La Leche League

[Sparky]

So…what you do…is start a la leche group for your parish, and say it’s going to have a Catholic focus. You can have your own group for Catholics. If you’re starting a private group, I don’t see why you have to offer it to CAtholic moms outside your parish (though you could get word to neighboring parishes about it). Make a Catholic breast-feeding group that focuses on Our Lady.

I know if I had such a group, I would have been there. I did breastfeed my son until he was 14 months old. My only beef with LaLache (and its the only one) is that they seemed to guilt you if you didn’t breastfeed for 2 or more years. For me, 14 months was the right time. I didn’t continue meetings after 1 visit because the attitude was just too much.

But had it been a Catholic only meeting, I would have been there in a quick second.
–Ann

 

[SAHMVicki]

I had no idea LLL was originally founded by Catholics! Sadly the group here is filled with liberal tree huggers who are anything but supportive of the Catholic faith (or any faith actually). I wish threre was a breastfeeding support group at my parish – so I could get some ideas how to convince my 27 month old that it’s finally time to STOP nursing!

 

[spacecadet]

you know this thread got me thinking…maybe we should start a Catholic group

 

[TAS2000]

Not to hijack the thread or anything, but I’m glad you weren’t offended spacecadet. It is just that if I read your statement as saying God likes breast feeding better than bottle, others might as well.

I agree with other posters who pointed out that there are no difinitive answers to say that kids turn out better or worse in the long run over one single issue like how they were fed as infants. It is a combination of things like environment, quality of parenting and parental involment, role models, etc. When people come on so strong insisting that breast is the ONLY way to go, it just puts others on the defensive. Breast is ONE way to go, and to speculate that others are doing less than they should because they choose another route is judging unfairly. I would gladly give up breast feeding (and have) so that I can work in a job that lets us live in a house in a nice neighborhood, as opposed to the house we were living in where I’d fear that my husband would get shot on our lawn. (At least it was brick so chances of a stray bullet going through the wall and killing my daughter while she watched TV, like we heard on the news last night, were slim.) And even if I choose it simply because it was more convienient doesn’t make it wrong, either. Or make me selfish. It simply isn’t that critical of an issue.

 

[spacecadet]

well certainly your situation is quite different from mine. my profession is not high paying so going back to work would mean a loss of money since i would have to switch to disposable diapers, store bought baby food, formula, and then add in child care. and certainly the safety of your child is a factor in your decision so that weighs very heavy, as it should.

TAS2000:

It simply isn’t that critical of an issue.

here is where i do disagree though. it COULD be critical, but there is no way to know ahead of time. it is certainly very critical for 3rd world children that are dying of diarrheal infections due to drinking formula mixed with contaminated water. in our country it isn’t as critical but it could be critical. one mother could formula feed a child that doesn’t end up being prone to the risks of formula feeding and another mother could formula feed a child that ends up with lukemia, etc. that may have been prevented by breast milk. and yes i know sometimes breastfed children end up with lukemia, but i’d sure hate to have to ask myself would this have happened if i had breastfed.

i am not trying to attack you or make you feel bad, but they are different and breast is clearly better for the child. i understand that there are a variety of reasons that woman don’t breastfeed but that doesn’t mean we should pretend formula is as good as breastmilk for the child.

 

[spacecadet]

That being said, has anyone considered how when you are a nursing mother and received communion, you are passing on the body and blood of Christ to your child? Does the Church have any teaching on this? It is something I always thought about when I was preganat and when I was nursing.

i have wondered this too…anyone else???

 

[TAS2000]

i’d sure hate to have to ask myself would this have happened if i had breastfed.

Wow! Talk about confusing the issue! What does this have to do with anything? ANYTIME something goes wrong, it is human nature to say, “If only I’d done/not done this.” If little Jimmy rides his new bike into the street and gets hit by a car you’d say if only I hadn’t bought that bike, or if only I’d been standing closer. It is a useless arguement.

Then you bring up contaminated water? And 3rd world contries? It is my understanding that most thrid world countries breast feed simply because formula isn’t widely available. And if you use contaminated water, that has NOTHING to do with this topic. It isn’t the formula that is bad, it is the water. Try to stay focused.

Virtually the entire baby boomer generation was bottle fed and they are widely regarded as the healthiest generation ever, live longer, etc. Do I think that was solely because they were bottle fed? NO! I said that breast vs. bottle is not critical and it isn’t. It is ONE factor amoung MANY that will be made over the course of the child’s life, and there is not one study anywhere that can definatively say that all children will get X because they were fed formula. Isolated cases do not prove a point anymore than little Jimmy getting hit by a car.

To imply that this is the end-all decision about how your child will turn out is ludicrus. And to think that only the direst of reasons is adequate for someone to choose a perfectly good alternative rather than your choice is hubris.

 

[spacecadet]

TAS2000:

Then you bring up contaminated water? And 3rd world contries? It is my understanding that most thrid world countries breast feed simply because formula isn’t widely available. And if you use contaminated water, that has NOTHING to do with this topic. It isn’t the formula that is bad, it is the water. Try to stay focused…

it is the formula companies that are going into third world countries and pushing formula on moms and they end up mixing it with contaminated water so i see that as formula being the problem and further more i see giving money to forumla companies that do that (Nestle) as contributing to it

To imply that this is the end-all decision about how your child will turn out is ludicrus. And to think that only the direst of reasons is adequate for someone to choose a perfectly good alternative rather than your choice is hubris.

you totally missed my point. i said it could be critical, but it isn’t always. let’s try another example. baby girl isn’t bottle fed. baby girl grows up and chooses not to bottle feed. that woman is now in a higher risk (twice over) for breat cancer. she may not get breast cancer (which would be wonderful) but if she does how can a person not say “i wonder if i had been breastfed or if i had breastfed if i would have gotten breast cancer” in my teen years when i was stupid and rebelious i was a smoker. i know if i ever get lung cancer i will say, i wonder if i had neverd smoked if i would have gotten lung cancer/if my parents hadn’t smoked around me would i have gotten lung cancer. I hope and pray i never do but THE CHOICES WE MAKE do sometimes have consequences. Yes there are many healthy people that were fed formula but you don’t know if that will be your child or not.

 

[TAS2000]

I think you totally missed my point. If a woman gets breast cancer, it COULD be because she was breast fed. Or it could have been that she lived down the road from a plant dumping harmful chemicals in the water. Or it could be caused by plastic decomposing in the landfills. Or by years of working in front of a computer terminal that was leaking radiation. All I am saying is that it is just ONE factor amoung many. We can’t know, and unless you want to live in a bubble (which will probably be found to cause something that is bad for you) then you can’t avoid every possible factor. Yes, we can try to do what we think is best, but no one single factor is that critical, or we won’t know it was until it is too late anyway.

Yes there are many healthy people that were fed formula but you don’t know if that will be your child or not.

And there are many people who were breast fed that that are healthy, and not. That is the whole point. It isn’t the one single deciding factor. And if you listen to the “experts” and “studies” you will surely screw up somewhere. “Experts” told us to use asbestos in everything to make it safer for us. Later other “experts” discovered it was bad. I could probably list a dozen expert opinions that have since been found to be untrue at best, and actually harmful in many cases, without even thinking hard about it. All we can do is try the best we can, and NO ONE has the ability to say what far reaching consequences each decision will have until after it happens. And unless you are talking about a decision to jump off a cliff or not, then no single choice is that essential to the overall outcome of a child.

 

[spacecadet]

All we can do is try the best we can

Finally something we agree on
As for the rest we just have to agree to disagree. I know from other threads that we have very different views on parenting and that’s ok.

 

[TAS2000]

Yep. Agree to disagree? Sure! I don’t expect everyone to think as I do. That’d be boring. And then who would I have to argue with?

Frankly, I do agree that it would be better if there was more of a support system for breast feeding in this culture. I had a hard time with #1 when I tried it. I only knew one other mom who breast fed, and she was very far away. Also, it seems that the only way to get “help” is to go to a group or consultant. That can cost money, and/or be less than comfortable for a woman to discuss with strangers. And unfortunately, as you may have guessed, I have been “turned off” by what I tend to regard as extremists who spout a Breast Feeding partyline about how anyone can breast feed, and everyone should, and it is natural, and imply or even outright state that you are a horrible person if you don’t. Not everyone can breast feed, and natural doesn’t mean you and your baby will both magically “know” what to do. Hence the need for the darn support system in the first place. So to my way of thinking, they do themsleves a disservice by driving people away who do need help because they make you feel stupid for not being able to do already what they are supposed to be helping you with!

 

[spacecadet]

TAS2000:

Frankly, I do agree that it would be better if there was more of a support system for breast feeding in this culture. I had a hard time with #1 when I tried it. I only knew one other mom who breast fed, and she was very far away. Also, it seems that the only way to get “help” is to go to a group or consultant. That can cost money, and/or be less than comfortable for a woman to discuss with strangers. And unfortunately, as you may have guessed, I have been “turned off” by what I tend to regard as extremists who spout a Breast Feeding partyline about how anyone can breast feed, and everyone should, and it is natural, and imply or even outright state that you are a horrible person if you don’t. Not everyone can breast feed, and natural doesn’t mean you and your baby will both magically “know” what to do. Hence the need for the darn support system in the first place. So to my way of thinking, they do themsleves a disservice by driving people away who do need help because they make you feel stupid for not being able to do already what they are supposed to be helping you with!

I totally agree. Our culture does not support it or women enough. I STRUGGLED for 6 weeks. My hospital has a weekly meeting run by lactation consultants and that saved us. That and they also allowed me 3 free follow up visits. They are one of the few UNICEF baby friendly hospitals. If it hadn’t been for them we’d never had made it. I do want to help others and have thought about becoming a Lac. Consultant. I personally don’t like LLL because I think they seem to turn off working moms who need the support the most and as someone above posted moms who wean before two. THat is why I like the hospital group because they help everyone.

 

[manualman]

While I agree that it isn’t usually a life or death decision, I would also say it rises rather above the Healthtex vs. Carters PJ’s dilemma that you seem to imply it resides at.

FACT: Breast milk contains some of momma’s antibodies. Formula does not. As you say, experts dispute the significance. For my money, until many generations prove otherwise, I am going to assume that GOD did a better job formulating breast milk than Nestle food chemists did on the formula.

FACT: Mothers who practice ecological breast feeding don’t get their cycle back anywhere near as fast as mom’s that bottle feed. More and more research shows that modern women have FAR more cycles in life than ever in history. This is strongly suspected to be linked to western women’s cancer rates.

Finally, those baby boomers you note ARE the first American generation to be so totally fed formula as infants. Given some of the research about the value of the bond formed between infant and mother during breastfeeding, maybe there is a link here as to why baby boomers are the most screwed up generation in history (my opinion!).

I can understand how the militant BFers turn some off. And how they can be condescending. But in fairness, they probably got to that point as a reaction against all the cultural hostility to BF.

Admittedly anecdotal, but we have two daughters. The first only got 4 weeks of BF due to my wife needing post partum meds that had an unknown effect on nursing babies. Given that her post-partum manifested largely as anxiety, the meds and BF were NOT both going to happen. That daughter has allergies, exsema (sp?) and asthma. Second daughter was BF for 13 months. Healthy as an ox. We’re convinced.

 

[maryceleste]

manualman:

Admittedly anecdotal, but we have two daughters. The first only got 4 weeks of BF due to my wife needing post partum meds that had an unknown effect on nursing babies. Given that her post-partum manifested largely as anxiety, the meds and BF were NOT both going to happen. That daughter has allergies, exsema (sp?) and asthma. Second daughter was BF for 13 months. Healthy as an ox. We’re convinced.

manualman, I’m glad that your second daughter is so healthy, and that your wife was able to breastfeed her. Just wanted to mention something, though… It’s well documented that first-born children (regardless of feeding method) are more prone to allergies than their younger sibilings. There are various theories as to why this happens. It could be related to the Mom’s body “offloading” a lifetime’s accumulated toxins into the first baby during gestation. Or it might be due to some type of overreaction by the mother’s immune system, that gets toned down in subsequent pregnancies (maybe similar to pre-eclampsia). Or the later-born babies might get exposed to more germs from older siblings, thus helping their immune systems to develop normally.

I think breastfeeding is great for babies and moms – physically, emotionally, and spiritually – but the jury is still out on whether or not it helps prevent allergies, asthma, and eczema. Many studies indicate that it does, but others indicate the opposite.

 

[bapcathluth]

I agree that choosing to breast feed isn’t life or death, but why choose man-made formula made from cow’s milk when you can get the stuff specifically designed for humans for free?

I felt such a bond while breast-feeding my babies, and I took off my post-partum weight because of the calories burned. Plus, it is so much easier once you get over the first month and the pain involved there.

I have to say that my first-born has allergies and asthma and I nursed him until he was 14 months old. Even breast fed babies can have problems.

 

[spacecadet]

It’s well documented that first-born children (regardless of feeding method) are more prone to allergies than their younger sibilings. There are various theories as to why this happens. It could be related to the Mom’s body “offloading” a lifetime’s accumulated toxins into the first baby during gestation.

i know my family is a small sample size, but…
the one sibling in my family that has the worst allergies was only BF for 1 month and she was number 4. number one has no health problems

my number one (and only so far) as no allergies, etc…still nursing at 17 months. he’s also never had an ear infection or diarreha

 

[mumto5]

Just like to offer my perspective. I have five children, none have had as much as a bottle of formula. I have been breastfeeding or pregnant or both for a solid 13.5 years and will probably be nursing close to another year before it’s all over. As far as health goes:

#1 child - chronic ear infections due to allergies. She has outgrown them now. Is allergic to penicillin. Is allergic to nickel.

#2 child - had allergies to food she has outgrown. Has life threatening allergies to penicillin and sulpha drugs, is allergic to citrus oils and perfumes. No ear problems.

#3 child - very bad eczema and ears as a baby. Very allergic to soy and peanuts. Is probably the most allergic. Came very close to being bottlefed but we stuck out three months of pain and bleeding and managed to nurse for 2.5 years in the end. It was worth it because he would probably have had much worse problems to any formulas due to allergies. Allergies are not so bad now but still there. Developed glue ear due to allergies not being diagnosed until later and had serious speech issues as a result. Overcome now after two years therapy.

#4 child - no allergies we are aware of other than an allergy to dye. No ear problems.

#5 child - no allergies, no ear problems, in fact has only been sick once in her 20 months of life.

So it’s getting better and I do have a very allergic family history as does my husband. I was very sick in early pregnancy so I don’t know if that has an impact. Children are very healthy - just had a less than ideal first year or two.

So breastfeeding, while I support it fully, is not a guarantee. I do believe though that my children would have been much worse off if bottlefed as formula contains a number of identified allergens for them. At least once the allergies were identified I could simply cut them out of my own diet. They were fine then.

 

[kaymart]

This type of talk it what led to so much guilt 17 years ago for me. I tried to breast fed all three children, the first two did wonderful. #3 resisted, did not latch on, in fact he hated to be held. After several tears (and major weight loss of my baby) I had to bottle fed him from his infant seat (the only way he would take it) I never propped it always held the bottle and had to burb him by putting him across my lap (the only way he didn’t fight holding)-----I come to find out at 18 months that he was severly Autistic. On a scale of severity he is 9 1/2 even today. I endured many a tounge lashing (before it was found he was Autistic) from so many “well meaning mothers of breast fed babies” To all the young moms today, please don’t make another mom cry like I did. BTW—I pumped for year yet I would be “yelled” at for using formula! I would try to expalain and was dismissed like a moron.

 

[bapcathluth]

Yes, I agree with kaymart that some of these breastfeeding mothers are such true-believers that they become very insensitive. I breast-fed, but I don’t think it is the end of the world if somebody cannot. I was bottle-fed and I am healthy.

By the way, my son, who was breast-fed for over a year, also had repeated ear infections, glue ear, and now he has some speech problems which we are paying big money to fix!!

 

[kaymart]

bapcathluth:

Yes, I agree with kaymart that some of these breastfeeding mothers are such true-believers that they become very insensitive. I breast-fed, but I don’t think it is the end of the world if somebody cannot. I was bottle-fed and I am healthy.

By the way, my son, who was breast-fed for over a year, also had repeated ear infections, glue ear, and now he has some speech problems which we are paying big money to fix!!

Thank you