Jesus died in India

[BelFarfalla]

This time I’m talking about kellie continueing to rat on people for their beliefs. But ofcourse we(Christians) aren’t the only ones who do this.

by ‘rat’ do you mean complain to the moderator or just confront individuals?
I surely don’ see any difference between the Kellie’s remarks and paarsurrey’s relentless attack on Christian beliefs. Well except that paarsurrey is always ever so gentle. But in the end it’s the same thing.

 

[blacktiger057]

Exactly. There isn’t any difference. By ‘rat’ I mean the continueing arguement of whose religion is better and purer. But I think that it only adds filth to the confronter’s religion.

Edit: But the reason why I’m taking whoever is not on kellie’s side is because she started this post. Whether they want to or not, people will always defend their beliefs and try to disprove the beliefs of the accuser.

 

[BelFarfalla]

Exactly. There isn’t any difference. By ‘rat’ I mean the continueing arguement of whose religion is better and purer. But I think that it only adds filth to the confronter’s religion.
Edit: But the reason why I’m taking whoever is not on kellie’s side is because she started this post. Whether they want to or not, people will always defend their beliefs and try to disprove the beliefs of the accuser.

You right in many ways.

I do understand why she stared this post. It was because at the time of the post, every time a Christian mentioned that Jesus was crucified they were greeted with posts about how that is a made up lie and Christians are stupid. It got pretty tiresome. Tolerance of religious views must go both ways.

 

[blacktiger057]

It was because at the time of the post, every time a Christian mentioned that Jesus was crucified they were greeted with posts about how that is a made up lie and Christians are stupid. It got pretty tiresome. Tolerance of religious views must go both ways.

Yeah, I guess I’d be tired of it, too.

 

[jburgherr]

The New Testament is the “Pristine Word of God as revealed to”:

• The Apostle Mathew
• The Apostle Mark
• The Apostle Luke
• The Apostle John
• The Apostle Peter
• The Apostle Paul
• The Apostle James
• The Apostle Jude
  These Holy inspired Words of the Most High God, are proof that the “PromisedMessiahImamMahdi” and “Mohammad” are frauds and are not inspired by anyone.

May all of Islam repent and come to know the truth of Christianity. May they bow down before Jesus Christ and and accept Him as their Lord, God and Saviour!

 

[blacktiger057]

The New Testament is the “Pristine Word of God as revealed to”:

• The Apostle Mathew
• The Apostle Mark
• The Apostle Luke
• The Apostle John
• The Apostle Peter
• The Apostle Paul
• The Apostle James
• The Apostle Jude
  These Holy inspired Words of the Most High God, are proof that the “PromisedMessiahImamMahdi” and “Mohammad” are frauds and are not inspired by anyone.

May all of Islam repent and come to know the truth of Christianity. May they bow down before Jesus Christ and and accept Him as their Lord, God and Saviour!

I’m not a Muslim, but just because Muhhamad isn’t Jesus does not mean that he was not divinely inspired…

 

[jburgherr]

I’m not a Muslim, but just because Muhhamad isn’t Jesus does not mean that he was not divinely inspired…

Oh Boy…you really don’t get the point of the post.

 

[jimmy85]

Exactly. There isn’t any difference. By ‘rat’ I mean the continueing arguement of whose religion is better and purer. But I think that it only adds filth to the confronter’s religion.

Edit: But the reason why I’m taking whoever is not on kellie’s side is because she started this post. Whether they want to or not, people will always defend their beliefs and try to disprove the beliefs of the accuser.

I believe that God is with every person individually, regardless of their religious background.
We werent discussing about religions but only about historical facts.

I also believe that a good moral life is important and religions are moral paths to go to God.

like st James said the faith without good works is death.

I think that the mayor religions have the same goal, that is to make people morally better, regardless of whether someone believe this or that.

If you are Buddhist, dosent matter if you believe in rencarnation or in heaven. If you stop to think about it, the result is the same,
it is that we must be more spiritual and better people to go to heaven or to achive nirvana. The words are different but the goal is the same.

So then, why the evangelization?
the main reason of the catholic evangelization is “charity”.
Because catholics believe that they have:
The endless mercy of God in the confesions, the holy body of God in the eucharist, our holy Mother, baptism, the intercetions of the Saints, Tradition, The Church, The pope as sucesor of Peter, Devotions, Mass etc. and all those gifts that make us grow more spiritualy. Therefore you want other people to take advantage of this spiritual gifts as well.
However we believe that we have more spiritual responsabilitys because of having this spiritual gifts.

 

[BelFarfalla]

I’m not a Muslim, but just because Muhhamad isn’t Jesus does not mean that he was not divinely inspired…

Do you believe that God would inspire people by telling them to convert, subjugate/humiliate under islamic law, or kill every non-Muslim in the world.

Do you think that is inspired by God?

Do you think that God inspired Muhammad to assassinate those who disagreed with him?

These are important questions… because if God did, then we are all wrong and had better convert to islam today. If Muhammad was inspired by God, your (and my beliefs) are blasphamous and we should be killed.

 

[paarsurrey]

Do you believe that God would inspire people by telling them to convert, subjugate/humiliate under islamic law, or kill every non-Muslim in the world.
Do you think that is inspired by God?
**Do you think that God inspired Muhammad to assassinate those who disagreed with him? **
These are important questions… because if God did, then we are all wrong and had better convert to islam today. If Muhammad was inspired by God, your (and my beliefs) are blasphamous and we should be killed.

Hi
Muhammad was a peaceful person.
First: Name just one person whom Muhammad killed by his own sword, with a reference from Quran.
Second: Name just one person whom he himself converted from anyother religion to Islam under fear of his sword, with reference from Quran.
Third: Name just one person who got converted to some other religion from Islam, and Muhammad killed that person with his own sword to punish him, with reference from Quran.
I think there is not a single person in any category.
The West, as I understand, due to certain disinformation has seen only MullahIslam or MullahShariah; the true face of peaceful and human loving Muhammad and his religion Islam and Islam of PromisedMessiahImamMahdi is yet hidden from their eyes, which is truly speaking moral and peaceful.
The first forty years i.e. before Muhammad was appointed ProphetMessenger by GodAllahYHWH has been offered as a reasonable argument/challenge in Quran before Infidels-of-Mecca, and they could not deny its truthfulness.
Muhammad had a marvelous record of a peace loving person for 40+13+2=55 years, he joined in welfare activities if there was any in Mecca, he helped the needy and in distress, he stood for the human cause, he never harmed any person. His record in these 55 years is clean by any standards.
Thanks

 

[blacktiger057]

Oh Boy…you really don’t get the point of the post.

What was the point of the post, then?

 

[mirandajb]

It’s fine if paarsurrey wants to believe this or anything else.

You may want to ask him why he is having a hard time allowing us to have our own beliefs.We did not go to a Muslim Ahmadi forum and tell them there that they are wrong and misguided. It was paarsurrey who came to a Catholic forum and told us that we are wrong and misguided.

So if you want to jump on someone for not letting others have their beliefs, jump on paarsurrey.

Amen to that. If this was a Muslim forum, there would be a fatwa on Paarsurrey’s head, but we Christians are different. I think when Paarsurrey finally becomes a Christian, he would be a great testimony to the Christian faith.

 

[blacktiger057]

Do you believe that God would inspire people by telling them to convert, subjugate/humiliate under islamic law, or kill every non-Muslim in the world.

Do you think that is inspired by God?

Do you think that God inspired Muhammad to assassinate those who disagreed with him?

These are important questions… because if God did, then we are all wrong and had better convert to islam today. If Muhammad was inspired by God, your (and my beliefs) are blasphamous and we should be killed.

Where are you getting this information from? I thought Muhhamad was peaceful and never killed anyone…

 

[BelFarfalla]

Hi
Muhammad was a peaceful person.
First: Name just one person whom Muhammad killed by his own sword, with a reference from Quran.

We call it conspiracy to commit murder. He ordered the death of people who critizied him. His minions did the killing for him. Muhammad is guilty of those murders as much and the person who pulled them off.
Paarsurrey, I do not attack your faith. It is solid. I only address issues about Islam and Muhammad that cause me great concern.

Second: Name just one person whom he himself converted from anyother religion to Islam under fear of his sword, with reference from Quran…

Thousands converted to islam during the time fo Muhammad out of fear of Muhammad. He also had people executed who first converted to Islam, than has second thoughts and left Islam. The execution of apostates is still the law of Islam.
Does you sect of Islam execute apostates?

Third: Name just one person who got converted to some other religion from Islam, and Muhammad killed that person with his own sword to punish him, with reference from Quran.

In the Qur’an and Hadith Muhammad ordered the exectution of apostates. This has been the law of Islam for over 1400 years.

Qur’an 4:89-They wish that you reject Faith, as they have rejected (Faith), and thus that you all become equal (like one another). So take not Auliya’ (protectors or friends) from them, till they emigrate in the Way of Allah (to Muhammad SAW). But if they turn back (from Islam), take (hold) of them and kill them wherever you find them, and take neither Auliya’ (protectors or friends) nor helpers from them.

I think there is not a single person in any category.

This is a game of words that you play. Since the Qur’an and Hadiths do not say that Muhammad killed anyone with his own hands you carefully state your question this this way. The fact is that he ordered the assassition and exectuion of many. He ordred that non-Muslim convert, subjugate to Islam or die. Muhammad is responsible for all of the deaths that have occurred based on his teachings.

Muhammad had a marvelous record of a peace loving person for 40+13+2=55 years, he joined in welfare activities if there was any in Mecca, he helped the needy and in distress, he stood for the human cause, he never harmed any person. His record in these 55 years is clean by any standards.

This is just not true and has been proven false over and over on these forums. Yet you repeat it over and over. Repeating a falsehood does not make it true.

 

[paarsurrey]

Does your sect of Islam execute apostates?

How could we do that, that would be a foolish thing to do, also it would prove counterproductive.
Quran/Islam/Muhammad never gave any teachings for that.
I, perhaps, suggested you to have some research by surfing some links. If you feel interested I would provide the same again.
Thanks

 

[BelFarfalla]

Where are you getting this information from? I thought Muhhamad was peaceful and never killed anyone…

From the Islamic holy scriptures … from the Qur’an and Hadith.

*usc.edu/dept/MSA/fundamentals/hadithsunnah/bukhari/052.sbt.html#004.052.286 *
*Bukhari, Book Volume 4, Book 52, Number 286: *
Narrated Salama bin Al-Akwa:
“An infidel spy came to the Prophet while he was on a journey. The spy sat with the companions of the Prophet and started talking and then went away. The Prophet said (to his companions), ‘Chase and kill him.’ So, I killed him.” The Prophet then gave him the belongings of the killed spy (in addition to his share of the war booty).

*Sahih Bukhari Volume 4, Book 52, Number 271: *
Narrated Jabir:
The Prophet said, “Who is ready to kill Ka’b bin Ashraf (i.e. a Jew).” Muhammad bin Maslama replied, “Do you like me to kill him?” The Prophet replied in the affirmative. Muhammad bin Maslama said, “Then allow me to say what I like.” The Prophet replied, “I do (i.e. allow you).”

*Sahih Muslim Book 019, Number 4436: *
It has been narrated on the authority of Jabir that the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) said: Who will kill Ka’b b. Ashraf? He has maligned Allah, the Exalted, and His Messenger. Muhammad b. Maslama said: Messenger of Allah, do you wish that I should kill him? He said: Yes. He said: Permit me to talk (to him in the way I deem fit). He said: Talk (as you like). So, Muhammad b. Maslama came to Ka’b and talked to him, referred to the old friendship between them and said: This man (i. e. the Holy Prophet) has made up his mind to collect charity (from us) and this has put us to a great hardship. When be heard this, Ka’b said: By God, you will be put to more trouble by him. Muhammad b. Maslama said: No doubt, now we have become his followers and we do not like to forsake him until we see what turn his affairs will take. I want that you should give me a loan. He said: What will you mortgage? He said: What do you want? He said: Pledge me your women. He said: You are the most handsome of the Arabs; should we pledge our women to you? He said: Pledge me your children. He said: The son of one of us may abuse us saying that he was pledged for two wasqs of dates, but we can pledge you (cur) weapons. He said: All right. Then Muhammad b. Maslama promised that he would come to him with Harith, Abu 'Abs b. Jabr and Abbad b. Bishr. So they came and called upon him at night. He came down to them. Sufyan says that all the narrators except 'Amr have stated that his wife said: I hear a voice which sounds like the voice of murder. He said: It is only Muhammad b. Maslama and his foster-brother, Abu Na’ila. When a gentleman is called at night even it to be pierced with a spear, he should respond to the call. Muhammad said to his companions: As he comes down, I will extend my hands towards his head and when I hold him fast, you should do your job. So when he came down and he was holding his cloak under his arm, they said to him: We sense from you a very fine smell. He said: Yes, I have with me a mistress who is the most scented of the women of Arabia. He said: Allow me to smell (the scent on your head). He said: Yes, you may smell. So he caught it and smelt. Then he said: Allow me to do so (once again). He then held his head fast and said to his companions: Do your job. And they killed him.

You can find all of these on this web site. It’s one of the best Islamic sources on the web.
usc.edu/dept/MSA/fundamentals/hadithsunnah/

 

[anthony022071]

How could we do that, that would be a foolish thing to do, also it would prove counterproductive.
Quran/Islam/Muhammad never gave any teachings for that.
I, perhaps, suggested you to have some research by surfing some links. If you feel interested I would provide the same again.
Thanks

Where is your proof that Jesus died in India? Debate with us about this.

 

[blacktiger057]

Wow, Belfarfella, that is bad. I still think that Muhhamad was somewhat divinely inspired, but sometimes people go the wrong way about it. I don’t know why some people say the pope is infallible. He may be divinely inspired, but he is not God. In history he has been wrong before.

What you wrote above supports the fact that Muhhamad was not like Jesus. Muhamad was still human.

 

[BelFarfalla]

Wow, Belfarfella, that is bad. I still think that Muhhamad was somewhat divinely inspired, but sometimes people go the wrong way about it.

There is a lot more of it.
In what way do you think he was divinely inspired instead of just being a charismatic man who was able to gather the Arab tribes into cohesive force?

I don’t know why some people say the pope is infallible. He may be divinely inspired, but he is not God. In history he has been wrong before.

It seems that you do not understand what Papal infallibility means. No one has ever claimed that the Pope is God. The pope is human and sin just like the rest of us. He is only infallible in matters of faith and moral. For example when the pope says that we are to eat fish on Fridays that is NOT an infallible statement. That is him leading us in a way to fast and contemplate our sins.
Now when the Pope says that Catholics must believe in and follow the ten commandments, that is an infallible statement. That is a matter of dogma based directly on the bible. The pope himself cannot just claim that some statement he made is infallible. It is judged by the college of Cardinals who study the statements and decide which are infallible. In the history of the CC only a couple of dozen infallible statements have been declared. Its very rare.

What you wrote above supports the fact that Muhammad was not like Jesus. Muhammad was still human.

Muslims believe that Jesus was only a man and a prophet… They do not believe that he was crucified.

 

[jimmy85]

The people that have made famous religions perhaps knew some knowledge about God. Mohamed made people to believe in a unique God, Buddha made people to have a life of compasion toward others.
This stuffs certainly come from a kowledge of God.

The primitive men of every culture used to have a spiritual side they had some knowledge about the existens of divinitys, and about an afterlife becuase of their likeness with God.
However their selfish and evil actitude made them to go astray of that true. They were led to paganism n awfull rituals immolating people and a lack of moral in their lifes.

However religions have been changing and maturing and paganism had almsot disapeared giving space to only monotheistic religions, or religions that believe in compasion and love toward others.

So I think God has influenciated some people of several cultures in order to show them some of his true.