Married 7 months and having a family dilemma

[EasterJoy]

I agree, and there may be other scenarios we do not know. My point is that it MAY very well be incestuous, and it most certainly is definitely wrong of the parents to do under any circumstances. Now, what the conditions of the situation are exactly and what the young married couple could do better are all debatable. The only thing that isn’t really debatable is the OPs original point in the post. If they should not engage in loud chandelier swinging sex, and get a job is not really the issue here. And until the OP clarifies, we are all just blowing smoke anyway. I can tell you as someone who is married, and has intrusive parents that what the OP is describing does indeed raise some odd sexual flags from the parents end. If they are trying to send a message that they do not approve of the marriage, age, or possibility of children, what they are doing will damage the marriage of those involved and also a future aspect of family especially if kids are involved.

If we’re just “blowing smoke”, then let’s not drop the “incest” bomb into this. If you want to talk about an accusation that is going to damage a relationship, that is one right there. When that word is appropriate, distance is undeniably in order. If the term is used when it is not appropriate, the target is going to be the one who feels rightfully indignant and unfairly vilified. That is a terrible accusation to make. Use the word when it applies, but until then, do not throw it around lightly.

 

[LongingSoul]

The OP expresses no such expectation that the parents cannot make rules. The OP is surprised (as I think most people would be) and asked for suggestions.

I was more addressing the attitude of HD who said that these parents behaviour amounted to incest. The original post didn’t inspire me to contribute at first. I could see the OP was surprised but since I’m ‘living the dream’ of adult but still dependent children, I know the unique joys of being called on time and time again as a safety net for a child who by rights should be independent and beginning to think about helping his parents out sometimes. There are quandries that a parent of a highly dependent, (sometimes feeling entitled to carefree responsibility free life at a parents expense) adult child, have to deal with as best they can.

 

[EasterJoy]

The OP expresses no such expectation that the parents cannot make rules. The OP is surprised (as I think most people would be) and asked for suggestions.

If her question is “If a married couple is invited to move in with someone, is it normally assumed that they will be given double accommodations if such accommodations are available without displacing another married couple?” then the answer is YES.

If her question is “Is it OK for parents to treat a married child as if she were not married when setting up sleeping arrangements for a child and her husband?” the answer is NO, provided that they are validly married, it isn’t, but should the parents try it and the child has to draw a boundary about it, both firmness and a sense of gentle humor are in order, and perhaps a bit more tolerance than the parents are strictly entitled to have.

If her question is “Am I stuck in a beggars-can’t-be-choosers situation here, with no negotiation possible?” the answer is, “You won’t know unless you ask your parents.” If* their *answer is “Yes,” then look for other digs ASAP, because this probably won’t be the last “arbitrary” decision you have falling against you, OP. I don’t even have to know why, and that is the way I’d bet.

 

[Hoosier_Daddy]

If we’re just “blowing smoke”, then let’s not drop the “incest” bomb into this. If you want to talk about an accusation that is going to damage a relationship, that is one right there. When that word is appropriate, distance is undeniably in order. If the term is used when it is not appropriate, the target is going to be the one who feels rightfully indignant and unfairly vilified. That is a terrible accusation to make. Use the word when it applies, but until then, do not throw it around lightly.

I see that it bothers many here to “drop the incest bomb” Ok that is an unpleasant topic. I still think there is some possibility of that. A parent of a grown woman does not want her sleeping with her husband with the only apparent motive sexual.

Incestuous overtones or not. There will be much damage inflicted upon the OP and her husband because of this.

 

[Rau]

…
regardless, this is a very unhealthy and borderline incestuous situation.

Perhaps this language is a bit incendiary especially in light of the absence of corroborating evidence. I get the meaning, which the remainder of your (original) post did capture without inflaming anyone!

 

[Rau]

If her question is “If a married couple is invited to move in with someone, is it normally assumed that they will be given double accommodations if such accommodations are available without displacing another married couple?” then the answer is YES.

If her question is “Is it OK for parents to treat a married child as if she were not married when setting up sleeping arrangements for a child and her husband?” the answer is NO, provided that they are validly married, it isn’t, but should the parents try it and the child has to draw a boundary about it, both firmness and a sense of gentle humor are in order, and perhaps a bit more tolerance than the parents are strictly entitled to have.

If her question is “Am I stuck in a beggars-can’t-be-choosers situation here, with no negotiation possible?” the answer is, “You won’t know unless you ask your parents.” If* their *answer is “Yes,” then look for other digs ASAP, because this probably won’t be the last “arbitrary” decision you have falling against you, OP. I don’t even have to know why, and that is the way I’d bet.

I agree with your Q&A. I think LongingSoul inadvertently “verballed” the OP to a degree - by assuming facts not in evidence.

 

[LongingSoul]

I agree with your Q&A. I think LongingSoul inadvertently “verballed” the OP to a degree - by assuming facts not in evidence.

The OP didn’t return to the thread after the first page or so so the issue as do most threads here, became a theoretical exercise.

At first I did feel the possible influence of people bagging on the OPs parents as problematic for their relationship. She is young and we simply don’t know this families history. If she came to this Catholic site surprised by her dilemma and left outraged and indignant against such evil parents… there is a problem. I clearly remember my son coming home from his First Eucharist and Reconciliation class with what I believe is a life changing experience. The ladies (who were the holier and involved mothers of the Parish) asked the question ‘what happens when you sin?’. My son, all excited to know the answer, put up his hand and said ‘you get a black mark on your soul’, which is the wording that I had used all along in teaching them about sin. The ladies all laughed. Apparently this is not how Catholics talk anymore and essentially your Mother is just a dumb dumb. (They didn’t say this but that’s how he translated the whole embarrassing moment) I still feel that that imagery which is how I learnt about the effects of sin, is powerful and meaningful to me. I do feel the shadow of sin on my soul and I feel the veil lifted by Reconciliation. This is the son who has rebelled against everything we say and do and I feel that that excruciating experience when he was 7 contributed to that dynamic somewhat. It does matter what we say to the young as Catholic adults. It does affect their relationship with their parents to paint them as lesser than a good Catholic parent.

I still think it is important for children to respect thier parents first and foremost even if they think their ideas are dumb. Respect is important and especially respect within their own home.

 

[Aaron_Brrr]

Interesting LongingSoul. On a scale of 1-10, how would you rate the parent’s respect for the OP’s marriage in this scenario?

 

[EasterJoy]

Perhaps this language is a bit incendiary especially in light of the absence of corroborating evidence. I get the meaning, which the remainder of your (original) post did capture without inflaming anyone!

Yes, the idea that it is inappropriate is on the spot, but jumping to the most inappropriate possible cause is, I don’t know how to put it…prematurely Freudian, perhaps?

 

[Hoosier_Daddy]

Yes, the idea that it is inappropriate is on the spot, but jumping to the most inappropriate possible cause is, I don’t know how to put it…prematurely Freudian, perhaps?

I can back of the incestuous accusation. I am not married to it. But I think it is worth noting that it is a possibility, not necessarily in action, but in psychological undertones. A parent interfering in a grown, Married, child’s sex life in an intrusive and invasive, uninvited, and unwanted way, and in effect psychologically castrating the ego of the husband by this awkward and deliberate, in your face move is odd.

It either indicates that we do not have the full story from the OP or that the parents have some serious issues. But charitably I go by the only information we have, the OPs post. And yes, it is one sided, and yes, there is something that does not seem right about it but if the OP’s description is accurate and inclusive of all the information we need, there is something down right scary about this level of sexual involvement by the parents.

Legally can the parents make some sort of condition on the living situation. Yes probably. But morally, and relationaly they cannot make this type of in your face disrespect to a married family member. It is odd. Pick up your clothes, sure. Buy your own food and cook it yourselves. Yup. But separating the marital bed of a grown couple!? Weird, and not kind of but VERY creepy.

 

[LongingSoul]

Interesting LongingSoul. On a scale of 1-10, how would you rate the parent’s respect for the OP’s marriage in this scenario?

My perspective was not about saying what the parents were doing but saying that what *others were suggesting they were doing *is not necessarily right. We don’t know at the end of the day, what they were thinking. But as a parent of adult dependent children, faced with the quandry of obligation and some resentment that you are being constantly used as a safety net for the adult child who doesn’t want to rely on their own ingenuity… it’s possible that the parents reaction is a way of protecting themselves against a life of bailing a child out.

There was a news story here recently about a mother who’d been granted a restraining order for 20 years against a son who constantly pestered her for money for drugs and other lifestyle choices. The son was 50 and the mother was 78! I looked at my husband and we groaned. Perhaps Aaron Brrr your children aren’t at that age yet… but with any luck you will have it sorted by the time they are and won’t need to deal with it… But many of us out of ignorance and weakness (but not for wont of trying) as parents, have failed to get these kids on their feet and are looking into a lifetime of servitude to adult children who know that your feelings of guilt will keep you there for them forever. Sometimes you are at your wits end about it and make rules that you think will help them and protect you. Sometimes those rules don’t seem ok to others but it doesn’t always mean that you’re a deviant with sexual interest in your child. That’s what I see as VERY creepy.

 

[underacloud]

Sometimes those rules don’t seem ok to others but it doesn’t always mean that you’re a deviant with sexual interest in your child. That’s what I see as VERY creepy.

One poster commented on a potential incest issue. No one else has supported that view. And yet you keep raising it in arguments with other posters.

Anyway, you seem to be suggesting that the parents are deliberately trying to make living in their house unappealing so they will move out. Good. That seems to mean you are in agreement with almost everyone else that the couple ought to move out (whether from the parents’ persepctive or the couple’s).

I think this whole thread has scared off the OP? OP, are you still here?

 

[hamilte3]

I came in late and this may not be helpful because of it. Me and my wife had issues early on and it was due to an ignorance of sexual morality on my part. Our relationship counselor was understanding of the both of us, but I was wrong. It was a matter of conscience for me, and an incorrect conscience. Therefore the delimma was about as great and perhaps of your in-laws (or is it his in-laws??) level. So love them and do not hold it against them. I think you or your husband could read up a little like in the CCC for example and ease their minds. Like some posters, it is at the very least a matter of justice to sleep togather due to natural law, but I also see it is recognized by the church, so obedience of faith compells a catholic to regard the marraige as valid. You could also get support from a parish preist who, with you two with love, kindness and understanding, straighten out the whole misunderstanding.

If not, I would not dwell on it to much. Remember that someone in ignorance are more susceptable to scandal despite the injustice they might cause. But to be sure, they have given you and your husband shelter so their hearts are in the right place as far as they can for the moment, it appears. It may also be something else in their hearts, but the Lord only knows. So it sounds really hard, but don’t dwell on anything like that, Maybe its just a time for prayer that the Lord allows.

So if a missionary went to a foriegn land and saw injustice, or backwardness that needed repair, I think he would make friends with them and tell them about Jesus Christ. As a baptized Christian, it is the first matter. And of course, your husband is your first Christian to be concerned about, but not too far after that, your moms and dads. (Kids of course would be before them when they come). This is a very important matter, but Jesus loves them all. Maybe you can get it all to work out there. If not completely, as I’m sure you know, living on your own is the best solution when it can be done. It probaby isn’t sooner enough. I will pray for you and all those invovled.

Also remember that the challenge of having a whole new family for a newly married couple you will want to be ready for. I mean, be Jesus to them all right from the get-go. Too often in our individualist society, extended family relations get strained I hope and am also confident that with God’s grace you can keep it all just as needed for all those involved. Pray to everyone’s guardian angels for guidance, love and support.

Best of all in your first big challenge! Remember, Jesus gave us companions for life in marraige, but a cross will always be there. Accept its challenge and offer what suffering you can to him. He will bless you trememdously! Confession will also be of great relief since family can help you see and feel your inner challenges as well. Its funny, the confessional can sort of help you hold up a white flag when feeling your in a fight! I’ve found that many times. But bless the Lord for helping you see yourself inside better. And bless him for the gifts he’s given you in your family. He is always to be be praised and blessed.

You have my prayers as well sister in Christ. Let us know of how it goes if you want to share! You may have an uplifting story for our benifit here as well.

Sincerely,

Ed Hamilton

 

[Hoosier_Daddy]

My perspective was not about saying what the parents were doing but saying that what *others were suggesting they were doing *is not necessarily right. We don’t know at the end of the day, what they were thinking. But as a parent of adult dependent children, faced with the quandry of obligation and some resentment that you are being constantly used as a safety net for the adult child who doesn’t want to rely on their own ingenuity… it’s possible that the parents reaction is a way of protecting themselves against a life of bailing a child out.

There was a news story here recently about a mother who’d been granted a restraining order for 20 years against a son who constantly pestered her for money for drugs and other lifestyle choices. The son was 50 and the mother was 78! I looked at my husband and we groaned. Perhaps Aaron Brrr your children aren’t at that age yet… but with any luck you will have it sorted by the time they are and won’t need to deal with it… But many of us out of ignorance and weakness (but not for wont of trying) as parents, have failed to get these kids on their feet and are looking into a lifetime of servitude to adult children who know that your feelings of guilt will keep you there for them forever. Sometimes you are at your wits end about it and make rules that you think will help them and protect you. Sometimes those rules don’t seem ok to others but it doesn’t always mean that you’re a deviant with sexual interest in your child. That’s what I see as VERY creepy.

I think your experience as a parent is clouding your view here.

There is NO POSSIBLE situation in which the parents are doing the “right thing”

So while you might sympathize with situations in which parents have to help grown children navigate through life, you need to see that what these particular parents are doing is really really bad. No matter the intentions, which may very well come from a place of love and thinking they are right. I very much doubt that they are wringing their hands and laughing with an evil laugh about this, but if the OP is to be believed, there is a problem with the situation.

Can’t you just say the parents are wrong? Without any qualifiers or sugar coating, or way of kind of saying it but not really? Or is it too close to your experiences to look at objectively?

 

[LongingSoul]

I think your experience as a parent is clouding your view here.

There is NO POSSIBLE situation in which the parents are doing the “right thing”

So while you might sympathize with situations in which parents have to help grown children navigate through life, you need to see that what these particular parents are doing is really really bad. No matter the intentions, which may very well come from a place of love and thinking they are right. I very much doubt that they are wringing their hands and laughing with an evil laugh about this, but if the OP is to be believed, there is a problem with the situation.

Can’t you just say the parents are wrong? Without any qualifiers or sugar coating, or way of kind of saying it but not really? Or is it too close to your experiences to look at objectively?

I didn’t enter the discussion to whitewash the parents. I just didn’t think it was right for people like yourself to be so damning of the parents without any more information than a few lines in the original post. Sure I know what it is like to be damned as a parent for having rules that others think are evil… but can’t you just say that your assessment of the evilness of the parents is coloured by your own dodgy relationship with your parents which you gave us?

 

[Hoosier_Daddy]

I didn’t enter the discussion to whitewash the parents. I just didn’t think it was right for people like yourself to be so damning of the parents without any more information than a few lines in the original post. Sure I know what it is like to be damned as a parent for having rules that others think are evil… but can’t you just say that your assessment of the evilness of the parents is coloured by your own dodgy relationship with your parents which you gave us?

I’m not “damning” anyone. And you still can’t do it can you.

The parents are wrong. You have no information that would support that they are not wrong. What the parents are doing is potentially unhealthy for all involved and they are most certainly damaging their daughter and her marriage. Or the OP would not have posted here.

Just say they are wrong, I moved away from the accusation of incest. Can you meet me a little here. Like I said, their motives MIGHT be good. The action is horrible!

If you cannot agree, then you may very well need to look at the role of a parent and a husband and wife.

 

[LongingSoul]

I’m not “damning” anyone. And you still can’t do it can you.

The parents are wrong. You have no information that would support that they are not wrong. What the parents are doing is potentially unhealthy for all involved and they are most certainly damaging their daughter and her marriage. Or the OP would not have posted here.

Just say they are wrong, I moved away from the accusation of incest. Can you meet me a little here. Like I said, their motives MIGHT be good. The action is horrible!

If you cannot agree, then you may very well need to look at the role of a parent and a husband and wife.

For the short time a couple needs emergency accommodation, their marriage is not going to suffer by separate beds. Parents should not have to rearrange their lives or accommodate any guest in this way if they so choose. They are well within their rights to ask for some compromise from their adult child guest for the short period of time they need that emergency accommodation. Millions of couples have spent great lengths of time apart without damaging their marriage.

 

[Hoosier_Daddy]

For the short time a couple needs emergency accommodation, their marriage is not going to suffer by separate beds. Parents should not have to rearrange their lives or accommodate any guest in this way if they so choose. They are well within their rights to ask for some compromise from their adult child guest for the short period of time they need that emergency accommodation. Millions of couples have spent great lengths of time apart without damaging their marriage.

:banghead:

Not much is really going to get figured out until the OP comes back I guess.

 

[EasterJoy]

I can back of the incestuous accusation. I am not married to it. But I think it is worth noting that it is a possibility, not necessarily in action, but in psychological undertones. A parent interfering in a grown, Married, child’s sex life in an intrusive and invasive, uninvited, and unwanted way, and in effect psychologically castrating the ego of the husband by this awkward and deliberate, in your face move is odd.

It either indicates that we do not have the full story from the OP or that the parents have some serious issues. But charitably I go by the only information we have, the OPs post. And yes, it is one sided, and yes, there is something that does not seem right about it but if the OP’s description is accurate and inclusive of all the information we need, there is something down right scary about this level of sexual involvement by the parents.

Legally can the parents make some sort of condition on the living situation. Yes probably. But morally, and relationaly they cannot make this type of in your face disrespect to a married family member. It is odd. Pick up your clothes, sure. Buy your own food and cook it yourselves. Yup. But separating the marital bed of a grown couple!? Weird, and not kind of but VERY creepy.

That the daughter’s parents might be passively-aggressively saying, “You say you want to be a husband? When we see you actually supporting your wife, we’ll believe that”–OK, yes. I’d certainly expect him to take it that way, even if the parents do not mean it that way.

My point is that there are many conservative thinkers who’d say the same thing without having anything more “creepy” to their stance than that they think being grown-up married people means being willing to live according to your means instead of moving in with someone else and letting them support you. IOW, I see this less as “castrating” than as “infantilizing.” The parents are treating adults like children in order to make their “point” that they don’t consider someone under 25 years old to be an adult until they’re out paying their own rent and making their own living.

Of course, if neither of the bedrooms being offered comes equipped with a double bed, the parents may be simply saying, “you’re not going to be living here long enough for us to be buying you new furniture…RIGHT?.” In that case, the couple can buy themselves an air mattress and sleep together in one of the bedrooms.

I still think that the OP ought to just talk to her mom. Since she hasn’t been back to post, let’s hope that’s what she’s doing. Certainly no one here believes that she has no standing to object.

 

[EasterJoy]

Early TV couples were not allowed to sleep in the same beds, either. What would Freud say about that? Being squeamish about directly confronting someone else’s sex life is hardly something new, particularly when that someone is your son, daughter, or–worst of all!!!–your parents. These aren’t parents who are showing an unhealthy interest in this newly-married couple’s sex lives, but parents who are showing an unrealistic desire to act as if the couple doesn’t have one.

I will be blunt–they may be afraid that if their daughter, the employed spouse, gets pregnant in a house with two guestrooms available–one for the new parents and one for the baby–they’ll have these “houseguests” for far longer than they are wanted. They will become the default babysitters. It doesn’t take an overactive imagination for this to be anything but their dream retirement years. They may simply be trying to ensure that this young couple does not make themselves “at home,” but really does move out ASAP. They know how well the “OK, but you have to leave in six months” agreement tends to work out, after all.