John 6:25-71. Help me understand something

  • Thread starter Thread starter Yakuda
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
Benny12 said:
It’s not a literal teaching it’s a spiritual one.
Click to expand...
As a result of this, many [of] his disciples returned to their former way of life and no longer accompanied him.
There would have been no reason for them to leave Him unless it was a literal teaching.
 
Yakuda said:
So what’s the upshot? I won’t be getting to them today.
Click to expand...
A very simplified (perhaps a bit too simplistic) summary is that most - but not all - Protestants interpret the Bread of Life discourse from a strictly nominalist (i.e. non-real presence) perspective is because of their systematic theology. A realist theology of the eucharist and a requirement for participation therein is seen by many - again, but not all - Protestant (especially evangelical) theologians as incompatible with justification by faith alone.

My experience has been that the average evangelical layperson (or even pastor) isn’t likely to have a well developed theology of the eucharist simply because it does not feature prominently in their theology. If you want a systematic, cogent and comprehensive analysis of the Bread of Life discourse from an evangelical perspective, it’s best to read some of their scholarly commentaries.
 
Don’t you think Jesus saying 5 times you must eat my flesh and drink my blood to have eternal life should “…feature prominently in their theology”? And it’s not “their” theology is it? I will look into those wtotings, thanks
 
Same tired refrains. In the passages Jesus refers to his being the bread of life so by your sarcastic statement he is bread right? The difference here is Jesus goes further and says the bread he gives us his flesh. His flesh a real. He moved from the figurative to the literal.
 
I just explained to you how your argument fails. Its not my fault you can’t think logically
 
Does it really matter if you believe Jesus meant literally or figuratively eat the body and blood of Christ?

Jesus knew who would take what He offered, those who wouldn’t. Isn’t the fact that we are willing to eat the Body and Blood of Christ, whether Jesus meant it literally or figuratively, tells Jesus we want to become one with Him. That we believe He is the Bread of Life?

Later on He does take bread and wine and tells His Disciples, this is my body, this is my blood, eat this, drink this, in memory of Me. We do that every week, we are reminded of what Jesus did for us, who He was and we accept Him.

We do not turn from Him.
We know He is the Bread of Life
We are telling God we want what He is giving us.
We are blessed to welcomed at God’s table.

Isn’t that the most important part of the Eucharist, the true understanding of what it means that Jesus is the Bread of Life, and those who believe in Him, partake in Him will be welcomed by the Father and never ever rejected?
 
Last edited:
How are we not doing what Jesus said?

He didn’t cut a slice of His arm and said this is my body, or pour His blood into a cup and said this is my blood.

He presented Bread and said this is my Body, He presented Wine and said this is my Blood. We are doing that ever week.

This is my Body (bread), This is my Blood (wine) for us this becomes the Body and Blood of Christ… Just as Jesus did at the Last Supper.
 
We need to stretch our understanding even more. There are many layers here and I think the Catholic Transubstantiation thing does not help one bit.

To eat the flesh of Jesus and to drink his blood is to incorporate his being into our own as intimately as possible. The Eucharist is a reminder of that as well as a distinctive and unique way that he becomes present to us.
 
Verse 51 “I am the living bread that came down from heaven. Whoever eats this bread will live forever. This bread is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world.”

Jesus refers to himself as bread (figurative) as he is not bread but then says “This bread is my flesh” (literal) he moved from figurative ymto literal.
 
But eating the elements of Eucharist means nothing if we do not live his teachings and obey his commands.
 
He was laying the groundwork and the bread and wine we share IS Jesus body and blood.
 
Yakuda said:
He was laying the groundwork and the bread and wine we share IS Jesus body and blood.
Click to expand...
for some Bread and Wine becomes Jesus
for some Jesus is present in the Bread and Wine

In both cased you tell Jesus Christ you want to become one with Him.

Is there really a difference? Is one more accepted by God over the other? Are you not telling Jesus you want to be one with Him, by any means necessary?
 
Benny12 said:
Jews took it literal as well.

v35 Jesus already said what He’s talking about…“I am the bread of life; he who comes to Me shall not hunger, and he who believes in Me shall never thirst.”

??? The Old Testament rejects cannibalism. So why would Jesus be telling the Jews to literally eat my flesh?
Click to expand...
How do you answer that question.
Jesus himself is questioned, in scripture, as to the tone and meaning of his words. And he reemphasizes his words in contrast to the objection, the same one you are making.
 
Yes there is a difference as Jesus is not present in every bread and every wine as that’s utter heresy. The only way to Jesus is the way he instructs us. If it’s “by any means necessary” then we don’t need Jesus’ instruction and it’s more heresy.
 
okay…
Yakuda said:
If it’s “by any means necessary” then we don’t need Jesus’ instruction and it’s more heresy.
Click to expand...
but what I meant by any means necessary is that we are willing to do what Jesus instructs us to do to know we accept Him as our Lord and Savior, we see Him, and love Him.

If He asks us to give up everything to follow Him, we will.
If He asks us to be born again by being baptized by blood of Christ we will.
If He asks us to eat His flesh and drink His blood we will.

That’s what I meant, we will and are willing to do all that Jesus asks of us. To let Him know we want to follow Him because we love and accept Him.

So, how can we show Him, we will follow Him by any means necessary if Jesus doesn’t instruct us of the necessary means to follow Him?
 
Last edited:
Benny12 said:
From what I red, this was the best explanation given and you still can see it.
Click to expand...
I don’t know Benny, I understand your perspective, but the clincher for me is the parallels to the Old Testament Passover. Of course, the last supper was a Passover celebration. And as part of the Passover celebration, everyone had to eat the Passover lamb. You couldn’t skip that part even if you didn’t like lamb. All of Jesus disciples were Jews. After the experience of the last supper, and then thinking back on the bread of life discourse, I don’t see how they could’ve come to any other conclusion, other than that Jesus meant something both symbolic and literal. His words are life-giving, of course, but perhaps not the only life-giving thing that he gives to his people. Plus there is the weight of church history. Keep striving for truth my brother, but I just don’t agree.
 
I get it but he instructs us to eat his flesh and drink his blood but many many Christians do not do so.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top