Jehovah's Witnesses

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A quick question. I might have missed the answer to this.

How can jw’s deny the existence of hell?
I thought you were right there hovering over your pc:D

I will try to answer your question based on my assumption.

Through various references of greek and hebrew translations the WTS beleives that “hell” is no more than the, “common grave of mankind.” (direct quote) Where man is not conscience of anything at all.

So, it is not a denial of hell but is a different opinion of what hell is.

Here: watchtower.org/e/20020715/article_02.htm
 
I thought you were right there hovering over your pc:D

I will try to answer your question based on my assumption.

Through various references of greek and hebrew translations the WTS beleives that “hell” is no more than the, “common grave of mankind.” (direct quote) Where man is not conscience of anything at all.

So, it is not a denial of hell but is a different opinion of what hell is.

Here: watchtower.org/e/20020715/article_02.htm
Ahh…so you don’t believe what Jesus said.:eek:

Can’t be a Christian then.
 
I thought you were right there hovering over your pc:D

I will try to answer your question based on my assumption.

Through various references of greek and hebrew translations the WTS beleives that “hell” is no more than the, “common grave of mankind.” (direct quote) Where man is not conscience of anything at all.

So, it is not a denial of hell but is a different opinion of what hell is.

Here: watchtower.org/e/20020715/article_02.htm
Mt 5:22, 29 10:28 13:42, 50 Mk 9:43-48 Mt13:41-42
 
You mean deny the existence of a fiery hell where our loving Heavenly Father burns people in eternity?
Oh…and in the OT…the rich man and lazaras. You know…Lazaras in the bosom of Abrahham and the rich man suffering in Hell. The divide that cannot be crossed. The rich man wanted to go back to warn his brothers of the PUNISHMENT if they didn’t change their lives.
 
I thought you were right there hovering over your pc:D

I will try to answer your question based on my assumption.

Through various references of greek and hebrew translations the WTS beleives that “hell” is no more than the, “common grave of mankind.” (direct quote) Where man is not conscience of anything at all.

So, it is not a denial of hell but is a different opinion of what hell is.

Here: watchtower.org/e/20020715/article_02.htm
Please don’t quote the heresy of watchtower.
 
Ahh…so you don’t believe what Jesus said.:eek:

Can’t be a Christian then.
“I” don’t believe??

I have no dog in this fight. I do not ascribe to the Watchtower’s doctrine.

I merely answered your question.
 
Please don’t quote the heresy of watchtower.
With all due respect, you asked a question about the WTS and their opinon/position on “hell”.
In what better way can you understand and gain knowledge of their belief than by reading exactly about it in their own words?

I’ll post what I please, so long as it does not violate any rules of the site owners.
 
Oh…**and in the OT…**the rich man and lazaras. You know…Lazaras in the bosom of Abrahham and the rich man suffering in Hell. The divide that cannot be crossed.
That is in Luke in the NT, not the OT. 👍

Furthermore, it is a “parable”, and was not a literal event.
It did not actually happen.

Do you understand this?
A parable is a story intended to convey a spiritual truth. it is not about real people or even real situations (such as a camel passing through the eye of a needle).
The important message in it has nothing at all to do about hell.
It is this… Jesus has been teaching about materialism and money – the unjust steward, serving Mammon, and stewardship. His audience includes his disciples (16:1) as well as “the Pharisees who loved money” and ridiculed his stand on money (16:14). Jesus affirms the validity of the Law, rightly interpreted (16:16-18) – important to the Pharisees. This parable condemns the Pharisees for their love of money and neglect of showing compassion for the poor (16:19-31).👍
 
Sorry. “Different forms” of the word god. Like “The God” and “a god”?

Sounds like you are a bit of a greek scholar!

Please. What is the difference between “ton theon” and “theos”?
From the very little Greek that I know, through my own extensive logical/linguistic studies, and coming across other renowned scholarship with respect to this question, I do know the following points are correct. Ignoring Coptic, here’s what we do know about Greek:

“…KAI THEOS En hO LOGOS” is not a clause expressing strict identity, but is rather a predicative clause.

In Greek, “Ton theon” is in the accusative case, acting as the direct object of the clause, and is translated “the God.”

On the other hand, “theos”–lacks both a definite and indefinite article, so it is not strictly a noun. However, it is not an adjective either, since in Greek, “theos” is never translated as “godly.” So what is the clause saying? We have to pay attention to the syntax and grammar of the clause:

Within the structure of the rest of the clause, “theos” is acting as the predicate nominative which the clause is ascribing to the Logos.

So, since “theos” cannot be translated as “godly,” nor can it be contrued as a noun, it can only be predicating Divinity to the Logos itself. Notice the difference between the following two predicative statements.

(1) a is red.
(2) a is redness.

In Greek, “KAI THEOS EN hO LOGOS” most likely means something very similar in structure to (2), namely, “The Logos is the essence of God himself,” or “…is Divinity.”

So we at least know the JW’s have it wrong on both counts. “Theos” neither means “a god” nor does it merely mean “godly.” But, of course, neither does it mean “the god,” and more than anything, supports a trinitarian interpetation of the relationship between Christ and His Father.
 
That is in Luke in the NT, not the OT. 👍

Furthermore, it is a “parable”, and was not a literal event.
It did not actually happen.

Do you understand this?
A parable is a story intended to convey a spiritual truth. it is not about real people or even real situations (such as a camel passing through the eye of a needle).
The important message in it has nothing at all to do about hell.
It is this… Jesus has been teaching about materialism and money – the unjust steward, serving Mammon, and stewardship. His audience includes his disciples (16:1) as well as “the Pharisees who loved money” and ridiculed his stand on money (16:14). Jesus affirms the validity of the Law, rightly interpreted (16:16-18) – important to the Pharisees. This parable condemns the Pharisees for their love of money and neglect of showing compassion for the poor (16:19-31).👍
You are absolutely correct. I spoke incorrectly. It is the NT. But at the same time I do believe that Jesus made several references to the suffering of people that could end up in Hell. Our Father is love…but also just. He doesn’t condemn anyone to eternal punishment…we risk doing it to ourselves.

But I also apologize for jumping to the conclusion that you were trying to defend the watchtower.

Gosh…I’m not thinking well. Am I?

God bless you on your new journey in faith.
Steve
 
You are absolutely correct. I spoke incorrectly. It is the NT. But at the same time I do believe that Jesus made several references to the suffering of people that could end up in Hell. Our Father is love…but also just. He doesn’t condemn anyone to eternal punishment…we risk doing it to ourselves.

But I also apologize for jumping to the conclusion that you were trying to defend the watchtower.

Gosh…I’m not thinking well. Am I?

God bless you on your new journey in faith.
Steve
no worries at all:thumbsup:

After all of those years in the WTS, I do not sweat the small stuff anymore. 😃

God bless you too!
In these difficult times for Christians we all need His blessings 24/7!
 
Aren’t you the lucky ones who count on us CHRISTIANS to be willing to go to war to insure democracy for the people. JW’s are more then willing to let us fight the military battles for you. If you are unwilling to fight for your country because of religion , even going as far as not to work on a military base, then you should not have the rights and privileges that brave patriots have died for. It is because of the brave who gave their lives for freedom, that you have the freedom to preach the WT.

*It is not a matter of hating our brother that there is war but a matter of retaining our freedom *
.
Thank God we have brave souls that WILL fight for the freedom of all, even for the Witnesses.

Jeanne
Well said, Jeanne. The JW’s have no trouble in receiving the benefits of their freedoms, but don’t acknowledge thay they wouldn’t have them if it wasn’t for people who have laid their lives down for them. I liken it to a picnic where an invited guest doens’t have an issue in the partaking of the eating of the food, but didn’t bother to contribute to the meal.
 
Well said, Jeanne. The JW’s have no trouble in receiving the benefits of their freedoms, but don’t acknowledge thay they wouldn’t have them if it wasn’t for people who have laid their lives down for them. I liken it to a picnic where an invited guest doens’t have an issue in the partaking of the eating of the food, but didn’t bother to contribute to the meal.
T More,

Thanks. I just needed to vent.

Jeanne
 
Well said, Jeanne. The JW’s have no trouble in receiving the benefits of their freedoms, but don’t acknowledge thay they wouldn’t have them if it wasn’t for people who have laid their lives down for them. I liken it to a picnic where an invited guest doens’t have an issue in the partaking of the eating of the food, but didn’t bother to contribute to the meal.
They don’t even vote…but then complain about the government. I think it’s called being hypocrites
 
JW’s here on CAF, why dont you believe that Christ died on a cross?

John 20:25 So the other disciples were saying to him, “We have seen the Lord!” But he said to them, “Unless I see in (AM)His hands the imprint of the nails, and put my finger into the place of the nails, and put my hand into His side, (AN)I will not believe.”
 
JW’s here on CAF, why dont you believe that Christ died on a cross?

John 20:25 So the other disciples were saying to him, “We have seen the Lord!” But he said to them, “Unless I see in (AM)His hands the imprint of the nails, and put my finger into the place of the nails, and put my hand into His side, (AN)I will not believe.”
They once did along with Jesus being God and worthy of worship. I think they change their “teaching” just to be contrary to real Christianity.

As for the above, they will say that Jesus had his hands over his head so there would be nail holes in both hands.

Just my opinion
Jeanne
 
JW’s here on CAF, why dont you believe that Christ died on a cross?

John 20:25 So the other disciples were saying to him, “We have seen the Lord!” But he said to them, “Unless I see in (AM)His hands the imprint of the nails, and put my finger into the place of the nails, and put my hand into His side, (AN)I will not believe.”
At one time time, they actually did believe he died on a cross. But then Joseph Ruherford changed this doctrine, one of many that he changed from what Russell believed. In fact, during Rutherford’s tenure as President, several books that he himself wrote depicted Christ on a cross, before later changing his mind. His idea to change was a segregational move.
 
A quick question. I might have missed the answer to this.

How can jw’s deny the existence of hell?
This is the one that started it all Russle Taze didnt like the doctrin of hell so he set about to read through the Bible and tried to reinterpret every verse that had to do with Hell. there is in scripture Sheol, Gehenna , hades, the lake of fire, etc. each requiring a different explanation. they also say eternal punishment is to be destroyed forever This is the doctrine that I was investigating when I found that the watchtower was being deceiving about what another book said.
 
Oh…and in the OT…the rich man and lazaras. You know…Lazaras in the bosom of Abrahham and the rich man suffering in Hell. The divide that cannot be crossed. The rich man wanted to go back to warn his brothers of the PUNISHMENT if they didn’t change their lives.
believe me they know all the verses. the watch tower lies to them and says the Jews of Jesus day did not believe in an eternal punishment therefor they would not have taken these verses literally. THIS IS A BIG FAT LIE TOLD BY THE WATCH TOWER!!! PROOF THEY ARE NOT GODS FAITHFUL SERVANT!!!
 
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