Lector at Invalid Marriage

[Stella_Matutina]

Bad news- I have stupidly made the classic mistake of agreeing to read a reading during my cousin’s wedding. She’s Methodist and the groom is a lapsed Catholic. I just found out that it doesn’t matter if he’s lapsed. He is still obligated to follow canonical form, therefor the marriage is presumptively invalid unless he gets permission from the bishop. Even more bad news- the wedding is in 3 weeks… in her church!

How long could it take to get “permission to enter into a mixed marriage” and a “dispensation from canonical form”? Can it be done in less than 3 weeks? (Probably depends on the diocese I’m sure… but just curious if anyone wanted to share the experience with this and if it was difficult.)

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

Bad news- I have stupidly made the classic mistake of agreeing to read a reading during my cousin’s wedding. She’s Methodist and the groom is a lapsed Catholic. I just found out that it doesn’t matter if he’s lapsed. He is still obligated to follow canonical form, therefor the marriage is presumptively invalid unless he gets permission from the bishop. Even more bad news- the wedding is in 3 weeks… in her church!

How long could it take to get “permission to enter into a mixed marriage” and a “dispensation from canonical form”? Can it be done in less than 3 weeks? (Probably depends on the diocese I’m sure… but just curious if anyone wanted to share the experience with this and if it was difficult.)

Probably 6 months, because they most likely have not done the required 6 month Marriage preparation with the Catholic pastor.

I would just let her know you can not participate in the Marriage ceremony because of the situatio but you will be happy to come to the reception.

 

[Stella_Matutina]

I figured as much. :banghead:

Oh well, I hope they didn’t print the programs yet!

 

[saieditor]

** Bad news**- I have stupidly made the classic mistake of agreeing to read a reading during my cousin’s wedding. She’s Methodist and the groom is a lapsed Catholic.

They are human beings, aren’t they?
Doing something human, aren’t they?

What’s bad news about that?

 

[Dicerning]

They are human beings, aren’t they?
Doing something human, aren’t they?

What’s bad news about that?

The bad news I believe is the OP mentions they agreed to read at an invalid wedding and they are now in a dilemma. Fortunately the OP has the courage to stand with the Heart of the church and not participate.

Also bad is the fact that the groom is a Catholic and thus has turned his back on the ONE TRUE faith of GOd and is entering into an invalid Marriage. The consequences have eternal ramifications.

How is that NOT bad?

 

[Stella_Matutina]

What is so strange about this situation is that if he were Methodist, Baptist, Presbyterian, or simply just baptized as a baby in any protestant denomination- the marriage would be valid and I would be able to participate in the ceremony. But because he is Catholic (even though not practicing) and has not committed a “formal act” of separation from the Church, that makes the marriage invalid because he is still obligated to follow canonical form.

Sigh… the validity of sacraments!!! I probably sound like I am complaining. I’m not. I just wish I knew this months ago when she originally asked me. My bad…

 

[Lux_et_Tenebrae]

Have you asked your confessor?

This is a non-Catholic relative, marrying a non-practicing Catholic. Are you certain you cannot participate? This marriage is valid for your cousin. The Catholic Church does recognize non-Catholic marriages.

Lux

 

[FrDavid96]

Have you asked your confessor?

This is a non-Catholic relative, marrying a non-practicing Catholic. Are you certain you cannot participate? This marriage is valid for your cousin. The Catholic Church does recognize non-Catholic marriages.

Lux

An invalid marriage is an invalid marriage. It can’t be valid for one party while at the same time being invalid for the other party.

 

[Newbie2]

Also bad is the fact that the groom is a Catholic and thus has turned his back on the ONE TRUE faith of GOd and is entering into an invalid Marriage. The consequences have eternal ramifications.

How is that NOT bad?

It may not be permanent. He could come back and bring his family with him.

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

It may not be permanent. He could come back and bring his family with him.

And this might be the awakening message he needs.

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

It may not be permanent. He could come back and bring his family with him.

And this might be the awakening message he needs.

 

[Lux_et_Tenebrae]

An invalid marriage is an invalid marriage. It can’t be valid for one party while at the same time being invalid for the other party.

The methodist is being married in her church, and it is valid there. Obviously the Cathlic party is satisfied with this. What would happen if this doesn’t work out, and she wishes to remarry?

Lux

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

The methodist is being married in her church, and it is valid there. Obviously the Cathlic party is satisfied with this. What would happen if this doesn’t work out, and she wishes to remarry?

Lux

We are making assumptions.

“The methodist is being married in her church, and it is valid there.”

The Marriage is accepted by her Christian Community, however at it’s root it is not valid because a Catholic cannot validly Marry under the circumstances. (Assumming the Catholic party does not have the Bishops permission to do so)

In a perfect world the Methodist Community would not attempt to celebrate a mixed Marriage without documentation from the Catholic showing that the Catholic has all the necessary permissions and/or dispensations from their Bishop. In reality today many Protestant Communities will allow their members to marry, divorce, then remarry into an adulterous union without a second thought, sometimes several times.

 

[FrDavid96]

The methodist is being married in her church, and it is valid there. Obviously the Cathlic party is satisfied with this. What would happen if this doesn’t work out, and she wishes to remarry?

Lux

Again, no. There is no such thing as one party being validly married and the other party being invalidly married. It takes two people to marry. There is no such thing as “half a marriage.”

I cannot imagine why you would think that if one party is in an invalid marriage, the other party could be in a valid one. Why would you think this? I’m genuinely curious.

 

[Stella_Matutina]

Have you asked your confessor?

This is a non-Catholic relative, marrying a non-practicing Catholic. Are you certain you cannot participate? This marriage is valid for your cousin. The Catholic Church does recognize non-Catholic marriages.

Lux

You’re right, the Church does recognize non-Catholic marriages but that’s the thing- this marriage is not “non-Catholic,” it is a Mixed Marriage between a Catholic and non-Catholic. Even though the Catholic isn’t practicing, he is still obligated to follow canonical form (which would mean obtaining permission from the bishop to marry outside the Church), unless he separated himself from the Church by a formal act (which he did not in this case.) Complicated- I know.

And very heartbreaking. I broke the news to my cousin today and it didn’t go so well. She was very hurt. The rest of my family is too. I’m the only Catholic in my family (converted in 2005.)

This story gets worse- my dad called my parish priest to ask him about this to confirm if I were right and the priest told him that I was wrong and that I could read at the wedding. Of course my dad told my cousin this which made her even more upset. So now everyone thinks that I am a self-righteous nazi and that I think I know more about the Church than a priest who has been ordained more than 50 years- AND to make me look even less credible- he’s the priest who married me!!!

:bighanky: Ugh… living your faith can be heartbreaking at times. She’s my favorite cousin. Like I said, the wedding is three weeks away. They already had programs printed with my name in them. This is just all a big mess because I just wasn’t thinking. I thought- both baptized, alright cool. Why did he have to be Catholic??? I’m going to try to talk to my parish priest myself. I’ll let you know what happens.

 

[Lux_et_Tenebrae]

Good—I can’t think that it would be best to cause all the trouble in the family, because this man does not care about his religion. Formal or not, his intention is clear. Why would anyone who doesn’t care about the church bother to file a formal document?

As a convert there may be many things that you really can’t bend on—I don’t feel this should be one of them.

Peace and blessings to you.

Lux

 

[Lux_et_Tenebrae]

Again, no. There is no such thing as one party being validly married and the other party being invalidly married. It takes two people to marry. There is no such thing as “half a marriage.”

I cannot imagine why you would think that if one party is in an invalid marriage, the other party could be in a valid one. Why would you think this? I’m genuinely curious.

It is an invalid Catholic marriage. She is not Catholic, so why would Catholic laws bind her? I find it very confusing that the Catholic Church recognizes marriages of 2 non-Catholics, but not this situation. The girl is validly married by civil law, and her faith.

Lux

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

It is an invalid Catholic marriage. She is not Catholic, so why would Catholic laws bind her? I find it very confusing that the Catholic Church recognizes marriages of 2 non-Catholics, but not this situation. The girl is validly married by civil law, and her faith.

Lux

She is legally married which is accepted erroneously by her Christian Community as valid.

 

[Lux_et_Tenebrae]

Do you say the same of a marriage between 2 non-Catholics in their Church?

Lux

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

It is an invalid Catholic marriage. She is not Catholic, so why would Catholic laws bind her? I find it very confusing that the Catholic Church recognizes marriages of 2 non-Catholics, but not this situation. The girl is validly married by civil law, and her faith.

Lux

The Church DOES NOT across the board accept all non-Catholic Marriages as valid.