John Paul II being beatified for holiness, not his papacy, speakers say

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I must admit that there have been times that I felt unsettled at a number of controversial discrepancies that took place between His Holiness Pope John Paul II in his many trips in trying to mesh an aire of Ecumenism with multiple Faiths and in trying to bring closer ties with the Vatican.

Kissing the Koran, Placing a Buddhist Statue on a Tabernacle amongst other foul ups that created much sensationalism.

However; in giving much thought to this I have tried to swing my doubts in favor of Pope John Paul II especially considering his feebleness and poor health in the last decade reigning as our Pope.

If anything I think the blame of such controversies should rest on the organizers (Cardinals and Bishops) who were directly instrumental in many of the Pope’s visits.

The Pope was an ambassador and statesman. Would the Pope really have kissed the Koran or placed a Buddhist statue next to a Tabernacle if he had full knowledge of this in his itinerary? Somehow I am at a loss to say that he was often put on the spot deliberately without having full knowledge before hand.

I would rather concentrate on the Spirituality of this beautiful Pope rather than all the negativity and sensationalism. Faced with the relentless bombardment of modern secular humanism and moral relativism in the global world and infiltrating within the inner sanctum of the Church itself, I would say Pope John Paul II did the best possible job he could.

Peace
Chris
 
jp was a foolish man no more to be said goodbye to you all and get your silly heads out of the sand…he allowed a lot of scandals and now you want to justify his actions…you might as well do the same with Alexander the vi life.:mad:
 
centurionguard said:
Placing a Buddhist Statue on a Tabernacle amongst other foul ups that created much sensationalism.
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What? I’ve never heard that one before.
centurionguard said:
I would rather concentrate on the Spirituality of this beautiful Pope rather than all the negativity and sensationalism. Faced with the relentless bombardment of modern secular humanism and moral relativism in the global world and infiltrating within the inner sanctum of the Church itself, I would say Pope John Paul II did the best possible job he could.
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Do you think this was the case for Pope St. Pius X, too?
 
Geremia said:
What? I’ve never heard that one before.

Here’s a few links concerning the Buddhist Statue:

remnantnewspaper.com/Archives/2011-0315-cotter-assisi.htm

traditioninaction.org/RevolutionPhotos/A169rcBuddhaAssisi.htm

Do you think this was the case for Pope St. Pius X, too?
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What point are you referring to here?

I think Pope Saint Pius X made one of the greatest encyclicals that is still very prevalent today namely; PASCENDI DOMINICI GREGIS in relation to Modernism affecting society in the world and inside the walls of the global Church.

papalencyclicals.net/Pius10/p10pasce.htm

Peace
Chris
 
Of course this is true but the way Pope John Paul II ran his papacy is definitely evidence for his holiness in my own personal opinion.
 
Holly3278 said:
Of course this is true but the way Pope John Paul II ran his papacy is definitely evidence for his holiness in my own personal opinion.
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No Pope in Church history was as ecumenical as Pope John Paul II.

Some are quick to judge this seeing discrepancies.

I like you would rather not. No human including Popes are perfect.

But he was a successor of Peter. That in itself for all Catholics demands the greatest of respect. And I will honor and pray for his beatification.

Peace
Chris
 
Hmm… strange. I thought a dove representing the Holy Spirit was supposed to be placed over tabernacles?
centurionguard said:
I think Pope Saint Pius X made one of the greatest encyclicals that is still very prevalent today namely; PASCENDI DOMINICI GREGIS
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Yes, that is an excellent encyclical, especially apropos today where many inside and outside the Church believe in immanentism and religious indifferentism.
 
I just have to wonder at extreme speed at which they are going about beatifying Pope John Paul II. If it took so many years so many others saints, why so fast for him? It almost seems to me that it’s done as a reaction to the overwhelming pressure that’s being given to do it.

Taking more time wouldn’t hurt anything.
 
The_Curt_Jester said:
I just have to wonder at extreme speed at which they are going about beatifying Pope John Paul II. If it took so many years so many others saints, why so fast for him? It almost seems to me that it’s done as a reaction to the overwhelming pressure that’s being given to do it.
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What pressure? Are you referring to vox populi?
 
Geremia said:
John Paul II being beatified for holiness, not his papacy, speakers say

http://www.catholicnews.com/photos/11hp0150.jpg
Cardinal Angelo Amato, prefect of the Congregation for Saints’ Causes, speaks at a conference about Pope John Paul II in Rome April 1. (CNS/Paul Haring)

By Cindy Wooden
Catholic News Service

ROME (CNS) – Pope John Paul II is being beatified not because of his impact on history or on the Catholic Church, but because of the way he lived the Christian virtues of faith, hope and love, said Cardinal Angelo Amato, prefect of the Congregation for Saints’ Causes.

“Clearly his cause was put on the fast track, but the process was done carefully and meticulously, following the rules Pope John Paul himself issued in 1983,” the cardinal said April 1, during a conference at the Pontifical University of the Holy Cross in Rome.

The cardinal said the church wanted to respond positively to many Catholics’ hopes to have Pope John Paul beatified quickly, but it also wanted to be certain that the pope, who died in 2005, is in heaven.

Cardinal Amato said the sainthood process is one of the areas of church life where the consensus of church members, technically the “sensus fidelium” (“sense of the faithful”), really counts.

“From the day of his death on April 2, 2005, the people of God began proclaiming his holiness,” and hundreds, if not thousands, visit his tomb each day, the cardinal said. A further sign is the number of biographies published about him and the number of his writings that are translated and re-published.

“In the course of a beatification cause, there is the vox populi,” he said, which must be “accompanied by the vox dei (voice of God) – the miracles – and the vox ecclesiae (voice of the church),” which is the official judgment issued after interviewing eyewitnesses and consulting with historians, physicians, theologians and church leaders to verify the candidate’s holiness.

Beatification and canonization are not recognitions of someone’s superior understanding of theology, nor of the great works he or she accomplished, he said. Declaring someone a saint, the church attests to the fact that he or she lived the Christian virtues in a truly extraordinary way and is a model to be imitated by others, the cardinal said.

The candidate, he said, must be perceived “as an image of Christ.”

Cardinal Amato said, “the pressure of the public and of the media did not disturb the process, but helped it” because it was a further sign of Pope John Paul’s widespread reputation for holiness, which is something the church requires proof of before it moves to beatify someone.

Joaquin Navarro-Valls, who served as Vatican spokesman under Pope John Paul, told the conference that the late pope’s voice, his pronunciation, his use of gestures and his presence at the altar or on a stage all contributed to his success as a communicator.

But the key to his effectiveness was that he firmly believed that each person was created in God’s image and likeness, Navarro-Valls said. “I think this was what attracted people even more than the way he spoke.”

People felt he was sincere in his recognition of their dignity and of their destiny to be with God, he said.

“He was a man profoundly convinced of the truth of those words in Genesis – ‘God made man and woman in his image and likeness.’ This gave him optimism even when he could no longer walk, and then even when he could no longer speak,” Navarro-Valls said.

The Spaniard, a member of Opus Dei, said he had the blessing of personally knowing three saints: Josemaria Escriva de Balaguer, founder of Opus Dei; Blessed Teresa of Kolkata; and Pope John Paul.

What all three have in common, he said, was a good sense of humor, a ready smile and an ability to laugh.

As for those who question beatifying Pope John Paul only six years after his death and those who say the explosion of the clerical sex abuse scandal during his pontificate casts a dark shadow on his reign, Navarro-Valls said people must remember that beatification is not a judgment on a pontificate, but on the personal holiness of the candidate.

The key question, he said, is: “Can we be certain he lived the Christian virtues in a heroic way?”

END
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Whos next Karl Rahner or Hans Kung?Guess if you kiss a Quran and let Buddha idols be put up In Assissi its a lock now 2 get canonized.
 
centurionguard said:
No Pope in Church history was as ecumenical as Pope John Paul II.

Some are quick to judge this seeing discrepancies.

I like you would rather not. No human including Popes are perfect.

But he was a successor of Peter. That in itself for all Catholics demands the greatest of respect. And I will honor and pray for his beatification.

Peace
Chris
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Being a successor of Peter doesnt make U perfect. No pope was as ecumenical as him because before his modernist 1983 code of canon law revision, it was illegal to take part in any non catholic religious service.So he just threw out 1917 code.
 
The_Curt_Jester said:
I just have to wonder at extreme speed at which they are going about beatifying Pope John Paul II. If it took so many years so many others saints, why so fast for him? It almost seems to me that it’s done as a reaction to the overwhelming pressure that’s being given to do it.

Taking more time wouldn’t hurt anything.
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Cause now they will have “canonized” All The post Vatican 2 Masonic inspired all religions are equal mumbo jumbo.
 
Hope you Stay in the faith. Papal Infallibility is a negative gift not a positive one though.Popes have only used it a couple of times.
 
So you are ok with one pope going against 2000 years of Popes because hes the only one who kissed a quran which denies Jesus Divinity and okd putting pagan statues on catholic Altars? Im a historian who looks at the whole picture not just on e Pope in one sement of time.
 
90 years ago he would be in violation of canon law. End of story.
 
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