a man not to marry, unless he burns with passion. So it would seem like these “needy” times is when “being married” should come into play and the strategy of avoid “overly compelling situations” would actually be against his advice – which I finally decided is too bad because it is simply not good when she is defensive and I’m there with a sense of need.

Maybe it’s like if I pound on a door instead of knocking “modestly” it scares those inside because they think I’m coming to take advantage of them. Which, in fact, I am … but since it is Paul giving his own personal opinion rather than speaking on behalf of TRVTH, that makes it less binding to me so I do not feel guilty about it (nor a desire to “enforce” this teaching by controlling her). I just do go somewhere, do a chore, post on CAF or Facebook, or whatever, and maybe tomorrow things will be different:

1 Cor 7:1-11
Now in regard to the matters about which you wrote: “It is a good thing for a man not to touch a woman,” but because of cases of immorality every man should have his own wife, and every woman her own husband. The husband should fulfill his duty toward his wife, and likewise the wife toward her husband. A wife does not have authority over her own body, but rather her husband, and similarly a husband does not have authority over his own body, but rather his wife. Do not deprive each other, except perhaps by mutual consent for a time, to be free for prayer, but then return to one another, so that Satan may not tempt you through your lack of self-control. This I say by way of concession, however, not as a command. Indeed, I wish everyone to be as I am, but each has a particular gift from God, one of one kind and one of another.

Now to the unmarried and to widows I say: it is a good thing for them to remain as they are, as I do, **but if they cannot exercise self-control they should marry, for it is better to marry than to be on fire. **To the married, however, I give this instruction (not I, but the Lord): A wife should not separate from her husband—and if she does separate she must either remain single or become reconciled to her husband—and a husband should not divorce his wife.

I’m very sorry for your wife’s attack. Not to pry but has she gone for counseling even if it’s just a priest? Regardless of that: please continue to pray for patience and strength. What happened to your wife is not only her’s to bear but for the both of you to share; it was the marriage that was attacked via a partner and not just an individual. God Bless you and grant you courage to lead your wife through the trying times ahead.

 

[Mystical_Seeker]

I’m very sorry for your wife’s attack. Not to pry but has she gone for counseling even if it’s just a priest? Regardless of that: please continue to pray for patience and strength. What happened to your wife is not only her’s to bear but for the both of you to share; it was the marriage that was attacked via a partner and not just an individual. God Bless you and grant you courage to lead your wife through the trying times ahead.

I agree with you, and thank you for the kind words. Over 30 years together, it took a long time to recognize that was what was going on. We have a psychiatrist who is really good but he really doesn’t do much psychotherapy mainly monitors symptoms. (On our first date in 1985 we discovered something we had in common – not only had we both experienced involuntary lockups in mental wards, we had the same psychiatrist! It was a match made in heaven for sure.)

Some things happened in the past year, including become much more open and my understanding these things, and when her beloved sister died last fall it completely changed the power structure of her family – taking “power” from a very controlling and emotionally abusive and divisive mother.

One really good thing is starting this year we’ve been seeing a clinical psychologist in California by Skype, who had worked in wards for mentally insane for 30 years, and noting that nothing really productive is done in hospitals, came up with his own program for recovery – and yes recovery not “treatment”. ( Remember to main stream medicine, a :mental patient healed" is a “customer lost”. ) So the Lord arranged for this man to come across our paths and life is amazingly, well, like Jesus talks about in the kingdom.

Just in the last few months we’ve gotten to where we can discuss these things openly and honestly. It’s kind of weird to find out that she’s not been telling me that this movement or that little phrase or even the word “nice” had been taking her right back to that day, but it’s amazing when that stops.

Plus we have an amazing pastor now, who has helped us in office sessions. He is also very worldly wise, and has helped us greatly and has an amazing sense of humor that is very closely “adjusted” to the audience at hand.

So the prognosis for her is very good, and I am much more aware of both myself and her, and this Skype guy’s “Roto-Rooter” approach to healing these old wounds has given me new life and a whole new grasp of understanding Jesus’s words about the kingdom. That is the best money I’ve ever spent for psychotherapy. The only psychotherapy that had really been of value before that, was some pre-marital counseling we got at Catholic Charities.

But when I get worked up and she’s not ready, I no longer whine to myself internally and try to figure out how to “unlock the combination” as much as back off, and learn to wait until the time is better. And part of the results from all this, is that after all these years, when we are in bed, finally there are only us and God, without all these demonic memories from the past that I didn’t even realize were there with us until a couple years ago.

Back to the OP, though, my comments were based on the wife having reservations about his religious ideas, especially as they relate to sex. These could be a cover for something deeper, and there may be common ground to agree on. Given the right situation, and with trust of the Holy Spirit we can believe that will come about, you may learn to communicate with each other in a way that is more fundamental and about your honest impressions and feelings – mentally, emotionally, spiritually, and sexually. Because to me, when “honesty” is practiced, that is why when two or more are gathered in His name, there He is. So when honesty become increasingly honest, God can come more into the relationship and help in the healing, I believe.

 

[808Catholic]

I agree with you, and thank you for the kind words. Over 30 years together, it took a long time to recognize that was what was going on. We have a psychiatrist who is really good but he really doesn’t do much psychotherapy mainly monitors symptoms. (On our first date in 1985 we discovered something we had in common – not only had we both experienced involuntary lockups in mental wards, we had the same psychiatrist! It was a match made in heaven for sure.)

Some things happened in the past year, including become much more open and my understanding these things, and when her beloved sister died last fall it completely changed the power structure of her family – taking “power” from a very controlling and emotionally abusive and divisive mother.

One really good thing is starting this year we’ve been seeing a clinical psychologist in California by Skype, who had worked in wards for mentally insane for 30 years, and noting that nothing really productive is done in hospitals, came up with his own program for recovery – and yes recovery not “treatment”. ( Remember to main stream medicine, a :mental patient healed" is a “customer lost”. ) So the Lord arranged for this man to come across our paths and life is amazingly, well, like Jesus talks about in the kingdom.

Just in the last few months we’ve gotten to where we can discuss these things openly and honestly. It’s kind of weird to find out that she’s not been telling me that this movement or that little phrase or even the word “nice” had been taking her right back to that day, but it’s amazing when that stops.

Plus we have an amazing pastor now, who has helped us in office sessions. He is also very worldly wise, and has helped us greatly and has an amazing sense of humor that is very closely “adjusted” to the audience at hand.

So the prognosis for her is very good, and I am much more aware of both myself and her, and this Skype guy’s “Roto-Rooter” approach to healing these old wounds has given me new life and a whole new grasp of understanding Jesus’s words about the kingdom. That is the best money I’ve ever spent for psychotherapy. The only psychotherapy that had really been of value before that, was some pre-marital counseling we got at Catholic Charities.

But when I get worked up and she’s not ready, I no longer whine to myself internally and try to figure out how to “unlock the combination” as much as back off, and learn to wait until the time is better. And part of the results from all this, is that after all these years, when we are in bed, finally there are only us and God, without all these demonic memories from the past that I didn’t even realize were there with us until a couple years ago.

Back to the OP, though, my comments were based on the wife having reservations about his religious ideas, especially as they relate to sex. These could be a cover for something deeper, and there may be common ground to agree on. Given the right situation, and with trust of the Holy Spirit we can believe that will come about, you may learn to communicate with each other in a way that is more fundamental and about your honest impressions and feelings – mentally, emotionally, spiritually, and sexually. Because to me, when “honesty” is practiced, that is why when two or more are gathered in His name, there He is. So when honesty become increasingly honest, God can come more into the relationship and help in the healing, I believe.

Thank you and God’s blessing be upon you and your wife for sharing your deeply moving testimony. Your path to God was definitely harder than mine and I applaud your conviction and determination to continually move forward. My prayer that the Holy Spirit continue to be with you both as you experience your journey of faith. May your redemptive suffering be joined with Christ’s and lead you closer to Him!