Lead as contributing factor to crime?

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St_Francis

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An interesting idea on the cause of the rise and decline of crime.

This is about lead as a cause of crime. Many younger people may be unaware that gasoline used to be leaded, spewing lead into the atmosphere.

Lead has a very bad effect on the brain, esp the brains of growing children–the reason it was outlawed. This article describes several studies which propose a link between lead and crime.

I found it very interesting and wish that this theory had been picked up more so that more studies would be done. If this is the case, we could do something to help improve our society and help people that would really have a good effect. I’m not saying this is IT! and all we have to do, but that this might be a big area.
 
So part of what the article says:
  1. On the one hand, studies, some with MRIs, on the effects of lead on brain development. reduction of IQ, and also problems with myelin (sheath of the nerves) growth, and most importantly, problems with executive/frontal lobe development–this last is where one’s self-control is located.
And as our ability to gather this info increases, we find changes occurring at lower levels of lead in the body.
  1. On the other, studies of timelines, areas of cities, internationally… all showing the same matching curves about 23 years apart. Additionally, high crime areas in areas where there are high amounts of lead in the environment (altho I am not too sure about how that works in the city).
All of this showing a relationship between increases and decreases in lead and, some 23 years later, increases and decreases in crime.

One thing is that people tend to explain decreases according to their own theory, so the decrease in NYC crime was atteibuted to Giuliani’s handling it via the broken windows theory, but! the decline started *before *Giuliani was elected.

Concealed carry advocates point to expanding CC laws to explain the decrease in crime, but the decreases were national, not just in those areas where the laws changed.

And so on…

What the author advocates is a massive effort at lead abatement, mostly in old houses. I have to look the article over to get a bettter idea about the soul aspects.
 
St_Francis said:
So part of what the article says:
  1. On the other, studies of timelines, areas of cities, internationally… all showing the same matching curves about 23 years apart. Additionally, high crime areas in areas where there are high amounts of lead in the environment (altho I am not too sure about how that works in the city).
/QUOTE]

Just to poke good natured fun on a serious topic… more lead in high crime areas might come from the amount of bullets abounding… sad and maybe not true… forgive me!
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petra22 said:
St Francis;11133397:
So part of what the article says:
  1. On the other, studies of timelines, areas of cities, internationally… all showing the same matching curves about 23 years apart. Additionally, high crime areas in areas where there are high amounts of lead in the environment (altho I am not too sure about how that works in the city).
/QUOTE]

Just to poke good natured fun on a serious topic… more lead in high crime areas might come from the amount of bullets abounding… sad and maybe not true… forgive me!
Click to expand...
There have been many times when I thought of a joke in response to a serious topic… such a difficult temptation to resist 🙂
Click to expand...
 
St_Francis said:
Many younger people may be unaware that gasoline used to be leaded, spewing lead into the atmosphere.
Click to expand...
Some gasoline still is, though I think you can only use it in vehicles that are not passenger vehicles approved for driving on the road (off road vehicles, farm equipment, so on). Its usually died red. Despite lead being toxic some prefer it because it leaves less deposits on the ending.
 
Lead cannot in this direct way contribute to crime, because brain ailments do not (directly) affect the soul. You’re talking about the brain like it’s the soul, but that’s not the case.
 
St_Francis said:
An interesting idea on the cause of the rise and decline of crime.

This is about lead as a cause of crime. Many younger people may be unaware that gasoline used to be leaded, spewing lead into the atmosphere.

Lead has a very bad effect on the brain, esp the brains of growing children–the reason it was outlawed. This article describes several studies which propose a link between lead and crime.

I found it very interesting and wish that this theory had been picked up more so that more studies would be done. If this is the case, we could do something to help improve our society and help people that would really have a good effect. I’m not saying this is IT! and all we have to do, but that this might be a big area.
Click to expand...
The victimization of America. We concoct all kinds of excuses for bad behavior. There’s right and wrong. It’s not that difficult to understand.
 
migueltojose said:
The victimization of America. We concoct all kinds of excuses for bad behavior. There’s right and wrong. It’s not that difficult to understand.
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If you don’t think this is true, read what the drug companies are saying is ok for women to put in their bodies for “birth control.”

prolife.com/BIRTHCNT.html

…OFTEN sending our littlest sons and daughters to their deaths. Sorry to get off topic but it’s about other toxins… causing sad behaviors for men and women.
 
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weller2:
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 	 		 			 				 					Originally Posted by **SentinelofTruth** 					[<no images allowed for trial members>](http://forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?p=11152099#post11152099) 				
			*Lead cannot in this direct way  contribute to crime, because brain ailments do not (directly) affect the  soul. You're talking about the brain like it's the soul, but that's not  the case.*
cerebromente.org.br/n07/d…/disease_i.htm
medicalnewstoday.com/articles/251798.php
jnnp.bmj.com/content/71/6/720.full
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phineas_Gage
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The internet is not some magic database that only lets in truth. There’s this being called satan, and he has human minions. All he would need to do to lead the entire world into a misconception this important is to have them post a couple articles on the internet about it containing fabrications and lies, which anyone can do. It is unfortunate that people trust so easily that it is this easy for him to fool billions of people.
 
Aggression and abnormal development of the frontal lobes is well known in the field of psychology. The effects of lead and the abnormal development of the frontal lobes is also well known.
 
Robert Sock:
Aggression and abnormal development of the frontal lobes is well known in the field of psychology. The effects of lead and the abnormal development of the frontal lobes is also well known.
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On what basis do you know this? Because you were raised to believe it?
 
ThinkingSapien said:
Some gasoline still is, though I think you can only use it in vehicles that are not passenger vehicles approved for driving on the road (off road vehicles, farm equipment, so on). Its usually died red. Despite lead being toxic some prefer it because it leaves less deposits on the ending.
Click to expand...
There is no leaded motor fuel in the U.S. anymore. I believe it may still be used in a small handful of countries as a motor fuel. The only remaining use of leaded fuel in the U.S. is in general aviation (100LL), which will probably be gone within the next decade.

Dyed fuel has to do with taxation and nothing else. Off-road diesel or gasoline is not taxed in many areas and is dyed to prevent tax fraud (i.e., being sold or used for on-road use).
 
Robert Sock:
I have a PhD in psychology with a bunch of graduate training in aggression. Are you somehow trying to refute this fact?
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I am not denying that you have this degree. But a degree in psychology doesn’t make you an expert in philosophy of mind. Psychology and neurology are separate fields, by the way. If they study the same object, why are they separate?
 
SentinelofTruth said:
Lead cannot in this direct way contribute to crime, because brain ailments do not (directly) affect the soul. You’re talking about the brain like it’s the soul, but that’s not the case.
Click to expand...
There are cases in which a person’s frontal lobes are injured, causing some to behave more aggressively.

In addition, Alzheimer’s patients often deteriorate to the extent to which they become violent.

Are you saying this phenomena doesn’t exist, or that a person with a brain damaged in this way is not guilty of sin?
 
migueltojose said:
The victimization of America. We concoct all kinds of excuses for bad behavior. There’s right and wrong. It’s not that difficult to understand.
Click to expand...
It is true that there is right and wrong; however, “man is a creature composed of body and soul.” We are not pure spirit or pure intellect. We are also physical beings, and our physicality is a part of us; without our bodies we are incomplete.

If we see a person with cerebral palsy move suddenly and hit someone, we do not think that an assault has occurred, but that the person’s condition caused a movement.

And I am not saying that people who commit crimes of violence due to brain injury of whatever source should not be locked up for the protection of others.
 
St_Francis said:
It is true that there is right and wrong; however, “man is a creature composed of body and soul.” We are not pure spirit or pure intellect. We are also physical beings, and our physicality is a part of us; without our bodies we are incomplete.

If we see a person with cerebral palsy move suddenly and hit someone, we do not think that an assault has occurred, but that the person’s condition caused a movement.

And I am not saying that people who commit crimes of violence due to brain injury of whatever source should not be locked up for the protection of others.
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I understand the reality of the scientific/psychosocial basis for bad behavior. I’m just sayin that we seem to spend a lot more time explaining, defending or excusing bad behavior than we do on being good parents, teachers, law enforcement, doctors, lawyers… citizens, etc. We are creatures. We’ve spent tens of thousands of years being hungry and killing to survive. Bad behavior isn’t new it’s just becoming socialized as the “new normal”. In general, we’re obsessed with celebrity wealth and fame and these fine “examples” of what to do and how to behave are abominable. (Miley Cyrus the other night… oh… that’s nice.)

Conformity has become a bad word. There used to be upper and lower limits on what is and is not acceptable “normal” behavior. We used to “govern” ourselves better. Now we encourage individuality to the extent that all kinds of deviant behavior is being considered acceptable. It has a deliterious effect on society. It has a deliterious effect on “normal”. The pendulum has swung to far left from the repressive nineteen-fifties. The sixties were great in many ways but also very damaging.

Being God fearing and law abiding is normal. Marriage is normal. Family is normal. One Father, the Spiritual leader of the family unit and one mother is normal. More than two kids is normal. Siblings who enter the religous community is normal. Working for a living is normal. Working two jobs, going to night school to get ahead, that’s normal. Drinking water from a hose and wearing hand me down clothes is normal too.

Now kids will kill each other for a pair of sneakers. How did sneakers get so important? How did ____ get more important than the value of life? (Oh yeah, abortion. Society says it’s okay to kill for socio-economic reasons.)

Whining and making excuses for bad behavior is the new normal.
 
St Francis:
There are cases in which a person’s frontal lobes are injured, causing some to behave more aggressively.

In addition, Alzheimer’s patients often deteriorate to the extent to which they become violent.

Are you saying this phenomena doesn’t exist, or that a person with a brain damaged in this way is not guilty of sin?
Click to expand...
I am indeed saying that these phenomena don’t exist. People always have free will, that’s part of what it means to be a person. So people (provided they are aware of the immorality of their behaviour) are always culpable for their behaviour.
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migueltojose:
I’m just sayin that we seem to spend a lot more time explaining, defending or excusing bad behavior than we do on being good parents, teachers, law enforcement, doctors, lawyers… citizens, etc.
Click to expand...
While I disagree with your belief in scientific basis for bad behaviour, I must commend that you look at the issue this way.
 
SentinelofTruth said:
I am not denying that you have this degree. But a degree in psychology doesn’t make you an expert in philosophy of mind. Psychology and neurology are separate fields, by the way. If they study the same object, why are they separate?
Click to expand...
Physiological psychology indeed studies neurology. What is your area of expertise to reject my claim that abnormal development of the frontal lobe is associated with aggression? You’re going against a large amount of literature in psychology and physiology. And where does philosophy come into play within a purely psychological and physiological phenomenon?
 
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