John MacArthur's ironic comment of the day

[Howie01]

Monkey:

Not so, show me where in the history of the Church has anti-semitism been taught officially by the magisterium?

I’ve never stated that anti-semitism was an official teaching of your Church, but merely cited a book which also cites Catholic historians stating that anti-semitism was practiced in the church and into the 20th century, according to the author of the book, Ronald Diprose.

“Harlotry” is also not an official teaching of the Catholic Church; nevertheless, historians verify that there was a length of time in the history of the church in which “harlotry” occurred; that period of time is referred to as the Pornocracy, or the Rule of the Harlots.

 

[Howie01]

MrS:

You should read slooooooowwweeerrrr. Jeff Cavins opined that that only reason Catholics leave the Church is because they don’t know what they are leaving.

You twist it to say that the individual him(her)self says “I am leaving cuz I don’t know what I am leaving.”

That version of yours, again, makes not sense other than to be a display of spiritual immaturity on YOUR part.

MrS, if Cavins’ opine is accurate, then I should expect to hear those very words come out of the mouths of those who are in the process of leaving the Catholic Church.

But I doubt that will be given as a reason, and the reason I doubt Cavins’ opine is, I’ve talked to Catholics who’ve left the church, both pre, and post-exit, and have yet to hear Cavins’ reason given.

Unfortunately, you’ve self-appointed your own heart as the judge of the hearts of those who leave the church, and you seem to deem them liars because their experience differs from both your own experience, and Cavins’ opine.

 

[RonaldH]

My point has only to do with the word catholic. Go read what it says.

John 3:5 follows with, “unless one is born of *water *and the spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God.” How is God made flesh not speaking strictly about Baptism?

The true Church must be One under the authority given by God to Peter, correct? (Matt. 16:18)

“Upon this rock I will build My church” He did not say, “Peter’s church”. That rock is Christ. I Cor. 10:4, “And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ.”

 

[RonaldH]

I’m not suggesting a forum for attacks on Catholicism, but an exit interview of Catholics leaving the church as a counterbalance to the great fanfare given by EWTN for the entrance interview given by EWTN of Protestants entering the Church.

That comment in blue is a quote cited by you, MrS, and made by one Jeff Cavins. So if you view that comment as being indicative of spiritual immaturity, at least chain the placard stating that around the neck of the one who coined it, and around your own neck if you agree with Cavins.

Howie, How do you reply to a quote, with a comment, the a different quote, ant then comment? I think my replies come across fragmented. BTW, you seem to have my name attached to the above quote but it wasn’t mine???

 

[jam070406]

Oh my, I thought Jesus was coming back for a church without spot a Holy Chuch washed in His blood. Ya’ll need to stop fightintg. Paul said because of your fighting your still in the flesh. Jesus Loves you all and yes He Loves and died for John MacArthur too. How can you please the Father when your fighting with your brothers. Satan is having a good time with this post. Just stop and love and pray for each other. And by the way I don’t agree with John MacAthur, but He is a tool for the Lord. I think alot of us, because we are sinners would go astray if God didn’t keep someone on our toes. You have to addmit He keeps you saying “Why does He say we worship Mary, we don’t” Thats good we don’t, we are to only worship God and thats what we claim. It will takes some thought and prayer to understand what I am saying so don’t be confused. I can already hear it now people will say " are you saying we need John MacAuthur so we don’t worship Mary" No!!! But, God does use Him, He is also feeding the poor around the world, pulling people off the streets, and fighting against abortion, Becareful not to attack Gods people. I hope some of you understand what Iam saying. God Bless

Dennis,
I do appreciate your sincerity & message.
But this whole thing is stemmed from John doing a Mac attack on the Catholic Church. Catholics believe that the Catholic Church is the body of Christ, the Chuch started by Jesus Himself. So When MacArthur attacks, slanders & misrepresents Catholic teaching from the pulpit I believe Satan has a good time with it, as He is attacking Christ Himself.
Perhaps you could also convey your message to grace community church and John MacArthur that his actions are not very Christian or charitable. :nope:

God bless!

 

[M0nkey]

“Upon this rock I will build My church” He did not say, “Peter’s church”. That rock is Christ. I Cor. 10:4, “And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ.”

Jesus called Simon Peter, in the Greek kepha, it literally translates into rock. We can both agree that Christ is the Rock of salvation, but God built His Church upon solid rock, the rock that is Peter, hence the name *kepha *which is what He called him. Deny Peter and you deny the one who sent him, deny the Son, and you deny the Father who sent Him.

“Harlotry” is also not an official teaching of the Catholic Church; nevertheless, historians verify that there was a length of time in the history of the church in which “harlotry” occurred; that period of time is referred to as the Pornocracy, or the Rule of the Harlots.

Wait, so you are basically claiming harlots ran the Church because popes were having affairs with them? Now we are getting superstitious, again, show where in the history of the Church has a harlot or a pope influenced by such taught anything outside the deposit of faith? I think you seem to mix teachings with deeds, the popes are not saints and they may err in the way of bad judgment, but when it comes to teaching and the authority exercised thereof, there can be no err. Catholics do not claim popes are without personal mistakes that a sinner can make, it only goes insofar as morals and teaching. BTW, while we are on the topic of morals, does your interpretation of the Bible teach contraception?

How can you please the Father when your fighting with your brothers.

I don’t see it as fighting, merely showing the way and the truth and the light. If I know that the ship is sinking and there is only *one way *that leads to sure salvation shouId I keep quiet?

 

[jam070406]

I don’t see it as fighting, merely showing the way and the truth and the light. If I know that the ship is sinking and there is only *one way *that leads to sure salvation shouId I keep quiet?

:yup:

 

[Howie01]

RonaldH:

BTW, you seem to have my name attached to the above quote but it wasn’t mine???

Sorry, Ronald, I don’t know what I did, but that’s obviously what MrS said, and nothing you said.

 

[Howie01]

MOnkey:

Wait, so you are basically claiming harlots ran the Church because popes were having affairs with them?

You’ve completely missed my point, MOnkey; you might go back and re-read what I’ve said in its context.

I’m making none of the claims you claim I’m claiming.

 

[M0nkey]

You’ve completely missed my point, MOnkey; you might go back and re-read what I’ve said in its context.

I’m making none of the claims you claim I’m claiming.

Fair enough; I think I follow. Going to back to anti-semitism, Catholic Christians worship a Jewish God, the son of David who lives forever and ever! Don’t you think it’s ironic to be anti-semitic and still claim to be Christian? My assertion being, not that logically it may follow the “no true Scotsman” fallacy, but you can’t love Jesus and be an anti-semite for the same reason Jesus himself is a Jew, these people need to just get it right. Instead we should really be thanking our brothers of Jewish faith and honoring them for giving us the Savior.

 

[Pixie_Dust]

MrS, if Cavins’ opine is accurate, then I should expect to hear those very words come out of the mouths of those who are in the process of leaving the Catholic Church.

But I doubt that will be given as a reason, and the reason I doubt Cavins’ opine is, I’ve talked to Catholics who’ve left the church, both pre, and post-exit, and have yet to hear Cavins’ reason given.

They will say things like, “I left the Church because they sacrifice Jesus over and over at the Mass” or “…because I didn’t agree with Mary worship/no artificial contraception/the Real Presence” or “…because they teach a works salvation” or “…because I got a divorce and they wouldn’t let me receive Communion” or a myriad of other reasons that are not actually what the Church teaches. The old stand-by, “I read the Bible and decided that Catholicism isn’t biblical” shows that they’ve made an idol of their own intellect, or the intellect of an influential preacher, over the Teachings of the Church that have not changed in 2000 years.

 

[guanophore]

I’m not suggesting a forum for attacks on Catholicism, but an exit interview of Catholics leaving the church as a counterbalance to the great fanfare given by EWTN for the entrance interview given by EWTN of Protestants entering the Church.

If they had that much attention from an educated Catholic, they would never leave. Why would someone want to create “fanfare” for a person abandoning the One Church founded by Christ for an imitation?

I came to understand the gospel by reading the bible, and without having heard of MacArthur, or any other preacher; therefore, with respect to the gospel being simple because the minds of men are simple, I had no need of MacArthur.

I am so glad to hear you already know that you are a simple man.

This will save me the trouble of a public demonstration.

 

[guanophore]

The all Howie trinity?

That was good!

 

[Howie01]

MOnkey:

Fair enough; I think I follow. Going to back to anti-semitism, Catholic Christians worship a Jewish God, the son of David who lives forever and ever! Don’t you think it’s ironic to be anti-semitic and still claim to be Christian?

I agree; I find the two incompatible and add that God has clearly stated He will bless those who bless Israel, and curse those who curse Israel.

 

[Howie01]

Pixie Dust:

They will say things like, “I left the Church because they sacrifice Jesus over and over at the Mass” or “…because I didn’t agree with Mary worship/no artificial contraception/the Real Presence” or “…because they teach a works salvation” or “…because I got a divorce and they wouldn’t let me receive Communion” or a myriad of other reasons that are not actually what the Church teaches.

And I would add that most believe the CC does not preach the true Gospel with respect to both justification, and the substitutionary atonement of the cross.
Pixie Dust:

The old stand-by, “I read the Bible and decided that Catholicism isn’t biblical” shows that they’ve made an idol of their own intellect, or the intellect of an influential preacher, over the Teachings of the Church that have not changed in 2000 years.

IMO, that’s the pot calling the kettle black.

 

[Howie01]

guanophore:

If they had that much attention from an educated Catholic, they would never leave.

Assumes that those leaving the Catholic Church are not educated Catholics. Was Martin Luther an educated Catholic? How ‘bout Calvin and the others, were they educated Catholics, or uneducated morons?

And if it were true that an encounter with an educated Catholic by those leaving would cause them to stay in the Church, wouldn’t that be a win, win for both parties, IYO?

guanophore:

Why would someone want to create “fanfare” for a person abandoning the One Church founded by Christ for an imitation?

I’m not suggesting a “fanfare,” guanophore, but a counterbalance to an existing stage that celebrates the entrance of former protestants into the CC.

 

[phoenix3212]

“Upon this rock I will build My church” He did not say, “Peter’s church”. That rock is Christ. I Cor. 10:4, “And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ.”

Let’s see the full quote first.

“And I tell you, you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven, and whatever you bind on earth shall be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.” Then he strictly charged the disciples to tell no one that he was the Christ.” Mt 16:18-20

Substituting “rock” with the Aramaic, Jesus stated “you are Kephas and on this Kephas I will build my church.” Now, grammatically “this rock” must refer to the last use of the word rock in the sentence, that being Peter’s name. There is absolutely no way around the sentence structure here, and pulling a verse from Corinthians won’t help your cause either.

 

[guanophore]

Ya'll need to stop fightintg....  Satan is having a good time with this post.  Just stop and love and pray for each other.

It is not loving to confirm people who are embracing error.

And by the way I don’t agree with John MacAthur, but He is a tool for the Lord.

He is a tool for someone, no doubt!

You are right, though, God can speak through the mouth of a donkey.

God does use Him, He is also feeding the poor around the world, pulling people off the streets, and fighting against abortion, Becareful not to attack Gods people. I hope some of you understand what I am saying. God Bless

I do. Jesus said Mark 9:39-41
"Do not forbid him; for no one who does a mighty work in my name will be able soon after to speak evil of me. 40 For he that is not against us is for us. 41 For truly, I say to you, whoever gives you a cup of water to drink because you bear the name of Christ, will by no means lose his reward.

 

[guanophore]

I’ve never stated that anti-semitism was an official teaching of your Church, but merely cited a book which also cites Catholic historians stating that anti-semitism was practiced in the church and into the 20th century, according to the author of the book, Ronald Diprose.

“Harlotry” is also not an official teaching of the Catholic Church; nevertheless, historians verify that there was a length of time in the history of the church in which “harlotry” occurred; that period of time is referred to as the Pornocracy, or the Rule of the Harlots.

The problem is, Howie, that you are pointing out sinful behaviors, then implying that these are the teachings of the Church, or because they were approved by sinful men, claiming to be Catholic, that they are condoned by Christ.

 

[guanophore]

if Cavins’ opine is accurate, then I should expect to hear those very words come out of the mouths of those who are in the process of leaving the Catholic Church.

No, Howie. Not knowing means just that. They are ignorant, or unconscious. Whatever comes out of their mouths will reflect the unknowing in their hearts.

But I doubt that will be given as a reason, and the reason I doubt Cavins’ opine is, I’ve talked to Catholics who’ve left the church, both pre, and post-exit, and have yet to hear Cavins’ reason given.

Well, of course not. Use your common sense, man. How can someone give a reason that they don’t know exists? They think they know.

Unfortunately, you’ve self-appointed your own heart as the judge of the hearts of those who leave the church, and you seem to deem them liars because their experience differs from both your own experience, and Cavins’ opine.

How is it that you are allowed to talk to them, and reach a conclusion, but we are not?

They are not liars. A lie is a deliberate attempt to deceive someone. They are sincerely seeking God, and a more authentic religious/spiritual experience than they have had. They believe they can find it in a bible church.

There experience is no different than mine. I believed similarly.