Laura Ingalls Wilder's name pulled from library award over 'stereotypical

  • Thread starter Thread starter Cruciferi
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
Serbia is a Western nation with Western values.
The fact that those perpetrating the genocide had evidently abandoned those values is true, even tautological. But they are still truly of a Western nation and the values there Western and Judaeo-Christian.
I think that’s a mostly reasonable assertion, but only “mostly”. Serbia is on the eastern side of the ancient Latin/Greek divide that is at least 1000 years old and has not changed much, geographically, during that time. Serbia is as “western” as Russia is, which is to say, somewhat western, but with an oriental overlay.
 
I think that’s a mostly reasonable assertion, but only “mostly”
While I agree that there are distinctions between the Christian Est and West, the key criterion in the post at issue was Judaeo-Christian. Serbia and Russia are certainly part of the tradition.
 
Last edited:
Not trying to pick a fight with you. I don’t disagree that both are Judaeo-Christian, and didn’t intend to communicate that I did. But while both Russia and Serbia have been heavily influenced by the west, they aren’t as “western” as any countries west of the historic “dividing line” between Latin Christianity and Orthodoxy.
 
40.png
7_Sorrows:
especially to the girls. i pictured myself on the prairie with her and since i grew up in Kansas i would daydream about what life was like back then. i always felt i was born in the wrong point in history - instead of 1952, i should have been born 80 years earlier!
Take no offense, but I’m sure glad I wasn’t born 80 years earlier. I would almost certainly not have survived childhood. Had what was then called “Scarlatina” with a temp that spiked at 107. But for penicillin, I’m fairly confident I would not have made it.
Believe me, i know how hard life must have been on the prairie in the 1800’s.
As you say, many medicines we have today we didn’t have back then. i had several childhood illnesses i would not have survived from being paralyzed to severe asthma.
i think i romanticized about it because most people lived on farms and families were close. the Dad was usually around.
there were no cars, but people had horse and buggies. towns were small, not so many people. if i actually lived back then i am sure it would have been a different story.
 
there were no cars, but people had horse and buggies. towns were small, not so many people. if i actually lived back then i am sure it would have been a different story.
I sometimes get puzzled by the stories.

My Italian great-grandfather (as he told it) pretty much ate nothing but polenta for several years to save his money to eventually buy a farm, which he did. My grandfather grew up on that farm. I remember him telling me that they would set off in a horse-drawn wagon before dawn to go several miles to Mass on Sunday. They would bring quite a bit of prepared food with them. The young men would drive the wagon and the women and children would all bundle up in blankets in the wagon in the winter.

They would arrive, go to Mass, then everybody there would go to the church basement with the food they had brought and have a pot luck meal. Afterward, they would all pile in the wagon again and head back home. It all took hours. But my grandfather had no complaint about it.

But it can be romanticized with some justification. In that family, everybody could play a musical instrument and they could all sing. Their entertainment was playing and singing. They had an enormous garden and canned all kinds of things. The younger women would do that work, as well as sewing, some of the gardening and cleaning. The young men did the heavy farming and some of the gardening, cutting wood. And the old folks picked things from the garden and took care of the little kids while the younger ones worked.

They said the rosary as a family every night of the world…in Italian. My Irish great-grandparents said it every night in Gaelic. My parents, who heard both, claimed it took much longer to say it in Gaelic. I can see how it might. 🙂
 
while growing up until my teen years, i loved visiting my grandfather’s farm outside a small town in Kansas. they had a cellar filled with canned fruits and vegetables. i would help my grandfather gather eggs and he would let me ride on the tractor with him for a short ways.
there was a tree stump where they used to chop off the heads of the chickens to use for cooking.
the Amish community in Kansas close to where I grew up did not use electricity and
still used horse and buggies.
 
This makes me so sad. I tackle Little House on the Prairie every semester in a unit on controversial children’s literature and we get into the ugly depictions of Native Americans included in this novel, consider how to treat them with children, etc.
Do you discuss the fact that Ingall’s were illegal immigrants in their little house?
 
But they are still truly of a Western nation and the values there Western and Judaeo-Christian.
There is also the issue of what people claim to be and what they actually are.

OTOH, you can have a society where the majority are believing Christians, but a minority is holding the power and making decisions against the beliefs of the majority.
 
There is also the issue of what people claim to be and what they actually are .

OTOH, you can have a society where the majority are believing Christians, but a minority is holding the power and making decisions against the beliefs of the majority.
Yes, but not germane to the validity of @Raxus’s remark.
 
I wonder what actress Melissa Gilbert has to say about the situation. After all, she was one of the stars of the Little House on the Prairie TV series.
 
I wonder what actress Melissa Gilbert has to say about the situation. After all, she was one of the stars of the Little House on the Prairie TV series.
i would think she would be equally shocked like the rest of us.
 
Actress Melissa Gilbert, who played Laura on the TV show “Little House on the Prairie,” wrote on Facebook: "In my research for the musical and another Laura project I’m working on I’ve found it’s true. Caroline and many others were prejudiced against native Americans and people of color because they didn’t know or experience time around them. They were also very afraid of them. The native Americans particularly because they fought brutally.

"But let’s face it. We invaded their country, slaughtered thousands of them and stole their land. They fought back.

“It’s time for us to own that.”
 
Were they also not Communist or immediately post communist though? I agree with your larger point but Yugoslavia had been steeped in communism for 50yrs before that war. Hardly fertile soil for fostering a sense of human rights.
 
Were they also not Communist or immediately post communist though? I agree with your larger point but Yugoslavia had been steeped in communism for 50yrs before that war. Hardly fertile soil for fostering a sense of human rights.
Yes. But then again, the long-term Judaeo-Christian heritage in the religion was apparently fertile ground for atheistic communism. Overall, I think that if you look at history, it is very hard to make a case that imparts some special protection against atrocity. It clearly call us to a moral life, But we are just as clearly susceptible to gross failure.
 
Last edited:
Sadly, people are potentially greedy and wish this wouldn’t happen but some people are just better @ being greedy than others But is it because wars were used to steal American Indian land or is the true meaning of this-the Whites were just better @ doing what we wanted to do 🤔. Potentially, if the Native Americans or American Indians had the better weapons and military strategies, then it would have been the other way round. Same thing with slavery-instead of Whites enslaving Blacks it would have been the opposite, because it’s just the way people sadly are potentially. Yes, treatment of American Indians or Native Americans was haughty and wars were used to take their lands, only that have found the meaning of this ends up being ‘you did what we wanted to do and more’ and this makes 1 no better than what they say to be against. Incidentally, actress MelissaE Gilbert lives in Michigan and used to have implants.

Other things-Committing atrocities such as rape, sex abuse and mutilation are bad. If a White person raped a 10 year old American Indian girl or harmed a child, then the perpetrator is a horrible person. And if an American Indian person raped a 10 year old girl or harmed a child, then the perpetrator is a horrible person. I hope that actress is not implying that she is excusing these deeds because that is a :poop: thing to excuse.

And with wars-soldiers killing eachother in a fight is 1 thing. But harming POW is bad. Bataan death march during WW2, atrocities committed against POW during the Korean War and Vietnam War (Hanoi Hilton) are bad and against Geneva Protocol. Once asked a Vietnam War veteran what he thought about enemy soldiers 🤔 He told me that if they were trying to kill him in a fight, he won’t pass judgment as it’s a war and soldiers are sent to fight for their nations whether it’s the right or wrong cause. Now however, if the enemy soldiers are going to take POW and mutilate them, then that is bad & that’s murder. Many people would not know who Sgt. Leonard George Siffleet was-the ANZAC POW who was beheaded during WW2 by the Japanese soldiers. Japanese soldiers followed Bushido code (Samurai way) and they treated POW, including American POW, Chamorro Indians in Guam, Chinese POW , Filipino POW were beheaded and bayonetted by Japanese soldiers. That is bad.
 
Last edited:
Sadly, people are potentially greedy and wish this wouldn’t happen but some people are just better @ being greedy than others But is it because wars were used to steal American Indian land
In this case, the Ingalls “settled” on Indian land prior to the land being taken by the US government.
 
Were they also not Communist or immediately post communist though? I agree with your larger point but Yugoslavia had been steeped in communism for 50yrs before that war. Hardly fertile soil for fostering a sense of human rights.
Undoubtedly living under Communism didn’t help the relationships in the former Jugoslavia. But one remembers reading that even back in Roman times, some of the fiercest legionnaires were recruited from what is now Croatia and Serbia.

The fear of Indians was real many years ago, even in my lifetime. When I was growing up, Indians were actually sort of romanticized. True, they sometimes chased the hero across deserts and even threatened the heroine. But by and large, they were heroic figures; majestic and speaking in sonorous, if broken, English.

But among older people it wasn’t so. As a little kid I used to go down to the creek below our house. the Ozarks was a primitive place then, and a lot of people didn’t have running water. We didn’t for quite awhile. But there were two old brothers; in their eighties somewhere, who used to come and dip water out of the creek to fill 55 gallon drums for their milk cows if their well went dry. They both lived on hilltops, so that happened now and then.

Anyway, I remember being told how, when they were little themselves, Indians would sometimes come up out of Oklahoma and dig some kind of mineral out of the ground about a quarter mile away, build big fires and seemingly smelt the metal or something. Might have been lead or zinc. Maybe a little silver which sometimes occurred with them. But regardless what they were doing, their family was very much afraid, and would leave the house at night and go sleep in the tall grass just in case. Back when those old gentlemen were kids, Indian wars were still very much within adult memory. And they weren’t pretty memories.

Those old brothers’ parents would have been alive during the Civil War, and the Cherokee under Stand Watie were on the Confederate side. And if a group of one of them crossed your path during that era, it might be too bad for you, no matter what side you were on.
 
Thanks for the historical perspective. During most of my early years, a lot of things, from root beer stands to motels and sports teams, were named with Indian motifs, and not in a pejorative way.
 
Aha!!! You just don’t realize the hatred and damage those names and logos perpetuated!! 😱
 
Last edited:
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top