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irishpatrick
Guest
Sometimes it is very difficult to accept the truth.
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baylee
Guest
I think we all know that sexual abuse very often has nothing to do with attraction or even sex. When a man rapes a woman, it isn’t because he’s attracted to her as a woman. It’s not because he is heterosexual. Likewise, I do not believe these abuses is about attraction. I honestly don’t know enough about pedophilia (or whatever you want to cal it) to know whether heterosexual abusers will go for the same sex too. I suspect that they could since again I don’t think any form of sexual abuse is about sexual attraction.
Having said that, that does not mean that at least some of these priests *were *homosexual. It seems as if those who are defending the perceived attack on homosexuality aren’t willing to admit that at least some of these priests may in fact be homosexual! Or that it’s possible that these particular homosexual priests are just sick men…not a reflection on homosexual men as a whole. How dare anyone say such a thing! They must all be heterosexual of course.
Having said that, that does not mean that at least some of these priests *were *homosexual. It seems as if those who are defending the perceived attack on homosexuality aren’t willing to admit that at least some of these priests may in fact be homosexual! Or that it’s possible that these particular homosexual priests are just sick men…not a reflection on homosexual men as a whole. How dare anyone say such a thing! They must all be heterosexual of course.
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OriginalJS
Guest
As something of an aside to this thread, wasn’t it established a few years ago that the incidence of AIDS was higher in the priesthood than in the general population? I thought it was common knowledge that there is a large percentage of priests that are homosexuals. But being homosexuals doesn’t make one a pedophile or ephebophile.
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NewEnglandPriest
Guest
You’re referencing a Kansas City Star article that wasn’t exactly scientific in its methods. However, its been “convential wisdom” for a while that there’s a sizable minority of priests who have sexual issues.
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Joegrane
Guest
Please consider the history of the Church in the US 30-40 years ago. The late 60’s and 1970’s were a crazy time of cultural change. There was great pressure to modernize and ‘get with the times’. This included pressure to be more sexually ‘tolerant.’
Furthermore, the number of seminarians was decreasing. There was some pressure to accept men who in previous generations would not have made the cut. It is not very surprising that seminaries were breaking with tradition and accepting men with stronger homosexual orientation. In addition seminaries were too often lax in teaching and demanding a traditional Christian moral lifestyle. It was a time of sexual experimentation both inside and outside the church.
I was in a seminary for a few years in the early 80’s just as things started to turn around. The church was starting to feel the positive effects of the pontificate of John Paul the Great. The seminary I was in had expelled a couple of guys for homosexual activity and were teaching traditional Christian morality. Some other bishops heard about it and transferred some of their men in. Of course they came in with stories of homosexual activity elsewhere. I’m not surprised that it came back to bite us. That’s what sin always does!
Please don’t misunderstand me. I’m not anti-homosexual, or more accurately, I’m not disrespectful of my brothers in Christ who are struggling with a homosexual orientation. I don’t know exactly why approximately 80% of the abuse cases are homosexual, but the number are what they are. In fact since altar girls became a common occurrence in the US, the percentage of homosexual cases has actually increased, even as access to boys by the average priest has decreased!
Of course I have no respect for sinful actions. I detest the irresponsibility of those who had a problem but were not straightforward with their confessors and superiors.
Fortunately now the statistics show that the problem of clergy abuse is almost entirely behind us–six new allegations by minors in 2009 in the US. I wish we could say the same about the situation in public schools and in the general public where the liberal media and liberal lawmakers seems content to conspire to cover it up.
Are they outraged when abortion clinics don’t followup on cases of rape of underage girls who come in for an abortion?
Why have lawmakers in several states, including recently in CT, passed legislation extending the statute of limitations on abuse cases but essentially EXCLUDE public schools–their political allies?
Apparently the liberal lawmakers don’t really care about children. They are just care about shoving their political agenda down people’s throats–or maybe up our ___!
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edwest2
Guest
I was there for the late 1960s. “crazy time” “cultural change” Yes. In the early 1960s we were living out our faith and the surrounding culture resonated with our beliefs and values.
In 1968, Humanae Vitae, about artificial contraception, freaked out a lot of radicals both inside and outside of the Church. A priest posted here about how he, at the time, was being pressured by another priest to sign a protest letter against it. He refused. A few priests in recent years who did sign on have changed their minds.
Imagine a time when greater trust existed among the people, and for the government. When greater trust existed between the people and experts. Now imagine kind, compassionate Catholics who did not know how to manipulate people being approached and counseled by people who did. Imagine that. Trust abused. People, including priests and nuns, pointed in the wrong direction. Theologians telling Catholics to ignore clear teaching. It’s up to you, they said. A priest on Catholic Radio said that that idea was taught in seminaries in the 1970s but all that is being corrected today.
There was a plan in place to discredit the Church.
God bless,
Ed
In 1968, Humanae Vitae, about artificial contraception, freaked out a lot of radicals both inside and outside of the Church. A priest posted here about how he, at the time, was being pressured by another priest to sign a protest letter against it. He refused. A few priests in recent years who did sign on have changed their minds.
Imagine a time when greater trust existed among the people, and for the government. When greater trust existed between the people and experts. Now imagine kind, compassionate Catholics who did not know how to manipulate people being approached and counseled by people who did. Imagine that. Trust abused. People, including priests and nuns, pointed in the wrong direction. Theologians telling Catholics to ignore clear teaching. It’s up to you, they said. A priest on Catholic Radio said that that idea was taught in seminaries in the 1970s but all that is being corrected today.
There was a plan in place to discredit the Church.
God bless,
Ed
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Polycarp1
Guest
The Bible has always warned us that there would be wolves in the sheepfold and it is certain that we “the Church” have not been as alert and defensive as we should be in keeping the wolves out. We have to remember that the Roman Catholic Church is engaged in constant spiritual warfare, and under constant attack by the forces of evil. Perhaps more so than other churches, but that also make sense as who would Satan concentrate the most on?.. his biggest enemy of course, the one that is the biggest threat to him in leading people to the Truth.
Satan is evil but he is not stupid, far from it. In fact he is genius when it comes to contriving and executing devious attacks sometimes implemented slowly and over long periods of time. His ultimate goal is to undermine the credibility of the Church and It’s clergy. As a Catholic I hate what he does but as a retired intelligence officer I gan only marvel at the deviousness of the mind behind it! The logistics and planning he uses in his attacks are incredible.
We would be alerted to sudden direct attacks but often the slow sneaky ones catch us napping. Take for example the rash of sex scandals in amongst some clergy in recent years. Many have been hurt and left the faith over this and that is exactly the goal Satan had in mind when he sent the wolves slinking in. It makes many wonder what is happening to the clergy of the Church and they lose their focus on Christ. What we have to remember through all of this is that the offenders weren’t priests who became abusers and pedophiles, these were abusers and pedophiles who became priests!
It is true that in many cases the Church administration, clergy and the laity were too slow to act. The nature of these acts are not easy to ferret out and not long ago it was very hard to believe or accept that such could be going on. That is what has to change. The dogma of the Church is as solid as ever and always will be.
When much of this was going on almost all of us were ignorant of the nature and extent of the problem. We didn’t know that there was little true remorse in or rehabilitation for pedophiles. Maybe not wanting to believe such things made us for a while at least “wilfully blind”.
When confronted with a “repentent” pedophile it was in the nature of clergy to forgive and to accept that they would not do it again. We now know that that was naieve and that it was not just clergy who fell into that trap. On the otherhand now we know and have to take appropriate steps in dealing with this evil that has infiltrated the “sheepfold”.
The Pope is now under attack and being called sinful for forgiving and transfering a pedophile priest. While with what we now know that may have been unwise but it was not sinful. Maybe we can forgive him for being too forgiving?
And he said to his disciples: “It is impossible for scandals not to occur. But woe to him through whom they come!
It would be better for him if a millstone were placed around his neck and he were thrown into the sea, than to lead astray one of these little ones.
Maybe we should order more millstones!
Satan is evil but he is not stupid, far from it. In fact he is genius when it comes to contriving and executing devious attacks sometimes implemented slowly and over long periods of time. His ultimate goal is to undermine the credibility of the Church and It’s clergy. As a Catholic I hate what he does but as a retired intelligence officer I gan only marvel at the deviousness of the mind behind it! The logistics and planning he uses in his attacks are incredible.
We would be alerted to sudden direct attacks but often the slow sneaky ones catch us napping. Take for example the rash of sex scandals in amongst some clergy in recent years. Many have been hurt and left the faith over this and that is exactly the goal Satan had in mind when he sent the wolves slinking in. It makes many wonder what is happening to the clergy of the Church and they lose their focus on Christ. What we have to remember through all of this is that the offenders weren’t priests who became abusers and pedophiles, these were abusers and pedophiles who became priests!
It is true that in many cases the Church administration, clergy and the laity were too slow to act. The nature of these acts are not easy to ferret out and not long ago it was very hard to believe or accept that such could be going on. That is what has to change. The dogma of the Church is as solid as ever and always will be.
When much of this was going on almost all of us were ignorant of the nature and extent of the problem. We didn’t know that there was little true remorse in or rehabilitation for pedophiles. Maybe not wanting to believe such things made us for a while at least “wilfully blind”.
When confronted with a “repentent” pedophile it was in the nature of clergy to forgive and to accept that they would not do it again. We now know that that was naieve and that it was not just clergy who fell into that trap. On the otherhand now we know and have to take appropriate steps in dealing with this evil that has infiltrated the “sheepfold”.
The Pope is now under attack and being called sinful for forgiving and transfering a pedophile priest. While with what we now know that may have been unwise but it was not sinful. Maybe we can forgive him for being too forgiving?
And he said to his disciples: “It is impossible for scandals not to occur. But woe to him through whom they come!
It would be better for him if a millstone were placed around his neck and he were thrown into the sea, than to lead astray one of these little ones.
Maybe we should order more millstones!
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Teelynn
Guest
You hit the nail on the head…I don’t think the majority of Catholics realize this…the book “Goodbye Good Men” explains it all.
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seekerz
Guest
Any takers? (I apologize if I’ve missed someone addressing this question but took a short break from and came back to this thread still with the same unanswered questions).
J
Joegrane
Guest
There is more news on the link between homosexuality and the abuse.
Pedophilia is not linked to celibacy, but homosexuality, says Cardinal Bertone
I personally know the doctor that is quoted in the article. He is a fine Catholic man. You might have seen him on EWTNs programs. This is his website.
Pedophilia is not linked to celibacy, but homosexuality, says Cardinal Bertone
I personally know the doctor that is quoted in the article. He is a fine Catholic man. You might have seen him on EWTNs programs. This is his website.
S
Shaken
Guest
Here is the down low, according to the Catholic League for Religious and Civil Rights.
A priest involved in a child abuse scandal was reported to the police in Wisconsin in the mid-1970s over incidents that occurred in the 50s. After an investigation, the case was dropped.
Cardinal Ratzinger learned of it in 1996 while he was the head of the Church office that was contacted. That was some 40 years after the occurrence and some 20 years after the police had dismissed it.
Before the Church’s inquiry could be completed, the priest died.
A priest involved in a child abuse scandal was reported to the police in Wisconsin in the mid-1970s over incidents that occurred in the 50s. After an investigation, the case was dropped.
Cardinal Ratzinger learned of it in 1996 while he was the head of the Church office that was contacted. That was some 40 years after the occurrence and some 20 years after the police had dismissed it.
Before the Church’s inquiry could be completed, the priest died.
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