Jesus gives us His Own Mother as Mediatrix of all Graces

[patricius79]

Dear friends,

I think it is so wonderful that Jesus (God) gave His own Mother to us, as our “Mother in the order of grace” (Vatican II)–so that we could live our whole lives in her Immaculate Heart.

Here are two beautiful quotes which seem especially needing understanding in our times, as if they were written just today.

Here is Blessed Pope Pius IX, who dogmatically defined the Immaculate Conception:

“5. And likewise in our own day, Mary, with the ever merciful affection so characteristic of her maternal heart, wishes, through her efficacious intercession with God, to deliver her children from the sad and grief-laden troubles, from the tribulations, the anxiety, the difficulties, and the punishments of God’s anger which afflict the world because of the sins of men. Wishing to restrain and to dispel the violent hurricane of evils which, as We lament from the bottom of Our heart, are everywhere afflicting the Church, Mary desires to transform Our sadness into joy. The foundation of all Our confidence, as you know well, Venerable Brethren, is found in the Blessed Virgin Mary. For, God has committed to Mary the treasury of all good things, in order that everyone may know that through her are obtained every hope, every grace, and all salvation. For this is His will, that we obtain everything through Mary.[3]”

Ubi Primum - Papal Encyclicals

Here is Pope St. John Paul II, after he explains that Mary stands at the center of the Paschal mystery with Jesus, who gives her to every human person as mother from the Cross:

“45. Of the essence of motherhood is the fact that it concerns the person. Motherhood always establishes a unique and unrepeatable relationship between two people: between mother and child and between child and mother. Even when the same woman is the mother of many children, her personal relationship with each one of them is of the very essence of motherhood. For each child is generated in a unique and unrepeatable way, and this is true both for the mother and for the child. Each child is surrounded in the same way by that maternal love on which are based the child’s development and coming to maturity as a human being.”
http://w2.vatican.va/content/john-p.../hf_jp-ii_enc_25031987_redemptoris-mater.html

 

[BayCityRickL]

I understand that this is not a dogma of the church, but it is doctrine. It seems an embellishment to me, another reason for focusing more attention on Mary. In fact, when you read the geneologies of Jesus in the gospels, there were many predecessors who could likewise be called not “mediatrix” but “co-mediatrix” of grace.

Do we need more titles and honor for Mary? I don’t understand the reason. We cannot add to the honor that has already been bestowed on Mary. It’s almost blasphemous that we could “out do” God in honoring Mary. As Paul says, let us keep our eyes on Christ, and Him crucified.

 

[Benadam]

Do we need more titles and honor for Mary? I don’t understand the reason.

Jesus in no way feels the way you do about His mother. Catholics aren’t seeking titles and honors to bestow but are devoted to Mary. That allows for a process of discovery of who she is. Ever finding her role more profound and substantial.

when you read the geneologies of Jesus in the gospels, there were many predecessors who could likewise be called not “mediatrix” but “co-mediatrix” of grace.

I know this might sound offensive to you but it can’t be denied.
Through Our Blessed Mother the world receives salvation. Can that be said about anyone else who ever lived? What about this grace?

When Elizabeth heard Mary’s greeting, the child leapt in her womb. And Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit.

Is there anyone else in the Gospels who’s voice caused some one to be filled with the Holy Spirit? Jesus.

It’s almost blasphemous that we could “out do” God in honoring Mary.

How do you know that God is outdone this way? You think we honor Mary almost as much as you do God. The more we understand how marvelous are God’s creatures the more so we marvel at God.

We can’t lift Mary up higher than her Son no more than we can honor the pot more than the potter who made it.

 

[CRM_Brother]

I just want to point out something.

The Church has declared Our Mother as the ‘Mediatrix of Grace’, but the title ‘Mediatrix of All Graces’ is currently a very sensitive theological question in the Church. There was a report of an apparition of Our Lady under the extended title in Lipa, Philippines (actually quite literally down the street from me) in 1948. It was declared null at the time, but it somewhat recently came to light that the investigation never actually took place and the Vatican official in charge of the investigation threatened the Archbishops of the Philippines with excommunication if they did not support him in his decision. There is a movement to get the Vatican to reopen the investigation, but theologians have not declared the ‘All Graces’ aspect of the title as true. There is still the question if there are certain Graces given which are solely under the authority of the Son.

 

[Ron_Conte]

Mary is mediatrix of all graces except (1) the graces she herself receives, in which case she is the recipient, not the mediatrix, and, (2) the graces that flow from the Divine Nature to the human nature of Christ within the hypostatic union. There is no mediator between the Divine Nature and the human nature of Christ, since the two natures are united as one person. But of all other graces, she is the mediatrix.

 

[Vonsalza]

As an ex-Reformed Baptist who still has difficulty committing himself to the Rosary (that also goes to a parish where the priest tells me “that’s alright”), I enjoy reading about Marian devotion.

But I think some folks go a little too far with it. When your eyes are on Mary alone, you might need to reel-in your devotions a bit.

 

[patricius79]

As Popes and doctors (like St. Alphonsus Liguori, St. Bernard)) and other saints (like St. Maximilian Kolbe) tell us, every grace comes to us through Mary, our Mother in the order of grace,. Mary is the "Spouse of the Holy Spirit’ (St. JPII)

As the quotation from Blessed Pope Pius IX says in the opening post. “every grace” comes to us from Jesus Christ (God the Son) through Mary (a creature).

Here, for example, is Pope Leo XIII as well:

"Thus is confirmed that law of merciful meditation of which We have spoken, and which St. Bernardine of Siena thus expresses: "Every grace granted to man has three degrees in order; for by God it is communicated to Christ, from Christ it passes to the Virgin, and from the Virgin it descends to us." And we, by the very form of the Rosary, do linger longest, and, as it were, by preference upon the last and lowest of these steps, repeating by decades the Angelic Salutation, so that with greater confidence we may thence attain to the higher degrees-that is, may rise, by means of Christ, to the Divine Father."
http://w2.vatican.va/content/leo-xi...enc_08091894_iucunda-semper-expectatione.html

 

[Tis_Bearself]

When your eyes are on Mary alone, you might need to reel-in your devotions a bit.

It is impossible to have “your eyes…on Mary alone.” Without Jesus, there would be no Blessed Mother, no reported messages from her, no point. It is impossible to remove Jesus from the Mary equation. This seems very basic to me.

 

[pianistclare]

I imagine it saddens Mary that Catholics fight over this. She never takes anything for herself. She does not desire accolades, or titles, She just wants us to love her Son, as is so obvious in all the approved Apparition messages.

It must make her sad, and I imagine Jesus frowns when people disrespect her honor.
She’s just that holy, and the human part of Him would like to see us in agreement.

For myself, on the last day, I don’t want Him to look at me and say “why did you so easily dismiss my mama? She loved you so much. She was there for you”.

Let’s make an effort to stop quibbling over titles or no titles.

 

[Vonsalza]

Vonsalza:

When your eyes are on Mary alone, you might need to reel-in your devotions a bit.

It is impossible to have “your eyes…on Mary alone.”…

Oh, I’m old enough to know that man can make a false idol of anything. Anything at all.

 

[De_Maria]

I understand that this is not a dogma of the church, but it is doctrine.

Correct.

It seems an embellishment to me,

The Holy Spirit continues to lead the Catholic Church deeper in understanding the Teachings of Jesus Christ.

another reason for focusing more attention on Mary.

Apparently, God feels that she deserves more attention.

In fact, when you read the geneologies of Jesus in the gospels, there were many predecessors who could likewise be called not “mediatrix” but “co-mediatrix” of grace.

So could all people who mediate between God and man. But she was mediator in a special way. She brought Christ into the world.

Do we need more titles and honor for Mary?

If we do, the Holy Spirit will inspire the Catholic Church to Teach them to the world.

I don’t understand the reason.

Your understanding is not necessary. Only your faith and obedience to the Word of God through the Church:

Hebrews 13:17 [a]Obey your leaders and defer to them, for they keep watch over you and will have to give an account, that they may fulfill their task with joy and not with sorrow, for that would be of no advantage to you.

We cannot add to the honor that has already been bestowed on Mary.

We can’t add to the honor which has already been bestowed upon Mary, by God. But we can provide the honors which we have, in our ignorance, neglected to provide.

It’s almost blasphemous that we could “out do” God in honoring Mary.

That’s true. But we aren’t trying to out do God. We are being obedient to God by attempting to recognize and celebrate all the wonderful things that He has done for her.

Luke 1:49 The Mighty One has done great things for me,
and holy is his name.

As Paul says, let us keep our eyes on Christ, and Him crucified.

As St. Matthew says:

Matthew 2:11 And when they were come into the house, they saw the young child with Mary his mother, and fell down, and worshipped him:

 

[Vonsalza]

Let’s make an effort to stop quibbling over titles or no titles.

Right on, pianistclare.

 

[De_Maria]

As an ex-Reformed Baptist who still has difficulty committing himself to the Rosary (that also goes to a parish where the priest tells me “that’s alright”), I enjoy reading about Marian devotion.

But I think some folks go a little too far with it. When your eyes are on Mary alone, you might need to reel-in your devotions a bit.

If anyone’s eyes are on Mary alone, then that is going too far. But those who give her the title “mediatrix” do not have their eyes on her alone. The title is self-explanatory. She is a facilitator for you and the whole world to receive God’s grace through her Son. Therefore, she is leading you to put your eyes on her Son.

 

[De_Maria]

Tis_Bearself:

Vonsalza:

When your eyes are on Mary alone, you might need to reel-in your devotions a bit.

It is impossible to have “your eyes…on Mary alone.”…

Oh, I’m old enough to know that man can make a false idol of anything. Anything at all.

But you are falsely claiming that the Catholic Church is making a false idol of Mary. Whereas, the Catholic Church is not teaching anyone to worship Mary nor to put their eyes on her alone. The only value the title mediatrix has, by definition, is that she is leading all of us to Christ. And she alone deserves the highest honor with that respect, because she alone conceived Christ in her womb, bore Him in her body for 9 months and then gave Him to the world.

 

[Vonsalza]

Vonsalza:

As an ex-Reformed Baptist who still has difficulty committing himself to the Rosary (that also goes to a parish where the priest tells me “that’s alright”), I enjoy reading about Marian devotion.

But I think some folks go a little too far with it. When your eyes are on Mary alone, you might need to reel-in your devotions a bit.

If anyone’s eyes are on Mary alone, then that is going too far. But those who give her the title “mediatrix” do not have their eyes on her alone. The title is self-explanatory. She is a facilitator for you and the whole world to receive God’s grace through her Son. Therefore, she is leading you to put your eyes on her Son.

To the last, I agree. I also think the Spirit carries the primary responsibility for that task.

The more devout will have to exercise their patience with this ex-reformer, I suppose. I’m happy to pay homage to her as “theotokos” and intercessor. But do I think she plays a soteriological function? No, not really.

 

[Vonsalza]

Vonsalza:

Tis_Bearself:

Vonsalza:

When your eyes are on Mary alone, you might need to reel-in your devotions a bit.

It is impossible to have “your eyes…on Mary alone.”…

Oh, I’m old enough to know that man can make a false idol of anything. Anything at all.

But you are falsely claiming that the Catholic Church is making a false idol of Mary.

Absolutely incorrect.

I challenge you to reference a post where I do so.

 

[De_Maria]

To the last, I agree. I also think the Spirit carries the primary responsibility for that task.

The more devout will have to exercise their patience with this ex-reformer, I suppose. I’m happy to pay homage to her as “theotokos” and intercessor. But do I think she plays a soteriological function? No, not really.

All of us play a soteriological function (i.e. a role in salvation). Both to us and to those who hear us. She just plays a greater role because she is the Mother of God:

1 Timothy 4:16 Attend to yourself and to your teaching; persevere in both tasks, for by doing so you will save both yourself and those who listen to you.

so·te·ri·ol·o·gy
noun
the doctrine of salvation.

 

[Vonsalza]

Vonsalza:

To the last, I agree. I also think the Spirit carries the primary responsibility for that task.

The more devout will have to exercise their patience with this ex-reformer, I suppose. I’m happy to pay homage to her as “theotokos” and intercessor. But do I think she plays a soteriological function? No, not really.

All of us play a soteriological function (i.e. a role in salvation). Both to us and to those who hear us. She just plays a greater role because she is the Mother of God:

1 Timothy 4:16 Attend to yourself and to your teaching; persevere in both tasks, for by doing so you will save both yourself and those who listen to you.

so·te·ri·ol·o·gy
noun
the doctrine of salvation.

You cite that Mary plays a role in soteriology and then cited a scripture that supports enduring in the faith and in teaching for your benefit and those that listen to you (not just hear)… The text doesn’t directly support your statement, so I’m confused.

Evangelism and soteriology are different things. I agree that we all have an evangelical responsibility. We’re commissioned by Christ and empowered by the Spirit. Any role that any saint would play (including Mary) is secondary. Not unimportant. But secondary.

 

[patricius79]

Mary always helps me to be closer to Christ. I pray for those who don’t know her love personally (see opening post quote from JPII)

According to the dogmatic teaching of the Catholic Church at Vatican II, there is a “union of the mother and the Son in the work of salvation” (Vatican II Lumen Gentium)

The Church is clear that in this union Mary’s role as our Maternal Mediatrix is entirely dependent on Jesus Christ and neither adds nor subtracts anything from His grace.

Rather, Vatican II says, it shows His power:

"57. This union of the Mother with the Son in the work of salvation is made manifest from the time of Christ’s virginal conception up to His death it is shown first of all when Mary, arising in haste to go to visit Elizabeth, is greeted by her as blessed because of her belief in the promise of salvation and the precursor leaped with joy in the womb of his mother.(288) …

1. There is but one Mediator as we know from the words of the apostle, “for there is one God and one mediator of God and men, the man Christ Jesus, who gave himself a redemption for all”.(298) The maternal duty of Mary toward men in no wise obscures or diminishes this unique mediation of Christ, but rather shows His power. For all the salvific influence of the Blessed Virgin on men originates, not from some inner necessity, but from the divine pleasure. It flows forth from the superabundance of the merits of Christ, rests on His mediation, depends entirely on it and draws all its power from it. In no way does it impede, but rather does it foster the immediate union of the faithful with Christ.
2. This maternity of Mary in the order of grace began with the consent which she gave in faith at the Annunciation and which she sustained without wavering beneath the cross, and lasts until the eternal fulfillment of all the elect. Taken up to heaven she did not lay aside this salvific duty, but by her constant intercession continued to bring us the gifts of eternal salvation.(15*) By her maternal charity, she cares for the brethren of her Son, who still journey on earth surrounded by dangers and cultics, until they are led into the happiness of their true home. Therefore the Blessed Virgin is invoked by the Church under the titles of Advocate, Auxiliatrix, Adjutrix, and Mediatrix.(16*) This, however, is to be so understood that it neither takes away from nor adds anything to the dignity and efficaciousness of Christ the one Mediator.(17*)"
   http://www.vatican.va/archive/hist_...s/vat-ii_const_19641121_lumen-gentium_en.html

 

[De_Maria]

All of us play a soteriological function (i.e. a role in salvation). Both to us and to those who hear us. She just plays a greater role because she is the Mother of God:

1 Timothy 4:16 Attend to yourself and to your teaching; persevere in both tasks, for by doing so you will save both yourself and those who listen to you.

so·te·ri·ol·o·gy
noun
the doctrine of salvation.

You cite that Mary plays a role in soteriology and then cited a scripture that supports enduring in the faith and in teaching for your benefit and those that listen to you (not just hear)… The text doesn’t directly support your statement, so I’m confused.

Soteriology means "doctrine of salvation.

You claim that Mary plays no role in that Doctrine.

I posted a verse which shows that we ALL play a role in that Doctrine.

So, if we, who are poor and blind in comparison to the Mother of God, play a role, how much greater a role did she play who brought Christ into the world?

Evangelism and soteriology are different things.

True. But not mutually exclusive. In fact, evangelists play a role in soteriology.

I agree that we all have an evangelical responsibility. We’re commissioned by Christ and empowered by the Spirit. Any role that any saint would play (including Mary) is secondary. Not unimportant. But secondary.

Well, now you’ve admitted that Mary does play a role. Great!

The only difference remaining is that you think Mary’s role is unimportant. Given that Mary brought the Savior into this world, I maintain that she played the most important role, short of being the Savior herself. In other words, Mary’s role is secondary to Christ, but greater than any other human being’s.