KofC -- Is it worth joining?

[MHalsey]

I realize this thread is slightly older, but I just had to post because I just received my 1st degree on Tuesday and my 2nd degree on Wednesday (yesterday) and I am really excited. It’s quite interesting too, because I’m in the Los Crusados council (#1990), and the mascot of my elementary school was the St. James Crusaders, and the mascot of my high school was the Bishop Montgomery Knights. Go figure

Anyways, I had some concerns before because I’m 23, I’m single, and just finished college (I think I’m the youngest Knight in my council). It was kind of intimidating at first, because pretty much most of the active members I’ve met are married with young kids, and from what I’ve heard most of the membership as a whole are in their 70’s and 80’s. But it’s been a good experience thus far: I realized there was so much I could learn from being around older men, learning from their stories, getting career advice, getting marriage/parenting advice advice (I don’t even know if marriage is my vocation yet, but I suppose it’s good knowledge anyways) , and just learning about what it means to be a good (Catholic) man. I have been reading a lot of different books on masculinity and manhood over the past couple years (John Eldredge is a good author), which basically say that our mainstream society right now isn’t conducive to and doesn’t respect or understand the “masculine journey.” And my recent personal observations and experiences at college definitely reflect that: a lot of the guys I met and knew have not “grown up” as men cough see dating norms now cough . Long story short, I think it’s definitely worth joining at any (eligible) age, because all men are somewhere on the path, and having the support of brother Knights can only help all of us become better men and better servants of God and our neighbors.

I’m really excited to begin working on some of the service programs my council does. I’ve also talked with some of the guys about sponsoring a Columbian Squires Circle, because I really do feel that younger men do need that experience of being with older men.

Welcome!! Yes, there are quite a few older gentlemen in the Knights of Columbus, but get to know them and you’ll find that many have been knights for like 30 or 40 years. That means they joined when they were in their 20s and 30s. Just think, some day you’ll be one of the older knights who always seems to be everywhere doing everything.

 

[duskyjewel]

1. How faithful is it to the Faith?

I suppose this depends upon where you live. Many in this thread have stated that it is 100% faithful to the Church. However, just last year, my father traveled to CA to see his friend’s “promotion” ceremony in the Knights of Columbus. This friend is openly and actively gay. My DH and I have wondered many times how that could be possible… My Dad told me about it because I am Catholic (he’s not), thinking I would be interested. Horrified is more like it.

 

[vocatio]

dusky

The Organization is orthodox Catholic. Not necessarily the members. That should go without saying. I assume you already know that, but just in case someone sees this remark I thought I’d throw a defense for the Organization as a whole. Fr. McGivney, founder, is being considered for canonization as we speak. Read up on the history and you’ll see why the organization was created to begin with. If you join you’ll get the “spill” on the history.

There are older Catholic men, some who know and understand someone their faith, but there are many that don’t. We’re trying to educate the men so that they can be strong in their faith for their families and themselves.

 

[Greg72]

I suppose this depends upon where you live. Many in this thread have stated that it is 100% faithful to the Church.

It is, despite how some of its members might behave (though in my experience, any bad-behaviour doesn’t include doubting or contradicting Church teaching).

However, just last year, my father traveled to CA to see his friend’s “promotion” ceremony in the Knights of Columbus. This friend is openly and actively gay. My DH and I have wondered many times how that could be possible… My Dad told me about it because I am Catholic (he’s not), thinking I would be interested. Horrified is more like it.

There are a couple of things that don’t sound right about this situation.

1. A practicing homosexual can’t be a practical Catholic, therefore shouldn’t be accepted into the KofC.
2. I don’t know what your father means by a “promotion ceremony”, but the degrees aren’t open to the public.

You are right to be horrified about this story, but I wouldn’t be too quick to believe it. Besides, even if it was true, it wouldn’t represent the organization at all.

 

[Maverick]

Well I am a converted Catholic, joined K of C a few years ago. The members of my chapter are mostly older, in their 60’s and up, but I’m no spring chicken myself.

I got my life insurance through the Knights, which I am very happy with, saved me money over what I was paying before for this insurance.

Problem I have with Knights is that I am rather shy and don’t really like talking before groups, etc. So I have gone to a few meetings but just sit and listen, sometimes someone talks to me. But it is hard to get incentive to go after sitting at my desk all day at work, to go and sit at a meeting for over an hour.

I think what the Knights needs to do is to get more speakers, films, etc to make the meetings more interesting, even to those who don’t like to talk. Rather than just repeatedly having speakers and officers going over the boring stuff like exactly how much money the chapter has in the bank, and the minutes of the last meeting.

 

[Leopard]

…I don’t know what your father means by a “promotion ceremony”, but the degrees aren’t open to the public…

Correct, but they are open to other Knights who are advanced at least to that Degree, so if the earlier poster’s father was a Knight, he may have attended. It is also possible the earlier poster’s father may have been speaking of an installation ceremony for Council or Assembly officers, which may be open to guests.

You are correct, though, about the conflict between being an active homosexual and being a practical Catholic. A Catholic man with homosexual tendencies who was trying to live chastely, and who may even sometimes fail, but who uses the Sacrament of Reconciliation and keeps trying should be considered a practical Catholic, though, and should not be refused membership or serving as an officer in the Knights of Columbus unless there is some possibility of public scandal.

 

[Phemie]

It is, despite how some of its members might behave (though in my experience, any bad-behaviour doesn’t include doubting or contradicting Church teaching).

You’re right, it’s only as orthodox as its members and chaplain make it. In our council a young man living common-law has been elected to an officer position. Some of the older and most active members were very offended and stopped attending meetings and having anything to do with the council. This upset the chaplain greatly, he didn’t see anything wrong with the election of this man. Said chaplain is anything but orthodox.

 

[Greg72]

Correct, but they are open to other Knights who are advanced at least to that Degree, so if the earlier poster’s father was a Knight, he may have attended.

His father isn’t Catholic, so he had better not be a Knight

It is also possible the earlier poster’s father may have been speaking of an installation ceremony for Council or Assembly officers, which may be open to guests.

I hadn’t thought of that. That seems more likely.

You are correct, though, about the conflict between being an active homosexual and being a practical Catholic. A Catholic man with homosexual tendencies who was trying to live chastely, and who may even sometimes fail, but who uses the Sacrament of Reconciliation and keeps trying should be considered a practical Catholic, though, and should not be refused membership or serving as an officer in the Knights of Columbus unless there is some possibility of public scandal.

Absolutely!
Those who suffer from same-sex attraction have a huge cross to bear and can be inspirations to us all. If they recognize it as a cross to bear (rather than an excuse to sin) and do not give in easily to temptation, then there is no reason to think that they are any worse than the rest of us sinners.

The problem, as you note, is one of possible scandal. It’s one thing for someone to struggle with sinful tendencies, to mess up once in a while and come before the Lord with regret and humility. It’s quite another to be a loud and proud, parade-marching, club-hopping homosexual.

His father’s friend is descibed as “openly and actively gay”. Such a one would almost certainly lean more toward the latter and be unfit for membership.

 

[Greg72]

You’re right, it’s only as orthodox as its members and chaplain make it.

Actually, I maintain that the KofC, like the Church Herself, is an orthodox organization, regardless of its members (of course, too many bad members would make it hard to see it as such).

In our council a young man living common-law has been elected to an officer position. Some of the older and most active members were very offended and stopped attending meetings and having anything to do with the council. This upset the chaplain greatly, he didn’t see anything wrong with the election of this man. Said chaplain is anything but orthodox.

That is disgraceful.
I don’t blame the older, active members for leaving. I’m sure that there are other councils that would love to have them.

They should, however, lodge a complaint with the Knights of Columbus (State Council I believe?) about their old council. There are people who will come down to look into anything strange and see that it’s corrected. The Knights of Columbus has standards that must be maintained and nobody has the right to ignore them.

 

[Phemie]

Actually, I maintain that the KofC, like the Church Herself, is an orthodox organization, regardless of its members (of course, too many bad members would make it hard to see it as such).

That is disgraceful.
I don’t blame the older, active members for leaving. I’m sure that there are other councils that would love to have them.

They should, however, lodge a complaint with the Knights of Columbus (State Council I believe?) about their old council. There are people who will come down to look into anything strange and see that it’s corrected. The Knights of Columbus has standards that must be maintained and nobody has the right to ignore them.

No other council around so that wasn’t an option. The young man has since married so things have settled down. I see a push to establish a council in a neighboring community where most of the couples are living common law (i.e. only 2 marriages but 40+ baptisms for children of unmarried parents). I think it’s ridiculous to establish a council when most members won’t meet the basic criteria for membership.