JPII now baptised by proxy by LDS

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Eden said:
I don’t see the quotes you provided from my link as a defense of Maimonides’ anti-Christianity. Nowhere is it indicated that he is being persecuted by Christians in these excerpts you shared. Further, it is completely absurd, if he is indirectly referring to Jesus, to say that Christ used “the sword” for anything.
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First of all, I wasn’t trying to defend Rambam’s anti-Christanity. As far as I’m concerned, he had every right to condem christanity. I’m sure you don’t need a history lesson as to the relationship between christians and jews up to the 12 century CE.

Second, if you read the link and the excerpt I posted, Jesus is not used as an example of one who tried to destroy Judaism by the sword. He is used as an example as one who tried to destroy Judaism through conequest or controversy.
 
tequilamac said:
What in the world does this have to do with Mormons running around baptising dead people? If Valke feels that it is more insulting to Jews than to anyone else, let him start a new thread on that. this is way off topic here and Valke has had his day in the sun. Let’s move back to the topic. Which was Mormonism bapitisng the dead.
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Fine with me. I’ve just been responding to questions/allegations raised in posts.
 
tequilamac said:
No problem. But Valke is an extremely faithful Jew and he tends to bring all things into a discussion of Judaism. Gotta watch him for that. It gets confusing after a while, especially when people come on who don’t like Jews and then we are all mired up. so back to Mormons. 😃
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Go reread the entire thread. Who asked about Talmud? Wasn’t me. Who brought up Jesus? Wasn’t me. Who brought up Rambam? Wasn’t me. Geez. I understand that you and others are extrememly faithful catholics and that you tend to bring all things into a discussion of Jesus. I guess I just have to watch out for that.
 
Damascus said:
Mormons dont want to grind Jesus’ bones up.
Mormons dont burn up holy books.
Mormons did not …
I dont have to say it.
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I am sure the Jews don’t do any of that either. The last thing I would want to see is someone using Mormonism as a stick with which to bash Judaism.

zerinus
 
Mormons baptise their children at age 8. I don’t think there’s much difference between baptising an 8 year-old than baptising an 8 day-old. Neither child truly has the freedom to decide whether or not to be baptised and it is the faith of the parents, not the child, that is operative in both cases.

Just my opinion,
Paul
 
PaulDupre said:
Mormons baptise their children at age 8. I don’t think there’s much difference between baptising an 8 year-old than baptising an 8 day-old. Neither child truly has the freedom to decide whether or not to be baptised and it is the faith of the parents, not the child, that is operative in both cases.

Just my opinion,
Paul
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I think the eight year-old has much greater ability to discern right from wrong and to excercise personal faith. By eight, a child has been speaking well over five years of his or her life, has begun to grapple with abstract concepts, and has some ability to take responsibility for his or her own actions. Certainly at that age there is still a great desire to please one’s parents and this would skew the decision-making skills of the child to some degree. On the other hand, in the process of normal development, most adolescents begin to rebel against parents as a way of learning to differentiate their values from those of their parents. At either stage of life, there are biological dimensions to one’s decision-making ability.
 
I’m no expert on LDS but I would guess the reason they wait until the child is 8 is because they consider that the age where a person first needs to have sin washed away. That before that age, all children are without blame in the eyes of God.

(Did I win?)
 
zerinus said:
Because the Lord has commanded us not to! 🙂

zerinus
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Firstly, where did the Lord command you not to baptise certain people in the Bible?

Secondly, do you baptise dead infants? When you are doing genealogy and you come across a relative who died in infancy or early childhood in, say, the 16th century, do you exclude that person from your ceremonies? And what is the fate of such a person in your LDS worldview?
 
we can get more specific amgid. LDS classify 8 as the “age of reason” and thus the point where you become accountable for your sins. They believe that prior to that if you die you go to heaven.
 
I love this idea and I think the Catholic Church should borrow from it but not necessarily with babtism but with confirmation. We could confirm or cannonize muslims and buddists. OHHH even lutherans. I am voting for a confirmation of Osama. Benjamin Netanyaho, and Pat Robertson, of course we will wait until they die so they can’t deny being Catholic. Did you know Joseph Smith was a Catholic. A confirmed saint. I can see it now St Brigham Young Parish.
 
Eden said:
Firstly, where did the Lord command you not to baptise certain people in the Bible?
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We baptize everyone when they are at the right age to be baptized. The Bible tells us “he that repents and is baptized shall be saved”. Infants cannot “repent,” therefore they need not be baptized—until they reach the age when they can repent.
Secondly, do you baptise dead infants? . . . And what is the fate of such a person in your LDS worldview?
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No, we don’t vicariously baptize those who have died in infancy. Infants are only “sealed to their parents,” not baptized.

zerinus
 
zerinus said:
We baptize everyone when they are at the right age to be baptized. The Bible tells us “he that repents and is baptized shall be saved”. Infants cannot “repent,” therefore they need not be baptized—until they reach the age when they can repent.
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You forgot this part, " “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God.” (John 3:5)

It does not say, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one over the age of 8 is born of the water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God.”

This passage is about baptism and and by one, this means everyone.
 
Karin said:
In this light the BoM specifically forbids the practice of Infant baptism, maintaining that it is "solemn mockery before God." (See Moroni 8:4-23.):eek: :mad:
SOURCE
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Isn’t it just amazing that the Book of Moroni - all 13 pages of it - happen to discuss all of the sticky points of doctrine that Joseph Smith would have encountered in the early 19th century? Why wasn’t this mentioned earlier in the BoM?
 
Megatron said:
Isn’t it just amazing that the Book of Moroni - all 13 pages of it - happen to discuss all of the sticky points of doctrine that Joseph Smith would have encountered in the early 19th century? Why wasn’t this mentioned earlier in the BoM?
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EVERYTHING is truly amazing regarding the mormons.😛
 
Eden said:
You forgot this part, " “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God.” (John 3:5)
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No my friend, I forgot nothing. You are the one who forgot this verse: “But Jesus said, Suffer little children, and forbid them not, to come unto me: for of such is the kingdom of heaven” (Matthew 19:14). Little children are already “in the kingdom of heaven”. They don’t need to be “born again” to get there. The “born again” bit applies to those who aren’t already there.

zerinus
 
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