Jehovah's Witness

[Javl]

Could you elaborate on what their “Bible Study” is and how it is a trap?

Their bible study is using their bible only. You can’t use yours. Their bible is a corruption of the regular Christian Bible, since they have made changes in it to fit their idea of doctrines, dogma and theology. A well noted change is in John 1:1-3, where they have changed “…and the Word is God” to “…and the word is a god”. Their bible study will
continue until they think you are ready to be “baptized”. It will also continue long after this until in my estimation you are completely brainwashed and are totaly commited to them.

PAX DOMINI

Shalom Aleichem

 

[spockrates]

I have been visited by Jehovah’s Witnesses for several months. I have always been kind and accepted their literature as to learn more about their sect. Saturday they called again. We had some short words on the cannon of scripture and authority. I also gave them 2 cds I prepared of the program The Journey Home where Marcus interviewed former JWs. I informed this JW that a few minutes at the door step was not enough time to discuss theology. He suggested we sit down next week for a longer period of time. I agreed.

He is coming next Saturday. I will be studying this week to prepare. I was hoping some one could share with me their own experience as it relates to this. What is the best approach to take with this gentleman?

Thanks

Been in your boat myself! I had JWs visit me at home for many months. Try to resist two urges–(1) the urge to argue and (2) the urge to not pray to be shown what to say. How you say is as important as what you say, and that you pray is paramount. My experience is that God helps those who admit they need His help.

 

[Regardless]

Their bible study is using their bible only. You can’t use yours. Their bible is a corruption of the regular Christian Bible, since they have made changes in it to fit their idea of doctrines, dogma and theology.
Shalom Aleichem

That is simply NOT correct. You can use whatever Bible transation you prefer when studying the Bible with Jehovah’s Witnesses.

Beware of people telling you not to study what the Bible says!
It is a pivotal way God instructs us. (Not CD interviews with bitter ex-JW’s.)

Jesus said: “Your word is truth” John 17:17.

 

[Regardless]

Could you elaborate on what their “Bible Study” is and how it is a trap?

The Jehovah’s Witnesses will examine many scriptures from God’s Word the Bible on whatever subject you want with you. From whatever translation of the Bible you prefer.
(They prefer the NWT)

If you have any questions they can’t answer they will go and research them for you and bring you the answer. All free of course.

Make sure what they teach is what the Bible says!

Our friend tells you it is a trap since many who seriously study the Bible with JW’s (from all religions and faiths) eventually conclude what the witnesses are showing them from the Bible is the truth.

Be very carefull of people telling you not to study the Bible. Note what Paul was inspired to warn Christians at Colossians 2:8.

 

[Javl]

The Jehovah’s Witnesses will examine many scriptures from God’s Word the Bible on whatever subject you want with you. From whatever translation of the Bible you prefer.
(They prefer the NWT)

If you have any questions they can’t answer they will go and research them for you and bring you the answer. All free of course.

Make sure what they teach is what the Bible says!

Our friend tells you it is a trap since many who seriously study the Bible with JW’s (from all religions and faiths) eventually conclude what the witnesses are showing them from the Bible is the truth.

Be very carefull of people telling you not to study the Bible. Note what Paul was inspired to warn Christians at Colossians 2:8.

My friend, I have studied with the JWs and was told many times that my bible did not
have the correct translation and that theirs did. Also, if you claim to teach the truth, then why is there such a big difference between the NWT and the other bibles? Why do you
read some scripture as symbolic when it should be read as literal and vice-versa? There
are many other instances I can name.

PAX DOMINI

Shalom Aleichem

 

[raffo]

That is simply NOT correct. You can use whatever Bible translation you prefer when studying the Bible with Jehovah’s Witnesses.

Yes you can, but here in our area, they’d keep suggesting to use the NWT.

 

[Anna_Scott]

More important that theological information -

I can’t tell from your name if you are a man or woman. If you are a woman (and maybe even if you are a man), don’t invite this person into your home if you are the only adult there. If you want to talk to this man, have at least one other adult (a man would be best) there with you. If you can’t arrange that, meet him at a public place.

I agree with kalt. You need to make sure you are safe. I wouldn’t use my home as a meeting place. There are all sorts of cons going on these days. People will do almost anything to gain entry to your home.

I used to attend a large Baptist church in my area. One Sunday evening, I received a call from a man, who said he was visiting for the church. He asked if he could stop by and visit. I said no. The church would have my records and know that I am a single woman. I did not think it was appropriate for a man to call. And–I had no way of knowing if he was really from the church. Even if he was attending the church, I would have no way of knowing whether or not he would be trust worthy–or what his real intentions would be.

So, be careful.

Also, I think I would really pray about whether or not to meet with them again.

Anna

 

[mark_a]

I have been visited by Jehovah’s Witnesses for several months. I have always been kind and accepted their literature as to learn more about their sect. Saturday they called again. We had some short words on the cannon of scripture and authority. I also gave them 2 cds I prepared of the program The Journey Home where Marcus interviewed former JWs. I informed this JW that a few minutes at the door step was not enough time to discuss theology. He suggested we sit down next week for a longer period of time. I agreed.

He is coming next Saturday. I will be studying this week to prepare. I was hoping some one could share with me their own experience as it relates to this. What is the best approach to take with this gentleman?

Thanks

I keep a questionaire concerning moral theology next to the door and offer to let them take it, fill it out, and return it to me on their next visit.

Once you show them how they stack up against historical church teaching concerning contraception, they won’t return. It’s the Catholic slam-dunk.

 

[Javl]

I agree with kalt. You need to make sure you are safe. I wouldn’t use my home as a meeting place. There are all sorts of cons going on these days. People will do almost anything to gain entry to your home.

I used to attend a large Baptist church in my area. One Sunday evening, I received a call from a man, who said he was visiting for the church. He asked if he could stop by and visit. I said no. The church would have my records and know that I am a single woman. I did not think it was appropriate for a man to call. And–I had no way of knowing if he was really from the church. Even if he was attending the church, I would have no way of knowing whether or not he would be trust worthy–or what his real intentions would be.

So, be careful.

Also, I think I would really pray about whether or not to meet with them again.

Anna

I agree with you, Anna. You did the right thing. But, believe it or not, the JWs are
trustworthy. They will not enter your home unless asked. Their zeal for the Lord is sometimes greater than ours to go through what they do. But, sad to say, they are
in total error and it is up to us to show them the real truth, whether we are Catholic
or Protestant.

PAX DOMINI

Shalom Aleichem

 

[Anna_Scott]

I agree with kalt. You need to make sure you are safe. I wouldn’t use my home as a meeting place. There are all sorts of cons going on these days. People will do almost anything to gain entry to your home.

I used to attend a large Baptist church in my area. One Sunday evening, I received a call from a man, who said he was visiting for the church. He asked if he could stop by and visit. I said no. The church would have my records and know that I am a single woman. I did not think it was appropriate for a man to call. And–I had no way of knowing if he was really from the church. Even if he was attending the church, I would have no way of knowing whether or not he would be trust worthy–or what his real intentions would be.

So, be careful.

Also, I think I would really pray about whether or not to meet with them again.

Anna

I agree with you, Anna. You did the right thing. But, believe it or not, the JWs are
trustworthy. They will not enter your home unless asked. Their zeal for the Lord is sometimes greater than ours to go through what they do. But, sad to say, they are
in total error and it is up to us to show them the real truth, whether we are Catholic
or Protestant.

PAX DOMINI

Shalom Aleichem

Javl:

You have a kind heart. You are right about their zeal for the Lord. It is sad that it is so misguided.

Anna

 

[Javl]

Javl:

You have a kind heart. You are right about their zeal for the Lord. It is sad that it is so misguided.

Anna

Thank you for your kind words. Yes, they are misguided and so brainwashed that they
refuse to accept the truth, or read anything other than what is published by the Watch-
tower Bible and Tract Society ( JWs ). They are warned not to, since anything other than
what they are given or told by the WBTS is false and of the devil. To do otherwise is to go against them and God! This usually results in dis-fellowshipping, which in their eyes is
the same as being condemned to hell. As in all cults, the JWs do not think for them-
selves. If they ever do, they would learn the real truth and leave the organization. It is
up to us to put a chink or crack in that armor, and get them to think for themselves.

PAX DOMINI

Shalom Aleichem

 

[Anna_Scott]

Thank you for your kind words. Yes, they are misguided and so brainwashed that they
refuse to accept the truth, or read anything other than what is published by the Watch-
tower Bible and Tract Society ( JWs ). They are warned not to, since anything other than
what they are given or told by the WBTS is false and of the devil. To do otherwise is to go against them and God! This usually results in dis-fellowshipping, which in their eyes is
the same as being condemned to hell. As in all cults, the JWs do not think for them-
selves. If they ever do, they would learn the real truth and leave the organization. It is
up to us to put a chink or crack in that armor, and get them to think for themselves.

PAX DOMINI

Shalom Aleichem

Javl:

You touched on such an important issue in the cult mentality–that warning not to read anything outside the Watch-tower Bible and Tract Society, because it is “false and of the devil.”

Sadly, this tactic is used in some of the fundamentalist Christian groups as well.

A few years ago, a long-time friend of mine came to visit from out-of-state. She was so disturbed by the books and Bibles I have in my house.(I usually have several stacks of books going at one time-reading, reference, etc.) She was even upset to find my Catholic Comparative New Testament. I have many Bible translations, including the Torah with Commentary, and the TANAKH. I have many books on the history of religion.

Anyway, she thought I should not be reading these things–that I was being led astray. She spent about 5 days at my house. Her attitude towards me worsened everyday. By the time she left, great damage had been done to our friendship. We have talked on the phone a few times since, but things have never been the same. I still use the Catholic Comparative New Testament and the Torah, TANAKH, and my other translations, as I continue my studies. The experience is really heart-breaking for me. I value my friends, so much. Yet, it is difficult to have a friendship with someone who is constantly judging you.

I continue to pray for her. I know she clings to the KJV. I tried to talk to her about the errors in this translation, but to no avail.

I think we should all be suspicious of any religious group who imposes limits on study and education. This is a serious red flag.

Anna

 

[Javl]

Javl:

You touched on such an important issue in the cult mentality–that warning not to read anything outside the Watch-tower Bible and Tract Society, because it is “false and of the devil.”

Sadly, this tactic is used in some of the fundamentalist Christian groups as well.

A few years ago, a long-time friend of mine came to visit from out-of-state. She was so disturbed by the books and Bibles I have in my house.(I usually have several stacks of books going at one time-reading, reference, etc.) She was even upset to find my Catholic Comparative New Testament. I have many Bible translations, including the Torah with Commentary, and the TANAKH. I have many books on the history of religion.

Anyway, she thought I should not be reading these things–that I was being led astray. She spent about 5 days at my house. Her attitude towards me worsened everyday. By the time she left, great damage had been done to our friendship. We have talked on the phone a few times since, but things have never been the same. I still use the Catholic Comparative New Testament and the Torah, TANAKH, and my other translations, as I continue my studies. The experience is really heart-breaking for me. I value my friends, so much. Yet, it is difficult to have a friendship with someone who is constantly judging you.

I continue to pray for her. I know she clings to the KJV. I tried to talk to her about the errors in this translation, but to no avail.

I think we should all be suspicious of any religious group who imposes limits on study and education. This is a serious red flag.

Anna

Anna, that is so sad a story. Truly I grieve for you. And truly if she acted that way, you
can rest assured it was a one way friendship. For a true friend will never act that way.
As you know I am Catholic. My wife is Methodist and her sister, my sister-in-law, is
Baptist. We discuss religion, some times heatedly, yet we all love each other and I would give up my life for them. Not because they are relations but because I truly love them as
I think they love Jesus. By the way, I do not try to convert them. They have come to
Mass with me and I have attended their services. My purpose is to inform them and all
to try to dispell all the myths, lies and distortions they hear and learn about the Catholic Church. In return, I learn about theirs. I try to do the same in these forums.

But when it comes to cults, Lord forgive me, I do lose my temper many times and become abrasive. If I ever do that to you, please shout me down. Thank you for your
confiding in me and may the Good Lord Bless you and yours abundantly.

Len

P.S. I am impressed at your description of your library. I also have one, but not as im-
pressive as yours. Have you read any of the writings of Flavius Josephus, or any of those ancient historians. There is a wealth of information in them.

PAX DOMINI

Shalom Aleichem

 

[Anna_Scott]

Anna, that is so sad a story. Truly I grieve for you. And truly if she acted that way, you
can rest assured it was a one way friendship. For a true friend will never act that way.
As you know I am Catholic. My wife is Methodist and her sister, my sister-in-law, is
Baptist. We discuss religion, some times heatedly, yet we all love each other and I would give up my life for them. Not because they are relations but because I truly love them as
I think they love Jesus. By the way, I do not try to convert them. They have come to
Mass with me and I have attended their services. My purpose is to inform them and all
to try to dispell all the myths, lies and distortions they hear and learn about the Catholic Church. In return, I learn about theirs. I try to do the same in these forums.

But when it comes to cults, Lord forgive me, I do lose my temper many times and become abrasive. If I ever do that to you, please shout me down. Thank you for your
confiding in me and may the Good Lord Bless you and yours abundantly.

Len

P.S. I am impressed at your description of your library. I also have one, but not as im-
pressive as yours. Have you read any of the writings of Flavius Josephus, or any of those ancient historians. There is a wealth of information in them.

PAX DOMINI

Shalom Aleichem

I really appreciate your feedback on my experience. I still feel such a deep sadness over what happened with my friend.

I believe we can have respectful discussions with those who hold different beliefs. I admire your relationships with family. At the end of the day, if we are not acting in love, we would do well to keep quiet. I have to remind myself of that very often, yet still fail miserably.

I have a wonderful relationship with my Jewish neighbors. We have great discussions about religion. No one tries to convert the other. They know what Christianity is; and I know what Judaism is. I know that Christ calls us to Himself. So, I don’t try to do His job for Him.

I know what you mean, though, about the temper flaring. I’ve been there myself-and have apologized to a few people on the forums. Unfortunately, anger seems to be the least vulnerable expression of emotion–often used to cover a world of hurt.

As for my book collection, my son always gives me gift cards to B&N–since he knows that is what I want the most. He knows his mom well. Ironically, one Christmas, my Jewish friends gave me the Torah/with Modern Commentary; and my son gave me the TANAKH. Those were very odd gifts for “Christmas.”

As for Christian Bible translations, I really have found some of the Catholic Bibles to be the most accurate. I’ve been comparing translations for a long time–especially on controversial passages. Comparing commentaries contained in the study Bibles is also very interesting.

Oh my. I am rambling way off topic. My apologies.

Anna

 

[Javl]

I really appreciate your feedback on my experience. I still feel such a deep sadness over what happened with my friend.

I believe we can have respectful discussions with those who hold different beliefs. I admire your relationships with family. At the end of the day, if we are not acting in love, we would do well to keep quiet. I have to remind myself of that very often, yet still fail miserably.

I have a wonderful relationship with my Jewish neighbors. We have great discussions about religion. No one tries to convert the other. They know what Christianity is; and I know what Judaism is. I know that Christ calls us to Himself. So, I don’t try to do His job for Him.

I know what you mean, though, about the temper flaring. I’ve been there myself-and have apologized to a few people on the forums. Unfortunately, anger seems to be the least vulnerable expression of emotion–often used to cover a world of hurt.

As for my book collection, my son always gives me gift cards to B&N–since he knows that is what I want the most. He knows his mom well. Ironically, one Christmas, my Jewish friends gave me the Torah/with Modern Commentary; and my son gave me the TANAKH. Those were very odd gifts for “Christmas.”

As for Christian Bible translations, I really have found some of the Catholic Bibles to be the most accurate. I’ve been comparing translations for a long time–especially on controversial passages. Comparing commentaries contained in the study Bibles is also very interesting.

Oh my. I am rambling way off topic. My apologies.

Anna

No rambling at all, Anna. It is a pleasure to converse with you and listen to you. No
apologies needed or required. It is great to have a son like yours and also friends. I
wish mine would do the same. All I get is either apparel to wear or handkerchiefs. I
have to purchase my own books, since they say they don’t know what I want ( HAH ).
Oh, well. As for Judaism, I have studied some Hebrew and have attended schull to
learn more. But at my age ( 84 ) it is hard to teach an old dog something new. Anyway,
GOD bless.

P.S. If you are interested, we have a Jewish Rite in the Catholic Church to which many
Jewish Catholics belong. They keep their practices and cultural identity but are totaly
Catholic and are faithfulr to the magisterium. Their web site is hebrewcatholic.org.

Len

PAX DOMINI

Shalom Aleichem

 

[Lucas3]

I was visited by a JW recently. I invited him in, and we had an enjoyable chat. What I found fascinating is that I have been a Catholic for under 2 years, (and was evangelical for 20 years before that). I have witnessed to JWs in the past, (we both try and evangelise the other!) What I found fascinating is that the arguments I’ve used on this occasion are completely different.

I’m no longer arguing about interpretation of individual verses in the Bible. What I said this time is that the teaching of the Catholic Church is solidly based on Scripture (just look at the myriad of verses quoted in the Catechism!). But, (and this is vital), the Catholic Church can trace how its teachings have been preserved through every century since. An evangelical cannot do this, a JW cannot do this. We have history on our side.

Please pray for Beriton, that God in His great grace and mercy will lift the veil. By the way, he’s promised to read a copy of the book “The Catholic Answer to the Jehovah’s Witnesses: A Challenge Accepted.”

 

[Shin]

It’s an unusual Jehovah’s Witness who will read a book mentioned to him! If he really means it be careful – do not mention it in front of any of his compatriots, or he won’t dare do it, because he’d get in trouble for it. Keep quiet as a mouse and don’t let the devil prompt your tongue.

They are hard to work on, you must pray a great deal. They are not for amateurs!

They will try to attack the Trinity so you must be up and up on the Trinity doctrine which is a difficult area for many. Look to the Creeds for help there. There’re also good talks on the Trinity below.

 

[Lucas3]

It’s an unusual Jehovah’s Witness who will read a book mentioned to him!

I agree: I was really surprised! But because of my Protestant background, I’m aware that attempts to interpret the Bible are fraught. (My post script outlines the fragmentation of the body of Christ because of this very issue).

So I’m hardly likely to agree with a JW that his interpretation is acceptable or correct. And it’s him who has agreed to wade through 20 centuries of consistent theological interpretation of the truth that sets us free.

Pray for him, please!

Lord Jesus Christ, Son of God, have mercy on Beriton, sinner.

 

[jw2lds2catholic]

JW’s have a playbook. It’s the same edition as I used as a JW.
“Reasoning from the Scriptures” lists bible verses along with talking points about pretty much any topic you can think off. They will refer to it verbatim to make their points. Do not expect any other logic to prevail. If you ‘push’ your agenda they will most likely visit to simply leave literature (but not accept any, especially from Catholics who are part of the whore of Babylon) and bid a farewell.
I enjoyed sparing with members of other faiths when I perched high on my WatchTower and rarely bother to listen to opposing viewpoints as was expected, nay, demanded of those in “The Truth”.
Personally - what got me out was not the seeds of doubt planted by others, but from the organization itself. It is a joyless faith and that’s what prompted me to find God and eventually find him in the Catholic church.

Here is an online scan of the Reasoning book if you are interested in just how twisted scripture can be turned:

watchtowerwiki.org/files/1989-Reasoning-Book-R.pdf

 

[adstrinity]

JW’s have a playbook. It’s the same edition as I used as a JW.
“Reasoning from the Scriptures” lists bible verses along with talking points about pretty much any topic you can think off. They will refer to it verbatim to make their points. Do not expect any other logic to prevail. If you ‘push’ your agenda they will most likely visit to simply leave literature (but not accept any, especially from Catholics who are part of the whore of Babylon) and bid a farewell.
I enjoyed sparing with members of other faiths when I perched high on my WatchTower and rarely bother to listen to opposing viewpoints as was expected, nay, demanded of those in “The Truth”.
Personally - what got me out was not the seeds of doubt planted by others, but from the organization itself. It is a joyless faith and that’s what prompted me to find God and eventually find him in the Catholic church.

Here is an online scan of the Reasoning book if you are interested in just how twisted scripture can be turned:

watchtowerwiki.org/files/1989-Reasoning-Book-R.pdf

Why is it a joyless faith?