Jews--Christians--Muslims...same God?

[jakasaki]

`snip

**we don’t give the status ‘’ Holy’’ to anybody except God… **

`snip

Hi Meedo ~

Based on the above statement, I was just reading Abu Dawud hadits and in them, the prophet of Islam was labeled as “Holy Prophet”.

So, it would appear that the term “Holy” is & was used to describe Mohamad.

 

[Shamati]

Are you sure what you wrote above about islam are facts and not opinions ?

Brother. They are my personal reflections from my amateur studies of Byzantium, Gnosticism and early Islam. But we all have to acknowledge that the ideas of Qutb is very important in todays Islam, especially Sunni.
For example, take a look at a school photograph from the 1960’s from Egypt and compare it with one from this year. in the 60’s no one word the Hijab while today almost all do. The wearing of the Hijab was never seen as a commandment to be followed but only by personal choice. There has been a real radicalisation within Islam. I believe it has been going on since Sayyid Qutb wrote his seminal Quran commentary advocating Holy war to by all means possible subjugate the west so as not to allow the poisonous decasence of western culture to under more muslim land. But I believe this has been a movement on the margins for years and years but that the western reaction from 9/11 has resulted in this extreme view becoming far more popular. Couple that with the daily humiliation facing the palestinians muslims from the behaviour of the Osraeli government and we have a deadly cocktail.
But that is not to say that the teachings of Muhammad are in themselves evil or violett through and through. Only that it is sad that this militantism has gained such a stronghold in the middle eastern islamic community which of course will affect all non-arab muslim community because the theological scholars of islam are mostly writing in and from the middle eastern surroundings. I believe this is all a reaction from the middle eastern peoples having felt somewhat humiliated for a long time and since 9/11 practically excluded or looked down upon.

Even the president of Egypt visits sermons by Imams who openly preaches that “Jerusalem will be the capital of the caliphate. 1 million martyrs marching!” and other derogatory anti semitical rants. There are many shows on official television in Hamas controlled Palestine that show childrens programs clearly glorifying “martyrs” (suicide bombers) and other sad propaganda. Thus it is clear to me that within the middle eastern islamic community we have a larger and larger percentage of clearly violent and vicious ideas.

I believe that for the good of Islam and for humanity at large this has to be discussed and analyzed openly by scholars and amateurs, religious and secular. Because only by exposing the irrationality of hatred will we make way for an interpretation based on and enphasising love to be heard. For islam to be de-politicized.
Otherwise, given the current developments in world affairs. The seemingly arrogant or maybe even ignorant responses from western politicians I believe we are heading for a full on War of Civilizations. In fact i believe its already here. When/if the western economy collapses the “party will be over”. The large muslim communities of Europe (where fundamentalism is also growing) will be at odds with the european people. This is how it is always played out in history and the writing is on the Wall for all to see. When the “Masters of Mankind” have gamled away the welfare system and riches of the western society, the way to divert attention will be standard “divide & conquer”.

Zbigniew Brzezinski (former advisor to Obama. National security advisor to Pres. Jimmy Carter :

“People? you can beat them, you can starve them, but they never rebel…
They will just turn around and eat their dead”

I’m sorry for going off topic but politics is so intertwined with these problems facing humanity today.

Heres a fact: peoples as in regular Joes (regardless color or creed) never have any problems with eachother that result in conflict. All conflict resulting in nation against nation, peoples against peoples is due to the fact that a few narcissistic evil men at the top are willing to risk all but their own honor to not deal a blowing to their own personal ego.
Therefore its in the interest of all good people (imho) to “bridge the differences” between all differing cultures. Who knows, maybe with Gods will, One day these leaders will become i obsolete!?

God bless you

 

[dzheremi]

Hi Meedo ~

Based on the above statement, I was just reading Abu Dawud hadits and in them, the prophet of Islam was labeled as “Holy Prophet”.

So, it would appear that the term “Holy” is & was used to describe Mohamad.

Let’s not forget the many, many translated versions of their central text that go by the title The Holy Qur’an (and related explanatory texts that also use that title in reference to the Qur’an). I guess that means the Qur’an is God…but only in certain English editions.

But I guess the Qur’an is uncreated and eternal, so maybe it’s God anyway, since those are attributes that we believe are of God alone. And yet somehow we are the ones who Muslims call “associators”, while Muslims claim that they are the monotheists. What a funny sort of monotheism that is.

 

[brianhoyland]

Allah if you go back in history was the god of the moon, before Muhammad started preaching about him being the only god. The angel that appear to him was satan so don’t believe a word he says

I feel your comment would be very insulting to Muslims and would not help to convert them if that is even your intent, but the truth is they do love the same God we do, the God of Abraham. Now it is also true that they are lacking the additional and most important revelation that has been entrusted to us through Jesus Christ, but inferring that they worship Satan is not the way to share our knowledge with them.

 

[meedo]

The punchline is on the Syriacs. But it’s great because Muslims say “Salam”. هاهاها!

We need a bar , but i wont drink lol

 

[meedo]

Hi Meedo ~

Based on the above statement, I was just reading Abu Dawud hadits and in them, the prophet of Islam was labeled as “Holy Prophet”.

So, it would appear that the term “Holy” is & was used to describe Mohamad.

I have never read in arabic anything about a prophet being holy. Not in Islamic books any way . I don’t know about the English translations, may be it is written this way so English speaking audience to relate ?

 

[meedo]

Let’s not forget the many, many translated versions of their central text that go by the title The Holy Qur’an (and related explanatory texts that also use that title in reference to the Qur’an). I guess that means the Qur’an is God…but only in certain English editions.

The Quran in arabic is called ‘’ The noble Quran ‘’ Basically meaning ‘’ The Noble recitation’’ But i think for English speaking people it is translated the Holy Quran … like the Holy Bible i guess. But There is no issue to call it Holy. As it is the Words of God. However the words of prophets are not labeled holy.

 

[meedo]

I feel your comment would be very insulting to Muslims and would not help to convert them if that is even your intent, but the truth is they do love the same God we do, the God of Abraham. Now it is also true that they are lacking the additional and most important revelation that has been entrusted to us through Jesus Christ, but inferring that they worship Satan is not the way to share our knowledge with them.

Thanks my man for your rational words.

 

[meedo]

A Catholic, Muslim and Buddhist. Seems like there should be a punch line after that lol

Totally agree lol

 

[dzheremi]

The Quran in arabic is called ‘’ The noble Quran ‘’ Basically meaning ‘’ The Noble recitation’’ But i think for English speaking people it is translated the Holy Quran … like the Holy Bible i guess. But There is no issue to call it Holy. As it is the Words of God. However the words of prophets are not labeled holy.

Yes, I know these are your beliefs. And of course they’re trying to compare it to the Bible by calling it that. As I’m sure you know, we have no issue in Arabic calling the Bible by its proper name: al-kitab al-muqaddis. But then we also don’t have this idea that it is wrong to call other things and people ‘holy’. The word we use in Coptic for our saints, if we are not borrowing the Syriac ‘Mar’ or Greek ‘Agios’, is ‘ethowab’ – related to words like owib ‘priest’ (from the root w-b, meaning something like ‘pure’) – and it means ‘holy’. But then we also say in the Angelos (Song of the Angels) of the first hour of the Agepya that God alone is holy, and God alone is the most high. All holiness in any person or thing is through the work of God in that person or thing, so things and people are not holy in and of themselves, but when we call them holy, it is a recognition and in praise of of God’s holiness

 

[J_the_Centrist]

We need a bar , but i wont drink lol

Neither will I, unless for some strange reason a priest comes in and distributes Holy Communion. Lol

 

[J_the_Centrist]

“…And thou wilt find the nearest in friendship to the believers to be those who say, we are Christians. That is because they have priests and monks among them and because they are not proud.” - Always liked that one from the Quran ch. 5 verse 82
“And we sent after them in their footsteps Jesus son of Mary, verifying that which was before him of the Torah; and we gave him the Gospel containing guidance and light, and verifying that which was before it of the Torah and a guidance and an admonition for the dutiful.” - Not only do Muslims believe in the same God, but Jesus and Mary (in that Jesus is referred to as her son) are treated with only with utmost respect. This is from ch. 5 verse 46 and if it weren’t in the Quran I’d assume this came from some Christian theologian.

-These are quoted directly from a Quran I have had in my possession for years. Christians should read the above and reflect upon Philippians 4:8. “Fix your thoughts on what is true and honorable and right. Think about things that are pure and lovely and admirable. Think about things that are excellent and worthy of praise.”

Peace be with you all

 

[rossum]

A Catholic, Muslim and Buddhist. Seems like there should be a punch line after that lol

A Catholic, a Muslim and a Buddhist walk into a bar. The Catholic says, “I’ll have a glass of wine please.” The Muslim says, “I’ll have an Orange Juice please.” The Buddhist says, “Make me one with everything.”



rossum

 

[jakasaki]

A Catholic, a Muslim and a Buddhist walk into a bar. The Catholic says, “I’ll have a glass of wine please.” The Muslim says, “I’ll have an Orange Juice please.” The Buddhist says, “Make me one with everything.”



rossum

:clapping:

 

[J_the_Centrist]

A Catholic, a Muslim and a Buddhist walk into a bar. The Catholic says, “I’ll have a glass of wine please.” The Muslim says, “I’ll have an Orange Juice please.” The Buddhist says, “Make me one with everything.”



rossum

Good one!

 

[meedo]

A Catholic, a Muslim and a Buddhist walk into a bar. The Catholic says, “I’ll have a glass of wine please.” The Muslim says, “I’ll have an Orange Juice please.” The Buddhist says, “Make me one with everything.”



rossum

HAHAHA got it

 

[meedo]

Brother. They are my personal reflections from my amateur studies of Byzantium, Gnosticism and early Islam. But we all have to acknowledge that the ideas of Qutb is very important in todays Islam, especially Sunni.
For example, take a look at a school photograph from the 1960’s from Egypt and compare it with one from this year. in the 60’s no one word the Hijab while today almost all do. The wearing of the Hijab was never seen as a commandment to be followed but only by personal choice. There has been a real radicalisation within Islam. I believe it has been going on since Sayyid Qutb wrote his seminal Quran commentary advocating Holy war to by all means possible subjugate the west so as not to allow the poisonous decasence of western culture to under more muslim land. But I believe this has been a movement on the margins for years and years but that the western reaction from 9/11 has resulted in this extreme view becoming far more popular. Couple that with the daily humiliation facing the palestinians muslims from the behaviour of the Osraeli government and we have a deadly cocktail.
But that is not to say that the teachings of Muhammad are in themselves evil or violett through and through. Only that it is sad that this militantism has gained such a stronghold in the middle eastern islamic community which of course will affect all non-arab muslim community because the theological scholars of islam are mostly writing in and from the middle eastern surroundings. I believe this is all a reaction from the middle eastern peoples having felt somewhat humiliated for a long time and since 9/11 practically excluded or looked down upon.

Even the president of Egypt visits sermons by Imams who openly preaches that “Jerusalem will be the capital of the caliphate. 1 million martyrs marching!” and other derogatory anti semitical rants. There are many shows on official television in Hamas controlled Palestine that show childrens programs clearly glorifying “martyrs” (suicide bombers) and other sad propaganda. Thus it is clear to me that within the middle eastern islamic community we have a larger and larger percentage of clearly violent and vicious ideas.

I believe that for the good of Islam and for humanity at large this has to be discussed and analyzed openly by scholars and amateurs, religious and secular. Because only by exposing the irrationality of hatred will we make way for an interpretation based on and enphasising love to be heard. For islam to be de-politicized.
Otherwise, given the current developments in world affairs. The seemingly arrogant or maybe even ignorant responses from western politicians I believe we are heading for a full on War of Civilizations. In fact i believe its already here. When/if the western economy collapses the “party will be over”. The large muslim communities of Europe (where fundamentalism is also growing) will be at odds with the european people. This is how it is always played out in history and the writing is on the Wall for all to see. When the “Masters of Mankind” have gamled away the welfare system and riches of the western society, the way to divert attention will be standard “divide & conquer”.

Zbigniew Brzezinski (former advisor to Obama. National security advisor to Pres. Jimmy Carter :

I’m sorry for going off topic but politics is so intertwined with these problems facing humanity today.

Heres a fact: peoples as in regular Joes (regardless color or creed) never have any problems with eachother that result in conflict. All conflict resulting in nation against nation, peoples against peoples is due to the fact that a few narcissistic evil men at the top are willing to risk all but their own honor to not deal a blowing to their own personal ego.
Therefore its in the interest of all good people (imho) to “bridge the differences” between all differing cultures. Who knows, maybe with Gods will, One day these leaders will become i obsolete!?

God bless you

Brother… in many parts of your post i do agree with you .

The problem is that Muslims of recent have budged Islam between them and the world. As you say , as the arab world felt humiliated by occupation. They tried to find a scape goat. They convinced themselves that what happened to them is because they are not good muslims. And that riding the vehicle of Islam is the way to liberation and prosperity. They forget that success come from real work on the ground. Thus they have put Islam in a political confrontation with the western world from the 70s onward. But this is not an inherent problem in Islam … 50 years in history is nothing… Sayed Qotb is not a universal Islamic authority. He had his thoughts and mistakes as well.

I think the Muslim world needs to have a healthy understanding of success. That success is based on secular hard work and not just a chant from the Quran .

Thanks for your (name removed by moderator)ut my friend

 

[aidanbradypop]

A Catholic, a Muslim and a Buddhist walk into a bar. The Catholic says, “I’ll have a glass of wine please.” The Muslim says, “I’ll have an Orange Juice please.” The Buddhist says, “Make me one with everything.”



rossum

Cute lol

 

[Little_Star_1]

I really do not understand, given the amount of strife between the Christian and Muslim world, America and the Middle East, people hold backward ideas regarding the Muslim faith. The fact that some of them believe that terrorist acts are the way to enforce the laws of God, does not mean they actually believe in another God. First of all, they are descendants of Abraham, just like the Jewish line. They take their original set of beliefs from the same source as Christians. T

he Muslim faith grew out of members of both the Jewish and Christianity and other belief sets of the time, and there were lots of them with different ideas, even in Christianity. They believe Mohammad was visited by the Archangel Daniel (remember him, same Daniel) and was told to rewrite the Bible as the Christian and Jewish faith had changed it so much that the Truth had been lost. So, they hold very similar beliefs as Christians and Jews. The interpretations being given by some of their leaders can be compared to the way the Pharisees taught following the Jewish law. Yep, in the manner that Jesus condemned. So, folks that want to paint them as all evil need to stop as the Christian and Jewish faiths both went through periods when it was believed that the word required violence to be defended.

They also believe that Jesus was the only perfect prophet. Yep, they love Christ. They view him differently. See, for him to be alive as we believe, one must believe in spirits. They do not. Anyway, just like us, they believe he is coming back. Did anyone notice that the head of Iran stated Jesus was coming back? So, please, when you see a Muslim stopping all activity to pray to God at various times during the day, know that they are praying to the one and same God as we do.

 

[Reuben_J]

I really do not understand, given the amount of strife between the Christian and Muslim world, America and the Middle East, people hold backward ideas regarding the Muslim faith. The fact that some of them believe that terrorist acts are the way to enforce the laws of God, does not mean they actually believe in another God. First of all, they are descendants of Abraham, just like the Jewish line. They take their original set of beliefs from the same source as Christians. T

he Muslim faith grew out of members of both the Jewish and Christianity and other belief sets of the time, and there were lots of them with different ideas, even in Christianity. They believe Mohammad was visited by the** Archangel Daniel** (remember him, same Daniel) and was told to rewrite the Bible as the Christian and Jewish faith had changed it so much that the Truth had been lost. So, they hold very similar beliefs as Christians and Jews. The interpretations being given by some of their leaders can be compared to the way the Pharisees taught following the Jewish law. Yep, in the manner that Jesus condemned. So, folks that want to paint them as all evil need to stop as the Christian and Jewish faiths both went through periods when it was believed that the word required violence to be defended.

They also believe that Jesus was the only perfect prophet. Yep, they love Christ. They view him differently. See, for him to be alive as we believe, one must believe in spirits. They do not. Anyway, just like us, they believe he is coming back. Did anyone notice that the head of Iran stated Jesus was coming back? So, please, when you see a Muslim stopping all activity to pray to God at various times during the day, know that they are praying to the one and same God as we do.

Was that Gabriel, Little Star? Or some thing esle? I mean something not an angel … .