Jehovah's Witness Skinny

  • Thread starter Thread starter Bon_Croix
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
Hi. I’m a Jehovah’s Witness. Have been for 15 years. I don’t wish to engage in too much debate, I’m well aware of our pitfalls and failings and embarrassing scandals. Is any faith immune to radicals, sexual abusers and the like? However the thing that keeps me here is I see the Holy Spirit at work in our congregations. Genuine self sacrificing love amongst most of us. We love God, Jesus and the Holy Spirit although we may disagree about who they are. We spend a lot of time talking to people about God and faith in Christ, repentance and holy living. We also try to support those who don’t practice our faith but need physical assistance.

Not trying to convert anyone here, I have respect for Catholicism and I am grateful for its stance on abortion, faith and upholding the sanctity of marriage.

Warm Christian Love

Tom
 
There is a proverb in Scripture that states loosely “the one to present his case first always seems right, until someone comes and cross examines him.”

Coming here and reading other people’s views helps me to examine mine and deepen my respect for other interpretations.
 
Tom7 said:
Coming here and reading other people’s views helps me to examine mine and deepen my respect for other interpretations.
Click to expand...
This is a very respectful position and is welcomed but it does beg the question - do you assume the position of all other JW’s that we (I) do not truly know what we (I) worship?

Peace!!!
 
Some believe dogmatically that you don’t yes. Others certainly don’t despite it being an official teaching. I’m sure there are many Catholics who disagree with somethings in the Catechism.

I hope that we (all Christians) are not judged on doctrine but on love for God and Neighbour. The members in my congregation behave like a loving family, envelopes of cash through the letterbox of suffering people, the elderly being cared for the by young teenagers, meals for widows etc all in the name of Christ. That’s just in our congregation. Not boasting - just my observation.
 
Tom7 said:
Some believe dogmatically that you don’t yes. Others certainly don’t despite it being an official teaching. I’m sure there are many Catholics who disagree with somethings in the Catechism.
Click to expand...
I agree that there are Catholics who disagree with the catechism but that certainly dont mean they are correct. There is only one truth, correct? If you dont agree with the official teachings of the Watchtower are you in effect saying they are teaching untruths?
Tom7 said:
I hope that we (all Christians) are not judged on doctrine but on love for God and Neighbour. The members in my congregation behave like a loving family, envelopes of cash through the letterbox of suffering people, the elderly being cared for the by young teenagers, meals for widows etc all in the name of Christ. That’s just in our congregation. Not boasting - just my observation.
Click to expand...
:+1:t3: but again, you are here calling us all Christians, not a view held by the official teachings of the Watchtower, so how are “we” supposed to believe your sincerity here on CAF or the teachings of the Watchtower if you and the Watchtower are so different in your professions?

Peace!!!
 
You have a valid point of course. However discipleship of Christ is measured not in doctrine but in love amongst yourselves. I have yet to see a Catholic congregation in my area that practices this like ours. I am not in the least saying that there are none, but I have to go with my experience.

I also find it absolutely impossible to venerate Mary or the Saints, please, I implore you not to bring our arguments for this practice. I have truly tried and read the arguments in favour and have still been unconvinced. I am not trying to insult anyone’s view but I would rather have the errors of my faith than what I see to be in my honestly held belief to be errors in Catholicism.

Peace and Love. I am sorry we disagree but put an atheist amongst the two of us and we will and should join forces. We are 98% in harmony compared to an atheist.
 
Tom7 said:
You have a valid point of course. However discipleship of Christ is measured not in doctrine but in love amongst yourselves. I have yet to see a Catholic congregation in my area that practices this like ours. I am not in the least saying that there are none, but I have to go with my experience.

I also find it absolutely impossible to venerate Mary or the Saints, please, I implore you not to bring our arguments for this practice. I have truly tried and read the arguments in favour and have still been unconvinced. I am not trying to insult anyone’s view but I would rather have the errors of my faith than what I see to be in my honestly held belief to be errors in Catholicism.

Peace and Love. I am sorry we disagree but put an atheist amongst the two of us and we will and should join forces. We are 98% in harmony compared to an atheist.
Click to expand...
Tom you seem to be a very reasonable and respectful person but your position above, measuring discipleship, vs truthful teaching is what we call a red herring. It really has nothing to do with the teachings of the Church. And even you have already said we shouldn’t be judged by others which we both agree, however the practices of others or myself is not where this conversation was going. I was discussing the teachings of truth by either the Watchtower and/or the Catechism.

For conversation purposes, i really dont care about the bad practices of JWs or Catholics. I am just trying to converse about teachings of respective organizations and more specifically, what makes your opinion about “we Christians” and “our worship” more correct than the official teachings of the Watchtower?

Peace!!!
 
Tom7 said:
Is any faith immune to radicals, sexual abusers and the like?
Click to expand...
Don’t forget secular organizations, either; faith is not a requirement for sin. Be aware of a current tendency in the media to hyper-focus on scandals within religious groups specifically, because that’s the trending narrative: religion is corrupt. [Judging from the commentary of people I associate with day-to-day, the majority of whom are irreligious, it’s a persuasive narrative.]

The danger is this kind of reporting overlooks ideological extremists and criminal predators generally, which is hypocritical, and makes it seem as if religion is somehow causative of these problems, which is mendacious.
 
Last edited:
Angannas said:
I must be getting old. To me skinny means that somebody is thin. But there is obviously a newer meaning which I just don’t know. Could you please explain what you mean by ‘skinny’ here?
Click to expand...
You must be old LOL. I’m old (over and pretty far down the hill) and I remember that term from my youth-rarely hear it in “modern” times however.
 
As I have already stated I don’t believe all the teaching of the catechism and believe them to be in error compared to Scripture. I also don’t accept some of the teaching of my own faith. All done in good conscience. What should someone do? Obey their own conscience regardless. Please drop the notion that following the Catholic faith in its entirety hasn’t caused immense and unnecessary suffering to people over the centuries.

Not trying to be arrogant but if I can’t honestly say a prayer/intercession to Mary with a clean conscience how can I be judged to be in error by you? Paul says let each man examine his own conscience and keep quiet. That’s why I should stick to reading things here and not posting.

Nice talking to you.
 
Tom7 said:
As I have already stated I don’t believe all the teaching of the catechism and believe them to be in error compared to Scripture. I also don’t accept some of the teaching of my own faith. All done in good conscience
Click to expand...
I think i have already accepted this as your position. Im just trying to explore your conscience after all you did state:
Coming here and reading other people’s views helps me to examine mine and deepen my respect for other interpretations.
Click to expand...
I thought you would allow us to also deepen our understands of your views. :man_shrugging:t3:
Tom7 said:
Please drop the notion that following the Catholic faith in its entirety hasn’t caused immense and unnecessary suffering to people over the centuries.
Click to expand...
Please drop the notion you understand my notions as this has never been one. At lease not in the sense you put it here. And please understand the differences of teachings from the Church and practices of her adherents.
Tom7 said:
Not trying to be arrogant but if I can’t honestly say a prayer/intercession to Mary with a clean conscience how can I be judged to be in error by you? Paul says let each man examine his own conscience and keep quiet. That’s why I should stick to reading things here and not posting.
Click to expand...
Please show me where I have judged you? I know many Catholics who do not pray to Mary either, because it is not necessary to do so, and i dont judge them either.

Why cant we have a logical conversation about our faiths and question each other on our understandings.

It is illogical to me to follow an organization, Catholic or otherwise, and not believe in its entirety of teachings when that organization says it teaches truth. Either that organization is not teaching truth and therefore not of God or you believe there is no way the fullness of truth can be known through an organization which means the gates of hell did prevail and God left his people orphans.

Now this above has nothing to do with you personally but it does have to do with your logical viewpoint. If you would like more time to respond please take it but please dont think i dont have the right to question your logic and/or position. It IS what this forum is about.

Peace!!!
 
Tom7 said:
We love God, Jesus and the Holy Spirit although we may disagree about who they are.
Click to expand...
Hi Tom7. It is great to see a JW on the forum. I just want to make sure what you mean by the statement quoted. You are calling The Holy Spirit a who, which is very different from what I remember as a JW. I thought you liken The Holy Spirit to electricity and power that doesn’t have any personal characteristics. So what does your love for the Holy Spirit mean to you? You made a statement that you don’t agree with everything from the JWs, is this one, and can you share any points that concern you about their beliefs. Thanks again for entering into a conversation and doing so in a nice way.
 
I know this is a very basic question but could you explain JWs’ stance regarding the divinity of Jesus compared to G-d the Father? Who exactly is Jesus in your view?
 
Hello

We believe the Holy Spirit is an extension of God. I guess you can view that as personal but I don’t believe you can call the Spirit an independent being. I don’t think it’s useful to use too finer point. Like Joseph Ratzinger says in introduction to Christianity, the Trinity is a negative theology in the sense it means it’s a mystery and does not attempt to answer anything, but rather signifies the end of the search. That’s a paraphrase. Excellent book.

Jesus is the pre-existent wisdom of God but came into being as a direct creation. I don’t accept he is Michael the archangel because of Hebrews chapter 1. “To which one of the angels did he ever say…” but that is accepted by most as being true. In my view, especially in the Pauline letters Paul makes a clear distinction between God and Jesus, not the Father and the Son but God as a whole and Jesus. I don’t want to debate please, having read many catholic books on the subject by authorities as genius as Joseph Ratzinger my conscience is still not convinced that Jesus and the Father are equal.

Maybe I can ask you a question please: How do you reconcile the difficult parts of your history with the idea of the Church being the bride of Christ? I mean the misuse of political power, corrupt Popes, child sex abuse cover ups? Some severely criticise the mistakes in our faith but it feels extremely hypocritical.
 
I am not Catholic or Christian. However, it is my understanding that Catholicism separates the actions of members of the Church from the ideal of the Church and its beliefs, realizing that humans, including the Pope, are all subject to sin but that the Church is in keeping with the original teachings of Jesus.

I am not critical of your faith or any other faith although I might disagree with aspects of it, as you yourself probably do. I appreciate your reply.
 
Last edited:
Yes I believe that is true too. However there is a body in my faith and the Catholic Faith which is something that all must accept as intellectually true.

If you are not Catholic or a Christian are you here for research?
 
I’m here to learn about Catholicism. I enjoy learning and reading about different religions. I also happen to work in a Catholic university.
 
Do you believe the first cause of all things could be God? Personal question I know.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top