Lay mininsters may not cleanse Communion vessels, Pope Benedict says

[Melanie01]

I am shocked out of my cotton socks over this thread,as far as i am concerned only the hands of a consecrated cleric should be handling these items…

what is the purpose of the priest in the post V2 church?

 

[TradyDaddy]

I can just hear the Mahony’s and his ilk… “yeah, … .and who’s gonna make me?”

Lip service, lip service and more lip service…

 

[netmilsmom]

You know…forget the additional donuts from my last post…I’ll just buy you some stock in Krispy Kreme.

:bigyikes::bigyikes::bigyikes:

 

[a_pilgrim]

…the priest saying Mass sits down and lets the EMHCs distribute because it’s good to have lay people ‘helping with the Liturgy’.

This, from* Redemptionis Sacramentum* (emphasis mine)…

1. Only out of true necessity is there to be recourse to the assistance of extraordinary ministers in the celebration of the Liturgy. Such recourse is not intended for the sake of a fuller participation of the laity but rather, by its very nature, is supplementary and provisional.

 

[Elzee]

Just learned that our Bishop told our priests they need to comply with the Pope’s direction and that he was extremelysupportive of the Pope’s decision.

It will be interesting to see what our parish does in the next few weeks.

 

[lrs]

Tell me how a priest is to fit 60+ extra hours into his week? Or, are you assuming that they do absolutely nothing right now?

That may be true of your priests but I can assure you that is not the case with our priests.

Dear Sir Knight-
I am astounded at the lack of support and respect for Priests who have dedicated their lives, their heart, and their soul into serving God. They Marry, they bury the dead, they Baptize infants and adults, they Confirm, they tend to the Spirtual needs of so many. THIS IS THEIR LIFE- GOD FORGIVE THOSE WHO DO NOT UNDERSTAND THIS. What!!! " priests sit in front of the tv and wait for tee times" PLEASE!!!
The response to this post by MANY or MOST of who have already closed their eyes to the very REAL situation regarding the shortage of priests is unbelievable to me.
I do visits to the homebound, and give Communion to 6 elderly in the nursing facility in this town- and I do not run in and out. How in GOD’s Loving Creation can a priest with 2-3 parishes ever accomplish this.

MY husbands says-" these people need to shut the computer off and go do a nice Christian deed for someone instead of bashing these Priests- because that is what is being Catholic is all about":
He just wanted me to say that

AND PEACE,
Lisa

 

[Sir_Knight]

So you understand what I am say?

 

[Gottle_of_Geer]

I noticed that the title of this post is incorrect: “Lay mininsters may not cleanse Communion vessels, Pope Benedict says”.

An instituted acolyte is a lay minister. He has not been ordained. An instituted acolyte may cleanse the Communion vessels.

From the 2002 General Introduction to the Roman Missal (GIRM) which can be accessed from romanrite.com/girm.html :

“279. The sacred vessels are purified by the priest, the deacon, or an instituted acolyte after Communion or after Mass, insofar as possible at the credence table.”

So the CNS headline was also incorrect. The CNS story has: “with instituted acolytes being permitted in the Roman Missal to help the priest or deacon “to purify and arrange the sacred vessels.””

But the insituted acolyte can do the purifications on his own. More quotes from the GIRM on this:

“192. Likewise, when the distribution of Communion is completed, a duly instituted acolyte helps the priest or deacon to purify and arrange the sacred vessels. When no deacon is present, a duly instituted acolyte carries the sacred vessels to the credence table and there purifies, wipes, and arranges them in the usual way.”

“247. The deacon reverently drinks at the altar all of the Blood of Christ that remains, assisted, if necessary, by some of the concelebrants. He then carries the chalice over to the credence table and there he or a duly instituted acolyte purifies, wipes, and arranges it in the usual way (cf. above, no. 183).”

“249. … The deacon, however, consumes at the altar all that remains of the Precious Blood, assisted, if necessary, by some of the concelebrants. He carries the chalice to the credence table and there he or a duly instituted acolyte purifies, wipes and arranges it in the usual way.”

“284. … b. Whatever may remain of the Blood of Christ is consumed at the altar by the priest or the deacon or the duly instituted acolyte who ministered the chalice. The same then purifies, wipes, and arranges the sacred vessels in the usual way.”

That answers the question in post 18 nicely - thanks ​

Some people may think that lay ministers, & laity in general, are an accursed nuisance - it seems that Rome does not. ##

 

[Dr.Bombay]

Rome will. Someday.

 

[Sir_Knight]

But until they do, scripture teaches us that we are to be obedient to our church leaders because they have authority over our souls.

 

[Gottle_of_Geer]

When my pastor asked me to become an EMHC and minister to the homebound, the first words out of my mouth were that I was not worthy. His reply was that if I was unworthy to handle and touch our Lord, then I was unworthy to receive Him as well.

Well said him ​

The Eucharist is a lot of things - one thing it is not, is a reward for good behaviour.

If Jesus Christ was not bothered about mixing with all sort of unkosher characters in His public life, I don’t see why He suddenly, now that He is Glorified, seems to be allergic to being handled by laity.

Anyone would think that we were not sanctified by the Holy Spirit, or that we were lepers, Samaritans, heathens, tax-collectors - instead of members of Christ, children of God, & fellow-heirs with Him, & priests & kings to God in Him.

Clericalism from the clergy is about enough - do we need clericalism from the laity too ?

 

[Walking_Home]

That answers the question in post 18 nicely - thanks ​

Some people may think that lay ministers, & laity in general, are an accursed nuisance - it seems that Rome does not. ##

---

I do not believe Rome refers to us as accursed—but I do believe Rome has come to realize that the laity are taking over to much of the priest’s role.

cwnews.com/news/viewstory.cfm?recnum=47326

In France, Cardinal Arinze decries liturgical abuses

Oct. 27 (CWNews.com) - The prefect of the Congregation for Divine Worship spoke out sharply against liturgical abuses during an October 26 presentation in Paris.

Speaking at the Catholic Institute of Paris, Cardinal Francis Arinze (bio - news) decried the “banalization, desacralization, and secularization of the liturgy.” He rebuked priests who take an “overtly egocentric” approach to the liturgy, violating the norms of the Church. And he also criticized priests whose “false humility” leads them to “share their role with the laity.”

 

[Gottle_of_Geer]

But until they do, scripture teaches us that we are to be obedient to our church leaders because they have authority over our souls.

If Rome *did *think the laity were “an accursed nuisance” as in my post 146, the Church would certainly be small if it decided as in post 147 - but it would be made almost entirely of ageing, most childless, clergy. I suppose they could always give the sacraments to each other. Once they had got rid of all those dratted laity ​

Walking_Home:

I do not believe Rome refers to us as accursed—but I do believe Rome has come to realize that the laity are taking over to much of the priest’s role.

I hope you aren’t suggesting there is any doubt on the matter - If Rome does object to the laity, I think we ought to be told​

 

[Dr.Bombay]

Well said him ​

The Eucharist is a lot of things - one thing it is not, is a reward for good behaviour.

If Jesus Christ was not bothered about mixing with all sort of unkosher characters in His public life, I don’t see why He suddenly, now that He is Glorified, seems to be allergic to being handled by laity.

Anyone would think that we were not sanctified by the Holy Spirit, or that we were lepers, Samaritans, heathens, tax-collectors - instead of members of Christ, children of God, & fellow-heirs with Him, & priests & kings to God in Him.

Clericalism from the clergy is about enough - do we need clericalism from the laity too ?

That’s presumption. You act as if we have some guarantee of salvation.

 

[Gottle_of_Geer]

That’s presumption. You act as if we have some guarantee of salvation.

Presumption ? Where ? (If this is going to get off-topic, we need a new thread)​

 

[Walking_Home]

If Rome *did *think the laity were “an accursed nuisance” as in my post 146, the Church would certainly be small if it decided as in post 147 - but it would be made almost entirely of ageing, most childless, clergy. I suppose they could always give the sacraments to each other. Once they had got rid of all those dratted laity ​

I hope you aren’t suggesting there is any doubt on the matter - If Rome does object to the laity, I think we ought to be told​

---

He is telling the priests----they hold much of the blame. They let the laity take over.

 

[Victorious]

---

He is telling the priests----they hold much of the blame. They let the laity take over.

Yep. Anticlericalism has infiltrated even the priesthood. But it’s a subtle anticlericalism, and takes the form of a false humility that leads to the abdication of priestly dignity and eventually, if we’re not careful, the priestly office.

I will continue to declaim this from the rooftops: when priests start reasserting their rightful authority and take back their turf and their priestly dignity, and quit trying to blend in and act as though the priesthood is no big deal, we will see vocations skyrocket.

 

[Elzee]

I will continue to declaim this from the rooftops: when priests start reasserting their rightful authority and take back their turf and their priestly dignity, and quit trying to blend in and act as though the priesthood is no big deal, we will see vocations skyrocket.

Very well said. I’ve never heard it said better.

 

[prv]

Accursed laity? Excuse me? A priest must be baptized before he can be validly ordained, and hence they are baptized into the Church and the laity. In other words, w/o the laity, there would be no priests or deacons.

 

[cheese_sdc]

Clericalism from the clergy is about enough - do we need clericalism from the laity too ?

stands up and cheers

:clapping: :clapping: :yup: