Lex orandi lex credendi

[eelpis]

I start this thread because of a question that came up in another thread.

Since the Church’s teaching on the Eucharist is unchanged, how come there is so little Eucharistic devotions and how come repect for and belief in the Eucharist is waning?

Not long ago if you suggested Adoration and Benediction you could be laughed at.

 

[Trishie]

Let’s hope it’s turning around. It’s not died out over the years. While there may not always be official gatherings, I think there are a lot of people like me who like to put in an hour after Mass in front of the Tabernacle and have done so throughout the years.
There are also parishes that have continued to maintain perpetual adoration…
in addition to orders of nuns who maintain perpetual adoration.
And there are innumerable Catholics around the globe who continue to attend daily Mass.
I.e. the flame has remained burning!

 

[DL82]

I don’t recognise this. I have seen adoration in all of the Catholic Churches I’ve ever visited, there are always people before the tabernacle. I’ve also seen adoration and benediction play a pivotal role in the Charismatic renewal, and in all the retreats and other Catholic prayer events I’ve ever been to.

 

[eelpis]

I don’t recognise this. I have seen adoration in all of the Catholic Churches I’ve ever visited, there are always people before the tabernacle. I’ve also seen adoration and benediction play a pivotal role in the Charismatic renewal, and in all the retreats and other Catholic prayer events I’ve ever been to.

I suspect that Eucharistic devotions are making a come back in Church.

 

[strugglingalong]

I’ll bite

Honestly, I think receiving Our Lord in the hand while standing from a woman in a pant suit does not conduce to belief in the Real Presence. If this is truly the Body and Blood of Christ, should I really touch it? Should I just causally walk up and take it? I think to kneel and receive on the tongue illustrates to people that this is something serious, something profound, not just to be grabbed and chewed on but to be received in reverence and humility. The way we worship does affect what we believe.

I know for myself I’ve seen my reverence and belief in the Real Presence strengthen by attending the TLM.

Pax Christi tecum.

 

[GerardP]

I’ll bite

Honestly, I think receiving Our Lord in the hand while standing from a woman in a pant suit does not conduce to belief in the Real Presence. If this is truly the Body and Blood of Christ, should I really touch it? Should I just causally walk up and take it? I think to kneel and receive on the tongue illustrates to people that this is something serious, something profound, not just to be grabbed and chewed on but to be received in reverence and humility. The way we worship does affect what we believe.

I know for myself I’ve seen my reverence and belief in the Real Presence strengthen by attending the TLM.

Pax Christi tecum.

Add to that, the moving of the tabernacles, priests that no longer genuflect when they pass the tabernacle, laiety not genuflecting nor wearing appropriate clothing, no sacred silence in the Churches because of chit chat, horizontal pew arrangements in the Churches, And the most insidious tactic that I’ve seen is a local church that is “clamshell” shaped. There is a baptismal “pool” placed in such a way to make an immediate genuflection in front of the tabernacle look like you’re genuflecting to the pool. Then, to make it worse, there is a glass adoration chapel to the right. If you really are being reverent, you have to genuflect to two different locations when you cross Our Lord’s path. So, there is no consistency in the reverence shown.

 

[strugglingalong]

Add to that, the moving of the tabernacles, priests that no longer genuflect when they pass the tabernacle, laiety not genuflecting nor wearing appropriate clothing, no sacred silence in the Churches because of chit chat, horizontal pew arrangements in the Churches, And the most insidious tactic that I’ve seen is a local church that is “clamshell” shaped. There is a baptismal “pool” placed in such a way to make an immediate genuflection in front of the tabernacle look like you’re genuflecting to the pool. Then, to make it worse, there is a glass adoration chapel to the right. If you really are being reverent, you have to genuflect to two different locations when you cross Our Lord’s path. So, there is no consistency in the reverence shown.

All very valid issues.

Pax Christi tecum.

 

[maggiemay2u]

I’ll bite

Honestly, I think receiving Our Lord in the hand while standing from a woman in a pant suit does not conduce to belief in the Real Presence. If this is truly the Body and Blood of Christ, should I really touch it? Should I just causally walk up and take it? I think to kneel and receive on the tongue illustrates to people that this is something serious, something profound, not just to be grabbed and chewed on but to be received in reverence and humility. The way we worship does affect what we believe.

I know for myself I’ve seen my reverence and belief in the Real Presence strengthen by attending the TLM.

Pax Christi tecum.

Wait until the guy in shorts and tee shirt shows up…and before someone asks, yes, a scheduled EMHC…give me the woman in a pant suit (actually, give me the priest, but doesn’t look like that’s going to happen soon (pray for vocations!))

 

[pnewton]

I don’t recognise this. I have seen adoration in all of the Catholic Churches I’ve ever visited, there are always people before the tabernacle. I’ve also seen adoration and benediction play a pivotal role in the Charismatic renewal, and in all the retreats and other Catholic prayer events I’ve ever been to.

I have noticed the same thing. I wonder if the problem is as big as others make it, or is it just that this practice is coming back. I really don’t have enough years as a Catholic to know.

 

[Rawb]

Well my Parish just established a Eucharistic Chapel, with a stained glass window of the Sacred Heart and a small altar with two candles, and a beautiful tabernacle that is a miniature of the one still found in the main Church.

I’m quite lucky that I found out about it, because I had missed Mass last week where (I suppose) they made an annoucement about it, and was shown it by a friend who was just leaving the chapel, as I was coming into the Church to confess having missed Mass!

I thought I might make a visit tonight. The rule of silence is strictly enforced in the chapel apparently.

 

[Unitas]

I start this thread because of a question that came up in another thread.

Since the Church’s teaching on the Eucharist is unchanged, how come there is so little Eucharistic devotions and how come repect for and belief in the Eucharist is waning?

Not long ago if you suggested Adoration and Benediction you could be laughed at.

My opinions:

1. Lack of available perpetual adoration
2. The indult to legalize communion in the hand, along with the removal of “holy and venerable hands” has lessened the sense of the sacredness of the sacrament. The sense of the priest acting in persona christi has been seriously damaged. Familiarity breeds contempt.

People intuit a lot from looking at their surroundings. If the Eucharist is not treated like a big deal, then people will intuit that it is not a big deal. You cannot expect the belief to thrive if people’s actions do not reflect the belief.

Example: every knee will bend to the name of the Lord, yet we stand in His True Presence? Hmm…

1. The sub-standard prayers in the english translation of the new mass, as well as the removal and shortening of the latin text from the old, has led to a lessening in the quality of belief.

Lex orandi lex credendi. If you give the people poorer quality prayers this will be reflected in poorer quality belief. This is obviously an issue seeing as the new translation is be worked on. This is also a big reason why trads promote the old mass so much, because it is our belief that the lex orandi is of a much superior quality than the new mass in practice. Therefore it will foster a greater quality of lex credendi in the faithful.

 

[EasterJoy]

I start this thread because of a question that came up in another thread.

Since the Church’s teaching on the Eucharist is unchanged, how come there is so little Eucharistic devotions and how come repect for and belief in the Eucharist is waning?

First off, I think that respect for everything and everyone has plummeted. There is nothing and nobody that cannot be treated flippantly, and flippancy is taken as cleverness, as if a person who treated something as a joke was automatically funny.

Not long ago if you suggested Adoration and Benediction you could be laughed at.

Not where I come from. Ever.

 

[DarkNight]

1. The indult to legalize communion in the hand, along with the removal of “holy and venerable hands” has lessened the sense of the sacredness of the sacrament. The sense of the priest acting in persona christi has been seriously damaged. Familiarity breeds contempt…

I grew up with the TLM and communion “on the tongue”
I often attended Greek Byzantine liturgy and received the bread and wine “from the spoon”

Receiving Jesus in my hands is the most reverant manner to receive Him.
I have a heigthened awareness of Who it is I am receiving “under my roof”
And I am utterly humbled by the miracle that He comes to nourish me.

The Pauline Mass is as beautiful as the Tridentine and the Byzantine.
All in their own way, they speak differently but say the same thing - “I am here”

Go with Love, Go with God

 

[Unitas]

Receiving Jesus in my hands is the most reverant manner to receive Him.

Perhaps for you. The evidence says you’re the exception not the rule. Communion in the hand has done nothing but exacerbate the loss of belief in the True Presence.

When armies of EMHC’s take handfuls of our Lord then overstuff their ciboriums, or the celebrant breaks the host in such a grand manner with arms wide apart, not caring for the crumbs that flew away, or when you see a bishop dust his hands off on his vestments, when the “unspotted host” is now called “bread” and the “chalice of salvation” is called “spiritual drink”, when manifest public heretics are given communion without a care, when laity are giving communion to laity, do we wonder why the belief has dropped?

Suppressing the indult for that which began as an abuse would do more to reinforce correct belief than any encyclical or homily. Actions speak much louder than words; If it is treated with respect, then it will command respect.

 

[Deacon_Ed_B]

I suspect that Eucharistic devotions are making a come back in Church.

It is not a suspicion, but a fact. Eucharistic Adoration is growing. In the city where I live, there are numerous parishes with Eucharistic Adoration. In those parishes where there is adoration, attendance and participation is growing. In those parishes where there is no adoration, things are stagnant.
Prayers & blessings
Deacon Ed B

 

[bpbasilphx]

If this is truly the Body and Blood of Christ, should I really touch it?

**If you can touch it with your lips, tongue, teeth, roof of your mouth, throat, and stomach, why not with your hands? (Btw, I NEVER receive in the hand, except at the Chaldean Church, where it is their long standing ancient practice, or at the Divine Liturgy of St. James.)

And Eastern Christians have always stood to receive.**

 

[eelpis]

If this is truly the Body and Blood of Christ, should I really touch it?

**If you can touch it with your lips, tongue, teeth, roof of your mouth, throat, and stomach, why not with your hands? (Btw, I NEVER receive in the hand, except at the Chaldean Church, where it is their long standing ancient practice, or at the Divine Liturgy of St. James.)

And Eastern Christians have always stood to receive.**

It’s the ancient custom even in the Latin Church, but the understanding of the Eucharist has evolved in the Latin Church. That’s why we have Adoration and Benediction, for example.
In the context of our modern Western culture standing is not percieved as as reverent as kneeling.

 

[bpbasilphx]

Perhaps for you. The evidence says you’re the exception not the rule. Communion in the hand has done nothing but exacerbate the loss of belief in the True Presence.

**The Chaldean Catholic and the Assyrians have always received Communion in the hand, and have NEVER denied that this is the Body and Blood of Christ.

You might want to watch this clip of the Assyrian Liturgy and see how the faithful purify their hands and faces in the incense before receiving in the hand.

youtube.com/watch?v=u3kzhTOvZrQ

The Byzantine Liturgy of St. James, if the rubrics are strictly followed, call for receiving in the hand, too. (I will also say that I have NEVER seen this done.)

In the Orthodox Churches, Benediction and such devotions are totally unknown, but people believe in the Real Presence.**

 

[Deacon_Ed_B]

Perhaps for you. The evidence says you’re the exception not the rule. Communion in the hand has done nothing but exacerbate the loss of belief in the True Presence.
]

I would remind you that our Holy Father, Pope Benedict XVI gave Communion in the hand while here in the states. I would hardly say he is contributing to that which leads to a loss of belief in the true presence of Jesus in the Eucharist.

In discussing this with a convert to Catholicism, his description of receiving the Eucharist for the first time was that when the consecrated host was placed in his hand, that he was filled with an overwhelming awe of holding the Creator of all that is in his hand and that God humbles himself to come to each of us in this manner. This hardly contributes to a lack of belief, but when reflected upon tells us of our own insignificance before Almighty God.
Prayers & blessings
Deacon Ed B

 

[drforjc]

I would remind you that our Holy Father, Pope Benedict XVI gave Communion in the hand while here in the states. I would hardly say he is contributing to that which leads to a loss of belief in the true presence of Jesus in the Eucharist.

In discussing this with a convert to Catholicism, his description of receiving the Eucharist for the first time was that when the consecrated host was placed in his hand, that he was filled with an overwhelming awe of holding the Creator of all that is in his hand and that God humbles himself to come to each of us in this manner. This hardly contributes to a lack of belief, but when reflected upon tells us of our own insignificance before Almighty God.
Prayers & blessings
Deacon Ed B

But note that at papal masses in Rome, the trend has been toward the Holy Father distributing only on the tongue, kneeling.