John MacArthur and the Vatican Porn Collection

[lak611]

Thank you. I understand what you mean now. Yes, we should give all of our sources in an academic endeavour.

Thanks for clearing this up. God bless.

You’re welcome!:bounce:

 

[Zooey]

Did MacArthur always quote sources when he did not even know who they were, like New York Times op-ed pieces or “maybe” LA Times op-ed pieces? Although Boettner is NOT a credible source, at least he named Boettner. I have a major problem with anybody who does not name his source and isn’t even sure where he got the source.

No, he didn’t used to do this kind of thing! I am very disappointed to see him doing it now.
I have in the past respected him, even when I disagreed with him. This is very unlike the person I had belieeved him to be…

It seems his intellectual integrity has slipped.

Exactly.

Then you have a problem with me. I don’t always remember a source. When I read something, the thing I read is more important to me and I remember it. I don’t always remember the source. It would be a good thing to do but the fact that I don’t always do it does not make me a bad person and if you have a problem with me, you know how to solve it. And you have to do it before you partake of communion too.

Wait till you’re my age! I once called a friend in another state to ask her “what do they call that place with dead people?” When she said " you mean the cemetery", I hung up…(I think I may have been asleep, I can’t remeber this…Oh, wait! Maybe I’ve just forgotten that too…[wanders off, mumbling under her breath…]

Thank you. I understand what you mean now. Yes, we should give all of our sources in an academic endeavour.

Thanks for clearing this up. God bless.

There we go!!!

 

[stinkcat_14]

Do you know anything about the book that McLaughlin wrote that Boettner uses as his source? Title? Publication date?

The book is called People’s Padre, publication date around 1960 or 1962.

 

[hoosierdaddy]

Wait till you’re my age! I once called a friend in another state to ask her “what do they call that place with dead people?” When she said " you mean the cemetery", I hung up…(I think I may have been asleep, I can’t remeber this…Oh, wait! Maybe I’ve just forgotten that too…[wanders off, mumbling under her breath…]

LOL

 

[Iowa_Mike]

Why does anyone give this guy the ‘time of day’? He is completely anti-Catholic and looks for any reason, factual or not, to attack the Church. His articles are replete with error and radiate hate for all things Catholic. I, for one, don’t waste my time worrying about people whose hate filled opinions rule their life but I will keep him in my prayers.

Iowa Mike

 

[sadie2723]

Why does anyone give this guy the ‘time of day’? He is completely anti-Catholic and looks for any reason, factual or not, to attack the Church. His articles are replete with error and radiate hate for all things Catholic. I, for one, don’t waste my time worrying about people whose hate filled opinions rule their life but I will keep him in my prayers.

Iowa Mike

The guy is not cool…I agree with you 100%. We should really not waste our time reading his anti-catholic bunk.

 

[hoosierdaddy]

The guy is a moron…I agree with you 100%. We should really not waste our time reading his anti-catholic bunk.

Very Christ-like.

Maybe JM decided he didn’t want to waste his time documenting sources of your church’s anti-Christian bunk?

By the way, your sig is wrong. One does not join His Church. One is joined to the Christian Church by Jesus Christ Himself. Are you a Pelagian?

 

[SPH1]

IMO, no religion in the world uses misrepresentation, half-truth, lies and propaganda as does Protestantism. Protestantism was founded upon this, and they eat-it-up to this day.

The “I mean no offense to Catholics” card is a typical disclaimer anti-Catholic use. Maybe I’ll begin using a similar approach: bash and trash Protestantism…then end with a loving disclaimer.

 

[Michael_Francis]

IMO, no religion in the world uses misrepresentation, half-truth, lies and propaganda as does Protestantism. Protestantism was founded upon this, and they eat-it-up to this day.

The “I mean no offense to Catholics” card is a typical disclaimer anti-Catholic use. Maybe I’ll begin using a similar approach: bash and trash Protestantism…then end with a loving disclaimer.

Not here at CAF.:tsktsk:

Some posts pruned.

 

[hoosierdaddy]

IMO, no religion in the world uses misrepresentation, half-truth, lies and propaganda as does Protestantism. Protestantism was founded upon this, and they eat-it-up to this day.

The “I mean no offense to Catholics” card is a typical disclaimer anti-Catholic use. Maybe I’ll begin using a similar approach: bash and trash Protestantism…then end with a loving disclaimer.

Hey if that doesn’t work you can always burn us at the stake.

I don’t know about you you cynical person but when I say I mean no disrespect I mean it. If I really mean disrespect I have the guts not to lie about it. I’ll sell you some and your long dead pet canary can get out of purgatory at the same time.

PS I understand if this gets pruned or deleted.

 

[pnewton]

Hey if that doesn’t work you can always burn us at the stake.

I don’t know about you you cynical person but when I say I mean no disrespect I mean it. If I really mean disrespect I have the guts not to lie about it.

I do not think he was referring to you, but the subject of the thread. J.M. often uses the formula of “I mean no disrespect” before being rather disrespectful. I surely believe you. Both that you would be honest about being disrespectful and that you are very capable of it.

 

[hoosierdaddy]

I do not think he was referring to you, but the subject of the thread. J.M. often uses the formula of “I mean no disrespect” before being rather disrespectful. I surely believe you. Both that you would be honest about being disrespectful and that you are very capable of it.

As is everyone else. However, I do know that just because someone is disrespectful to me doesn’t mean I have to return the favour.

 

[Jeanette_L]

Why does anyone give this guy the ‘time of day’? He is completely anti-Catholic and looks for any reason, factual or not, to attack the Church. His articles are replete with error and radiate hate for all things Catholic. I, for one, don’t waste my time worrying about people whose hate filled opinions rule their life but I will keep him in my prayers.

Iowa Mike

I happen to agree with you, it is tedious and personally unedifying to have to read/listen to the rantings of those who hate us. Unfortunately, we can’t always just ignore such people as they do have a lot of harmful influence on the less knowledgeable laity, both Protestant and Catholic.

If a person is not aware of the false teachings out there concerning Catholicism, (especially from these otherwise respected ministers) and also how to honestly and successfully refute them, they will become the next prey for the wolf (in sheep’s clothing). And in learning how the enemy attacks and how to defend ourselves, we need to make others aware of the falseness of their teachings and how to defend themselves against attack.

This is a sad reality in this spiritual war we are engaged in. It’s a shame we as Catholic Christians don’t just have to worry about the “world” and it’s war against us, but our fellow Christian brothers as well.

 

[historyb]

With my 2 years as a 5 pointer Calvinist MacArthur could be considered less extreme than some I seen and even sadly participated in myself.

 

[Jeanette_L]

With my 2 years as a 5 pointer Calvinist MacArthur could be considered less extreme than some I seen and even sadly participated in myself.

You’re right, he isn’t the most extreme anti-Catholic out there. But they all tend to feed off each other. They seem to pass around/share quotes that have never been verified, some so completely outrageous, you wonder how they can repeat them without complete embarrassment. But they aren’t embarrassed, not even in the least, because they actually believe, (or at least want to believe) what they hear and repeat, all without the intellectual honesty to do even the slightest bit of research.

I am a lay person, born and bred in the Evangelical/Fundamentalist world, and in deciding to research this stuff on my own, it really didn’t take me long at all to discover all the lies I had been fed my whole life. Just because they weren’t intentionally lying doesn’t make it less egregious. I have absolutely no respect for a minister who doesn’t have the intellectual honesty to do at least as much research as I did. It’s all out there, there’s no excuse. And I’m afraid there may be no excuse in the end, if you know what I mean.

 

[hoosierdaddy]

And I’m afraid there may be no excuse in the end, if you know what I mean.

What do you mean? That he will go to hell? If anything, he would suffer loss but he would still be saved…according to Holy Scripture.

 

[Jeanette_L]

And I’m afraid there may be no excuse in the end, if you know what I mean.

What do you mean? That he will go to hell? If anything, he would suffer loss but he would still be saved…according to Holy Scripture.

I think you may have inadvertantly proven my point.

Why were you so quick to assume that I meant he was going to hell? Could it be some kind of misunderstanding based on what you also have heard all your life about what Catholics do and do not believe?

 

[johnnyjoe]

I was so intrigued by this Larry King Live interview about “God and the Girl” that I found the transcript!

Larry King Live & “God and the Girl”

 

[johnnyjoe]

Some of the priests comments on LK Live:

*ANTHONY PADOVANO, RESIGNED FULL-TIME PRIESTHOOD TO GET MARRIED: The entire discussion I thought it was very touching. The yearning of faith in these men was impressive.

What disturbed me was that so much energy has to be put into the issue of celibacy when the real issue is service to people and faith in God and this dichotomy that it’s God or a girl is a very false dichotomy. A woman does not detract from one’s commitment to God, nor does marriage.

KING: Father Manning you are celibate are you not?

FATHER MICHAEL MANNING, ROMAN CATHOLIC PRIEST: I am, yes.

KING: You’ve lived a celibate life?

MANNING: I’ve lived a celibate life to the best of my ability.

KING: Should the rule be changed?

MANNING: I think that there needs to be an openness to the possibility and it’s already happening. We have the eastern Catholics where they are, a married man may be ordained a priest. We even have some Anglicans that are…

KING: What’s the reason for it?

MANNING: Well, I think when you go back history wise you find that it was – on a political level it was oftentimes there was nepotism going on. But deeper down I think that there’s a real call with regard to the Scriptures.

Jesus was a celibate. I believe that despite the controversy of “The Da Vinci Code.” I believe that Paul was calling us to some real strong commitments to be missionaries.

The second coming, we’re people of the second coming and there’s that urgency of Christ, the urgency of Paul to live a life that just goes completely as best you can to serve others.

KING: Father Bartunek what do you think?

FATHER JOHN BARTUNEK, ROMAN CATHOLIC PRIEST: Well, I’m glad that I’m not married and that I’m a priest and I’m extremely happy to be a priest and to be able to be fully available for the, you know, for my people, for the church.

You know when I was deciding the priesthood it was wonderful to hear those young men and the same struggles that they had. I was just ordained two and a half years ago and I still remember those times.

I was seeing a woman very seriously and I loved her very much and I knew in my heart that she deserved someone who could be her husband, someone who was completely given and dedicated to her.

And when I was discerning my vocation I felt there was part of me that wanted to be a husband for the church that wanted to give myself completely to the service of God’s people and so I couldn’t marry her because I knew she deserved someone who could give more than I could give. And that to me was a sign that with the gift of the vocation to be a priest God was giving me the gift of celibacy.*

MacArthur’s response:

*JOHN MACARTHUR, EVANGELICAL CHRISTIAN PASTOR: Yes, well I think from a biblical standpoint we need to readdress this issue on a couple of fronts. Number one, according to the New Testament, you can’t be a pastor unless you are the husband of one wife and have proven that you’re able to manage your household well.

The apostle Paul also said that one of the false doctrines, he called doctrines of demons, 1 Timothy 4, is forbidding to marry. There is no biblical basis for this whatsoever. You can’t use Jesus as an example. He’s God in human flesh.

There is no biblical foundation. In fact, Paul said it’s better to marry than to burn. So, you put a priest in an impossible situation, then stick him in a confessional all day to listen to people reciting all their sexual sins and I think that’s just way over the top if you expect somebody to live a pure life with that kind of temptation thrown at them.

KING: You say a pastor should be married, you mean someone comes out of seminary they have to be married or they can’t be a pastor?

MACARTHUR: Well the bottom – yes, the bottom line is there could be exceptions. You could have a widower. You could have somebody who did never marry. But the qualification for a pastor is the husband of one wife, a one woman man.

KING: So you think the idea that even though it’s a discipline of the church it’s a bad idea?

MACARTHUR: Yes, I don’t think it’s a biblical idea at all and it came, as Father Manning noted, because priestly families were building fortunes and in 1079 when that became law at the Lateran (ph) Council, it was because Rome started seeing that money was being kept in these massive families. If you don’t have any children, you can’t pass on anything.*

 

[BobCatholic]

Ever hear of the saying:

“Lies, darn lies, and statistics”?

Well, we can update it.

“Lies, darn lies, statistics, and anti-catholicism”