Lust by looking?

[GraceDK]

Though a new member may I contribute or rather ask on this topic…

I fully don’t understand lust by looking coz, in a situation where for example a young man aged 25 to 30, working with mixed teenagers may be as a teacher,or any other close contact. He sees now and then young girls, dressed what we call immodest in such a secular set up.

How can this young man conquer this temptation?

The Bible says: for those who are clean, everything is clean. So when you look at a young woman try to think of her as your biological sister that should be respected and protected. She belongs to Christ and woe to the man who seduces her.

Jesus said: Woe to the one who leads one of these little ones to fall. It was better for him if he had never been born.

If a man feels greatly tempted when working with teen agers he should pray for chastity and purity and he should leave the job with teen agers to other mature Christians who are not tempted.
be humble enough to admit this job might not be for you.

Remember if you work with teen agers and you work for Christ then the parents and God in particular send the girls and boys to you because they trust that you can keep your eyes and hands to your self. If you lust at your little sisters in Christ then you should leave the job to a woman or someone else who can be trusted.

 

[joeybaggz]

To all the posters who offered the position that men are automatically incable of self respect and self control in the face of encountering a provocatively or suggestively dressed female, thanks for the insult. Queen Victoria would be proud of you.

 

[red_eye_chimera]

Sometimes the occasion arises that one will see something that one isn’t intended to see i.e. a woman bending over and giving (intentionally or not) a sneak peak.

My guess is that most men’s first reaction is “Hmmmmm”, which, of course, is not sinful. Dwelling on it is.

Same thing with seeing a “hot” individual.

My priest had a helpful take on this; you cannot help what you do not intend to see, and it’s fine to appreciate God’s created beauty. He suggested a quick prayer. “Lord, thank you for the beauty you’ve created”. That sort of gets one in the mindset of “OK you’ve seen her (or him), very nice, thank you Jesus, now let’s move on”.

That’s great, but what happens if the thought keeps on repeately comes back because the body part you lust is constatnly exposed? I’ve had a foot fetish ever since I was a wee lad. I didn’t realize that it could hurt me until my freshman year. One friend diagnosed it. I was curious and I explored more on this unique characteristic. Due to the media’s and the world’s ideas of sexual desires, what do you think happened to me? My whole entire Sophmore year I couldn’t remember a single day that I didn’t have a thought about feet. I honestly creeped out many of my peers last year. I’m entering my junior year on Sept 2nd.

Ever since the Lord has been working in me, it is a lot easier to avoid the standard nude porn,which I’m glad to get rid of .

Fetishes are part of the hundreds of other sexual intrests the Lord gave us , but as said the devil and the world twist the whole reason of having sexual desires into lust and sexual gradification .

Prayer is a good tool, but I get bored easily, especially when nothing important is hapening in the classroom especially when everyone is getting ready. What I also noticed is that I’m less proned to lust in a setting where it is normal to be barefoot, i.e. my karate studio and the beach.

After I confess, what else should I do?

 

[KeepaTrueHeadin]

I know it isn’t lust to look at an attractive person, otherwise we’d be covering our eyes everywhere we went (my general compliment to God’s Creation there ), but is there a point when you start sinning by over-indulging in staring a beautiful bodies say at the pool or beach (since we’re in the summer months)? My current moral “assessment” is that it would be only an occasion of sin. Not sure though. It’s especially hard for me being only 18 when we see other people’s bodies as very important in how we perceive our peers. Just wondering.

A woman, nearly nude, at the beach is a beautiful sight. This is natural, she is the epitomy of God’s creative beauty, This becomes sinful the moment the shift occurs from “She is so beautiful” to “I want to touch her”.

The former brings glory to God, the ladder brings glory to oneself.

If you struggle with lust (as most if not all men do) I advise you to avoid temptation. A very good technique is to “bounce your eyes” for a few weeks. It feels silly, but simply train yourself to automatically look away from a woman wearing anything revealing. It takes a few weeks to normalize it, but once you do it becomes natural for you to bounce your eyes away from temptation.

 

[surfinpure]

A woman, nearly nude, at the beach is a beautiful sight. This is natural, she is the epitomy of God’s creative beauty, This becomes sinful the moment the shift occurs from “She is so beautiful” to “I want to touch her”.

I would caution against this line of thinking. Far too many men have themselves convinced that when they look at a nearly-naked woman they are only admiring God’s wonderful creation. We have it on both Biblical and Church authority that God does not wish that portion of his creation to be on display for strangers to “admire.” He has reserved each woman’s body for her husband, if that is her calling. And I seriously doubt the ability of a man with a healthy libido to look at a woman in such a condition and remain chaste in his thinking. The chemicals in the brain are strong, and men are designed to be aroused by the visual.

So yes, look away immediately and don’t dwell on the image.

 

[westboro]

First off, I have a hard time believing that. There are certain parts of the female body that should be reserved for husbands only, because men are programmed to be attracted to those parts. If you do a bit of reading regarding the “wiring” of the male sex, you will find that it takes very little suggestion at all for men to desire an attractive woman. And certainly far less than we think.

You misunderstand me. Did you not read what I said about ignorance, and presuming the best? Out of charity, we must begin with the premise that these women do not realize what they are doing. Having grown up in a secular culture myself (on a beach, no less!) I am fully aware that this is not always the case. I did not always wear immodest clothing with pure intentions, and neither did my friends. But for the sake of discussion, and because the intention of the woman is really quite irrelevant to it anyway, I have granted every woman in a bathing suit the benefit of the doubt. There is no blame involved, but even in their ignorance, by clothing themselves in such a way, they are allowing the attention from men to their most intimate areas.

There is no drama invovled in this at all. But again, I urge you to read a good deal on the chemistry of men. They don’t simply desire the female form because they are told not to (indeed, our culture doesn’t tell them not to at all – rather, it tells them "go right ahead!") but because it is in their nature and the best interest of the human race to desire it. And not incidentally, a woman’s bared form should be forbidden for men to gawk at by all standards of modesty and Christian virtue. If you disagree with this, then there really is no point in further discussion here.

…as is the general European feeling on the subject, but like everything else, it must be weighed against what we as Catholics know is true of respect for human dignity. We must take not merely a global, but a moral and historical perspective. A look into moral teaching and the history of women’s fashion is enough to make the “naturalist” viewpoint look not quite so “natural” any longer.

It is wonderful to hear from a woman who really gets it about a man’s natural ‘condition’ and consequently…the huge struggle it is for males. ‘Looking’ is very much an ‘auto-response’ to seeing something provocative. Lustfull thoughts are not far behind! I believe it is as deep as our animal instinct, which of course needs to be brought into control through whatever means available such as prayer, fasting, and doing penance. The thing that this 20 year old girl does not understand is the greater portion of males in the world don’t even ‘know’ how nor do they have the ‘tools’ to deal with this natural response. She, and her friends could be causing such violent crimes as rape and other deplorable actions some males eventually turn to in order to relieve this building pressure and frustration over time. It is basically a ‘teasing’ in order to provoke a response. It has always amazed me how the prisons contain over 90% males and less than 10% females. Do women commit crimes? The answer is yes…crimes that are perfectly ‘legal’ but cause violence in there wake. The bible speaks of ‘tempting’ others and its consequences but the passage escapes me right now. Lastly, this girl seems to be confusing ‘looking pretty’ and ‘looking sexy’. A male who is ‘lusting’ at a woman is no longer viewing her as pretty. She then becomes merely an object of desire. The Blessed Mother is the most beautiful, ‘pretty’ woman that ever lived and she has never felt the need to expose her body to anyone in order to gain such recognition! If only this girl could get it about the VALUE of modest dress. It becomes more about genuine communication, respect and true love in the interaction rather than starting from lust!

 

[Harmony1988]

Saying that wearing bikinis, miniskirts and other ‘immodest’ wear whilst not knowing it caused lust is like saying you were shooting at someone with a gun but didn’t know you were going to kill them.

 

[DL82]

I’ve heard it said that deliberately putting yourself in a near occasion of mortal sin is itself a mortal sin. That means if you stare at a woman’s chest but she has small breasts and you’re not attracted, you have still committed the mortal sin because if her chest had been otherwise you would have lusted after her. You also have to think how this makes women feel.

It also means something for going to beaches, or other environments where you will be tempted. If you are in a nightclub where women regularly bare their breasts, get out. It’s only natural that you will stare, because it’s such an odd and shocking thing for a woman to do, so if you know you’re going to be made to sin, then don’t put yourself in that position in the first place.

I’ve started being really careful about this lately, I’ll rarely fix my gaze directly on a woman at all if I can avoid it, because I know I’m prone to look in the wrong ways. I’ve already found, after less than a month of this scrupulous care, that when a woman does cross my gaze I am no longer inclined to focus on parts of her body that I would have in the past. Thanks be to God for this grace. I have met men from Miles Jesu who do not even look at women, which strikes me as a little extreme, but seems to work for them.

Honestly, when you don’t even look, when you look at a woman’s face the way you would look at a man’s face, women become much more comfortable around you. Many secular women will be surprised at this level of comfort, because they’ve never experienced such chaste treatment from a (straight) man before. I think this pleasant surprise is just one of the many subtle ways that we can share God’s love and the recognition of the incredible dignity which He has given humanity with the world.

God bless

 

[westboro]

I wonder if women are just as prone to lust as men are. I heard somewhere that we’re more visual in ‘mate selection’ to put it in a very depth-less biological term, but women are more about feelings? Do women have just as much trouble with this sin as men then? And am I causing girls to lust after me by clothing and bathing suit choices I wonder…just something to think about I guess, the flip-side of the coin.

You make an interesting point. With all the talk about ‘women’ dressing immodestly, there is something to be said about men doing the same thing. Your statement makes me think of the rapid incline of homosexuality these days which has many factors to consider, one of which is immodest clothing by BOTH men and women for that very reason. Secondly, I don’t know if you can ‘equate’ the potential for lustful responses between the sexes though. Being a man, I know that for me, sexual arousal in the way of immediate ‘physical’ response is what I am prone to and need to guard myself from it diligently. I suppose you could liken it to what a woman would experience approaching the height of her sexual experience, such as orgasm. That might help you understand the huge struggle men have to deal with, sexually. It is a very painful urge that seeks immediate relief. If we were all to be honest with ourselves, we need to look squarely at the part we have played in the explosion of permissiveness and/or passivity in our society!

 

[red_eye_chimera]

So yes, look away immediately and don’t dwell on the image.

What about the images burned in the mind, due to regretful pornography

 

[surfinpure]

What about the images burned in the mind, due to regretful pornography

I’m afraid those are much harder to get rid of, but there are several very good organizations dedicated to helping men overcome these thoughts. Check out this thread: forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=55427&page=3

The good news is, it can be done. My own dear husband is a walking success story in that regard.

 

[westboro]

What about the images burned in the mind, due to regretful pornography

Two things…don’t listen to the devil who will try to convince you that when those images pop up in your mind you have sinned because you have not. It is only when you choose to dwell on them that they become sinful, the degree of which you ought to discuss with your confessor, because addiction is always an element to factor in according to the Catechism.
Second, habits can only be ‘replaced’ rather than rid of. When I earnestly took up the ‘habit’ of saying the rosary - all three sets of mysteries daily, meditating on each mystery as best I could in spite of huge distractions, I found that the old porno ‘reels’ became less and less prevalent until now they are almost transparent. The Blessed Mother does a marvelous job ‘cleaning’ us up from our soiled past. Turn to her for help and you can’t go wrong! If devoting that much time to praying the rosary sounds objectionable, just call to mind the amount of time you devoted to filling your mind with the garbage. That thought should give you the determination to do what you need to do to clean up your mind!

 

[CTA1967]

I have a question. What if you were sitting by a gal you fancy and caught a glance at her chest (clothed), and you glanced at it again without the intention of lust, but realizing you were becoming slightly aroused, shifted your attention to another attractive part of her body like her hands? Would that be a sin?

 

[CTA1967]

I have a question. What if you were sitting by a gal you fancy and caught a glance at her chest (clothed), and you glanced at it again without the intention of lust, but realizing you were becoming slightly aroused, shifted your attention to another attractive part of her body like her hands? Would that be a sin?

Or would something like this be a near occasion of sin?

 

[dazzi]

I have been trying to get an exact meaning on Lust for over a year now so I really need help Iam stunned at what it is actually, I have a thing in my mind that whenever a guy sees a girl who is pretty they get as you know a reaction downstairs that it is Lust? but over the last few weeks ive been thinking that that reaction might not actually be Lust? because then Iam worried if it is because there is no way a guy can go around everyday life especially a teen and never get that reaction when they see a pretty girl, so is it Lust only when you purposfully have sexual or rude thoughts but if this reaciton downstairs happends without any thoughts or anything is this not Lust, But attraction?

 

[red_eye_chimera]

Or would something like this be a near occasion of sin?

If you lust that body part too, then yes. Don’t worry, I feel the same way about a friend of mine. Just pray for her that she will remain pure for the rest of her life (chaste until marrige, then loyal to her spouse to death). As men, we have to not dwell on these desires for the women we like. We have to let go sometimes.

Also heres a tip for all those who are reading and lack the common sense like me . Don’t tell her your desires. ¡Soy un idiota!

 

[westboro]

I have been trying to get an exact meaning on Lust for over a year now so I really need help Iam stunned at what it is actually, I have a thing in my mind that whenever a guy sees a girl who is pretty they get as you know a reaction downstairs that it is Lust? but over the last few weeks ive been thinking that that reaction might not actually be Lust? because then Iam worried if it is because there is no way a guy can go around everyday life especially a teen and never get that reaction when they see a pretty girl, so is it Lust only when you purposfully have sexual or rude thoughts but if this reaciton downstairs happends without any thoughts or anything is this not Lust, But attraction?

You describe the ‘automatic’ male response very tastefully and make it perfectly clear. Some women, but a whole lot of ‘young women’ cannot even grasp the very real physical arousal response of the male body sexually. It can be very painful and is a very real ‘cross’ for most of us and because of the fact that girls don’t understand what they are doing to us by exposing their bodies, we must take defensive actions, such as avoiding extremely ‘permissive’ places…like the beach, etc. Other places, like school or work that we cannot avoid, we need to train our selves to look away as soon as that ‘auto’ urge to ‘look’ kicks in. I am describing allot of work but it is necessary in order to gain control over the potential lust you describe. There is a difference between ‘pretty’, as you describe it and ‘provocative’. In 1917, the Blessed Mother told Jacinta that immodest styles would be introduced and the prediction has come to pass. Tight jeans, well fitting pants, tank tops, tight shirts short skirts, short pants, gym shorts etc etc etc. All these styles are mostly provocative. It is as though there is ‘no where’ we can ‘look’ anymore! Because of the sad condition of our society, I highly recommend to turn to the rosary and the Blessed Mother who will strengthen you to endure the battle. To answer your question more specifically…lust occurs only when you ‘consent’ to the desire at hand by way of either ‘not avoiding’ the occasion of sin or dwelling on it. It is all about how we apply our ‘will’ in any given situation. We are not being lustful just because our bodies ‘automatically’ respond to an unavoidable situation because that is perfectly natural. St Francis of Assisi once ‘threw’ himself into a thorn bush as a way to deal with that condition, which of course is a bit extreme but it will give you some idea as to how the saints dealt with it!
Finally, bear in mind that males reach the absolute PEAK of their sexual desires between 13 and 18 years old whereas females don’t reach theirs until they are around 35 years old, which is why ‘young’ girls are very much in the dark about these things. These ‘biological’ facts will further help you to grasp what you are dealing with! God bless!

 

[surfinpure]

Excellent post, Westboro.

 

[dazzi]

So really if i go somewhere see someone, for eg at school today i felt so bad what i asked you was happening when i saw a person, i had a reaction, but in my head i quickly turned to face my computer and in my head i was saying god please help me, st michael please help me, would that be still classed as lust or not ? i did no want it but the reaction came and i knew i was gona fall for it so i started asking god for help…

 

[thomfra]

From a woman’s point of view…

One aspect to consider is that a woman wearing a bathing suit in mixed company is nearly always displaying parts of her body that should be reserved for husband, or future husband when they are married. More importantly, it is a violation of her own dignity to dress herself improperly, and to allow herself to be objectified or lusted after.

We must remember that as Catholics, we have an obligation to grant a much higher respect to our secular brethren than they give themselves. We know that they are made in the image and likeness of God, but they do not. We know that their lives and bodies are sacred, but they do not. And we must respect their human dignity, even if they do not. We are graced with the wisdom of God. They remain ignorant of His law, at best (and let us always presume the best).

If we happened upon an elderly or mentally handicapped person who was improperly clothed, what would we do? We would avert our eyes, of course, out of respect. Why should we treat the morally ignorant any differently? Of course women are beautiful, but they also deserve respect and dignity, and that requires that we turn our eyes away when we find them embarrassing themselves – whether they know it or not.

Why do I get the feeling that you’re not a beach person?