Local churches, in Northern Ireland, draw up plans for priestless Masses

[pepipop]

tyronetimes.co.uk/news/local/local-churches-draw-up-plans-for-priestless-masses-1-4252503
*
RADICAL new plans for Tyrone parishes to hold Sunday services led by lay people have been drawn up by church leaders.

The previously unthinkable move has been announced to tackle the acute shortage of priests and their increasingly older age profile.

Dean Colum Currie of Dungannon parish said that according to the new guidelines where there is no possiblity of getting a priest, male and female lay people will be able to conduct a Sunday service with a liturgy of the word and the Eucharist, followed by distribution of Holy Communion.

Lay people including women, have already conducted Sunday services from the altar in churches in the South.

Last week, parishioners turned up as usual for Sunday evening Mass in Blessington, Wicklow. However, when no priest arrived, a religious sister who was present led a liturgy, preached a homily and distributed Holy Communion to those present.*

How sad, there are so few new priests being ordained in Ireland.

 

[Rich_C]

It would be better to have to stay home on Sundays than go to a “lay service.” It will just confuse people, especially children, about the priesthood, the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass, and a host of other things, most likely. What are they thinking?

 

[ProdglArchitect]

Yeah, I have to say, this seems… dangerous.

Though, at least they are dedicated enough to Catholicism to try to do something. You cannot fault their intentions, unfortunately they just haven’t come up with a better idea yet.

 

[yukonbrad]

It would be better to have to stay home on Sundays than go to a “lay service.” It will just confuse people, especially children, about the priesthood, the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass, and a host of other things, most likely. What are they thinking?

So you would tell all of us up here we can’t gather because we have no priest? That we esentially can’t be Catholic without a priest. Many communities here have and still go without a priest and with the great distances between communities would be lucky to have mass once every 2 or 3 months.

Besides Sunday Celebration of the Word services have existed for decades, this is nothing new. The eucharist mass parts are omitted (for obvious reasons) however communion may be handed out if there are consecrated hosts in the Tabernacle (otherwise no communion).

 

[Corki]

This is not something new being “drawn up”. This is not “radical”. It is also not a Mass. The Church already has an approved rite for a ‘Sunday Celebration in the Absence of a Priest’. What seems to be happening in Ireland is that they are formalizing the norms for local use.

It is the Liturgy of the Word, with a homily delivered preferably by a deacon, followed by distribution of Communion. if a deacon is not available, a lay person can deliver a homily that was previously prepared by a priest or deacon. It’s not ideal but it gives Catholics a community option rather than just observing the Lord’s day privately.

If no priest is available to say Mass on a Sunday and there is no near-by Mass, there is no obligation to attend any non-Mass service. However, if a parish has an extended time without a priest, this is a way to keep the parish alive. It’s not ideal but it is not a “radical” plan either.

 

[yukonbrad]

tyronetimes.co.uk/news/local/local-churches-draw-up-plans-for-priestless-masses-1-4252503
*
RADICAL new plans for Tyrone parishes to hold Sunday services led by lay people have been drawn up by church leaders.

The previously unthinkable move has been announced to tackle the acute shortage of priests and their increasingly older age profile.

Dean Colum Currie of Dungannon parish said that according to the new guidelines where there is no possiblity of getting a priest, male and female lay people will be able to conduct a Sunday service with a liturgy of the word and the Eucharist, followed by distribution of Holy Communion.

Lay people including women, have already conducted Sunday services from the altar in churches in the South.

Last week, parishioners turned up as usual for Sunday evening Mass in Blessington, Wicklow. However, when no priest arrived, a religious sister who was present led a liturgy, preached a homily and distributed Holy Communion to those present.*

How sad, there are so few new priests being ordained in Ireland.

Ireland may wish to do what we have been forced to do - borrow priests from African dioceses as many parishes there have 7 or 8 priests. We have 3 priests at present from Nigeria, one of whom is now on his second 3 year tour.

 

[ProdglArchitect]

This is not something new being “drawn up”. This is not “radical”. It is also not a Mass. The Church already has an approved rite for a ‘Sunday Celebration in the Absence of a Priest’. What seems to be happening in Ireland is that they are formalizing the norms for local use.

It is the Liturgy of the Word, with a homily delivered preferably by a deacon, followed by distribution of Communion. if a deacon is not available, a lay person can deliver a homily that was previously prepared by a priest or deacon. It’s not ideal but it gives Catholics a community option rather than just observing the Lord’s day privately.

If no priest is available to say Mass on a Sunday and there is no near-by Mass, there is no obligation to attend any non-Mass service. However, if a parish has an extended time without a priest, this is a way to keep the parish alive. It’s not ideal but it is not a “radical” plan either.

I did not know any of that. It is good to know ^^ Thank you.

 

[latin_rite]

Maybe it is time we started to allow Catholic priests to marry. God didn’t forbid it.

 

[KCCatechist]

This is what happens when the role of laity on the altar is increased and the dignity and responsibilities of the priests are watered down. Soon catholic parishes will be no different than the protestant places of worship.

 

[Bill_Martin]

Nothing radical or new; many parishes with priest shortages have been doing it for years and it is approved by the Church.

Article gets a out of a possible for sensationalism.

 

[IanGE]

In our parish we have had communion services on friday mornings for decades. The “I confess”, then Liturgy of the word, no sermon, followed by the Our Father and peace exchange and communion with previously consecrated hosts. This is the formula used by Eucharist ministers taking communion to sick people at home. The friday service used to be conducted by our Polish deacon, who’d had a hard time in Poland during WWII: first the Germans, then the Russians, then Allied concentration camps. He still had an understandable persecution complex. One friday there was only the deacon and I, as it was my turn as reader. “They don’t like me, Ian!” and despite my counselling he moved to the North of England. We still haven’t a Deacon so the Friday services are led by nuns or Eucharistic Ministers. In the current absence of seminarians and priests a Communion Service is better than nothing, although one misses the full panoply of mass.
I guess the church will have to rethink and redefine Sunday “Mass” and the current Mortal Sin for missing it. The fourth commandment is “Remember to keep holy the Sabbath day” but in Genesis 31: 12 -17, God explains this commandment: mow the lawn on sunday and you shall be put to death! I guess the church lets us off lightly with a confession-forgiveable Mortal sin! Although Jesus says (Mk. 2:27): “The sabbath was made for man not man for the sabbath.”
In London, once, my brother was walking down his street on Saturday when a man rushed out of a door. “Sir, are you a Christian?”; “yes?” “Will you please switch on my lights for me?” Herbie went in thinking a fuse had blown, but the man pointed to a wall switch: “please switch it on.” Herbie did, the lights came on and Herbie, totally puzzled, asked “why couldn’t YOU switch on the lights?”
“I am a Jew and I am forbidden to work on the sabbath.”
“Flicking a switch is work?”
“Oh yes, I am controlling great power coming from Battersea Power Station!”

 

[markomalley]

Maybe it is time we started to allow Catholic priests to marry. God didn’t forbid it.

Priests have NEVER been allowed to marry. There is nothing in the Scriptures allowing ANY ordained man to marry. At any place. Any time.

Having said that, married men have been allowed to become priests.

There is a BIG difference.

 

[Santi2]

This is what happens when the role of laity on the altar is increased and the dignity and responsibilities of the priests are watered down.

We cannot make sweeping statements of the sort as pastoral necessity dictates the role of the laity in this case. Where Parishioners are deprived of Sunday Mass for the lack of priests in the area, must they also be deprived of the most Venerable Sacrament?

 

[Pilgrim1701]

First, its not a priestless mass.
It will be a liturgy led by someone other than a priest, so it could be clergy, as a deacon, religious(male or female) or lay person (male or female).
The guidelines for this have been around for donkeys years so its nothing new.
What is new is that it is beginning to happen in Ireland. What is surprising is how unaware the laity generally seem to about the impending changes. This will become more common and widespread, and much sooner than most realise! People need to be prepared for these changes.

The diaconate was reintroduced in Ireland much too late, and as I read in an article in The Tablet, as a last resort. An indication , I fear, of how the Episcopate view the diaconate. We are not getting deacons now because we need good deacons, but because we’ve run out of priests. And its a pity, because if they weren’t 45 years or so behind the curve of the rest of the English speaking world and reintroduced the diaconate in the 70s, there is no reason the diaconate could n’t have supported the priesthood. Perhaps married men with families may have prevented a lot of abuse scandals occurring in our church, and certainly may have demanded a better response to those that did occur. In any case, its shutting the barn door after the horse has bolted, the diaconate isn’t been taken up in any great numbers to fill the gap, hence the need for lay people.

It will diminish the priesthood, absolutely no doubt about the long-term consequences.
People will become confused as to why the priest is needed, despite what people may say about educating/catechising people about the difference between such a liturgy and the mass, and of course the media will be all over it. And not in a nice way.
The media and secular world will be demanding women priests, married priests, and any number of other ‘politically correct’ reforms,(why the atheist, no vested interest types are bothered anyway is beyond me) and the laity will be swept along, as it seems so far, with no leadership from the Church.

More than VII, or the abuse scandal that broke from the 90s onwards, this has the potential to change the Catholic church, and the practice of Catholicism in Ireland in a monumental and radical way. Catholicism may become unrecognisable and indistinguishable from some forms of Protestantism. People may even begin to convert to other Churches. Time will tell if the Holy Spirit is present in all of this.

The time is now for lay people to become more involved in their church, to take on the role and work that priests don’t need to do, and free up priests to be–priests:shrug:
If lay people begin to be, and remain more active, and congregations continue to come, hopefully the need for priests will be promoted, if congregations dwindle, this won’t be the case. Everyone in the Church has responsibility for this. At the moment, the laity are happy to leave it to the clergy. Just my thoughts:shrug:

 

[Tigg]

There is absolutely no such thing as a priestless Mass! How much more damage can be done to the non-catechized who will undoubtedly, fail to note the discrepancy of the title in this article?

 

[Rich_C]

So you would tell all of us up here we can’t gather because we have no priest?

I have no problem with gathering, but “lay services?”

That we esentially can’t be Catholic without a priest.

Correct. Catholicism is a priestly, sacrificial religion, after its High Priest, Jesus Christ.

Besides Sunday Celebration of the Word services have existed for decades, this is nothing new. The eucharist mass parts are omitted (for obvious reasons) however communion may be handed out if there are consecrated hosts in the Tabernacle (otherwise no communion).

It shouldn’t become the norm. If this was the norm where I lived, I would stay home and pray as a family and go to Mass when, if ever, a priest showed up. I could probably live with an ordained deacon leading some kind of prayer, but any less feels like playing church.

 

[Contarini]

Why don’t Catholics use the Liturgy of the Hours in such cases? That’s what Anglicans do.

 

[Corki]

It shouldn’t become the norm. If this was the norm where I lived, I would stay home and pray as a family and go to Mass when, if ever, a priest showed up. I could probably live with an ordained deacon leading some kind of prayer, but any less feels like playing church.

And that’s fine too - in fact, that was the norm for most of the history of the Church. The idea of a priest in residence, available every Sunday is a fairly modern development for Catholics not living in a city.

There is no obligation to attend a Sunday Celebration in the Absence of a Priest. It is not a Mass and when no Mass is available, there is no obligation. But not everyone is living with family and some people want to have the community experience of gathering on Sunday, even if no Mass is available. It’s an option that is appreciated by some but you are not required to attend or even to support this if it ever was offered at your parish.

There are some places that have extended the use of this to non-Sundays. I really don’t like that and in many dioceses, it is expressly forbidden. (just look at the title of the document that allows this liturgy ).

 

[Mrs_Sally]

We are so blessed to have 3 daily Masses and 7 Sunday Masses each week!

Without a priest in-residence or fairly close by, the faithful do what they can. Pray at home with their families, gather for the LOTH, or gather for a Sunday Celebration in the Absence of a Priest.

We need to pray for more vocations to the priesthood, the permanent diaconate, and religious life. And we as lay people need to step up and do what we can to relieve the burdens on our priests so that they can bring the sacraments.

 

[gus]

This could be a great thing
One never appreciates what they have.
We so take this gift for granted.
When denied it the appreciation and hunger for the true Eucharist will grow and lead to a new evangelization
The underground church In Japan susstained for 200 year

As long a one real Catholic Priest survives a rebirth is ineviditable