Kimberley Hanh vs. Fr. John Hardon + Cradle Catholics

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At one board meeting Hahn disagreed with Fr. Hardon when he urged NACHE to oppose diocesan guidelines.** He pointed out that, as a recent convert, she lacked the historical perspective to understand the problems many homeschoolers were facing with their bishops. It was a decisive conflict. From that point on, the board no longer consulted Fr. Hardon although he continued to be listed as their spiritual adviser**. At a retreat I attended for Marian Catechists in 1999, Father responded to several questions about problems in the homeschooling movement. He said NACHE no longer sought his spiritual direction. When asked why he did not withdraw his name from the group he replied, “That’s not the Jesuit way”

here is the link to the entire article.

google.com/search?hl=en&ie=ISO-8859-1&q=Kimberley+Hahn+forces+Fr.+Hardon+out&btnG=Google+Search

There is also the matter of promoting protestant texts for Catholic homeschoolers while abandoning or ignoring Catholic texts.

members.tripod.com/~catholic_homeschool/divided.html

While converts are always welcomed they are not universally trustworthy and they should not supplant as authorities Orthodox Cradle Catholics.
 
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Catholicguy:
While converts are always welcomed they are not universally trustworthy and they should not supplant as authorities Orthodox Cradle Catholics.
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Yeah, I’m sympathetic with your conclusion here. As a recent convert myself, I would rather stand on the shoulders of giants anyday. And I have no doubt that standing on the shoulders of the great John Hardon, SJ would have me seeing farther than the shoulders of either Hahn would.

Thanks for pointing this out. Prior to our conversion, my wife and I had settled on homeshooling from K-8th, at least. So, it’s very helpful to hear things like this.
 
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Catholicguy:
At one board meeting Hahn disagreed with Fr. Hardon when he urged NACHE to oppose diocesan guidelines.
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What are you talking about? I haven’t a clue.
 
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Catholicguy:
… While converts are always welcomed they are not universally trustworthy and they should not supplant as authorities Orthodox Cradle Catholics.
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What?

I suppose Orthodox Cradle Catholics are universally trustworthy?
 
What are you talking about? I haven’t a clue

*Click on the link - it is a clue for free :)🙂 *
 
What? This is wrong in so many ways.

Well,then tell me two ways how it is wrong.

I suppose Orthodox Cradle Catholics are universally trustworthy

Until proven otherwise, absolutely.
 
Yeah, I’m sympathetic with your conclusion here. As a recent convert myself, I would rather stand on the shoulders of giants anyday. And I have no doubt that standing on the shoulders of the great John Hardon, SJ would have me seeing farther than the shoulders of either Hahn would.

Thanks for pointing this out. Prior to our conversion, my wife and I had settled on homeshooling from K-8th, at least. So, it’s very helpful to hear things like this

You’re welcome and welcome to the Faith. Me Bride is also a convert…and so is our Pastor…and so are many others in our Parish.
And congrats on your home-schooling decision. You are role-models for others. The Domestic Church, imo, is crucial to preserving the Faith. I have no confidence in our American Bishops.
 
:confused: I have no idea if these allegations are true. It seems from the google search which lists other articles along the same lines as well, that there is a group of catholics that just don’t like the Hahn’s (dare I say HATE?) or today’s N.O. church. Here’s a link that came up with that google search ( google.com/search?hl=en&ie=UTF-8&q=Kimberly+Hahn+forces+Fr.+Hardon+out&spell=1 ) linking to lots of very negative articles about how evil the Pope is and how we people of the N.O. church are so stupid (everyone’s labeled a neo-con)
kensmen.com/catholic/offsiteessays.html

For all I know there are reasons to be leary of the Hahn’s but I wouldn’t necessarily take the word of a web site as Gospel truth. Have you tried contacting Mrs. Hahn or Fr. Hardon for a real response? I think you should try that before posting more conjecture, and perhaps further slandering someone.

Jennifer
 
Stand on the shoulders of such orthodox cradle Catholic giants such as John Henry Newman. . .:ehh:
 
I’m not sure I understand all the issues here but this statement in the article really bothered me.

***Mrs. Hahn insisting that he did not grasp the gravity of the situation and - using a popular Planned Parenthood slogan -said, “We must build bridges with our bishops.” * **

This is unnecessarily insulting as if to imply that Mrs. Hahn is somehow on the same level as Planned Parenthood.
 
I think the article was rather poorly written.

I couldn’t follow who was on what side. The diocese promoted a liberal sex-ed program and K. Hahn supported it? And Fr. Hardon opposed it? Or wait Fr. Hardon helped write it. No wait NACHE rejected it, but TORCH accepted it?

Can someone clarify this?
 
Jennifer J said:
:confused: I have no idea if these allegations are true. It seems from the google search which lists other articles along the same lines as well, that there is a group of catholics that just don’t like the Hahn’s (dare I say HATE?) or today’s N.O. church. Here’s a link that came up with that google search ( google.com/search?hl=en&ie=UTF-8&q=Kimberly+Hahn+forces+Fr.+Hardon+out&spell=1 ) linking to lots of very negative articles about how evil the Pope is and how we people of the N.O. church are so stupid (everyone’s labeled a neo-con)
kensmen.com/catholic/offsiteessays.html

For all I know there are reasons to be leary of the Hahn’s but I wouldn’t necessarily take the word of a web site as Gospel truth. Have you tried contacting Mrs. Hahn or Fr. Hardon for a real response? I think you should try that before posting more conjecture, and perhaps further slandering someone.

Jennifer
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I’d like to echo Jennifer’s thoughts. Everytime you hear criticism of the Hahn’s or other converts who are doing good work getting Catholics knowledgable and excited about their faith, that criticism can usually be traced to a group or individuals that appear to be jealous and resentful of their influence. They seem to think that these converts are “Protestantizing” and watering down the Faith, so as a result they take every opportunity to jump on them and attack them. Not that anyone is above reproach, of course, but there seems to be a deeper animus against their obvious popularity and influence, than against anything they actually do or say. I, for one, think the Hahn’s and others like them(plus the New Apologists such as the ones who run this site), have done more to revitalize the Church here in the US, than any other single group in the Church today.
 
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Prometheum_x:
Stand on the shoulders of such orthodox cradle Catholic giants such as John Henry Newman. . .:ehh:
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I’m sorry? “Cradle” Catholic such as Cardinal Newman? Cradle Anglican, maybe, who later turned Catholic.
 
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Magnanimity:
I’m sorry? “Cradle” Catholic such as Cardinal Newman? Cradle Anglican, maybe, who later turned Catholic.
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Yeah, I know. . . I was being sarcastic. . .
 
Brothers and sisters: I urge you, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, NOT to have factions among yourselves but all to be in agreement in what you profess - so that you are perfectly united in your beliefs and judgments. From what (I have been reading in this thread) it’s clear that there are serious differences among you. what I mean is this: everyone one of you is declaring (I belong to Hardon), or I belong to (the Hahns), or (I belong to the ‘_______’), or “I belong to Christ”. What then? Has Christ been split up? Was it (Hardon) that was crucified for you, or was it in (Hahn’s) name that you were baptized?

Sound familiar? It’s from 1 Cor 1:11-13, slightly emended.
Really now. Fr. Hardon - from all that can be externally discerned is a devout Roman Catholic, loyal to the Magisterium. So are the Hahns. So are converts (else they are not REALLY converted ARE they???). There are different styles for the different gifts God has given us (reread 1 Cor 12-14), but all springing from the one Holy Spirit - who is the Father’s Love for the Son AND the Son’s Love for the Father. And Jesus both prayed and commanded that we, too, be one with each other - by being one with Him and His Dad in their Holy Spirit.

As for “cradle Catholics” being more trustworthy, devout or qualified than converts, remember that NONE of the Apostles were “cradle Catholics”. They were ALL converts!!! And regarding the claim that tenure in the Church overrides the action of the Holy Spirit, read more of St. Paul’s words, especially where he specifically addressed that issue.

Here in my diocese, it is more often the case that “cradle Catholics” are grossly ignorant of the Catholic Faith and that converts - because they are required by the Church to actually learn something about it - may often be more knowledgeable.
Yet I do not give blanket condemnation nor praise to either.
 
. Have you tried contacting Mrs. Hahn or Fr. Hardon for a real response? I think you should try that before posting more conjecture, and perhaps further slandering someone.

I first read about this in “The Wanderer.” They carried a series of articles and Fr. John Hardon was quoted. It happened as was summarised in the link I posted.

But, then again, the oldest Catholic Newspaper in America was prolly just lying slandering and getting Fr. Hardon to cooperate in the slander
 
Meanwhile,** Fr. Hardon**** added his own comments. "I have not been privy to the forming of any international association for homeschoolers," said Fr. John Hardon in a telephone interview. ****"In fact, you may say that I am not consulted by the NACHE board. You may also say I was even told by NACHE and the bishop’s committee (National Council of Catholic Bishops), that ****I was not to be included **in their private meetings to discuss homeschool concerns."

…

"It seems I still have some use as a mascot. They told me I’m only their spiritual advisor,"** he commented wryly. ****“They reminded me I’m not on the NACHE board, and they said only the NACHE board could be at the bishop’s meeting. You know, I helped them found that organization but they voted me off the board. That was a decision these so-called Catholics made among themselves years ago.” **

**When questioned why he remains the group’s spiritual advisor if his counsels are ignored and/or disregarded, Fr. Hardon replied, “I have a mission from the Holy See to catechize parents and to work with homeschoolers. I still hope to be of some influence to NACHE.” **
members.tripod.com/~catholic_homeschool/hierarc.html#hardon
 
Stand on the shoulders of such orthodox cradle Catholic giants such as John Henry Newman.

I don’t recall Card Newman agitating to demote a respected orthodox clergyman from his papally-directed role as a spiritual advisor to Catholic Parents.

Refresh my memory.
 
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Fidelis:
I’d like to echo Jennifer’s thoughts. Everytime you hear criticism of the Hahn’s or other converts who are doing good work getting Catholics knowledgable and excited about their faith, that criticism can usually be traced to a group or individuals that appear to be jealous and resentful of their influence. They seem to think that these converts are “Protestantizing” and watering down the Faith, so as a result they take every opportunity to jump on them and attack them. Not that anyone is above reproach, of course, but there seems to be a deeper animus against their obvious popularity and influence, than against anything they actually do or say. I, for one, think the Hahn’s and others like them(plus the New Apologists such as the ones who run this site), have done more to revitalize the Church here in the US, than any other single group in the Church today.
Click to expand...
I agree. 👍 This is a very confusing post, but it sounds as if the the Hahn’s are being unjustly criticized. And the original comment about orthodox Catholics versus convert Catholics is plainly insulting (and this coming from a cradle Catholic).
 
  • And the original comment about orthodox Catholics versus convert Catholics is plainly insulting (and this coming from a cradle Catholic).*
A convert has already weighed-in in agreement with the statement you find insulting. Point out for me the insult. It wasn’t an inssult nor was it intended to be one.
 
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