Jehovah's Witnesses

[new]

Ask yourself these basic questions, by whose authority did Charles Taze Rusell in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania have to interpret the bible, and if he was correct, why did Rutherford change most of Russells doctrines? By whose authority did Rutherford have do that?

by who’s authority can the Catholic church claim to be the “owner” of the “true” Bible? Where was the “Catholic Church” (with its Christmas, Easter, Saints and other pagan festivals and worship) in the 1st century AD? 2nd century AD? 3rd century AD?

Is it the same Church that killed thousands of people in Spain few hundred years later? Is it the same Church that has offered its blessings on warfare, death and destruction since its appearance on the scene around 4 AD

I am not even a JW’s yet, but its been a blessing to find this website and see the ideology behind “the worlds largest and truest” form of Christianity.

As a matter of fact, contrary to yours and others claims, I have spent a good portion of my time looking into other teachings of Christianity, including yours, and it is so far fetched and twisted, that even to a beginner its obvious.

I’ll think I’ll leave it at that… and wish you all the best…

 

[Cides28]

by who’s authority can the Catholic church claim to be the “owner” of the “true” Bible? Where was the “Catholic Church” (with its Christmas, Easter, Saints and other pagan festivals and worship) in the 1st century AD? 2nd century AD? 3rd century AD?

Is it the same Church that killed thousands of people in Spain few hundred years later? Is it the same Church that has offered its blessings on warfare, death and destruction since its appearance on the scene around 4 AD

I am not even a JW’s yet, but its been a blessing to find this website and see the ideology behind “the worlds largest and truest” form of Christianity.

As a matter of fact, contrary to yours and others claims, I have spent a good portion of my time looking into other teachings of Christianity, including yours, and it is so far fetched and twisted, that even to a beginner its obvious.

I’ll think I’ll leave it at that… and wish you all the best…

no offense but you say it’s so far fetch? well you have not been studying scripture along with the writings of the early church, already in the year 107ad ignatius called Jesus church the Catholic Church in his writing before martydom.

and question - show me a place an orgainzation where there is no sin where everyone is holy and sinless? show me that place - -

JW’s have you even saw how they are batting 0000000 with all their false predictions, how a house was made for Abraham by RUtherford (i believe) but the prediction failed and no Abraham residing in that house…

look now i am sounding like you ripping the JW’s orgainzation when i should not for i am not perfect and i fail but as the Mercy of God to renew me every morning…

but with all do respect you are just sounding like those mis inform JW’s that i encounter many Saturday morning who have no clue of Church history only by what they are taught from in the magazines…

 

[T_More]

by who’s authority can the Catholic church claim to be the “owner” of the “true” Bible? Where was the “Catholic Church” (with its Christmas, Easter, Saints and other pagan festivals and worship) in the 1st century AD? 2nd century AD? 3rd century AD?

**The Catholic Church /was/has been there from the beginning.
Let no one do anything of concern to the Church without the bishop. Let that be considered a valid Eucharist which is celebrated by the bishop or by one whom he ordains *. Wherever the bishop appears, let the people be there; just as wherever Jesus Christ is, there is the Catholic Church" (Letter to the Smyrneans 8:2 [A.D. 110])- Ignatius of Antioch

“And of the elect, he was one indeed, the wonderful martyr Polycarp, who in our days was an apostolic and prophetic teacher, bishop of the Catholic Church in Smyrna. For every word which came forth from his mouth was fulfilled and will be fulfilled” (Martyrdom of Polycarp 16:2 [A.D. 155]).

“Besides these [letters of Paul] there is one to Philemon, and one to Titus, and two to Timothy, in affection and love, but nevertheless regarded as holy in the Catholic Church, in the ordering of churchly discipline. There is also one [letter] to the Laodiceans and another to the Alexandrians, forged under the name of Paul, in regard to the heresy of Marcion, and there are several others which cannot be received by the Church, for it is not suitable that gall be mixed with honey. The epistle of Jude, indeed, and the two ascribed to John are received by the Catholic Church (Muratorian fragment [A.D. 177]).

“Where was [the heretic] Marcion, that shipmaster of Pontus, the zealous student of Stoicism? Where was Valentinus, the disciple of Platonism? For it is evident that those men lived not so long ago—in the reign of Antonius for the most part—and that they at first were believers in the doctrine of the Catholic Church, in the church of Rome under the episcopate of the blessed Eleutherius, until on account of their ever restless curiosity, with which they even infected the brethren, they were more than once expelled” (Demurrer Against the Heretics 30 [A.D. 200]).- Tertullian

As for the bible, who was it that compiled it? By whose authority did the Catholic Church have to canonize the “Biblia”? Remember, this didn’t happen for over 300 hundred years after Christ, and yet, Christianity spread like wild fire. How? Read Matthew 16 honestly and tell me what you see? Christ promised perpetuity to an entity here on earth in this chapter. The WTS teaches it went apostate as soon as the last apostle died. Did Christ lie, or could not live up to his promise? Where did it go?

---

Is it the same Church that killed thousands of people in Spain few hundred years later? Is it the same Church that has offered its blessings on warfare, death and destruction since its appearance on the scene around 4 AD

The Old Testament is full of sinners that God still found favor with. Did not Moses, David, Solomon and many others sin? Did not the nation of Israel try God’s patience time after time? Yet, they were still God’s chsoen people. The world is full of sinners, my friend.

I am not even a JW’s yet, but its been a blessing to find this website and see the ideology behind “the worlds largest and truest” form of Christianity.

What should that tell you?

As a matter of fact, contrary to yours and others claims, I have spent a good portion of my time looking into other teachings of Christianity, including yours, and it is so far fetched and twisted, that even to a beginner its obvious.

**Really? It’s not obvious to me, so I must not be as smart as you. **

I’ll think I’ll leave it at that… and wish you all the best…

And to you as well. Peace be with you.

 

[yellowbird]

I am sorry, but you are either not getting the point or ignoring it. My question is: How come in various countries which don’t have the NWT translated into their language, can the local JW’s use other bibles such as King James?

:

The Devil often quoted scripture taken out of context & twisted ever so slightly.

The Watchtower Society are false prophets. Since their “founder” Charles T. Russell to present day, they have claimed to speak for Jehovah - claimed to be his “mouthpiece” and yet NONE of their prophecies have come true. Not one.

The generation born prior to 1914 did NOT pass away despite what they clamied on the inside cover of the AWAKE magazine for decades. God, knowing false prophets would come in His name, gave us a fool proof way of identifying these woves in sheeps clothing. If ONE thing they claim is about to take place does not actually happen, we are to disregard EVERYTHING they say. They do NOT speak for Him. The governing body of JWs have NEVER gotten a single thing correct.

Why would anyone want to follow a false prophet???

 

[Stylteralmaldo]

After seeing the slander and untruth here I am ever more convinced that the JW are talking, preaching and practicing the truth.

Why do central JW truth change?

Please don’t take this as me slandering your faith, but see it instead as an opportunity to explain why such a central teaching of the faith can change.

1914 - This Generation will not come to pass.
The most recent flip flop on dogma that the Watchtower has made has been on their interpretation of Matthew 24:34 "Truly I say to you that this generation will by no means pass away until all these things occur. " (NWT)
Until recently the Watchtower taught that the generation who witnessed Jesus’ second coming in the year 1914 would not die before the day of Armageddon. As time ticked by it became obvious that the Watchtower would have to change their views on this as time was running out for this prophecy to come true. At the time of writing this there are only 4 surviving UK soldiers who fought in the first world war.
Initially in the 1940’s the Watchtower’s definition of a generation was 37 years. The Watchtower got this from subtracting the date of the destruction of Jerusalem in 70 A.D. from the death of Jesus in 33 A.D. One year after 1951 (1914 + 37) the Watchtower received new light and revised their definition of generation to equal 70-80 years(three score years and ten)
One year after 1994 (1914 +80) the Watchtower has to revise their definition of a generation again. This time the Watchtower comes up with the figure of 120 years. The 120 years come from parallels drawn between the now and the time when flood struck in Noah’s day.

Source:
quotes-watchtower.co.uk/1914_generation.html

Please click on the link above which supplies all of the relevent Watchtower articles dealing with this issue. In 2007 they issued yet another pronouncement (which doesn’t appear on the first web site I provided) which states:

"It appears that we can not set a specific date for when the calling of Christians to the heavenly hope ends." (Watchtower, May 1, 2007, pages 30-31)

My source for that quote:

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Development_of_Jehovah%27s_Witnesses_doctrine

I don’t expect you to believe what an anti-JW web site has to say about JW teachings just like I don’t expect to believe what an anti-Catholic web site has to say about Catholicism. However, it is always a good idea to investigate what appears from one’s perspective to be an untruth so as to verify that it actually is true. If what this web site states is misquoted, then you can provide the evidence that it is being misquoted.

Thank you and I look forward to your response.

 

[new]

The Devil often quoted scripture taken out of context & twisted ever so slightly.

The Watchtower Society are false prophets. Since their “founder” Charles T. Russell to present day, they have claimed to speak for Jehovah - claimed to be his “mouthpiece” and yet NONE of their prophecies have come true. Not one.

The generation born prior to 1914 did NOT pass away despite what they clamied on the inside cover of the AWAKE magazine for decades. God, knowing false prophets would come in His name, gave us a fool proof way of identifying these woves in sheeps clothing. If ONE thing they claim is about to take place does not actually happen, we are to disregard EVERYTHING they say. They do NOT speak for Him. The governing body of JWs have NEVER gotten a single thing correct.

Why would anyone want to follow a false prophet???

Would you consider your Pope being the “spokesman” of god?

In the light of the recent abuse and cover ups of the Catholic Church worldwide, do you think that the “Governing body” of the Catholic Church is to be trusted for anything? On the scale of 1 to 10, how would you rate misinterpretations, actions and etc. of the JW’s governing body, compared to the legacy of the Catholic Church?

 

[PRmerger]

On the scale of 1 to 10, how would you rate misinterpretations, actions and etc. of the JW’s governing body, compared to the legacy of the Catholic Church?

What exactly is the JW’s governing body?

Did it exist in the 4th century? What about the 10th century?

If we want to compare our legacies, maybe we ought to start from similar time periods. When would we be able to make event for event comparisions?

 

[JeanneH]

Would you consider your Pope being the “spokesman” of god?

By spokesman of God do you mean prophesying? No our pope does not prophesy. The last prophet was Jesus.

In the light of the recent abuse and cover ups of the Catholic Church worldwide, do you think that the “Governing body” of the Catholic Church is to be trusted for anything?

The Church is trusted when she interprets scripture. Our “Governing Body” as you refer to it does not lead us a stray like the Watchtower leads its congregation a stray. I also don’t think that it is fair to judge the Catholic Church on the unfortunate decisions of a few men. Priests are first men after all and men do make mistakes. Are you going to tell us that the Watchtower has no skeletons in their closet?

On the scale of 1 to 10, how would you rate misinterpretations, actions and etc. of the JW’s governing body, compared to the legacy of the Catholic Church?

1 being the worst I would rate them a 0 They are knowingly leading their entire congregation in the wrong direction.

God Bless
Jeanne

 

[oneGODoneCHURCH]

In the light of the recent abuse and cover ups of the Catholic Church worldwide, do you think that the “Governing body” of the Catholic Church is to be trusted for anything? On the scale of 1 to 10, how would you rate misinterpretations, actions and etc. of the JW’s governing body, compared to the legacy of the Catholic Church?

Although numerous lawsuits have been filed in recent years, as of 2010[update] there has been no court decision against the Watchtower Society or any other legal agency used by Jehovah’s Witnesses for negligence in a child abuse case, as the Watchtower Society opts to settle out of court.
In a press release dated November 21, 2007, Jehovah’s Witnesses’ Office of Public Information stated: “In the United States, over 80,000 elders currently serve in over 12,300 congregations … During the last 100 years, only eleven elders have been sued for child abuse in thirteen lawsuits filed in the United States; In seven of these lawsuits against the elders, accusations against the Watchtower Society itself were dismissed by the courts.” [48]

In 2007 during a ground-breaking trial motion in the Napa, California court against the Watchtower Society, victims’ lawyers convinced the court that ‘ecclesiastical privilege’ does not override the legal obligation of clergy to report child sex abuse to secular authorities. The Watchtower Society paid an undisclosed amount (believed to be in the millions) in an out-of-court settlement with 16 unnamed victims of alleged sexual abuse within the religion.[49] According to court documents obtained by NBC News, one plaintiff was awarded over $780,000 USD.[50]

In criminal trials of individual Jehovah’ Witnesses, elders subpoenaed by the court have refused to testify against the accused, citing the confidentiality afforded by the penitent-clergy privilege.

The abuse of children is a grave saddness and all must fight to protect the children. However to even sggest that it is in anyway limited to Just Catholic Preist is wrong and evil. The number of Preist involed is less than 2 precent world wide. Also before throwing that stone you better make sure your own back yard is in order.

 

[T_More]

Would you consider your Pope being the “spokesman” of god?

**Would you consider the WTS to be this? They have made this claim themselves and if you’d like, I can cite many Watchtower magazine articles and publications to back it up.

**

In the light of the recent abuse and cover ups of the Catholic Church worldwide, do you think that the “Governing body” of the Catholic Church is to be trusted for anything?

[Do you think the WTS has not been guilty of transgressions? There was a national news special not too long ago (Dateline, NBC,http://www.jwfiles.com/news/dateline5-28-02.htm) uncovering child molestation going on in kingdom halls across the world, so let’s not pretend the Catholic Church has been the only one guilty of this. So what’s the point of bringing this up? That there are sinners in the world? Guess what? There are!

On the scale of 1 to 10, how would you rate misinterpretations, actions and etc. of the JW’s governing body, compared to the legacy of the Catholic Church?

When the WTS “Governing Body” has been around for 2000 years, then we’ll compare notes. How would you rate the WTS’ attempts at prophesying on a scale of 1-10?

 

[yellowbird]

Would you consider your Pope being the “spokesman” of god?

In the light of the recent abuse and cover ups of the Catholic Church worldwide, do you think that the “Governing body” of the Catholic Church is to be trusted for anything? On the scale of 1 to 10, how would you rate misinterpretations, actions and etc. of the JW’s governing body, compared to the legacy of the Catholic Church?

The Pope does not claim to be God’s prophet on Earth.

It doesn’t matter if I think the Governing Body can be trusted… God told us how we know if they can be trusted. In the book of Deut. Chapter 19 God tells us if what they claim doesn’t happen, they are false prophets.

And how many times have the Governing Body got it right? Zero. Every single thing they have claimed would happen, hasn’t. Do a search of “false Jehovah’s Witness prophecies” and literally pages & pages will come up. They are false prophets. And if you’re about to claim that they aren’t “prophets” you’re wrong. THEY claim to be God’s spokesman on Earth… Jehovah’s mouthpiece. The Governing Body claim to be God’s annointed giving out the proper food at the proper time. Only as time passes you realize it WASN’T the proper food at all.

As a Catholic I can read what the Earliest Christians believed… those who were taught by the apostles and my views are the same. They haven’t changed. JW’s can’t even read what was written 20 years ago. Foundational “truths” have changed. "This generation shall not pass away… "

So I wouldn’t put too much stock into what you’re learning from the JW’s in your studies today. In 20 years it will all be outdated as the “light gets brighter.”

 

[Cides28]

Would you consider your Pope being the “spokesman” of god?

In the light of the recent abuse and cover ups of the Catholic Church worldwide, do you think that the “Governing body” of the Catholic Church is to be trusted for anything? On the scale of 1 to 10, how would you rate misinterpretations, actions and etc. of the JW’s governing body, compared to the legacy of the Catholic Church?

MATTHEW 13 [24]“The kingdom of heaven may be compared to a man who sowed good seed in his field; [25] but while men were sleeping, his enemy came and sowed weeds among the wheat, and went away.
[26] So when the plants came up and bore grain, then the weeds appeared also.
[27] And the servants of the householder came and said to him, Sir, did you not sow good seed in your field? How then has it weeds?' [28] He said to them, An enemy has done this.’ The servants said to him, Then do you want us to go and gather them?' [29] But he said, No; lest in gathering the weeds you root up the wheat along with them.
[30] Let both grow together until the harvest; and at harvest time I will tell the reapers, Gather the weeds first and bind them in bundles to be burned, but gather the wheat into my barn.’”

This parable sounds like the Catholic Church to me, Christ planted a good seed instituting his church calling Men, then the devil came and brought in some Judas Iscariot. Christ states to allow them to grow together until his coming then he will seperate the sheeps from the goats. So again find me an orgainzation where there is perfect sinless!

 

[Vasian]

by who’s authority can the WATCHTOWER SOCIETY to be the “owner” of the “true” Bible? (NEW WORLD TRANSLATION)

Is it the same **WATCHTOWER SOCIETY ** THAT ALLOWED THE DEATHS OF COUNTLESS ONES BECAUSE THE WATCHTOWER SAID THAT ORAGAN TRANSPLANTS AND VACCINES WERE WERE PROHIBITED.

I am not even a JW’s yet, AND I HAVE NOT IDEA THE BACKGROUND OF THE WTS, but its been a blessing to find this website and see the ideology behind “the worlds largest and truest” form of Christianity.

As a matter of fact, contrary to yours and others claims, I have spent a good portion of my time looking into other teachings of Christianity, BUT NOT THAT OF THE WATCHTOWER SOCIETY EXCEPT FOR WHAT THE WATCHTOWER SOCIETY HAS SPOON FED ME. including yours, and it is so far fetched and twisted, that even to a beginner its obvious.

I’ll think I’ll leave it at that… and wish you all the best…

Fixed to reflect reality:thumbsup:

 

[Cides28]

Fixed to reflect reality:thumbsup:

WOW you were a JW for 15 + years, how were you able to come to see the real Jesus and how did you feel and feel now? i’m always fascinated and love to hear conversion stories.

 

[Vasian]

Would you consider your Pope being the “spokesman” of god?

In the light of the recent abuse and cover ups of the Catholic Church worldwide, do you think that the “Governing body” of the Catholic Church is to be trusted for anything? On the scale of 1 to 10, how would you rate misinterpretations, actions and etc. of the JW’s governing body, compared to the legacy of the Catholic Church?

Just as all baptized JW’s do, would you consider the “faithful and discreet slave” of the Watchtower Society (the governing body) the spokesmen of God?

In light of the long history and recent sexual abuse and cover ups of the world wide Watchtower Society headed up by The Governing Body should you trust them for anything?
On the scale of 1-10 how would you rate misinterpretastions, actions, etc of the JW’s compared to the Catholic Church?

You see there JW candidate, if you truly study the WTS background in all honesty and in a totally unbiased way you too will learn that religions such as the WTS who live in glass houses should not throw stones.

The Watchtower Society’s background is replete with its own skeletons in closets.
You just cannot bring yourself to use your own mental autonomy to research its background on your own. You have been told to not look at anything at all that is critical of the WTS as it all is, “apostate teachings”, no? Yes… That is what you have been told., I know, because i was one who used to tell bible studies that very thing when i was a JW. Just like it was told to me.
I thank God for the Internet for allowing me to do my own research in private.
Yes, there is a lot of falsehood written about the Watchtower Society just like there is about the Catholic Church.

If the WTS is “The Truth” do you not think that it will withstand the test of personal, inbiased research?

www.silentlambs.org.
jwfacts.com

 

[Vasian]

Key to Watchtower Truth

All religion claim truth, generally their version of truth is promoted as essential for salvation. The Watchtower assertion is that association with the Watchtower Organization is the only means by which to receive salvation. Jehovah’s Witnesses feel such a right claiming they alone adhere to correct doctrine and displays of true love.

Debating doctrine rarely convinces a person to change religion; rather it reduces to an inconclusive volley of choice scriptural texts. Most other religions can also produce “evidence” that their doctrine is truth and that they excel in love. Many 19th century religions have grown as large as the Watchtower Society, filled with sincere and intelligent people. Using doctrine to determine if the Watchtower teaches truth is tedious and ineffective, particularly if as a Witness you have spent many years subjected to constant indoctrination through repetitive meeting attendance and Watchtower study.

The underlying premise to being a Jehovah’s Witness is that the Watchtower Society is God’s visible organization. This is the foundation upon which everything is based. For as long as you believe the Watchtower Society represents Jehovah’s Organization it will not matter if doctrines change or practices are wrong because “who are we to question God?” On the other hand, once you prove that the Watchtower Society is not God’s Organization the doctrine become irrelevant. How can you test this claim?

**The Watchtower Society claims to be the Faithful and Discreet Slave of Matthew 24:45-47 and Luke 12:35-43, **explaining that this parable represents a group of leaders chosen to direct God’s people. This vague parable does not mention the word or even concept of an organization, Watchtower or Jehovah’s Witness yet it is explained that in 1919 the Slave came to be solely represented by the Watchtower Society. Two critical areas to consider are:

* who was the slave prior to the Watchtower Society
* was the Watchtower found to be cleansed in 1919

Since the Time of Jesus

***The Watchtower 1981 March 1 p.24 claims that;

  "Beginning with Pentecost, 33 C.E., and continuing through the 19 centuries since then, this slavelike congregation has been feeding its members spiritually…"***

If that is true, who was the slave immediately preceding Russell? There was no Slave promoting Russell’s teachings prior to the formation of the Watchtower Society. Russell felt that “It was often the case, however, that one religious group was distinguished by a clearer understanding of one Bible truth; another group, by a different truth. Their further progress was frequently hindered because they were shackled to doctrines and creeds…” (jv chap. 10 p. 120) For this reason he created a new religion with no connections to any 19 century historical lineage.
The Watchtower has provided discussion of many religious groups from the 1900 years prior to Russell but is yet to find even one group from any century that believed what the Witnesses now teach. None can be found that adhere simultaneously to the essential Watchtower doctrine concerning the Trinity, Ransom Sacrifice, Soul, Hell, Preaching and War.
**
There is no justification for the claim that the Watchtower Society represents a constant line since Jesus time. **

Continued on next post

 

[Vasian]

Cleansed in 1919
**
Most revealing is to test the concept that Jesus found the Watchtower Society to be cleansed and teaching pure truth in 1919.**

It is explained that in 1914 Jesus took rulership and cleansed the heavens. In 1918 this cleansing work was directed to his spiritual temple on earth.(1) In 1919 he re-inspected the Watchtower Organization and found it clean.
Describing this period the Watchtower 1998 May 15 p.17 says;

 ** "Anointed Christians who survived the testing period of 1914-19 were freed from the dominating influence of the world and from many Babylonish religious practices. The remnant went forward as a cleansed and refined people, willingly offering sacrifices of praise to God and having the assurance that they as a people were acceptable to him."

The supposed reason the Watchtower Society is the only means of salvation is that Jesus found it to be the only organization providing “the right sort of food” - truth - when Jesus inspected it in 1919.**

  God's Kingdom of a Thousand Years Has Approached pp.350, 355 "The serving of food, the right sort of food, at the proper time was the issue. It had to be according to this that a decision must be rendered by the returned master... On inspecting the remnant of his anointed disciples in the year 1919 C.E., the reigning King Jesus Christ did find the appointed "slave" faithful and discreet in the feeding of his "domestics." Accordingly, he appointed this "slave" class over all his belongings."

**
What exactly did Jesus find when he inspected the Watchtower Society in 1919? He found the following teachings being promoted;**

* The last days started in 1799 and the 1800's were the worst time period of all history
* Jesus had begun ruling in 1874
* Armageddon had started and was underway since 1914
* Pyramids and astrology pointed to 1914
* The resurrection on to earth would start in 1925
* Blood was acceptable as food for Christians
* Jesus should be prayed to and worshipped as well as Jehovah
* The Great Crowd were a heavenly class
* Birthdays and Christmas were acceptable celebrations
* The cross appeared on the cover of the Watchtower
* The use of Freemason symbology
* Strong Zionist support
* That Pastor Russell alone represented the Faithful and Discreet Slave

**
Are these teachings the ‘"right sort of food at the proper time’"?** By current Watchtower truth the food the Watchtower Society was serving in 1919 was seasoned with false prophecy, spiritism, paganism, polytheism, idolatry and political activism. Certainly anyone belonging to such a religion would be considered an apostate by current Watchtower truth. It brings into question if Russell himself could be one of the anointed 144,000.

**Did Jesus cleanse the Watchtower Society between 1918 and 1919? No, virtually all teachings remained unchanged. **The understanding of 1874 and 1914 was not transformed until 1943(2) and the (so called) idolatry of Jesus continued until 1954. Can you imagine Jesus pronouncing the Slave clean and then allowing them to worship the wrong God for the next 35 years?

An interesting twist is that in 1914 there was no Faithful and Discreet Slave class awaiting the Lord’s arrival. Luke 12:35-37 says;

  "Let YOUR loins be girded and YOUR lamps be burning, and YOU yourselves be like men waiting for their master when he returns from the marriage, so that at his arriving and knocking they may at once open to him. Happy are those slaves whom the master on arriving finds watching! Truly I say to YOU, He will gird himself and make them recline at the table and will come alongside and minister to them.

However, at that time there was no slave class as it was believed that Russell was the Slave.(3) Neither were any members of the Watchtower Society waiting for the Lord’s return as in 1914 it was believed Jesus had already returned over 40 years earlier in 1874.
**
The assertion that Jesus chose the Watchtower Society in 1919 has no basis.** The Watchtower Society promoted many false teachings until Rutherford made a radical overhaul of doctrine during the 1930’s, and has continued changing teachings ever since.
**
What should we conclude? Though Jehovah’s Witnesses think they alone follow the Bible what really is being followed are a group of men, referred to as the Governing Body. Consider;**

Up until the 1950’s Witnesses worshipped Jesus. In 1954 the Watchtower said it was wrong to worship Jesus, so all Witnesses stopped worshipping him. Before 1954 a person could be disfellowshipped if they didn’t worship Jesus, after they were disfellowshipped if they did! Bible truth had not changed so either before or after 1954 Jehovah’s Witnesses were not following Bible truth. It was not God’s Spirit that created this important discrepancy; it was the leaders of the Organization. God is a God of truth (Ex 34:6). If this organization was not teaching truth, either before or after the 1950’s, then it is not Spirit directed. Its members were not following God’s truth, they were following the untruths of men.

It can be seen that to be classified as a Jehovah’s Witness following truth is not important, unquestioning adherence to the incorrect teachings of the Governing Body is.

Viewing the history of Watchtower doctrine brings one to the understanding that holy spirit does not direct Watchtower teachings. The same is true in regard to the appointment of brothers and disfellowshipping of wrongdoers, which are also said to be done under the guidance of the holy spirit. When a person becomes aware of the number of people that are appointed to positions of authority whilst engaging in gross sin it is readily apparent that that holy spirit is not guiding the Watchtower Society in this area either.

Continued on next post

 

[Vasian]

Stumbling Blocks
**
Few people aware of the above information prior to baptism convert to being Jehovah’s Witnesses**. Once you leave it becomes difficult to comprehend how you could ever have been convinced that the Watchtower teaches truth. Just a small amount of research will uncover that;

* there are other religions with almost identical doctrine to the Watchtower
* there are some that have a far sounder doctrinal foundation
* there are religious groups that display a stronger anti-war stance
* other groups are more effective in their preaching work
* many religions display charity to an extent unheard of amongst the Witnesses

As a Witness, why are you convinced that no one else worships Jehovah? This is entirely related to the effects of constant indoctrination as described at Fear and Mind Control.

When a difficult question or the information presented here is encountered by the Witness mind it is prevented from understanding the relevance due to a number of mental hurdles. The following 4 though stopping concepts are almost universally used by high control groups to shut down clear thinking. To successfully see through Watchtower dogma you need to overcome every single one of these false concepts.

http://jehovah.net.au/firewall key.JPG

Sadly the last hurdle is most difficult of all. Fear is so ingrained that for years after leaving former Witnesses may still suffer panic about dieing at Armageddon. Even more real is the pain suffered at being shunned by family and friends on leaving the Organisation. There is no easy way to avoid this. When confronted with such a choice the mind suffers cognitive dissonance. It is safer mentally to refuse to consider the implications of such inconsistencies of belief than to confront them and realise many years of your life were controlled by misinformation and spent in pointless pursuits. With the Watchtower Society no longer stipulating your beliefs related to areas as disparate as theology, morals and your view of the historical past, present and future the mind is left grasping for a new reference point. Until it can find one it struggles in confusion and shock. This is a common dilemma for members leaving high control groups and parallels the philosophical question posed in The Matrix.

  Neo: What truth?
  Morpheus: That you are a slave, Neo. Like everyone else, you were born into bondage, born inside a prison that you cannot smell, taste, or touch. A prison for your mind. Unfortunately, no one can be told what the Matrix is. You have to see it for yourself. This is your last chance. After this, there is no turning back.
  (In his left hand, Morpheus shows a blue pill)
  You take the blue pill and the story ends. You wake in your bed and believe whatever you want to believe.
  (A red pill is shown in his other hand)
  You take the red pill and you stay in Wonderland and I show you how deep the rabbit-hole goes. Remember -- all I am offering is the truth, nothing more.

For many people it is easier to take the blue pill and think no further as to whether what they believe is truth; not everyone can live such a lie.

The United Nations Declaration of Human Rights says “a world in which human beings shall enjoy freedom of speech and belief and freedom from fear and want has been proclaimed as the highest aspiration of the common people.” Each individual should have freedom of choice in matters of religion. Are you sure you are being allowed to make your own decisions based on accurate information?

Each belief we have is interwoven with many others, resulting in our overall world view. If one of our fundamental beliefs is incorrect, then this will result in numerous other concepts also being wrong. Whilst you hold the fundamental belief that the Watchtower Society is Spirit directed and the Watchtower is from Jehovah, what it contains will be accepted with little question. After you find the Watchtower Society is not directed by Jehovah you will rapidly realise incorrect beliefs have entered almost every other part of your world view.

I know but one freedom, and that is the freedom of the mind. Antoine de Saint-Exupery

The passion for freedom of the mind is strong and everlasting, which is fortunate, because so is the passion to squelch it. AM Rosenthal

References

(1.) Isaiah’s Prophecy-Light for all Mankind II p.348 In 1918, three and a half years after his enthronement, he cleansed Jehovah’s spiritual temple, as represented on earth by the congregation of anointed Christians.

(2.) God’s Kingdom of a Thousand Years Has Approached pp.209-210 “In the year 1943 the Watch Tower Bible and Tract Society published the book “The Truth Shall Make You Free.” In its chapter 11, entitled “The Count of Time,” it did away with the insertion of 100 years into the period of the Judges and went according to the oldest and most authentic reading of Acts 13:20, and accepted the spelled-out numbers of the Hebrew Scriptures. This moved forward the end of six thousand years of man’s existence into the decade of the 1970’s. Naturally this did away with the year 1874 C.E. as the date of return of the Lord Jesus Christ and the beginning of his invisible presence or parousia.”

(3.) Watch Tower 1916 December 1 p.356 “Thousands of the readers of Pastor Russell’s writings believe that he filled the office of “that faithful and wise servant,” and that his great work was giving to the Household of Faith meat in due season. His modesty and humility precluded him from openly claiming this title, but he admitted as much in private conversation.”

 

[Cides28]

Stumbling Blocks
**
Few people aware of the above information prior to baptism convert to being Jehovah’s Witnesses**. Once you leave it becomes difficult to comprehend how you could ever have been convinced that the Watchtower teaches truth. Just a small amount of research will uncover that;

* there are other religions with almost identical doctrine to the Watchtower
* there are some that have a far sounder doctrinal foundation
* there are religious groups that display a stronger anti-war stance
* other groups are more effective in their preaching work
* many religions display charity to an extent unheard of amongst the Witnesses

As a Witness, why are you convinced that no one else worships Jehovah? This is entirely related to the effects of constant indoctrination as described at Fear and Mind Control.

When a difficult question or the information presented here is encountered by the Witness mind it is prevented from understanding the relevance due to a number of mental hurdles. The following 4 though stopping concepts are almost universally used by high control groups to shut down clear thinking. To successfully see through Watchtower dogma you need to overcome every single one of these false concepts.

http://jehovah.net.au/firewall key.JPG

Sadly the last hurdle is most difficult of all. Fear is so ingrained that for years after leaving former Witnesses may still suffer panic about dieing at Armageddon. Even more real is the pain suffered at being shunned by family and friends on leaving the Organisation. There is no easy way to avoid this. When confronted with such a choice the mind suffers cognitive dissonance. It is safer mentally to refuse to consider the implications of such inconsistencies of belief than to confront them and realise many years of your life were controlled by misinformation and spent in pointless pursuits. With the Watchtower Society no longer stipulating your beliefs related to areas as disparate as theology, morals and your view of the historical past, present and future the mind is left grasping for a new reference point. Until it can find one it struggles in confusion and shock. This is a common dilemma for members leaving high control groups and parallels the philosophical question posed in The Matrix.

  Neo: What truth?
  Morpheus: That you are a slave, Neo. Like everyone else, you were born into bondage, born inside a prison that you cannot smell, taste, or touch. A prison for your mind. Unfortunately, no one can be told what the Matrix is. You have to see it for yourself. This is your last chance. After this, there is no turning back.
  (In his left hand, Morpheus shows a blue pill)
  You take the blue pill and the story ends. You wake in your bed and believe whatever you want to believe.
  (A red pill is shown in his other hand)
  You take the red pill and you stay in Wonderland and I show you how deep the rabbit-hole goes. Remember -- all I am offering is the truth, nothing more.

For many people it is easier to take the blue pill and think no further as to whether what they believe is truth; not everyone can live such a lie.

The United Nations Declaration of Human Rights says “a world in which human beings shall enjoy freedom of speech and belief and freedom from fear and want has been proclaimed as the highest aspiration of the common people.” Each individual should have freedom of choice in matters of religion. Are you sure you are being allowed to make your own decisions based on accurate information?

Each belief we have is interwoven with many others, resulting in our overall world view. If one of our fundamental beliefs is incorrect, then this will result in numerous other concepts also being wrong. Whilst you hold the fundamental belief that the Watchtower Society is Spirit directed and the Watchtower is from Jehovah, what it contains will be accepted with little question. After you find the Watchtower Society is not directed by Jehovah you will rapidly realise incorrect beliefs have entered almost every other part of your world view.

I know but one freedom, and that is the freedom of the mind. Antoine de Saint-Exupery

The passion for freedom of the mind is strong and everlasting, which is fortunate, because so is the passion to squelch it. AM Rosenthal

References

(1.) Isaiah’s Prophecy-Light for all Mankind II p.348 In 1918, three and a half years after his enthronement, he cleansed Jehovah’s spiritual temple, as represented on earth by the congregation of anointed Christians.

(2.) God’s Kingdom of a Thousand Years Has Approached pp.209-210 “In the year 1943 the Watch Tower Bible and Tract Society published the book “The Truth Shall Make You Free.” In its chapter 11, entitled “The Count of Time,” it did away with the insertion of 100 years into the period of the Judges and went according to the oldest and most authentic reading of Acts 13:20, and accepted the spelled-out numbers of the Hebrew Scriptures. This moved forward the end of six thousand years of man’s existence into the decade of the 1970’s. Naturally this did away with the year 1874 C.E. as the date of return of the Lord Jesus Christ and the beginning of his invisible presence or parousia.”

(3.) Watch Tower 1916 December 1 p.356 “Thousands of the readers of Pastor Russell’s writings believe that he filled the office of “that faithful and wise servant,” and that his great work was giving to the Household of Faith meat in due season. His modesty and humility precluded him from openly claiming this title, but he admitted as much in private conversation.”

wow thanks for all this info!!! makes one just want to pray for all the followers of this organization - where THE SPIRIT OF THE LORD IS THERE IS FREEDOM!

 

[Vasian]

wow thanks for all this info!!! makes one just want to pray for all the followers of this organization - where THE SPIRIT OF THE LORD IS THERE IS FREEDOM!

The Apostle Paul preached prominently and primarily about two things…
The salvation through Christ, and the Freedom through Christ.

The JW’s almost brag about applying the following scripture:
"Make sure of all things, hold fast to what is fine" Which is word for word from their bible.
1 Thessalonians 5:21-22

They even put that quote on a book that published back in I believe 1953, and it was still being used up into the 1990’s.

Yet if you use that scripture literally to research the WTS itself, you will find that you would be aggressively admonished for doing so, and of you were to keep pursuing research outside of the WTS you would find yourself being brought up on charges of apostasy.

Nonetheless, I do encourage Everyone to follow the guidance set forth at 1 Thessalonians 5:21-22.