Jesus vs Muhammad

  • Thread starter Thread starter qwerk
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
don’t you dare tell Christians what the bible teaches when it suits the perversions of islam!
He may dare to say what he wants, you should be able to respond to his challenges by correcting his errant ideologies, instead of ranting about what he may dare or not dare to do.

When you rant, you are only stating that you cannot defend your position, and you cannot point out where he is wrong.
 
Matthew 15:1&2
1Then some Pharisees and teachers of the law came to Jesus from Jerusalem and asked,
2"Why do your disciples break the tradition of the elders? They don’t wash their hands before they eat!"


How can there be any doubt at all that the answer provided by Jesus (pbuh) in Matthew 15 was in direct response to a question about eating without first washing one’s hands?

It is diabolical for Christians to happily deduce that verse 11 i.e. What goes into a man’s mouth does not make him ‘unclean,’ but what comes out of his mouth, that is what makes him ‘unclean.’ " is a carte blanche for them to eat anything they want regardless of whether or not Jesus (pbuh) has warned that God Almighty has prohibited it.
Instead of telling Christians what to eat and drink…why not address this among your sad group of perverts.

news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100408/ap_on_re_mi_ea/ml_yemen_child_bride
 
He may dare to say what he wants, you should be able to respond to his challenges by correcting his errant ideologies, instead of ranting about what he may dare or not dare to do.

When you rant, you are only stating that you cannot defend your position, and you cannot point out where he is wrong.
If you look through the years of posts by hamba and planten you will see why most people no longer try to reason with them. Check it out. You’ll get tired of it.
 
If you look through the years of posts by hamba and planten you will see why most people no longer try to reason with them. Check it out. You’ll get tired of it.
If they are still here, it is because God wills for them to see the light. If I am to be the instrument of my Lord in some measure - let His will be done.
 
If they are still here, it is because God wills for them to see the light. If I am to be the instrument of my Lord in some measure - let His will be done.
Then you have my prayers for your success. Too many have tried to reason and have been frustrated by nonsense. Maybe you are the one that can make the difference.
🙂
 
Un-christian.

There is a beam in my eye, perhaps yours too?
Not un-Christian. People are suffering because of the brutality of islam. You don’t see the muslim clerics expressing sympathy for the little girl. You see them condemning an attempt to put to end raping children. It’s called rape, slavery, and kidnapping and many other things. It’s a sick culture that defends the practice and belief system that defends the practice. The un-Christian thing is to not SCREAM OUT against this perpertated suffering of the children by muslim so called men that can’t even find a date without paying for it.
 
The un-Christian thing is to not SCREAM OUT against this perpertated suffering of the children by muslim so called men that can’t even find a date without paying for it.
How do you feel about the sexual abuse suffered by countless people at the hands of catholic clerics?

More importantly how to feel about the widespread cover up perpetrated by the Church of these abuses.
 
How do you feel about the sexual abuse suffered by countless people at the hands of catholic clerics?

More importantly how to feel about the widespread cover up perpetrated by the Church of these abuses.
I am ABSOLUTELY FURIOUS! The coverup is adding fuel to the fire! The buck should stop at the highest responsible person in the heirarchy…regardless of who it is. My faith is not in the priests (though 97% are good and made to appear bad by this) it is in Christ and His Church. We all make up the church.
 
i just wanna to recognize what you see to be difference
the only difference i see now between my God and your God is that my God will torture the disbelievers because he hated thier behaviour , while your God will also torture the disbelievers while he loves them

can i consider that what you trying to proof ?
I think that you are trying to be smarter than God. You are trying to twist words so as to try to bring down YHWH to the level of Allah. Once again you have told us you do believe that the God of the Bible is different from Allah. But more importantly, you are trying to make out that the God of Israel just created you to torture you as what Muhammad told us about Allah.

Muhammad says that everyone will burn in hell before being taken out of it on Judgement Day unless you die while killing others. So Allah has some preconditions in order for someone to make it to his heaven of carnal lusts (sexual and oral). Did you fight and strive to either kill or subjugate enough Jews and Christians?

Muhammad has you breaking the 10 Commandments to follow Allah: To deceive, if you want to become a shahid you must die while killing, rape women if they are not believers (**adultry), **you can steal from unbelievers (covet), etc. The 10 Commandments do not say you can do those things against unbelievers, but it is ok if the person is an unbeliever in Islam.

Here is RockyRoad’s post again: John 3:16 "For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life.

So here are the two outlined for you. One was a god that Muhammad described, who was a deceiver as was Muhammad a deceiver. Islam based on lies. While the Bible has been consistent and the message consistent while the Quran’s message has not been consistent but dependent on Muhammad’s moods. When he thought he could establish a new religion with him as the prophet peacefully he didn’t get too many to follow him. He got people to follow him when he became a murderer and enslaver. When he got people to fear him.

How can anyone believe a liar? Allah’s teachings say to break the 10 Commandments and how do you trust him? A liar? Allah’s kingdom doesn’t sound like it is heaven.

Allah’s heaven basically reduces men to a bunch of glutonous, ‘sexual organs’ going after virgins and little boys, drinking from Satan’s stash of wine. But is it? Remember that Allah is a liar.

Matthew 22:30
“At the resurrection people will neither marry nor be given in marriage; they will be like the angels in heaven.”
 
The truth is that there is such a thing as the anonymous Catholic, a person, saved by the grace of God, for his search for the Christ.

Many jews, muslims, hindus, buddhists before Christ were saved as such, not knowing Him in life, yet seeking Him always.
 
They were both created by crazy old men who had nothing better to do. 🙂
 
in the first place, nobody else is comparable to Jesus…simply because of His divinity.

But even if we compare, and evidence had shown that Jesus won hands down ~ it wouldn’t be too much of a surprise either. To bash up the entire Muslim community because one disapproved Muhummed’s actions, was Unchristian. Many muslims did not choose to become muslims, but born as one. Like you can blame them (as long as they are peaceloving muslims) any more than you can blame a person born of any particular race. If they are peaceloving, remained faithful to God ~ they are essentially doing exactly what Jesus had taught us to do, and shouldn’t be condemned.

Bashing anybody else, it an act of ‘lacking love’ and thus, such actions hurt God, and should very much be avoided.
 
in the first place, nobody else is comparable to Jesus…simply because of His divinity.

But even if we compare, and evidence had shown that Jesus won hands down ~ it wouldn’t be too much of a surprise either. To bash up the entire Muslim community because one disapproved Muhummed’s actions, was Unchristian. Many muslims did not choose to become muslims, but born as one. Like you can blame them (as long as they are peaceloving muslims) any more than you can blame a person born of any particular race. If they are peaceloving, remained faithful to God ~ they are essentially doing exactly what Jesus had taught us to do, and shouldn’t be condemned.

Bashing anybody else, it an act of ‘lacking love’ and thus, such actions hurt God, and should very much be avoided.
Very sweet. Many muslims refuse to learn about Christ. Many muslims are not peace loving. We as Christians and Jews are dogs and pigs. You are correct. Mo teaches them to hate. We have to show them how false their religion is.
 
Islam is the most distressing and saddest of the major heresies. There are a couple matters of practice which I wish more Christians observed, such as a devotion to prayer, decrees against usury, etc., but bottom line, it denies Christ’s divinity, and it is a post incarnation religion. We, as Christians should accept no religion as valid which came into being after the incarnation, life, death, resurrection of our Lord. He founded on Church, and we will have no further prophesies, and certainly no whole new religions, until he returns in glofy to judge the living and the dead. We were left the Holy Ghost, and the sacraments. That’s it, and that’s plenty.

The Peace of the Lord, Jesus Christ be with you all.
 
thank you for the article , but it dosn’t address my question about his love for dibelievers

let me talking about the issues which your articl raised
God loves us so much that he sent his only Son to become one of us and to save the human race.

if this is why God is love , then we believe either that God loves us so much that he sent us his prophets for the people with revelations to save the human race

further in the article it says
Will you choose sin and separation? A life of selfishness, greed, and anger? A life of bitterness, frustration, even despair?
Or will you choose to become what you should be? Will you choose to embrace God’s love (even through the carrying of your own cross), to receive his forgiveness and healing, and to live as he made you to live–the only way you can be truly happy?

here he says that who choose to believe in christ will recieve his forgivness and healing , what about the others ?

my conclusion is that the concept of love which God have to all people are enclosed on his grace to sent for us the guidence .
some will refuse the guidence and some will follow it , my question is about love of God for those whom choose to refuse his massage
if he loves their disbelieves after his love which be offered to them , then give me clues ?
elwill,

To understand first of all why the human race needs a SAVIOR, and not just a prophet you must first understand the concept of Original Sin. In Islam, (correct me if I am wrong) I believe that after the fall of Adam and Eve, Adam was immediately forgiven by God, but according to Christian beliefs, they were cast out of the Garden of Eden and punished by the weight of Original Sin which was now going to be placed on every human thereafter…This Sin leads to death…I understand that Muslims do not believe we are born with original sin, and therefore have no need to be “saved” in that sense from sin.

The reason God the Father, sent Jesus Christ was to lift this Sin and all others off of all humans. When the Bible states “For God so loved the world he sent His only Begotten Son” This is explaining that to undo what we has humans did against God, He could only correct it by sending Himself to set the example straight.
We were not capable of saving ourselves and prophets, although there were many great ones indeed who had great messages, they were not capable of this either. They could send the message, but we couldn’t fully understand it until God set the record straight through the Lord, Jesus Christ.

Jesus Christ died on the cross to take away the sins of the world, and through Him alone we can be saved and know eternal life with God. The way we were created to know it. This does not however, mean that because Jesus came down from Heaven and died on the cross for us that all humans would believe it. God gave all mankind ‘Free Will’ we are given the choice to love Him or to turn away from Him…Why you might say? Because that’s what true love is… You may have heard the quote "if you love something set it free, if it comes back it’s meant to be” well in a sense that is what free will is doing. God loves us so much he gives us the option to choose to return His love or to turn away from it.

This is a different concept from God in Islam. We don’t have the 'Master/Slave" relationship with God, instead we have a “Father/Child” relationship with him. (You may want to revisit the Prodigal Son parable told by Jesus in the Gospels to better understand this relationship as Father/Child) Every parent wants the best for their child, and at times that may mean you have to set them free to do as they wish in order to fully come back to you and understand that you truly want the best for them. This is indeed what God wants for ALL humans. He wants the best for us and knows that ultimately there is nothing better than being with Him.

When you choose to believe in Jesus Christ, you are accepting the Best that the Father is giving us. And when you choose fully you will live the best possible way you can, which will gain Gods favor. Sadly that doesn’t mean that all Christians are living the way they should be or the way Jesus taught us to live, because ultimately we are all sinners. BUT by placing our sins at the foot of the cross, we have the ability to repent and to turn back to God. He WANTS us to love Him the way He loves us. He also wants us to love others they way He loves others. So God indeed loves ALL of his creation, believers AND unbelievers alike, He loves us so much that He gives us the free will to decide on our own if we will return His love or not.

Hopefully I am addressing your questions in a way that you can better understand them. 🙂 See the unbelievers who do not accept Christ when they have been given the choice will indeed be cast into Hell, but it is not because God doesn’t love them. The unbelievers who are sent to Hell are ultimately sending themselves there because on their last day when they will face the Lord they will be so ashamed of themselves they will know that they don’t deserve to be with Him and they basically will send themselves to Hell, understanding fully why they will go there for eternity.

God is a God of Love, but he is also Just, and when you have been given the chance to accept Him and know Him, but choose to turn away from Him, you will ultimately have to pay the consequences. And the worst one is not going to Hell…the worst consequence is that you don’t deserve to be with God in Heaven. The saddest thing for those in Hell is, is not what they will endure there, but that they had the chance to be with God, and did not take it. Therefore they put themselves in Hell.

May God Bless you and keep you in the palm of His hand. :hug3:

KS
 
in the first place, nobody else is comparable to Jesus…simply because of His divinity.

But even if we compare, and evidence had shown that Jesus won hands down ~ it wouldn’t be too much of a surprise either. To bash up the entire Muslim community because one disapproved Muhummed’s actions, was Unchristian. Many muslims did not choose to become muslims, but born as one. Like you can blame them (as long as they are peaceloving muslims) any more than you can blame a person born of any particular race. If they are peaceloving, remained faithful to God ~ they are essentially doing exactly what Jesus had taught us to do, and shouldn’t be condemned.

Bashing anybody else, it an act of ‘lacking love’ and thus, such actions hurt God, and should very much be avoided.
I actually posted this because Christians of so many Christians who are the ignorant ones. Who say that ‘Muhammad was a nice guy’, or something similar to that. They are the ones defending something they know nothing about. And I think that is very dangerous since it gives others the completely wrong idea about Muhammad and think it is ok to defend him too.

I want people to know what they are defending and I would prefer that they read Islamic texts themselves (something that the majority of Muslims don’t even do because they are told not to question).
 
I actually posted this because Christians of so many Christians who are the ignorant ones. Who say that ‘Muhammad was a nice guy’, or something similar to that. They are the ones defending something they know nothing about. And I think that is very dangerous since it gives others the completely wrong idea about Muhammad and think it is ok to defend him too.

I want people to know what they are defending and I would prefer that they read Islamic texts themselves (something that the majority of Muslims don’t even do because they are told not to question).
qwerk,

Perhaps stating that so many Christians are ignorant isn’t the best way to prove your point. Yes I agree there are ignorant Christians out there and hopefully they can come to a better understanding of their own faith, and we should indeed be praying for them. But I think it is safe to say that we ALL can be put into this category at some point and are all ignorant to the faith is some way. Nobody is perfect.

I can understand where you are coming from, and can see your passion about this, but wouldn’t it be more Christian of you my friend, to realize that perhaps defending Mohammad’s actions isn’t exactly what is being done here…I believe more or less defending that Mohammad was a human, and all humans are of God, so even if someone was defending him couldn’t it in fact be out of Love for others? This is what I understand this defense of Mohammad by Christians to be…

Let’s take a look real quickly at the whole situation. God loves us all…God even loved Mohammad. Can we argue that? No of course not because we as Christians know better. We don’t however know how he was judged by the Lord, if we are true believers of Christ, we should be praying that God had mercy on his soul!

As stated above, I can understand your concern for the dangers of allowing the teachings of Mohammad, and Islam helping to turn people away from the Lord, and I couldn’t agree more with you on this point. BUT you have to realize that perhaps Mohammad really believed what he was being revealed, by whatever force, evil or not was showing him.

You see…even if as many have stated above, that Mohammad reveled something that was an evil inspiration, did he in fact know this? This is something we cannot say. We don’t know this, even with the things that history has told us about this man. If he in fact believed in his heart that what he was doing was right and correct, then how can you judge him on that? He may have been trying to be faithful to what he was being told by ‘his angel’ etc. in the best possible way he knew how. Was it the right way of course not, but that is not the point here.

This is where man, makes the mistake in trying to be as God…we cannot judge anyone, only their actions and we should be more importantly trying to help and correct those who have the wrong ideas and are committing bad actions. Take a look at the historical facts of Mohammad’s time…the Christians that he was around were ignorant themselves…how could he grasp the message of true Christianity when those Christians he was around didn’t even grasp it? The same goes for Muslims today…When we as Christians don’t live by the Word…how can we expect unbelievers to believe us when we try to tell them about it? It cannot be done, and that is exactly where the Evil one seeps through. It is a sad situation indeed. We need to be the true witnesses to our Lord and Love as He loved us.

So yes can it be seen and stated that some actions by Mohammad were in fact not very good ones, of course. BUT the same can be said about some actions of Christians…take a look at Peter for example. He denied the Lord three times…does this mean that he was a bad person of course not; it means that the Evil one tempted him into doing that. And if Satan can tempt the people closest to the Lord and even the Lord himself, then of course he can tempt others who came years later. It doesn’t though give you, me, or anyone permission to judge that person, it only gives us the opportunity to say “Ok what this person did was not correct, and God wouldn’t like it. So in an effort to act in a way that the Lord would want us to, we should one pray for these people, and two, try and correct the bad actions”

By bashing the leader of a very large community of people is not the way to win their favor. We need to calmly show these people that the message that Mohammad brought wasn’t the correct one, and then prove this true by LIVING OUT the right message. The message of the Lord Jesus Christ. Only when they see us doing this will they be able to comprehend the ideas of Christianity, and the true Divine message of God.

It is a struggle I know! And again I understand how it is frustrating it is to do this, but we are called to be living witnesses of Christ. This is how true love spreads, and this is how true TRUTH spreads. Thanks for reading!

May God Bless you and keep you in the palm of His hand. :hug3:

KS
 
qwerk,

Perhaps stating that so many Christians are ignorant isn’t the best way to prove your point. Yes I agree there are ignorant Christians out there and hopefully they can come to a better understanding of their own faith, and we should indeed be praying for them. But I think it is safe to say that we ALL can be put into this category at some point and are all ignorant to the faith is some way. Nobody is perfect.

I can understand where you are coming from, and can see your passion about this, but wouldn’t it be more Christian of you my friend, to realize that perhaps defending Mohammad’s actions isn’t exactly what is being done here…I believe more or less defending that Mohammad was a human, and all humans are of God, so even if someone was defending him couldn’t it in fact be out of Love for others? This is what I understand this defense of Mohammad by Christians to be…

<snipped because of # of lines>
KS
Maybe understand that not everyone is going to say the same thing in the same way. I did it in my way. I have not complained about how anyone else posts here like others have complained about others who have different tactics.

I have read posts from so called Christians on this forum who say they are ‘witnesses’ to Christ and have said NOTHING to prove it except to say that ‘Muhammad was a nice guy’, ‘Islam is a great religion’, or some such stuff. None of it is true. Islam is a deen even in the eyes of Muslims which means that religion is only a part of it. Its own texts allude to it being over 70% political, another percentage is obsessive about bodily functions (mostly Muhammad’s and his obsessiveness about how women should carry out their toilet), and then there is about 20+% that could be considered religious. But he has successfully wrapped religion around the politics, and things that are considered sinful in most religions, so we are misled too often.

If you can say it differently then do so. I have no problems with that. Bickering among ourselves only helps Islam spread and endangers our children and their children. I am sure the Pope has said it the way you like and look how far he has gotten - a fatwa and a JIhad declared against him.

So to say it as clearly as I can - it doesn’t matter how you say it, if you say something about their prophet or Islam that they don’t want to hear - they get upset because non-Muslims are NOT to criticize Islam in any way. They are here to do da’wa, to spread Islam.

I quote their texts and I get a message from elwill: *'i think that my problem here is that you accusing teaching of islam which exist in sources where muslims never learning islam from it

i think that’s why their is a big gap in our discussions which make most of our discussions with you are about correcting the misunderstanding and the misconceptions rather than direct defence for our beliefs’*
So, you want me to guess what each Muslim knows or does not know? Or to assume they are not practicing religiously sanctioned deception, taqiyya? Victimhood, or whining, is a very real thing in Islam if they think they are in danger. In danger for their life, or in danger of ‘not winning’ to advance Islam.

I will assume no such thing and the best source for what Islam is and what it is about is the source - Quran, Hadith, Sira and the Sharia laws based on those things. I will go by the behavior (history), and that whether it is a stealth or violent Jihad the end is still the same. To assume that a Muslim is ignorant of their own texts (many are), then maybe it shows just another failing in Islam and should be pointed out.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top