Malachy Prophesies

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Hello, I just came across this old thread from 2004 while JPII was still alive, discussing St. Malachy’s prophecies of the Popes. It was a very interesting read, especially in light of Pope Benedict’s recent resignation:

forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=47852

I just wanted to share and perhaps give the discussion on St. Malachy’s prophecies new life. I should note that St. Malachy’s prophecies are private revelation and therefore as faithful Catholics we are not bound to believe or disbelieve them.
 
I wouldn’t put to much emphasizes on the Prophecy. I have read before (here on CAF and on the web were supposedly that was forged and that it did not really happen as “prophecy”.

This is my take and i commented on it earlier, God will never let his Church and those who follow alone, people will talk and people will try to divide us from our faith. What I would do which is what I have been doing since yesterday is to do several rosaries and Chaplets of Divine Mercy.

Do alot of Prayer and pray for our church, our Pope Benedict XVI and whomever the Holy Spirit is going to elect as our new Pope.
 
chero23 said:
I wouldn’t put to much emphasizes on the Prophecy. I have read before (here on CAF and on the web were supposedly that was forged and that it did not really happen as “prophecy”.

This is my take and i commented on it earlier, God will never let his Church and those who follow alone, people will talk and people will try to divide us from our faith. What I would do which is what I have been doing since yesterday is to do several rosaries and Chaplets of Divine Mercy.

Do alot of Prayer and pray for our church, our Pope Benedict XVI and whomever the Holy Spirit is going to elect as our new Pope.
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Yes, the prophecies are forged.
 
dshix said:
Yes, the prophecies are forged.
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They, however, accurately predicted that JPII the Great would be born and die on the day of a solar eclipse. Probably forgeries, but that’s a pretty good guess.😉
 
Luigi_Daniele said:
They, however, accurately predicted that JPII the Great would be born and die on the day of a solar eclipse. Probably forgeries, but that’s a pretty good guess.😉
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Then why were prophecies attributed to St. Malachy 300 years (something like that) after his death? He said nothing of them while he lived, and no one else brought them up until long after he was dead. The prophecies might have been coincidentally correct on some counts, but that doesn’t mean they were divinely inspired.
 
Ah, the “prophecies” of St. Malachy . Don’t put any stock in them. As Karl Keating stated on last night’s Catholic Answers Live, they’re forgeries, pure and simple. Unfortunately a lot of conspiracy-minded fundamentalists are in hyper-drive over this, mainly due to a website and book by a loose cannon fundamentalist named Tom Horn who runs a website that has been promoting his book for some months now:
raidersnewsupdate.com/ - Even the politically partisan WorldNetDaily has picked up the story. Horn puts anti-Catholic bigot Jack Chick to shame in his shrill diatribes against the Holy See.
This same Horn, by the way, a few years ago predicted that they year 2012 would see the rise of the anti-Christ and other momentous end-times events. Check the reviews of his book “Apollyon Rising 2012” at Amazon.com. None of what he predicted would happen happened. Apparently his fans have quickly forgotten his book and numerous radio interviews in which he confidently asserted that 2012 was THE year!
 
Page 15 of the Criterian, Fr John Dietzen answered a question about the prophecies
Q I am a student at our state university and came across a book called The Prophecies of St. Malachy. It supposedly gives a brief sketch of all the popes until the end of the world. Does the Catholic Church recognize this book? Is it heresy? Some of the prophecies seem believable. (Louisiana)
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A The “prophecy” that bears his name supposedly was written by St. [Bishop] Malachy of Ireland, who died in 1148. It claims to designate 111 successors of Pope Celestine II, who lived about the same time as Malachy. These successors are not identified by name, but by short verses said to characterize the man and his time as pope. The first 60 or so are somewhat clear and bear a bit of resemblance to the pope they refer to. After that, the verses become so generic they could almost refer to anyone anytime. It takes a vivid imagination to pull some meaning out of most references. According to these alleged predictions, there is only one more pope after the present one. He will be Petrus Romanus, Peter of Rome, who will preside over the destruction of Rome and the end of the present age. The whole supposed prophecy is, in fact, an elaborate forgery. St. Malachy, who had a holy and illustrious career, died more than years before his so-called prophecy first appeared in Europe, which is when the clearer references end and the impossibly vague ones begin. The author must have had fun composing this literary and historical curiosity, but it is a fake. Nevertheless, it seems to be rediscovered and gains a brief, new following about every 20 or 25 years.
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archindy.org/criterion/files/2006/pdfs/20061027.pdf
Malachy’s prophecy has been cast into doubt by the fact that the descriptions become vague from the 16th century on–about the time the prophecy was “discovered” in the Roman Archives. But there have been a few good matches in modern times. The phrase “pastor et nauta,” meaning “shepherd and sailor,” was attributed to John XXIII. This pope hailed from Venice, historically a city of sailors, and on the day he took office he indicated the goal of his pontificate was to be “a good shepherd.”
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There have been many more misses, though. Describing the popes to follow John XXIII are the phrases “flower of flowers” (Paul VI), “from a half-moon” (John Paul I), and “from the toil of the sun” (John Paul II), none of which is an obvious connection. After our current pope there are only two left in Malachy’s prophecy, “the glory of the olive” and “Peter the Roman.” The latter will supposedly lead the Church through many tribulations, concluding with the last judgment.
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Is “Malachy’s” prophecy legitimate? Probably not. The consensus among modern scholars is that it is a 16th-century forgery created for partisan political reasons.
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catholic.com/quickquestions/do-the-prophecies-of-st-malachy-suggest-we-are-living-in-the-end-times
 
dshix said:
Then why were prophecies attributed to St. Malachy 300 years (something like that) after his death? He said nothing of them while he lived, and no one else brought them up until long after he was dead. The prophecies might have been coincidentally correct on some counts, but that doesn’t mean they were divinely inspired.
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They were dead on right for three hundred years and then became hit or miss. Of course, they were found three hundred years after the death of St. Malachy. 😉
 
dshix said:
Then why were prophecies attributed to St. Malachy 300 years (something like that) after his death? He said nothing of them while he lived, and no one else brought them up until long after he was dead. The prophecies might have been coincidentally correct on some counts, but that doesn’t mean they were divinely inspired.
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In olde tymes, it was common to use the name of some other notable person as a pseudonym in order to make sure your work is read.

Still, the writing is vague enough it is difficult to determine for certain what it means.
 
SonCatcher said:
In olde tymes, it was common to use the name of some other notable person as a pseudonym in order to make sure your work is read.

Still, the writing is vague enough it is difficult to determine for certain what it means.
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Which means… it’s fake…
 
dshix said:
Which means… it’s fake…
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Not necessarily. Pseudo-Dionysius is the real deal, even if he did forge Dionysius’ name.

EDIT: But, as I was saying about the vagueness… I have periodically looked at the horoscopes published in the newspaper. They are vaguely written, and intentionally so. It seems that most of the entries are equally “applicable” to the events of one’s day because the reader reinterprets it in light of the events that happened.
 
dshix said:
Then why were prophecies attributed to St. Malachy 300 years (something like that) after his death? He said nothing of them while he lived, and no one else brought them up until long after he was dead. The prophecies might have been coincidentally correct on some counts, but that doesn’t mean they were divinely inspired.
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Oh, I am almost certain that they are fakes, but they did nail (if you’ll pardon the expression) the papacy of JPII the Great.
 
Why, oh why, do people who repeatedly talk about adherence to orthodoxy and Catholic teaching and the beauty of God’s love and the belief of the Church being under the guidance of the Holy Spirit continue to bring up such nonsense over and over again?

Don’t they realize this is exactly the type of superstitious, conspiracy theory thinking that feeds the non-religious world and makes Catholics look idiotic and backwards?

Friends, stick with the true teachings of the Church and stay away from such rubbish. If you really are that bored, quite frankly, get a dog!
 
coachdennis said:
Why, oh why, do people who repeatedly talk about adherence to orthodoxy and Catholic teaching and the beauty of God’s love and the belief of the Church being under the guidance of the Holy Spirit continue to bring up such nonsense over and over again?

Don’t they realize this is exactly the type of superstitious, conspiracy theory thinking that feeds the non-religious world and makes Catholics look idiotic and backwards?

Friends, stick with the true teachings of the Church and stay away from such rubbish. If you really are that bored, quite frankly, get a dog!
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Haha, well put. :rolleyes:
 
My Mother In Law, an orthodox and devout catholic, believes that the Anti-Christ could come via the papacy. I told her that although I would never persume to know the mind of almighty God, i just can’t imagine that he would permit that.
 
coachdennis said:
Why, oh why, do people who repeatedly talk about adherence to orthodoxy and Catholic teaching and the beauty of God’s love and the belief of the Church being under the guidance of the Holy Spirit continue to bring up such nonsense over and over again?

Don’t they realize this is exactly the type of superstitious, conspiracy theory thinking that feeds the non-religious world and makes Catholics look idiotic and backwards?

Friends, stick with the true teachings of the Church and stay away from such rubbish. If you really are that bored, quite frankly, get a dog!
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Amen and Amen to that!!! God Bless, Memaw
 
Curious_Georgia said:
Hello, I just came across this old thread from 2004 while JPII was still alive, discussing St. Malachy’s prophecies of the Popes. It was a very interesting read, especially in light of Pope Benedict’s recent resignation:

forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=47852

I just wanted to share and perhaps give the discussion on St. Malachy’s prophecies new life. I should note that St. Malachy’s prophecies are private revelation and therefore as faithful Catholics we are not bound to believe or disbelieve them.
Click to expand...
Would you happen to know the man with the yellow hat?😛
altarbouy said:
Ah, the “prophecies” of St. Malachy . Don’t put any stock in them. As Karl Keating stated on last night’s Catholic Answers Live, they’re forgeries, pure and simple. Unfortunately a lot of conspiracy-minded fundamentalists are in hyper-drive over this, mainly due to a website and book by a loose cannon fundamentalist named Tom Horn who runs a website that has been promoting his book for some months now:
raidersnewsupdate.com/ - Even the politically partisan WorldNetDaily has picked up the story. Horn puts anti-Catholic bigot Jack Chick to shame in his shrill diatribes against the Holy See.
This same Horn, by the way, a few years ago predicted that **the year 2012 would see the rise of the anti-Christ **and other momentous end-times events. Check the reviews of his book “Apollyon Rising 2012” at Amazon.com. None of what he predicted would happen happened. Apparently his fans have quickly forgotten his book and numerous radio interviews in which he confidently asserted that 2012 was THE year!
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He might be have risen, perhaps just not high enough.😉

Okay, in all seriousness, it’s beyond odd that the next pope (who will be the last one per the book if I recall correctly), according to the “prophesy”, will lead the Church amidst intense tribulation and her last persecution, which describes fairly accurately what we are beholding these days. It will get nastier but it’s pretty intense at the time being. How could anyone have foreseen our troubled times several centuries ago?
 
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