LDS Church Under Fire Again by Gay and Lesbian Groups . . .

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. . . for comments made by Elder Boyd K. Packer at LDS General Conference. Here is the link. What do you think?
 
Monday, the HRC released a statement saying that President Packer needs to “correct” his statements.
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Also, the HRC called President Packer’s rhetoric, “inaccurate and dangerous.”
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I’m not sure if homosexuality can be “cured” like Packer says but it’s nice to see him take a stand on an issue of morality. I also find it amusing that the HRC asked him to “correct his statements”. How can one adjust their statements when the Bible is explicit on the issue, unless the HRC would like to “correct” the Bible.
 
Well, it rarely does, because our attitude is more forgiving and tolerant. 👍
 
zerinus said:
[What do you think?
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I think it is an inevitable clash. Elder Packer believes homosexuality to be immoral and unnatural, for religious reasons. I’m not sure whether the LDS church formally believes that conversion therapy is effective, or whether Elder Packer is simply stating his personal belief.

The Human Rights Campaign, obviously, does not see homosexuality unnatural and immoral. And they consider conversion therapy to be not only ineffective, but also psychologically harmful. And expensive, to boot.

The HRC has no hope of changing the LDS position on homosexuality, but they want to head off an official endorsement of conversion therapy by LDS leaders.

At least, that is how I see it.
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LongJourney said:
Well, it rarely does, because our attitude is more forgiving and tolerant. 👍
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Umm, no. I skimmed the article and this quote popped out
“There are those today who not only tolerate but advocate voting to change laws that would legalize immorality, as if a vote would somehow alter the designs of God’s laws and nature.”
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Now, if that doesnt sound identical to the Catholic position then I will be a monkeys uncle.
zerinus said:
If the Catholic Church came under fire for the same thing I would care.
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I absolutely care. And I am glad that the LDS is under fire for this. The CC gets the same heat. Our two churches seem to be the last bastions of truth on this issue and the fact that we come under fire for this issue is a good thing. Its kind of like the Celebutants of today: any time you are in the news is good news. If we can get the word out more often that this is immoral and cannot be tolerated “as if a vote would somehow alter the designs of God’s laws and nature” then that is a good thing. Even if we are despised by the immoral and the “pushers” of immorality (moral relativists).

FSC
 
What I do care about are the abusive attempts by Mormons to change peoples’ sexual orientation. If the LDS church were to officially say that these attempts are ordained by God, then it would become subject to lawsuits, which, when combined with lawsuits for other problems, would eventually bankrupt it.

The very fact that the LDS church is obsessed with sexual sin is evidence that it is obsessed with sexuality. It is difficult to maintain celibacy in such an environment. This is abusive to all. Not everyone is suited for (one man one woman) marriage. And Mormon teachings urge ALL to marry in order to reap the full benefits of heaven.

So, yes, I do care, even though I believe that same-sex “marriage” is a contradiction to the meaning of marriage, and that homosexual BEHAVIOR is sin.
 
LongJourney said:
What I do care about are the abusive attempts by Mormons to change peoples’ sexual orientation. If the LDS church were to officially say that these attempts are ordained by God, then it would become subject to lawsuits, which, when combined with lawsuits for other problems, would eventually bankrupt it.
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LDS are not unique in these abusive attempts. Some of the elder’s comments may well have been made by one of our own bishops. Similar groups have made similar accusations on the Catholic message.
The very fact that the LDS church is obsessed with sexual sin is evidence that it is obsessed with sexuality. It is difficult to maintain celibacy in such an environment. This is abusive to all. Not everyone is suited for (one man one woman) marriage. And Mormon teachings urge ALL to marry in order to reap the full benefits of heaven.
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So, yes, I do care, even though I believe that same-sex “marriage” is a contradiction to the meaning of marriage, and that homosexual BEHAVIOR is sin.
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Perhaps LDS teaching on marriage increases the perceived severity of the message.

Can OP or another Mormon can instruct us on the role of celibacy among Mormons?
 
LongJourney said:
Since I am not Mormon, I really don’t care.
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At least the Mormon community’s administration is standing for some form of morality in this world. Its a better state than the Episcopalians are in right now. Hopefully the LDS administration doesn’t crack under pressure in this regard. My respect for the LDS community went up a bit and it will remain so so long as the LDS administration stays strong in moral teaching. Its good to know that at least someone has their head on straight in this regard.
 
I personally support any and all who speak out against immorality and who do so loudly and regardless of how they will be portrayed by the media.
The depravity of the 21st century culture cries out for our voices to be heard, though we few must “scream” both loudly and harshly to rise above the hum and din of today’s onslaught of filthy messags that are all presented as normal and accepted as such by the majority of the world.
👍
 
Well, you know I am always somewhat suspect as to the intentions of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter day Saints (Mormonism) because up until 80 years ago or so, they also railed against the immorality of heterosexual monogamy (a committed and loving man and woman couple) due to both Joseph Smith and Brigham Young speaking out that the only way to Heaven was “living the principle” (ie polygamy). These men literally said that the United States was a wicked country for practicing singular marriage, and that the reason Rome fell was not due to any historical reason, but rather due to the fact that they overturned earlier polygamy in favor of having only one wife in the time of the late republic. The only reason the modern church overturned that principle (which many still practice in rural communities) is due to tremendous legal pressure by the United States Federal Government, despite the fact that polygamy, or celestial marriage, is one of the most sacred tenents of the early mormon religion.
Thus, I am simply offering the point that Mormonism may not be the best and most morally justified group with which to align oneself when debating the gay marriage issue.
 
LongJourney said:
Well, it rarely does, because our attitude is more forgiving and tolerant. 👍
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Did you know that Catholic adoption agencies in the UK have been obliged to close down because they are not willing to comply with the new “anti-discriminatory” laws passed in UK forcing them to allow children to be adopted by gay and lesbian couples?

Did you know that the Pope also came under fire for some of the things he said during his recent visit to the UK? Check out this link for more details (and here is the written transcript of his talk).

During the same visit, he gave a great speech at the Palace of Westminster to all the UK politicians and dignitaries in which he alluded to the same issues. It is a great talk which any Mormon would welcome. Here is a link to a video of the speech, and here is the transcript.

LDS would support the Catholic Church and the Pope on all of these issues.
 
Perhaps LDS teaching on marriage increases the perceived severity of the message.
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Can OP or another Mormon can instruct us on the role of celibacy among Mormons?
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http://www.mazdas247.com/members/LinuxRacr/smiles/cricket.gif

:coffeeread:

If you do a search, you will find a heated discussion on this from several weeks ago. I tried, but I couldn’t find it.
Marriage is strongly encouraged as only married can reach the highest heaven, the Celestial Kingdom, the only heaven of the three heavens where one can live in the presence of God, and where husbands become gods and live with their wives through eternity, producing spirit babies who later come to the earth as human babies.
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sites.google.com/site/donbrowne/mormon2

For a Mormon source, one can do no better than D&C 131:1-4
“In the celestial glory there are three heavens or degrees; and in order to obtain the highest, a man must enter into this order of the priesthood [meaning the new and everlasting covenant of marriage]; and if he does not, he cannot obtain it. He may enter into the other, but that is the end of his kingdom; he cannot have an increase.”
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Pretty hard to back down from that.
 
zerinus said:
If the Catholic Church came under fire for the same thing I would care.
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The Catholic Church regulary comes under fire for its stance on this issue. I applaud the Mormons for standing up against immorality. When we can find common ground, we need to stand on it together. It give more strength to our common cause. :clapping:
 
Dale_M said:
I think it is an inevitable clash. Elder Packer believes homosexuality to be immoral and unnatural, for religious reasons. I’m not sure whether the LDS church formally believes that conversion therapy is effective, or whether Elder Packer is simply stating his personal belief.
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Elder Packer was referring to the supernatural powers that he believes is contained within the priesthood authority of the LDS Church to change people’s lives. He was referring to the possibility of a miracle. Such a miracle, if there is one, would only be relevant or applicable to members of the LDS Church who possess and believe in that priesthood. He was not referring to a “conversion therapy” in general.
The Human Rights Campaign, obviously, does not see homosexuality unnatural and immoral. . . .
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Mormonism does not see the tendency or inclination to homosexuality to be sinful, but only the practice of it.
. . . And they consider conversion therapy to be not only ineffective, but also psychologically harmful. And expensive, to boot.
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The HRC has no hope of changing the LDS position on homosexuality, but they want to head off an official endorsement of conversion therapy by LDS leaders.
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At least, that is how I see it.
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See above.
 
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