Lapsed Catholics Explain Why They Leave the Church

[Quodlibeta]

In a way, it’s like marriage. To keep it strong, we must work at it, but sometimes, it’s just beyond our saving it, and we have to leave. A weak analogy, but…

What worries me is that this seems to insinuate that individuals should decide whether or not they “like” or “enjoy” or can “self-actualize within” Catholicism; as if the matter is simply one judged by personal fulfillment. Although this may not be as shallow an excuse as many others which have been offered, I see it as being a more complex form of the same sort of thing.

If Catholicism is objective reality, then there is no sufficient reason for rejecting it; and all posited reasons must be viewed as insufficient and erroneous self-deception. If it is not objective reality, then we can speak in the way which you have been.

 

[SouthCatholic]

I recently learned that one of our parishioners has left the church. This is a 25-year old woman who had been Catholic her entire life. Her parents are very active in the Catholic church in another part of the state. She was at our parish when she moved down here for college because our priest was friends with her parents as he had at one time been the priest at her home parish. When she left our church, the only other people she knew down here were protestant and they invited her to their church.

She left, plain and simple, because our priest is E.V.I.L.

He has had problems at every church where he’s ever been assigned. He left her parents church after the conflicts between he, the parishioners, and the school staff made the newspapers and the bishop asked his order to move him. If your read the newspaper accounts of what happened at that church, you can check off the boxes of what is/has happened at ours. We have gone from having 800 to 1000 people attending the three weekend masses at our church to less than 250 weekly since he’s been here. A former parishioner’s daughter recently got married and the wedding and reception was like a Who’s Who of folks who no longer attend mass in our parish.

Our parish has gone from having 2 (at the vigil mass) to 8 (Sunday masses) altar servers per mass–with the kids rotating so the same kids were not serving every week–to 5 TOTAL altar servers. When the bishop says mass in our parish, we have to beg kids who are no longer active altar servers to serve because they FLATLY refuse to serve under him. AND LET ME BE CLEAR, there are absolutely NO suggestions that he is a sexual predator!!! Prior to his coming here, if you showed up at our parish on a Saturday during the day, you could find 20-30 kids just hanging around. Our youth group had about 50 kids. We had 100-125 kids enrolled in CCD classes. Now we have less than 25 kids enrolled in CCD. This year, we do not have a first communion class!

Parishioners–adult and children–do not like him because he has a nasty personality. The people who are still in our parish are determined to wait him out because most of us have been in the parish for generations (for example both me and my mother went to the school connected to the parish and I’m 43-years old–my mom is 72). I had lived in another state for several years. When I returned to my home state, I went to two masses at my home parish and told her I was going to another parish because I HAD NEVER–as a child nor as an adult–heard that much negativity coming from the altar. My mom had to talk me out of leaving the parish.

Despite numerous complaints to the Archbishop and his order, they have refused to move him. I understand the principle that the church is perfect but people are not. However, a priest with an anti-social personality can kill a parish as this priest is killing ours.

 

[GaryTaylor]

Uh, bad turn to the conversation. How longs it been? I’ve seen that before, they’ll move him eventually for sure. Count on it. There is no coincidence with Divine Providence.

Hang in there, helps coming, my prayers are with you.

 

[GaryTaylor]

I’ve heard it said that an excuse is “the skin of a reason, stuffed with a lie”.

I never heard this one So I guess the lie becomes the truth then.

Reminds me of Alice in Wonderland, I can’t remember, so I’ll have to paraphrase…The Well was Deep and Dark , but she had plenty of time to look around and see what was going to happen next as she fell.

 

[7_Sorrows]

I recently learned that one of our parishioners has left the church. This is a 25-year old woman who had been Catholic her entire life. Her parents are very active in the Catholic church in another part of the state. She was at our parish when she moved down here for college because our priest was friends with her parents as he had at one time been the priest at her home parish. When she left our church, the only other people she knew down here were protestant and they invited her to their church.

She left, plain and simple, because our priest is E.V.I.L.

He has had problems at every church where he’s ever been assigned. He left her parents church after the conflicts between he, the parishioners, and the school staff made the newspapers and the bishop asked his order to move him. If your read the newspaper accounts of what happened at that church, you can check off the boxes of what is/has happened at ours. We have gone from having 800 to 1000 people attending the three weekend masses at our church to less than 250 weekly since he’s been here. A former parishioner’s daughter recently got married and the wedding and reception was like a Who’s Who of folks who no longer attend mass in our parish.

Our parish has gone from having 2 (at the vigil mass) to 8 (Sunday masses) altar servers per mass–with the kids rotating so the same kids were not serving every week–to 5 TOTAL altar servers. When the bishop says mass in our parish, we have to beg kids who are no longer active altar servers to serve because they FLATLY refuse to serve under him. AND LET ME BE CLEAR, there are absolutely NO suggestions that he is a sexual predator!!! Prior to his coming here, if you showed up at our parish on a Saturday during the day, you could find 20-30 kids just hanging around. Our youth group had about 50 kids. We had 100-125 kids enrolled in CCD classes. Now we have less than 25 kids enrolled in CCD. This year, we do not have a first communion class!

Parishioners–adult and children–do not like him because he has a nasty personality. The people who are still in our parish are determined to wait him out because most of us have been in the parish for generations (for example both me and my mother went to the school connected to the parish and I’m 43-years old–my mom is 72). I had lived in another state for several years. When I returned to my home state, I went to two masses at my home parish and told her I was going to another parish because I HAD NEVER–as a child nor as an adult–heard that much negativity coming from the altar. My mom had to talk me out of leaving the parish.

Despite numerous complaints to the Archbishop and his order, they have refused to move him. I understand the principle that the church is perfect but people are not. However, a priest with an anti-social personality can kill a parish as this priest is killing ours.

i am so sorry to hear of the troublesome priest at your parish. is there an associate priest or priests? it sounds like your priest needs a lot of prayer. probably letters have been written to the bishop as well? with so much negativity coming from him, i can see why people would slowly fall away. you go to church for a sense of God, community, direction, love. my only confusion, is why they would refuse to move him. is he close to retirement perhaps? does he have family in the area? i woud suggest to continue praying for the priest or maybe even ask for a meeting with him.

 

[SouthCatholic]

Uh, bad turn to the conversation. How longs it been? I’ve seen that before, they’ll move him eventually for sure. Count on it. There is no coincidence with Divine Providence.

Hang in there, helps coming, my prayers are with you.

He’s been here 7 years.

 

[SouthCatholic]

i am so sorry to hear of the troublesome priest at your parish. is there an associate priest or priests? it sounds like your priest needs a lot of prayer. probably letters have been written to the bishop as well? with so much negativity coming from him, i can see why people would slowly fall away. you go to church for a sense of God, community, direction, love. my only confusion, is why they would refuse to move him. is he close to retirement perhaps? does he have family in the area? i woud suggest to continue praying for the priest or maybe even ask for a meeting with him.

Yes, letters have been written to both the Archbishop and the Provincial of his order. The archbishop keeps saying that he does not have the power to remove him as the parish is controlled by the order. His provincial keeps saying they don’t have anyone to send in his place. He is 60+ years old. He does not have any family in the area because his is from Ghana and most of his family is still there.

I was almost in tears one Sunday when I went into the church and there were only about 50 people there for the 10am mass. Before he came to our parish we would regularly have 400 to 500 people at that one Mass. If you did not get to the church 15 minutes early you had to park in the parking lot of the nursing home next door.

 

[7_Sorrows]

Yes, letters have been written to both the Archbishop and the Provincial of his order. The archbishop keeps saying that he does not have the power to remove him as the parish is controlled by the order. His provincial keeps saying they don’t have anyone to send in his place. He is 60+ years old. He does not have any family in the area because his is from Ghana and most of his family is still there.

I was almost in tears one Sunday when I went into the church and there were only about 50 people there for the 10am mass. Before he came to our parish we would regularly have 400 to 500 people at that one Mass. If you did not get to the church 15 minutes early you had to park in the parking lot of the nursing home next door.

that really makes me sad to think that because of this priest, so many Catholics are not coming to Mass!!! have they found other parishes to attend? how long has he been a priest? maybe he feels alienated because he is from Ghana. i don’t know where you live, but maybe he does not feel welcome in this country? we have had priests from Nigeria and the Phillipines. i am sure it must be hard. has anyone tried to speak with the priest directly?

 

[Bklynguy]

You know what triggered the trip home? A photo of our First Holy Communion.

Yes, the Eucharist is always involved in some way with bringing people back.

 

[Bklynguy]

“I am sure He will understand” also follows “God is everywhere”. The “understanding” bit I teasingly countered with: “Steal from your mother’s purse and let’s see how far she’d go to understand your thievery”.

I forgot about that one: “He will understand.” I’ve heard that one many times as well.

 

[Richard320]

youtube.com/watch?v=cGEmlPjgjVI explains a lot of it.

 

[fishergal]

2 things: First, I think those who leave the Church are not fully educated about Catholicism. Secondly, those who leave because they want better music are searching for stimulation and excitement. Sure, they may be surrounded by those who love Jesus and praise his name, but the fullness of the faith is found in the Catholic Church-through the sacraments— especially the source and summit of the faith: the Eucharist.

It does take desire and plenty of study to truly know the Church, however. She is full of traditions, oral and written, that echo the teachings of the first bishops- the apostles- who were given the authority and responsibly to spread the good news by Jesus himself.

…if those who left Holy Mother Church only knew what they were truly walking away from…

 

[GaryTaylor]

2 things: First, I think those who leave the Church are not fully educated about Catholicism. Secondly, those who leave because they want better music are searching for stimulation and excitement. Sure, they may be surrounded by those who love Jesus and praise his name, but the fullness of the faith is found in the Catholic Church-through the sacraments— especially the source and summit of the faith: the Eucharist.

It does take desire and plenty of study to truly know the Church, however. She is full of traditions, oral and written, that echo the teachings of the first bishops- the apostles- who were given the authority and responsibly to spread the good news by Jesus himself.

…if those who left Holy Mother Church only knew what they were truly walking away from…

Not so, I know individuals who attended Catholic Grammer, HS and a Catholic/Jesuit College, hold Masters and PHDs, and are lapsed Catholics.

They know the church better than I, and we often speak in depth about different ideas with much respect I might add. Ironic they often also bring up the topic in a round about way by inquiring as to what I am reading. As a general rule I won’t speak religion or politics at social gatherings unless it reluctantly becomes the topic of another. What the actual reason is one doesn’t attend church and is lapsed? The reasons are vast and difficult to pin it down.

I believe in many situations its the commandments and confession…penance. Then there are those who as you say are not educated in History/Bible/Oral and Written Tradition. Some are also educated in secular universities and reject God.

You can only be polite and have honest open dialogue when the occasion occurs. You know its the “You can bring a horse to water, but you can’t make them drink” theory.

 

[Bklynguy]

youtube.com/watch?v=cGEmlPjgjVI explains a lot of it.

lol…Protestantism in a nut shell.

 

[LegoGE1947]

lol…Protestantism in a nut shell.

Emphasis on the word “NUT” !

 

[Elizabeth502]

Secondly, those who leave because they want better music are searching for stimulation and excitement.

Whoa. Not at all! (At least, in my experience – self & others. ) Now, I have never “left the church” over the music; rather, I – and many Catholics – have searched far & wide for liturgies in which music (a) enhances the sacred presence, as opposed to detracting from it, (b) reinforces & deepens the readings of the day, emotively (c) helps to integrate, thematically and stylistically, the message of the Mass generally and specific to the feast on the calendar (d) is in itself prayerful; leads the faithful into prayer

Eph 5:19
Col 3:16

St. Augustine:

Qui enim cantat laudem, non solum laudat, sed etiam hilariter laudat; qui cantat laudem, non solum cantat, sed et amat eum quem cantat. In laude confitentis est praedicatio, in cantico amantis affectio…

For he who sings praise, does not only praise, but also praises joyfully; he who sings praise, not only sings, but also loves Him whom he is singing about/to/for. There is a praise-filled public proclamation (praedicatio) in the praise of someone who is confessing/acknowledging (God), in the song of the lover (there is) love.
And of course the Psalms themselves were sung. That is the reason for the repetition within them, including not only in a refrain but in the form of rephrasing, which is typical of lyrics which express the same thought or emotion in a variety of similar ways.

Sure, they may be surrounded by those who love Jesus and praise his name, but the fullness of the faith is found in the Catholic Church-through the sacraments— especially the source and summit of the faith: the Eucharist.

Indeed, sister! Which is why music which honors those sacraments is so important. Let’s put it this way: When I speak of Catholics searching for good music, what they are really searching for is an escape from bad music, more than some elusive search for a musical experience to replace a prayerful sacramental experience.

It does take desire and plenty of study to truly know the Church, however. She is full of traditions, oral and written, that echo the teachings of the first bishops- the apostles- who were given the authority and responsibly to spread the good news by Jesus himself.

I cannot agree more. Just remember that those sacred traditions include volumes of sacred music which spring from those teachings, those Words of Jesus, etc.

…if those who left Holy Mother Church only knew what they were truly walking away from…

Yep.

 

[Geist]

It sounds like many people want the church to revolve around them instead of the other way around.

 

[wynnejj]

The struggle for faith is always a struggle to reconcile with reason. People expect truth to be constant. The Catholic Church’s teachings have been constant, but not so its clergy and laity. Catholics are much like that old rhyme “When she was good she was very, very good… But when she was bad, she was horrid”. In our day, the lack of church attendance is directly related to the break-up of the family, and the break-up of the family is directly related to the fight over the definition of “responsible parenthood” - to contracept or not contracept. When Catholics are not constant in their faith, then people look to other alleged quests for truth - that is, science. Then men without a moral compass corrupt science by absolute denial of God in all scientific arguments. It is like saying theoretical math must govern the dialog of science without respect to physical evidence. Today, we say we say conventional wisdom must use the dialog of science without respect to the metaphysical evidence of God and His Son, Jesus. Now, there’s an irrational number for you.

 

[Ubenedictus]

He’s been here 7 years.

that is quite long. The non-diocesan with a parish i my area are transfered after 5yrs max.
Ubenedictus

 

[Ubenedictus]

that really makes me sad to think that because of this priest, so many Catholics are not coming to Mass!!! have they found other parishes to attend? how long has he been a priest? maybe he feels alienated because he is from Ghana. i don’t know where you live, but maybe he does not feel welcome in this country? we have had priests from Nigeria and the Phillipines. i am sure it must be hard. has anyone tried to speak with the priest directly?

he was probably rejected at first so he develop a sort of defence mechanism. Or im just speculating.
Ubenedictus