Judaism / Christianity

[aaronjo]

Actually the rabbis inserted in their Creed (Amidah, said 3x a day and in the synagogue) a curse against the Hebrew Christians (minim), the idea that the Christians wouldn’t come and curse themselves. That’s when the Christians had to set up their own synagogues.

I think the fact is exactly opposit to what you say.

In the beginning reasonable Jews had no problem with Jesus accepting him whatever he might have claimed, as his all followers were Jews and as we see he did not claim in certain words as G_d or any divinity. He was most certainly preaching nothing but reviving the Holy Torah to it’s purity without adding anything to it.

Reviving Holy Torah and the Prophets means not just keeping religion upto the Synagogues, as Jewish Scared Scriptues is about State/Politics as well, in order to implement criminal and civil laws.

And this revival and implement of Holy Torah and the Prophets was in fact a great threat not just to the pagan ROMANS but also to the those Jews who were in enjoying power under Romans/were puppets of Roman rule.

In otherwords Jesus was indeed ***The Radical Jew ***of his time who was on a great life threatening dangerous mission to enforce the Law of G_d of Israel (atleast on his nation).

Despite his mission was limited to mere Lost Sheep of House of Israel - Children of Israel, greedy/puppet Jews and Romans found Jesus a guilty man enough who could have soon or later been able to topple their rule or wage a war on collective level, as he was not an old man but a very young energetic and full of wisdom-man and could have lived long enough until he enforce Laws of G_d on individual and collective level (on atleast) of his society.

This Radicalism of Jesus was a good-enough crime to be killed by any means necessary. So sooner he be killed the better for Romans. They somehow “killed” him and most likley they took his dead body to an unknown place not to be found easily. Rumors spread across the nation. People started talking differently as not one of his disciples were eye witnesses as they all fled. Not so surprising to know now that after the discovery of most ancient manuscripts of Mark’s gospel, the last verses from 9 to 20 are not found in them.

So Jesus “resurrection from dead” and appearing to his disciples is a myth created/fabricated later to make his later followers happy and to justify/cover up Romans/puppet Jews’ crime.

When Romans through Saul/Paul were able to destablize Jesus mission of revivial of Holy Torah and the Prophets, and then paganized his teachings and turning into a lawless/baseless faith ( a mere set of some meaningless rituals and creed) it was let spread at it’s pace or in other words it became a state-back faith which was harmless to unGodly rule of Romans.

At this stage Jews when they saw the very base of their Monotheistic nature of Judaism is in severe dangeour they forcefully oppose this new cult called Christianity (as this new name was not even given or adopted by Jesus). It was named/lablelled by their enemies in Antioch.

But Jews were not strong enough nor in great number. They had to keep their theology either in their hearts and memorization if they had to survive as real Jews and protect their faith for future generations.

Any literature that could have revived the pure Judaic message of Jesus, was either burned or destroyed and in the course, lot of people got killed. Mere four meaningless/baseless gospels out of so many gospels “canonised” as true/authentic but when? In the fourth century, and no reason was given on what ground the rest of gospels were rejected nor they were kept as historical books open for public to see what game has been played. If you examine closely the actul words of Jesus qouted in these “canonized” gospels ( which are basically story-telling books, as per Catholic Bible) are no more than 10%.

So Christianity eventually was backed by Romans, as Romans were happy to see a totally new religion coming out (which is an easy meat to them ) whose core teachings were how to renounce the world and become a monk/nun or live in caves or how to turn the other cheak if you chose to live in society and get married. and procreate.

Well, a religion (such as Christianity) this kind of attitude/approach towards human life can never pose any threat to those who were in power and enjoying the worldly pleasures, as it is limited to caves or Churches. Take a look a similar incident of Buddhaism. It eas born in India, later when become paralized spread rapidly not in the birth palce India but in the neighboring areas, as it posed no threat to any power.

 

[reen12]

I do enjoy these little religious get-togethers. http://bestsmileys.com/nono/9.gif

What was the OP’s question?

quote: RosesforMary

The other day I was talking to a (Jewish) friend of mine, and she said that the reason for the differences between Christianity and Judaism was that the early Christians tried to convert the Jews and, when it turned out to be a harder task than they had bargained for and they failed, they then turned their attention to the other people. In order to make this new religion easier for them to catch on to and follow (and also purely to differentiate themselves), they then dropped the Mosaic Law and so on.

Perhaps this will shed light on same.

From the Judaic perspective:
The God of Israel granted salvation, forgiveness, mercy -
and a life in the world to come. What is less recognized, is that this included all peoples.
The members of Judaism are His chosen people. No one need convert to Judaism. If one acknowledges the God of Israel, and follows the natural law, one is welcome in the world to come. The God of Israel is savior.​

From the Christian perspective:
Christianity states that man is born in ontological sin.
A sin in man’s very being - said to have been ‘inherited’
from Adam. [original sin.]

Only baptism - in the name of the triune God of Christianity, can remove this sin.
Jesus is said to have made atonement [at-one-ment] between God and man.
Christianity holds that there was a rupture caused, in man’s relationship with God,
due to the sin of Adam - and that this rupture needed to be repaired.

If one accepts Jesus as God/man, savior, then one agrees
to accept the thought that man is born with sin in his/her
very being, and that mankind therefore needed a savior from same.
A savior who would ‘pay the price’ for man’s personal sin, as well.

Christianity claims to find warrant - for it’s view of deity - in
the Hebrew Scriptures. Christianity says that God had a
plan of salvation, that included a savior from sin.

---

From a Judaic perspective, it was blasphemy to call a man ‘God.’
There is one God and one law given.

Those who were well acquainted with Torah would recognize at once -
that this teaching concerning a God/man was to be rejected.

Saul of Tarsus [St. Paul] headed out to tell others of Jesus.
These others, Gentiles - hadn’t a clue, as to Torah.

Paul would find less opposition, to this new religious doctrine -
as he would have found - had he spent most of his time, in and
near Jerusalem. In fact, he was tossed out of some towns,
roughed up, and thrown into prison. [Act of the Apostles]

reen12 :tiphat:

 

[aaronjo]

Quote:
Originally Posted by aaronjo
Do you know that some Catholic writers [too] have sought a preliminary and partial fulfillment in the conception and birth of the future King Hezekiah, whose mother, at the time Isaiah spoke, would have been a young, unmarried woman (Hebrew, almah)?

From your Vatican Catholic source.

 

[aaronjo]

The Jews did not Kill Christ. He willingly died for our sins.

Also it was The Romans who crucified Jesus. The Cross was a Roman means of execution.

So, you say ***“The Jews did not Kill Christ. He willingly died for our sins”. *** If so, it simply means your Christ committed suicide to save you from sins. A wishfull death by any person who is not out of his mind or abnormal, is an unpardonable suicide not encourage nor accepted in any civilised society, let alone any faith. If it comes to God-Man who “came down” in flesh to set an example for you how to live and follow him, such a suicidal death can be called HIGHEST CRIME of the World.

Then further you say: Also it was The Romans who crucified Jesus. The Cross was a Roman means of execution.
It means either:
Romans helped your Christ in committing suicide (so that Christ can save his nation from their “sins”), hence Romans are not guilty of any crime rather they should be awarded biggest NOBLE PRIZE ever given in the history of the World, as they “saved” Christians’ neck from the Hell and Babies who were baptized. Because had not your Christ died with the “help” of Pagan Romans, you most certainly would have been in Hell.

Or

Romans are indeed guilty of killing your God-Man mecrcilessly with a most painfull death (as if these Romans had more power than G_d of Israel.) and as your Christ had no intention to die. Here it is meaningless to say Cross was means of execution. Because whether it was Cross or any other method to execute, Romans would have used any other means to kill your God-Man, if they had decided to ( for the reasons of their own), don’t they?

So pick your choice, because you cannot have both ways, as it is a clear CONTRADICTION that even a little boy can figure it out and will laugh at your “explanation”/ cover-up of something which is undefendable, no matter what.

 

[Isa_Almisry]

They did not reject their Jewish heritage? If so then they indeed were not Catholic, as Catholics have been killing Jews for centuries because in their mind, Jews killed Christians’ God-Man.

Were Jews really that much strong to kill your mighty Christian God-man?

No. Matthew 26:53-4

 

[Isa_Almisry]

I think the fact is exactly opposit to what you say.

In the beginning reasonable Jews had no problem with Jesus accepting him whatever he might have claimed, as his all followers were Jews and as we see he did not claim in certain words as G_d or any divinity. He was most certainly preaching nothing but reviving the Holy Torah to it’s purity without adding anything to it.

Reviving Holy Torah and the Prophets means not just keeping religion upto the Synagogues, as Jewish Scared Scriptues is about State/Politics as well, in order to implement criminal and civil laws.

And this revival and implement of Holy Torah and the Prophets was in fact a great threat not just to the pagan ROMANS but also to the those Jews who were in enjoying power under Romans/were puppets of Roman rule.

In otherwords Jesus was indeed ***The Radical Jew ***of his time who was on a great life threatening dangerous mission to enforce the Law of G_d of Israel (atleast on his nation).

Despite his mission was limited to mere Lost Sheep of House of Israel - Children of Israel, greedy/puppet Jews and Romans found Jesus a guilty man enough who could have soon or later been able to topple their rule or wage a war on collective level, as he was not an old man but a very young energetic and full of wisdom-man and could have lived long enough until he enforce Laws of G_d on individual and collective level (on atleast) of his society.

This Radicalism of Jesus was a good-enough crime to be killed by any means necessary. So sooner he be killed the better for Romans. They somehow “killed” him and most likley they took his dead body to an unknown place not to be found easily. Rumors spread across the nation. People started talking differently as not one of his disciples were eye witnesses as they all fled. Not so surprising to know now that after the discovery of most ancient manuscripts of Mark’s gospel, the last verses from 9 to 20 are not found in them.

So Jesus “resurrection from dead” and appearing to his disciples is a myth created/fabricated later to make his later followers happy and to justify/cover up Romans/puppet Jews’ crime.

When Romans through Saul/Paul were able to destablize Jesus mission of revivial of Holy Torah and the Prophets, and then paganized his teachings and turning into a lawless/baseless faith ( a mere set of some meaningless rituals and creed) it was let spread at it’s pace or in other words it became a state-back faith which was harmless to unGodly rule of Romans.

At this stage Jews when they saw the very base of their Monotheistic nature of Judaism is in severe dangeour they forcefully oppose this new cult called Christianity (as this new name was not even given or adopted by Jesus). It was named/lablelled by their enemies in Antioch.

But Jews were not strong enough nor in great number. They had to keep their theology either in their hearts and memorization if they had to survive as real Jews and protect their faith for future generations.

Any literature that could have revived the pure Judaic message of Jesus, was either burned or destroyed and in the course, lot of people got killed. Mere four meaningless/baseless gospels out of so many gospels “canonised” as true/authentic but when? In the fourth century, and no reason was given on what ground the rest of gospels were rejected nor they were kept as historical books open for public to see what game has been played. If you examine closely the actul words of Jesus qouted in these “canonized” gospels ( which are basically story-telling books, as per Catholic Bible) are no more than 10%.

So Christianity eventually was backed by Romans, as Romans were happy to see a totally new religion coming out (which is an easy meat to them ) whose core teachings were how to renounce the world and become a monk/nun or live in caves or how to turn the other cheak if you chose to live in society and get married. and procreate.

Well, a religion (such as Christianity) this kind of attitude/approach towards human life can never pose any threat to those who were in power and enjoying the worldly pleasures, as it is limited to caves or Churches. .

Your diatribe is an odd mix of Islam and marxism.

Still doesn’t explain how in the end, even the might of the Roman Empire submitted to the Gospel.

 

[Angelos]

This thread is about Judaism/Christainity, not about Judaism/Islamic religion.

If you are troubled by Islamic religion’s stance/allegations towards Jews or Christians, open a new thread by yourself and invite Moslems to respond you, as I am not an expert in their theology or history.

I am not even an expert in my Jewish theology hence I am a moderate Jew, not a fundamentalist rigid Jew.

I guess you hide behind this pretext because this is the only way for you to evade my questions.

Although this thread is about Judaism/Christianity, you could still answer my questions to highlight the tenets Judaism and Christianity concur on. Islamic allegations about Abraham in the Koran strikingly illustrate how Christianity is faithful to the core of Judaism unlike Islam.

 

[KenEOTE]

So, you say ***“The Jews did not Kill Christ. He willingly died for our sins”. *** If so, it simply means your Christ committed suicide to save you from sins. A wishfull death by any person who is not out of his mind or abnormal, is an unpardonable suicide not encourage nor accepted in any civilised society, let alone any faith. If it comes to God-Man who “came down” in flesh to set an example for you how to live and follow him, such a suicidal death can be called HIGHEST CRIME of the World.

Then further you say: Also it was The Romans who crucified Jesus. The Cross was a Roman means of execution.
It means either:
Romans helped your Christ in committing suicide (so that Christ can save his nation from their “sins”), hence Romans are not guilty of any crime rather they should be awarded biggest NOBLE PRIZE ever given in the history of the World, as they “saved” Christians’ neck from the Hell and Babies who were baptized. Because had not your Christ died with the “help” of Pagan Romans, you most certainly would have been in Hell.

Or

Romans are indeed guilty of killing your God-Man mecrcilessly with a most painfull death (as if these Romans had more power than G_d of Israel.) and as your Christ had no intention to die. Here it is meaningless to say Cross was means of execution. Because whether it was Cross or any other method to execute, Romans would have used any other means to kill your God-Man, if they had decided to ( for the reasons of their own), don’t they?

So pick your choice, because you cannot have both ways, as it is a clear CONTRADICTION that even a little boy can figure it out and will laugh at your “explanation”/ cover-up of something which is undefendable, no matter what.

Aaron those are fun arguements but you miss the point.

Once again as you stated you are not an expert in your own faith, stop trying to pretend to be an expert in ours.

What are the 5 books of the Torah? Do you even know that? It is essential to your faith since you claim to follow only the Torah and the Prophets.

Is it a suicide when you risk your life and stand between a man with a gun and your loved ones knowing you will be shot or is that an act of love?
Jesus knowing that the wages of sin was death stood between our punishment and us and took it for us. That is not suicide but an act of Love.

The thing is I am not saying any one people group is guilty of Christs Death. Not the Jews, Not the Romans. I am sayng all men our guilty of his death, that includes you and I. He died for all men and women. So it is because of our sin that he died.

Now as I said go learn what your religion teaches more fully then come back. Tell us about your form of Judaism. Stop mocking Christianity which you know very little about.

This is a thread about Judaism and Christianity so tell us more about what you believe. I am interested.

 

[oneGODoneCHURCH]

aaronjo

You have still have yet to answer how you are able to practice the Judaism of the Torah without there being a Temple or the Arch of the Covenant. with out Priest for the Sacrifices. I am starting to believe that you are not Jewish at all, but a troll come here to pick fights.

You miss represent Catholic/Christian beliefs and teachings and you can put forth no original statements on Jewish teaching or Beliefs but copy past or repeat what other have said.

So what is the really story are you in truth Jewish but have not real Faith? Are you Muslim and just trying to anger people and pretend to be Jewish or do you even have a belief in God at all?

 

[KenEOTE]

aaronjo

You have still have yet to answer how you are able to practice the Judaism of the Torah without there being a Temple or the Arch of the Covenant. with out Priest for the Sacrifices. I am starting to believe that you are not Jewish at all, but a troll come here to pick fights.

You miss represent Catholic/Christian beliefs and teachings and you can put forth no original statements on Jewish teaching or Beliefs but copy past or repeat what other have said.

So what is the really story are you in truth Jewish but have not real Faith? Are you Muslim and just trying to anger people and pretend to be Jewish or do you even have a belief in God at all?

He never will answer you. He is a moderate Jew. Which to Aaron means I know nothing about Judaism. I know the word Torah and the Prophets that is it. If you ask me the names of the Books in the Torah I couldn’t tell you cause I have never read it.

 

[aaronjo]

What are the 5 books of the [Holy] Torah?

Books of Holy Torah (The Pentateuch):

Bereishit

Shemot

Vayikra

Bamidbar

Devarim

Now you want me to cut-&-paste the whole Holy Torah here?

Please keep your arguements/discussion upto Christianity/Judaism and not what Jews believe or Christians believe on personal/individual level, as there are so many sects and denominations and even no two Catholics may have same identical beliefs (on personal/individual level, I should say).

Here we need to discuss/examine the base books of these two faiths to evaluate how much they make sense/whether they are away from truth, if so how far away, as not all can be right at the same time with so many different approaches/teachings.

 

[aaronjo]

The documents of the New Testament are grouped by compilers in
three families that can be called Alexandrian, Syrian, and Western. But none of these is entirely free from alterations.

 

[KenEOTE]

Books of Holy Torah (The Pentateuch):

Bereishit

Shemot

Vayikra

Bamidbar

Devarim

Now you want me to cut-&-paste the whole Holy Torah here?

Please keep your arguements/discussion upto Christianity/Judaism and not what Jews believe or Christians believe on personal/individual level, as there are so many sects and denominations and even no two Catholics may have same identical beliefs (on personal/individual level, I should say).

Here we need to discuss/examine the base books of these two faiths to evaluate how much they make sense/whether they are away from truth, if so how far away, as not all can be right at the same time with so many different approaches/teachings.

Its nice to see that you are able to cut and paste the first 5 books. Where did you get it from? The Pentateuch is the Greek name for it and I know how much you disdain the Greek paganism.

I think everyone here has been trying to keep it about Judaism and Christianity. You have taken it though as a personal attack against Christianity. You also in many of your post have a very Islamic sounding agenda.

I am more then happy to have a look at the similarities between Christianity and Judaism. I have had that discussion with many rabbi friends of mine.

I think it is valid to ask someones personal beliefs it is the only way to have a honest discussion or debate. If you do not know where that person is coming from it is hard to understand their thought process.

I hold Judaism dear and love the Jewish people. I have never met a Jewish man or woman who would not offer up their beliefs to me when asked. I have never with held my beliefs when asked.

 

[KenEOTE]

Further Mr. Aaron I think it would help your cause the most if you shared what you believed and what questions you have.

The form you take of attacking Christianity doesn’t serve your purpose.

I have mentioned this before that you say you don’t even know fully what Judaism teaches yet you pretend to know and understand our faith.

No one here is belittling Judaism in the manner you try unsuccessfully to belittle Christianity. Practice Charity and perhaps you will see people more willing to dialogue with you.

 

[aaronjo]

Your diatribe is an odd mix of Islam and marxism.

I just showed you what actually had happened by connecting the dots in the historical/religious data availabe to us.

If this you found “diatribe” and “an odd mix of Islam and Marxism” then this is either a coincidence or perhaps it has to do with your preconcieved attitude.

But the FACT of history, remains as is.

Still doesn’t explain how in the end, even the might of the Roman Empire submitted to the Gospel.

You are wrong here. By the time Christianity was adopted by Roman Empire, it was not really mighty. I suggest you to re-read the history of that period.

Up until Galerius period persecution of Christians was continued.

It was him who in about 300, officially put an end to the persecution of Christians and then Constantine “legalised” Christianity in 313 as per the so called Edict of Milan.

Then came Julian, who seved as the sole Emperor for mere two years, was a Christian by baptism years before, but no longer considered himself a Christian.

In his period the restriction and persecution of paganism (which was introduced by his predecessors Constantine I, II and others came to an end). But surprisngly (for your information) he enforced similar restrictions and unofficial persecution of Christians/Christianity.

After his death, Jovian, an army officer became emporer, as Julian was childless. He is considered a Christian himself but very little is known of his beliefs and it was he, who restored the privilages of Christinaty (for whatever political reasons he had)… as the Epire was in great turmoil.

By this time Christianity was completely lawless and paganized and was not a threat to the rulers, as it was limited to the caves or churches.

If Buddhaism was introduced instead of Christianity in Roman Empire, this too could have spread rapidly even on a larger scale, as this too pose no threat to the ruling class.

The bottom line is, so long as your belief/creed/religion is limited from your home to the place of your worship, it can grow even under the patronage of ruling body who do not share your beliefs/creed at all.

Here you must make note of this fact that:

What in fact Jesus taught is one thing

and

what you all Christians believe, teach, preach and attribute to Jesus from your own is (almost) totally another.

Thus Jesus is free from what you ascribe to him from your own and preach in his name.

You may repeat and assume whole life that “we believe in Jesus and follow him” but in fact you may be following something which Jesus never taught you or never expected such things from his followers, as Christinity got distorted from top to the bottom in his absence.

 

[Isa_Almisry]

I just showed you what actually had happened by connecting the dots in the historical/religious data availabe to us.

If this you found “diatribe” and “an odd mix of Islam and Marxism” then this is either a coincidence or perhaps it has to do with your preconcieved attitude.

But the FACT of history, remains as is.

You haven’t provided any data, let alone connect any “dots.”

yes, the FACT of history, remains as is.

You are wrong here. By the time Christianity was adopted by Roman Empire, it was not really mighty. I suggest you to re-read the history of that period.

I have, with one of the most eminent historians of the period, Prof. Waler Kaegi. He wrote a good account of the Arab conquests, btw.
A picture is worth a thousand words:



Still a good size empire at the time of the adoption of Christianity as the state Church.

Up until Galerius period persecution of Christians was continued.

It was him who in about 300, officially put an end to the persecution of Christians and then Constantine “legalised” Christianity in 313 as per the so called Edict of Milan.

Then came Julian, who seved as the sole Emperor for mere two years, was a Christian by baptism years before, but no longer considered himself a Christian.

In his period the restriction and persecution of paganism (which was introduced by his predecessors Constantine I, II and others came to an end). But surprisngly (for your information) he enforced similar restrictions and unofficial persecution of Christians/Christianity.

After his death, Jovian, an army officer became emporer, as Julian was childless. He is considered a Christian himself but very little is known of his beliefs and it was he, who restored the privilages of Christinaty (for whatever political reasons he had)… as the Epire was in great turmoil.

By this time Christianity was completely lawless and paganized and was not a threat to the rulers, as it was limited to the caves or churches.

The Emperor Theodosius found out otherwise:
It is worth noting that in 390 Ambrose had excommunicated Theodosius, who had recently ordered the massacre of 7,000 inhabitants of Thessalonica[17], in response to the assassination of his military governor stationed in the city, and that Theodosius performed several months of public penance.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theodosius_I
Such examples could be multiplied many times over.

If Buddhaism was introduced instead of Christianity in Roman Empire, this too could have spread rapidly even on a larger scale, as this too pose no threat to the ruling class.

Budhdhism was introduced into the Roman empire. It had spread to neighboring Iran: the Abbasids viziers,the Barmakids, were formerly a family of Budhdhist priests. It didn’t catch on in Rome. I’ll ignore the unsubstantiated semi-Marxist dribble.

The bottom line is, so long as your belief/creed/religion is limited from your home to the place of your worship, it can grow even under the patronage of ruling body who do not share your beliefs/creed at all.

Here you must make note of this fact that:

What in fact Jesus taught is one thing

and

what you all Christians believe, teach, preach and attribute to Jesus from your own is (almost) totally another.

Then what did He teach? as almost all the data is from Christian sources. Yes, there are some pagan sources and some Jewish, and they agree with the Christian sources (you are a Jew , you should know that).

Thus Jesus is free from what you ascribe to him from your own and preach in his name.

Then produce some teaching in His name, that you can prove is from Him.

You may repeat and assume whole life that “we believe in Jesus and follow him” but in fact you may be following something which Jesus never taught you or never expected such things from his followers, as Christinity got distorted from top to the bottom in his absence.

All the information from Christ’s time up until Muhammad is unanimous. Only with Muhammad do you get a new story. But as Jew you think Muhammad is a liar, no? After all he lied about the Jews, the Torah and the corruption of the latter by the former, no?

 

[Angelos]

Harun, please be a nice “moderate Jew” and answer my questions.

Don’t you think the way you “Jews” and we Christians teach about father Abraham is a significant point we have in common?

I wonder if you, as a moderate Jew, interpret the promises given to Father Abraham in the Torah like the rest of the Jews?

 

[Angelos]

Further Mr. Aaron I think it would help your cause the most if you shared what you believed and what questions you have.

The form you take of attacking Christianity doesn’t serve your purpose.

I have mentioned this before that you say you don’t even know fully what Judaism teaches yet you pretend to know and understand our faith.

No one here is belittling Judaism in the manner you try unsuccessfully to belittle Christianity. Practice Charity and perhaps you will see people more willing to dialogue with you.

Aaronjo has no equivalent on this forum or on our planet. He is the first and last “Jew” I have ever met who regards a pagan poet of the desert as a “prophet”, knows almost nothing about Judaism, claims to know a lot about Christianity, needs time to check Jewish and anti-Christian websites to answer our questions, and tries to degrade Christianity for the sake of Islam. LOL

 

[oneGODoneCHURCH]

He never will answer you. He is a moderate Jew. Which to Aaron means I know nothing about Judaism. I know the word Torah and the Prophets that is it. If you ask me the names of the Books in the Torah I couldn’t tell you cause I have never read it.

Yes I have noticed that even when he answers part of a posted Question he will not even acknowledge question about Jewish beliefs or Practices. Makes one wonder if he even know anything about Jewish beliefs other that the First 5 books of the Old Testament. I also found it funny that he made reference to naming the rest of the Torah when if I am correct the Torah only consist of the 5 books?

aaronjo: I have great love and respect for my Jewish brethren. I will never attack or degrade them. I pray for them as I see Jesus as the messiah that they have so long awaited and did not recognize. I do not think you realize that the whole of Christianity is found as fulfillment of of what was promised by the Prophets of the Old Testament.

 

[aaronjo]

Quote:
Originally Posted by aaronjo
They did not reject their Jewish heritage? If so then they indeed were not Catholic, as Catholics have been killing Jews for centuries because in their mind, Jews killed Christians’ God-Man.

In reply to my question, you are qouting the following verses:

**
Matthew 26:53-4
3 Do you think that I cannot call upon my Father and he will not provide me at this moment with more than twelve legions of angels?
54 But then how would the scriptures be fulfilled which say that it must come to pass in this way? —NAB"**

This referring to my question is meaningless because of the following reasons.

As per a Vatican’s Bible,

“This [Mark’s Gospel] shortest of all New Testament gospels is likely the first to have been written, yet it often tells of Jesus’ ministry in more detail than either Matthew or Luke (for example, the miracle stories at Mark 5:1-20 or Mark 9:14-29). It recounts what Jesus did in a vivid style, where one incident follows directly upon another. In this almost breathless narrative, Mark stresses Jesus’ message about the kingdom of God now breaking into human life as good news (Mark 1:14-15) and Jesus himself as the gospel of God (Mark 1:1; 8:35; 10:29).”
vatican.va/archive/ENG0839/__PW2.HTM

In other words , Mark knew more than what Matthew is writing about. ( Did Mattthew wrote his gospel by copying Mark’s gospel? This is an another interesting question for scholars/historians.)

Now lets see whether Mark, while talking about the same incident (of arrest of Jesus) is also qouting the same or similar words of Jesus, as qouted by Matthew in Chapter 26: verses 53-54:

**Mark 14:

43 Then, while he was still speaking, Judas, one of the Twelve, arrived, accompanied by a crowd with swords and clubs who had come from the chief priests, the scribes, and the elders.
44 His betrayer had arranged a signal with them, saying, “The man I shall kiss is the one; arrest him and lead him away securely.”
45 He came and immediately went over to him and said, “Rabbi.” And he kissed him.
46 At this they laid hands on him and arrested him.
47 One of the bystanders drew his sword, struck the high priest’s servant, and cut off his ear.
48 Jesus said to them in reply, “Have you come out as against a robber, with swords and clubs, to seize me?
49 Day after day I was with you teaching in the temple area, yet you did not arrest me; but that the scriptures may be fulfilled.”
50 And they all left him and fled. **

See, there is no mentioning at all of what Matthew is qouting as the words of Jesus in Matthew 26:53-4. This may be either an another LATER INTERPOLATION or Matthews ’ own insertion due to someone else instructions or his own will, in order to make his own gospel more spicey/distinct than Mark’s.

Here you may ask how about Mark’s qoute of Jesus saying “that the scriptures may be fulfilled.”?

I would say “scriptures may be fulfilled” does not necessarily mean Jesus is referring to a specific verse from the Holy Scriptures. It may means as “let whatever G_d had intended or intending come to pass…I leave the matter in the hands of G_d…I am just a man and tried my best…now it is upto G_d”. As this is what scriptures teaches because man knows nothng about the future. We are here just make an effort…