Mark Shea and Simcha Fisher Fired from National Catholic Register

[gracepoole]

So according to both bloggers, Mark Shea and Simcha Fisher have been fired by the NCRegister. They both wrote opinion pieces for the newspaper. It would seem their social media presences have much to do with it, but that’s speculation (from me) based on this: stream.org/pro-life-catholics-deserve-better-writers-national-catholic-register/

More attacks on Shea:
lifesitenews.com/opinion/mark-shea-would-lie-to-attack-pro-lifers-but-not-to-save-anne-frank-or-babi

I’ve never been an enormous fan of either but it strikes me as sad that anyone who is pro-life but doesn’t line up politically and see the GOP as a truly pro-life option is shot down.

 

[Monte_RCMS]

Kinda strange that the newer radical left wing National Catholic Reporter has the same design as the older more conservative traditional National Catholic Register.

Sigh.

1927: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Catholic_Register
ncregister.com

1964: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Catholic_Reporter
ncronline.org

Promoting a progressive position, NCR presents itself “as one of the few, if not the only truly independent, journalistic outlet for Catholics and others who struggle with the complex moral and societal issues of the day.”[6] However, the publication has been accused of ideological bias, favoring voices of dissent within the Catholic Church both in its expression of opinion and in its choice of news to report and of tending to criticize statements by the Holy See and Catholic bishops.[7] NCR has asserted that climate change is the most important pro-life issue facing the Catholic Church.[3]

Pray for the Catholic Church, so beset by attacks.

Holy Spirit, please help us.

 

[St_Francis]

So according to both bloggers, Mark Shea and Simcha Fisher have been fired by the NCRegister. They both wrote opinion pieces for the newspaper. It would seem their social media presences have much to do with it, but that’s speculation (from me) based on this: stream.org/pro-life-catholics-deserve-better-writers-national-catholic-register/

More attacks on Shea:
lifesitenews.com/opinion/mark-shea-would-lie-to-attack-pro-lifers-but-not-to-save-anne-frank-or-babi

I’ve never been an enormous fan of either but it strikes me as sad that anyone who is pro-life but doesn’t line up politically and see the GOP as a truly pro-life option is shot down.

From what I understand, Shea went far beyond that, and Fisher was somewhat scatalogical.

 

[Usige]

This is supposedly the official response from NCR, though I only find it reported by others and not on NCR itself.

The Register is no longer publishing blogs or commentaries submitted by Mark Shea. Mark’s writings at the NCRegister.com or published in our print edition were within our editorial guidelines. However, his writings and engagement on other forums were irreconcilable with our editorial vision or standards of charitable discussion.

(emphasis added)

I don’t think it was what he wrote about, but how he did it. Mr Shea has become more and more acrid in his writings and has blasted whole groups who disagree with him by insulting them at every turn. It wasn’t simply agreeing to disagree, but saying things like “you, and everyone like you, are morons”. I think it is that type of uncharitable writing that caused him to run afoul of the editorial board. When you are regularly calling readers of NCR morons because of their views, it should not be suprising if they no longer carry your pieces.

While I don’t know about Mrs Fischer’s situation, I suspect her regular use of fairly vulgar phrases and double entendre on Facebook and othet media, put her in the same boat. Again, I don’t think it was for what she wrote, but the vulgarity (and occasional vulgarity laden tirade) that did not endear her to the editors.

I’ll admit that I am not a regular reader of either author or NCR, but the pieces I have read by them does not seem consistent with the style of EWTN. I suspect that the editors had a number of complaints about the authors and decided to terminate them because of those complaints. That is merely speculation, but would make sense if they were damaging the readership of the paper.

 

[pensmama87]

I’m a fan of both of their writings, and they were the only reason I read the Register (apart from the odd film review by Stephen Greydanus.)

They can be very “real” on their Facebook pages. In Mrs. Fisher’s case, I don’t know how you have ten kids and survive without cracking a few “toilet humor” jokes. I find her willingness to be open about that stuff really refreshing, and her writings about human sexuality and NFP are really, really good.

I was not a fan of Mr. Shea’s political writings (at least, those that are less polished), but I think he has a knack for clearly and beautifully explaning the Faith to those outside it, especially evangelicals.

Overall I think the Register is going to lose out. It also seems they were both the targets of deliberate attempts to discredit and fire them, and I think that kind of infighting is despicable no matter who does it. Catholics should be building each other up, not tearing each other down.

 

[Usige]

It also seems they were both the targets of deliberate attempts to discredit and fire them, and I think that kind of infighting is despicable no matter who does it. Catholics should be building each other up, not tearing each other down.

But it seems the bolded appears to be exactly the issue that NCR had with Mr Shea; his repeated insults of Catholics he disagreed with. I seem to remember him once saying politically conservative Catholics are like the Waffen SS in following political ideology without regard to morals. It is exactly those types of political pot shots that many find uncharitable.

I’m not sure what you mean with “deliberate attempts to discredit and fire them”? Do you mean that people made things up or twisted some of their postings to be vulgar or uncharitable when they weren’t? My understanding is it was less about content than it was about style. I am not trying to dismiss what you are saying but I’ve not seen anything meant to discredit what they say. I have certainly seen people that disagree with what they say or their style and that are happy to see them shown the door, but I don’t know that I would call that attempts to discredit them.

 

[Mintaka]

I think it would be important to find out if they were just done with their contracts, versus actually being fired. Nobody seems to know anything solid, and yet people are talking about this stuff all over.

 

[Mary_Gail_36]

I’m a fan of both of their writings, and they were the only reason I read the Register (apart from the odd film review by Stephen Greydanus.)

They can be very “real” on their Facebook pages. In Mrs. Fisher’s case, I don’t know how you have ten kids and survive without cracking a few “toilet humor” jokes. I find her willingness to be open about that stuff really refreshing, and her writings about human sexuality and NFP are really, really good.

I was not a fan of Mr. Shea’s political writings (at least, those that are less polished), but I think he has a knack for clearly and beautifully explaning the Faith to those outside it, especially evangelicals.

Overall I think the Register is going to lose out. It also seems they were both the targets of deliberate attempts to discredit and fire them, and I think that kind of infighting is despicable no matter who does it. Catholics should be building each other up, not tearing each other down.

I feel bad for both. Probably worse for Simcha.

I follow both.

I totally can relate to Mark’s POV. I can understand his frustration in these times.

The vitriol I witnessed last night on Twitter and other blogs though was horrible. Catholics should not be calling Simcha names. Catholics should not be criticizing Simcha because she bought a steak on food stamps .

Terrible!!

 

[Joe_5859]

So according to both bloggers, Mark Shea and Simcha Fisher have been fired by the NCRegister. They both wrote opinion pieces for the newspaper. It would seem their social media presences have much to do with it, but that’s speculation (from me) based on this: stream.org/pro-life-catholics-deserve-better-writers-national-catholic-register/

More attacks on Shea:
lifesitenews.com/opinion/mark-shea-would-lie-to-attack-pro-lifers-but-not-to-save-anne-frank-or-babi

I’ve never been an enormous fan of either but it strikes me as sad that anyone who is pro-life but doesn’t line up politically and see the GOP as a truly pro-life option is shot down.

I really don’t think that it has anything to do with the GOP. I read both authors and the Register often enough. When I heard the news, I wasn’t terribly shocked. Mark Shea readily admits that he struggles with his temper. I’ve seen some of his and Fisher’s comments on Facebook (usually it’s in the comments responding to commenters, not in their articles or blog posts). They do overstep the bounds of charitable discourse (at least in my mind).

I still enjoy both of them more than not. And I know we all have our bad days. But I can also understand why the Register would want to distance themselves from that level of discourse.

Where did you read that Fisher was fired? I still see her blog listed in the drop down menu of the “blogs” tab on the Register homepage (though I no longer see her pictured on the right hand side). Shea is no longer listed in either place.

 

[steido01]

From what I understand, Shea went far beyond that, and Fisher was somewhat scatalogical.

Who cares? The Bible mentions poop more than a dozen times. St. Paul wished the Judaizers would’ve “gone the whole way!” and emasculated themselves. If the words fit, why shouldn’t a writer use it? Especially when today’s vernacular seems to only be understood in headlines and even then only when shouted.

I don’t understand the modern self-righteous faux-outrage that some have shown. (Not accusing you, mind you. Simply noting that it’s common.)

 

[PietroPaolo]

Who cares?

Apparently the editors of the National Catholic Register. They certainly are within their rights to disassociate themselves with anyone who they feel doesn’t represent the newspaper and the values and level of discourse for which it aims.

Continually insulting people for disagreeing with opinions you hold is a good way of getting yourself fired as is using scatalogical humor.

But don’t take my word for it, use some “poop jokes” with your boss at work, or verbally attack him for daring to disagree with your politics, and see what happens.

I see no reason why Shea and Fisher ought to be excepted.

 

[DeniseNY]

Apparently the editors of the National Catholic Register. They certainly are within their rights to disassociate themselves with anyone who they feel doesn’t represent the newspaper and the values and level of discourse for which it aims.

Continually insulting people for disagreeing with opinions you hold is a good way of getting yourself fired as is using scatalogical humor.

But don’t take my word for it, use some “poop jokes” with your boss at work, or verbally attack him for daring to disagree with your politics, and see what happens.

I see no reason why Shea and Fisher ought to be excepted.

 

[Mary_Gail_36]

I really don’t think that it has anything to do with the GOP. I read both authors and the Register often enough. When I heard the news, I wasn’t terribly shocked. Mark Shea readily admits that he struggles with his temper. I’ve seen some of his and Fisher’s comments on Facebook (usually it’s in the comments responding to commenters, not in their articles or blog posts). They do overstep the bounds of charitable discourse (at least in my mind).

I still enjoy both of them more than not. And I know we all have our bad days. But I can also understand why the Register would want to distance themselves from that level of discourse.

Where did you read that Fisher was fired? I still see her blog listed in the drop down menu of the “blogs” tab on the Register homepage (though I no longer see her pictured on the right hand side). Shea is no longer listed in either place.

Simcha had it on Twitter yesterday evening.

 

[Yeoman]

I’m a fan of both of their writings, and they were the only reason I read the Register (apart from the odd film review by Stephen Greydanus.)

They can be very “real” on their Facebook pages. In Mrs. Fisher’s case, I don’t know how you have ten kids and survive without cracking a few “toilet humor” jokes. I find her willingness to be open about that stuff really refreshing, and her writings about human sexuality and NFP are really, really good.

I was not a fan of Mr. Shea’s political writings (at least, those that are less polished), but I think he has a knack for clearly and beautifully explaning the Faith to those outside it, especially evangelicals.

Overall I think the Register is going to lose out. It also seems they were both the targets of deliberate attempts to discredit and fire them, and I think that kind of infighting is despicable no matter who does it. Catholics should be building each other up, not tearing each other down.

I haven’t read this entire thread yet, so I may be responding where others already have.

In Shea’s case, I think some of his writings crossed the line, for an apologist, from arguing a point to making a moral argument that was problematic in terms of urging votes a certain way. For a Catholic Apologist, that’s a fairly serious matter. Writing on the election is one thing, but urging votes in this morally heavily laden election is another. Therefore, I’m not sorry to see him go.

Fisher is another matter. Her comments on Facebook not only were vulgar, but quite frankly they were highly suggestive in a context which would cause a person to wonder about a person’s familiarity with what was being described. That’s fine, I suppose, but a person who writes from the context of a mother to be suggestive as an insult in the way she was, was clearly too much. I"m really sorry however as I really liked her writing.

Vulgarity has gotten too far in our culture in general, and we’ve become too acclimated. I feel like Fisher became a victim of that, but it was of her own making. I hope her writing returns to the NCR at some point.

 

[Yeoman]

I’m a fan of both of their writings, and they were the only reason I read the Register (apart from the odd film review by Stephen Greydanus.)

They can be very “real” on their Facebook pages. In Mrs. Fisher’s case, I don’t know how you have ten kids and survive without cracking a few “toilet humor” jokes. I find her willingness to be open about that stuff really refreshing, and her writings about human sexuality and NFP are really, really good.

I was not a fan of Mr. Shea’s political writings (at least, those that are less polished), but I think he has a knack for clearly and beautifully explaning the Faith to those outside it, especially evangelicals.

Overall I think the Register is going to lose out. It also seems they were both the targets of deliberate attempts to discredit and fire them, and I think that kind of infighting is despicable no matter who does it. Catholics should be building each other up, not tearing each other down.

With Shea, at some point, it would have become hard to separate his political writings from his religious ones, and the writings themselves did not do that.

I feel religious writers should comment on politics, and indeed I find the policy of this website to discourage that to be reflective of a problem the entire Church has about not wanting to comment directly on elections. We should be commenting directly on elections. The problem was, however, that Shea’s writings in this area seemed off the rails, really, in their moral arguments in regards to his swing state position.

 

[Yeoman]

Who cares? The Bible mentions poop more than a dozen times. St. Paul wished the Judaizers would’ve “gone the whole way!” and emasculated themselves. If the words fit, why shouldn’t a writer use it? Especially when today’s vernacular seems to only be understood in headlines and even then only when shouted.

I don’t understand the modern self-righteous faux-outrage that some have shown. (Not accusing you, mind you. Simply noting that it’s common.)

There are also numerous comments in the New Testament about not using vulgarity.

Having said that, and having only read of this as of this morning, I think the problem goes beyond mere vulgarity. It’s one thing to be scatological. It’s another to compare the symbol used by one of the two major candidates to being a cross between a swastika and an act between male and female that can be rather morally problematic in some circumstances, and would be in the way it was casually mentioned.

If you have a writer who writes from a female prospective, and from the prospective of a mother of several children, making causal references to an act that of that type, you’ve skated on to thin ice. Once a person mentions an act, it’s generally presumed they are familiar with it. Indeed, if you aren’t familiar with it, how would you know something looked like it? It’s not necessarily the case that this causes a moral problem, but in order to explain the morality of it, you’re explaining something that’s pretty graphic. And at that point, you are probably where you don’t need to be as a columnist in her context. Going there was really foolish on her part and she inevitably lost credit as a result.

I think this is likely a symptom of the degree to which public discourse is in the dumps in this country. But, given what she said, I don’t know that the NCR had much of a choice. In their place, I might have done the same. Having said that, I wish she’d been retained.

 

[Mary_Gail_36]

With Shea, at some point, it would have become hard to separate his political writings from his religious ones, and the writings themselves did not do that.

I feel religious writers should comment on politics, and indeed I find the policy of this website to discourage that to be reflective of a problem the entire Church has about not wanting to comment directly on elections. We should be commenting directly on elections. The problem was, however, that Shea’s writings in this area seemed off the rails, really, in their moral arguments in regards to his swing state position.

His political writing were on his blog at Patheos though.

Simcha, supposedly wrote something overly risque’ on her own facebook page.

Her blogs on National Catholic Register and her personal one were non political, general mommy blogging. She had a feature on preparing meals for many children. She talked about NFP. She’s discussed her struggles with post partum depression. She discussed her struggle with her mom with Alzheimer’s.

I like her and found her personable.

 

[PietroPaolo]

Apparently the man himself is weighing-in, with righteous indignation,

Look, I get that I’m abrasive and I get the rejoicing over my losing a job. Fair enough. But don’t hand me a load of bushwah about how Simcha Fisher had this coming. Somehow or other, the anti-abortion-but-not-prolife movement has mutated into a thing that eats its young and imagines that the unborn are being served by punishing a mother of 10 children with loss of her livelihood.
This. Was. Wrong.
Simcha Fisher is an ornament of the Church. She has been such a gift to so many and I will be grateful to God for her till the day I die. Punishing a mother of 10 with loss of income over something this utterly trivial is a judgment, not on her, but on the mob of bullies across St. Blog’s rejoicing over her humiliation. She does none harm. She says none harm. She thinks none harm. Nevertheless, it is not for the bawdy jokes that this mob have sought her blood, but because she would not bend to the marriage of the Faith with a fraudulent disgrace like Donald Trump.

patheos.com/blogs/markshea/2016/08/istandwithsimchafisher.html?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=facebook

 

[PietroPaolo]

So, it’s the fault of pro-lifers, republicans who support Trump, St. Blog, and whoever else except the woman fired. He also manages to attack his former employer by disparaging their motives. Like him or hate him, it really isn’t hard to see why they fired him.

 

[steido01]

Apparently the editors of the National Catholic Register. They certainly are within their rights to disassociate themselves with anyone who they feel doesn’t represent the newspaper and the values and level of discourse for which it aims.

Continually insulting people for disagreeing with opinions you hold is a good way of getting yourself fired as is using scatalogical humor.

But don’t take my word for it, use some “poop jokes” with your boss at work, or verbally attack him for daring to disagree with your politics, and see what happens.

I see no reason why Shea and Fisher ought to be excepted.

Shouldn’t writers, thinkers, artists, and all others who are paid to, essentially, *think *be free to do so without being censored? Seems to be the nature of the medium. It requires the freedom to speak.