John 3:13

[Mailman]

Then what good will that do? So will everyone.

Not everyone who has died will be resurrected together with Elijah. Elijah will be on the first resurrection (Rev. 20:5-6) – the resurrection of the just. He will be resurrected together will all of God’s saints. Elijah, and all those resurrected with him, would be given “power over the nations.” They will “rule them [the nations of this earth] with a rod of iron, as the vessels of a potter shall they be broken to shivers…” (Rev. 2:26-27) for a thousand years.

 

[geometer]

Not everyone who has died will be resurrected together with Elijah. Elijah will be on the first resurrection (Rev. 20:5-6) – the resurrection of the just. He will be resurrected together will all of God’s saints. Elijah, and all those resurrected with him, would be given “power over the nations.” They will “rule them [the nations of this earth] with a rod of iron, as the vessels of a potter shall they be broken to shivers…” (Rev. 2:26-27) for a thousand years.

Elijah and Enoch never died. They don’t need to be resurrected.

 

[JJ59]

“Jesus said to Nicodemus:
“No one has gone up to heaven
except the one who has come down from heaven, the Son of Man”

– Then I wonder where Enoch and Elijah went?

tektonics.org/af/firstascent.html

An alternate interpretation is that Jesus was the only one who “ascended” into Heaven (as many modern translations render this verse), whereas both Elijah and Enoch were “assumed” into Heaven.

God bless,

 

[geometer]

tektonics.org/af/firstascent.html

An alternate interpretation is that Jesus was the only one who “ascended” into Heaven (as many modern translations render this verse), whereas both Elijah and Enoch were “assumed” into Heaven.

God bless,

Jesus said very clearly that he was the first descended master, which made a joke of those who said that they were ascended masters.

The writers of the new testament knew full well that Enoch and Elijah had ascended, Jesus never spoke against them, and they are written about is the new testament as ascended.

 

[JJ59]

Jesus said very clearly that he was the first descended master, which made a joke of those who said that they were ascended masters.

The writers of the new testament knew full well that Enoch and Elijah had ascended, Jesus never spoke against them, and they are written about is the new testament as ascended.

I’m don’t quite understand what it is you’re trying to say, geometer…

All I was pointing out was that one perspective is a difference in terms. Jesus ascended into Heaven, meaning he went up by His own power. On the other hand, Enoch and Elijah (and Mary, according to Catholics) were assumed into Heaven, meaning God took them up to Heaven.

It’s just my interpretation, it could very easily be wrong.

God bless,

 

[geometer]

I’m don’t quite understand what it is you’re trying to say, geometer…

All I was pointing out was that one perspective is a difference in terms. Jesus ascended into Heaven, meaning he went up by His own power. On the other hand, Enoch and Elijah (and Mary, according to Catholics) were assumed into Heaven, meaning God took them up to Heaven.

It’s just my interpretation, it could very easily be wrong.

God bless,

Yes you are wrong. Jesus said many times that everything that he accomplished that was a miracle was done by Gods power and not his own.

 

[cheeto1]

Jesus was the only one who “ascended” into Heaven (as many modern translations render this verse), whereas both Elijah and Enoch were “assumed” into Heaven.

Well, yes, but when Jeus said that, he hadn’t ascended yet…

 

[Mailman]

Elijah and Enoch never died. They don’t need to be resurrected.

It is written [in 1 Cor. Chapter 15]:

“HOW SAY SOME AMONG YOU THAT THERE IS NO RESURRECTION OF THE DEAD?”

And why is a resurrection necessary?

“But if there be no resurrection of the dead, THEN IS CHRIST NOT RISEN: And if Christ be not risen, then is our preaching vain, and YOUR FAITH IS ALSO VAIN. Yea, and WE ARE FOUND FALSE WITNESSES OF GOD; because we have testified of God that he raised up Christ: whom he raised not up, if so be that the dead rise not.

“For if the dead rise not, then is not Christ raised: AND IF CHRIST BE NOT RAISED, YOUR FAITH IS VAIN; YE ARE YET IN YOUR SINS.”

No one goes ahead of Christ. He is the “firstfruits” because when He DIED, He was the first to be resurrected [to eternal life].

“Then they also which are fallen asleep in Christ are perished. If in this life only we have hope in Christ, we are of all men most miserable. But now is Christ RISEN FROM THE DEAD, and become THE FIRSTFRUITS of them that slept.”

ALL human beings die.

“For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead. For as in Adam ALL DIE, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.”

Jesus, as a human being, was no exception.

“But every man IN HIS OWN ORDER: Christ THE FIRSTFRUITS; afterward they that are Christ’s at his coming.”

What is so special about Enoch and Elijah that they would be spared from death? Even Jesus died the death of a human being. “For as in Adam ALL DIE” – all is all, no exception, and that even includes Christ: “But now is Christ risen FROM THE DEAD.”

 

[Ceil-1]

I think there is a misunderstanding of the difference b/w assumption and ascension, and, that is a good point cheeto1 made about Jesus not having ascended yet.

Jesus ascended by His own power. He was in His glorified body by the time He did so.

The others had to be assumed by God’s power.

Cheeto1, could you elaborate on your comment that He had not yet ascended when He made that statement?

 

[cheeto1]

Well it seems there are a few different answers here that people have

1. That Enoch and Elijah died, and when the bible says they were taken away,
   it was only to another physical location, not to heaven.
2. That they didn’t die, and were taken to a “holding tank” heaven for the righteous,
   “the bosom of Abraham”.
3. That Enoch and Elijah didn’t die, and were taken to heaven, but not by their
   own power, so that the words of Jesus about no one has gone up to heaven,
   are referring only to the difference between assumption, and ascension.
   But when Jesus said that, He had not yet ascended, or “gone up” to heaven.
   He had only come down from heaven, yet he says “no one has ascended, but
   the One who has come down.” (Himself)

 

[Ceil-1]

I got the impression that some are claiming that they did not go up to heaven because of Jesus’ saying no one has gone up. In that case, I understand it to be #3.