The whole thing is just a little too much. In my business I have to watch out for fraud. One of the red flags is when original documentation cannot be produced. It was just a little too convenient that the golden plates were taken back by the angel and that only three people claimed to have seen them. The only thing anyone has to rely on from Joseph Smith is “trust me and my buddies”. And this from someone who had a reputation that would not warrant “trusting”.Let’s not forget that Joseph ran through the woods, carrying them, jumping logs, and fighting off 3 different assailants. All of this with a bum leg that he had since childhood.
I would just like to add that as Christians (all of us including Catholics) don’t have to leave our ability to reason at the door the way mormons do.
Let’s not forget that Joseph ran through the woods, carrying them, jumping logs, and fighting off 3 different assailants. All of this with a bum leg that he had since childhood.
Im not sure how big these plates were or how many, but running with gold would slow you down. :crutches:
Stephen -
I have heard this accusation a few times now, it is false. To my knowledge Emma never said she heard the plates “tinkle”. Instead she says they would “rustle with a metallic sound”. Here is the quote:
Pablope, Thank you for your above post. Indeed Joseph did follow Paul’s example. Since the apostasy had occurred there were no apostles with authority. He and Oliver Cowdery therefore, submitted themself to the resurrected Peter and James along with John the beloved (who was still on the earth).
Of course someone laid their hands on Joseph Smith and Oliver. First was John the Baptist to restore the Aaronic Priesthood. Then Peter, James, and John laid their hands upon them and conferred the Melchizedek priesthood. Almost no lineage could be more sure!
No Christian can prove to me the truth regarding the resurrection. They may show me the Bible, they may take me to the garden tomb, they me tell me of witnesses to the fact but they cannot prove it. So it is with aspects of the restored gospel. You can read the Book of Mormon, I can take you to the Sacred Grove, even Oliver Cowdery bears witness to the facts. Such evidence is sufficient for one who seeks to know, but there will always be doubters. The Lord ever has, and will continue to require, a person to exercise faith.
Interestingly, the KJV (official bible of the LDS church) says:
I’m just sayin’.
This is not just a covenant between God and man, but also between the Father and the Son, which could not be broken by either of them. It assures that the priesthood will continue as the fulfillment of the Levitical covenant, (part of the covenant with David). It is Christ who takes over the kingship of David.
One big difference, however. When we read the Gospels we consider the character and the number of witnesses to Christ’s life, death and resurrection. We find them to be credible. When we consider the character of Joseph Smith, based upon his occupation as a “treasure hunter” in which he scammed the trusting people of his day, we draw a different conclusion. Joseph Smith would be among the last people in which I would exercise faith.
What evidence is there that there was a total loss of truth in the Church? Especially since God willed that such a thing never happen? (1 Tim 2:34)
As I indicated before, this scripture promises two things. That David would rule Israel and that the Levitical priesthood would remain. I have shown you that the first covenant was broken by Israel, do you not believe the second might have also have been broken? Do you agree that this scripture promises that David and his descendent’s will remain on Israel’s throne? Even if you insist this is strictly speaking of Christ, how is it that he never took David’s throne?
Jan,
We do not believe there was a “total” loss of truth. In previous posts on this thread I have addressed this comment.
Jan,
Jan,
I get Levites out of Jeremiah, which is the scripture in question.