Married Couples- Quickies to Avoid Sin?

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VeiledVeronica

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Longtime reader- first time poster here. Over the course of my marriage of 14 years, my husband has had problems with lust on occasion, usually during periods of high stress. He has a very stressful job and works the equivalent of two full time jobs. From the history on his phone, he was basically looking at pictures that would be similar to swimsuit or lingerie pics, but not pornographic videos as far as I can tell. Not being naïve, I can’t rule that out, but do not have evidence of it. Anyway, until last fall, he didn’t seem to get how hurtful this was to me. Well last fall was about my fourth round of discovering this activity and I after I confronted him, he went to confession, got rid of his laptop and switched from a smartphone to a flip phone, installed Covenant Eyes on the Computer, and gave me passwords to his email accounts in an effort to rebuild trust. We even have a USB internet modem that I disconnect and hide at night so that no one can get on the internet at night. I know that if he still wants to sin he will find a way, but the idea is to make it easier to be virtuous by removing some of the easy access.
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        My self esteem has taken a brutal beating. I have a good number of children with him, and I earned every stretch mark by saying yes to him and giving myself to him. To know that he (probably daily) desires to look at girls who have never had a child, let alone sacrificed the best of themselves to have his, infuriates me and makes me feel used up and discarded. To his credit, he seems to understand this now and at some level I think he hates himself for hurting me so deeply. I am trying to let go of my anger piece by piece, and trying to understand this typically male problem and have some compassion. 

    So my practical question is this: These sins usually took place in the morning when he was at work and had time to look at his phone. I know that testosterone is usually highest in the morning. Because of his job, our sleep schedules are not in sync and he usually falls asleep at night before we can be intimate. In the very early morning, though, he is quite amorous and I am usually still too tired for much after being up nursing at night. If I give him permission to have quickies with me in the early morning before he leaves for work, do you think this will help to stem some of his temptation that seems to occur most frequently in the morning? Or would this just contribute to me feeling like a means to an end? He is so tired already that I wonder if he would have any motivation to stay up and have proper lovemaking sessions with me at night if I was just a quick fix in the morning. I have always been apprehensive of quickies because they seem to be so utilitarian, but at the same time, I'd like to help my husband avoid potential mortal sins. Any suggestions from other married couples? Wives, has this helped or hurt your marriage? Husbands, have quickies helped to curb your lust, or just made it worse? 
    
     So, over and above counseling, is this something practical which would help?
 
Firstly, I can imagine that your husband’s behavior has been hurtful to you. It is also sinful on his part, even if his lustful thoughts have not led to self abuse. I hope he realizes this; you are fully entitled to explain it to him. Our husbands have leadership duties, which include setting a high moral example and being strong.

That said, men do generally have stronger sexual desires than women, and it is our duty to fulfil those needs. So yes, I think the ‘morning quickie’ is a good idea, and if you offered him that in return to an end to him viewing the images he should not be seeing, I’m sure he would gratefully accept 👍
 
Monicad- Thank you for giving me some perspective. I guess my ego has taken enough of a beating over this that I wondered if giving him quickies would be “rewarding” his bad behavior, or if it would be below my dignity. I guess it is very humbling to make love to someone knowing that they think all of these other women are prettier than me. Objectively, they are, but I am his and he chose me, so he should be happy with me.
Practically speaking, I would still like to hear from couples who might have tried this, and if it helped them. Obviously there is more to sins of lust than just having a physical desire met. Usually there is an emotional wound or communication problem, or even just plain narcissism and selfishness. In our case, it is probably a combination of having precious little waking time together to communicate, high stress, and not frequent enough sex. We are trying to work on all of these. To be frank, I never turn him down; it is more a matter of time and fatigue on his part.
 
KatieM2 said:
Firstly, I can imagine that your husband’s behavior has been hurtful to you. It is also sinful on his part, even if his lustful thoughts have not led to self abuse. I hope he realizes this; you are fully entitled to explain it to him. Our husbands have leadership duties, which include setting a high moral example and being strong.

That said, men do generally have stronger sexual desires than women, and it is our duty to fulfil those needs. So yes, I think the ‘morning quickie’ is a good idea, and if you offered him that in return to an end to him viewing the images he should not be seeing, I’m sure he would gratefully accept 👍
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No it is not the “duty” of the wife to give in to “sex on demand” from the husband. That is a fundamentalist protestant concept – that basically turns the wife into an object to be used as a “husbands” personal sex slave.
 
Walking Home- I was raised a feminist and I thought that way when I first married, not understanding that marriage was a covenant, an exchange of persons. When I found out that married couples have conjugal rights to the other person, and that refusal of the marital debt could be a grave sin, I re-evaluated how I responded to his advances and no longer turned him down if I was just tired or irritated.

Does not St. Paul say that he is a slave of Christ (out of love)? It is not slavery if I freely give it away. This goes both ways too- my husband should not turn me down if I approach him, but I rarely approach if I know he is exhausted.
 
VeiledVeronica said:
Walking Home- I was raised a feminist and I thought that way when I first married, not understanding that marriage was a covenant, an exchange of persons. When I found out that married couples have conjugal rights to the other person, and that refusal of the marital debt could be a grave sin, I re-evaluated how I responded to his advances and no longer turned him down if I was just tired or irritated.

Does not St. Paul say that he is a slave of Christ (out of love)? It is not slavery if I freely give it away. This goes both ways too- my husband should not turn me down if I approach him, but I rarely approach if I know he is exhausted.
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I wife being tired – would be a valid reason to abstain from sex – and resume – when the spouse is in a better state. Again expecting-- “sex on demand” from a spouse – is turning the spouse into an object to be used – without regard for the spouse.
 
The idea is generous, but not very likely to work. I would look for other ways to give yourselves opportunities to be intimate when you are both rested and neither of you is rushed for time. That does require scheduling, but this proposal is not likely to give the most satisfying results for either one of you.
 
Hiding the usb modem wont stop your husband looking at girls if hes determined to look at their photos…he could buy magazines and look at them or look at them on a computer at work…rather than hiding the usb modem and feeling upset and offering him quickies you should take him to a catholic marriage counseller to repair whatever the issue is rather than sweep it under the carpet . Otherwise its just going to niggle away at you and you will continue to not be able to fully trust him
 
I will not tell you what to do, but I will tell you what I did and would do in this situation.

I stopped allowing for opportunities for my body to be used, which included quickies.
I asked my husband to change his language toward me. He began offering to make love, rather than asking for sex. A huge change of perspective and completely changed the tone of communication about marital relations.
I agreed to allow him to woo me, and we agreed that if his efforts were not able to overcome my exhaustion (only happened rarely) we would just stop trying on that occasion and wait a day or so.
We agreed that if he was sorely tempted, he would come to me and talk about it directly, and that we would strategize first, and then consider our soonest opportunity for marital intimacy.
We agreed that any slipups would be immediately confessed to me as well as in confession, so we can address the type of temptation he was dealing with in the future.

After we came up with our plan, everything changed. His focus turned to giving and loving and we actually never had to deal with any crisis strategizing. I still check in with him occasionally about it and he tells me that it is not even a temptation for him now. He has directed all of his energy (what is left of his energy after a hard day of work and evenings with the kids) toward the wooing and the connecting. And we both offer lovemaking as often as we can. Timing wise, it may happen in the evening, morning, or after a middle of the night feeding of the baby. Frequency wise, it varies, but we still check in with each other every couple of days, so that long stretches don’t pass without considering the needs of each other, even if we are using NFP to avoid pregnancy. Even just having the conversation about it helps to ease the burden of waiting.

So, long story short: quickies were one of the first things we avoided, rather than being considered as any sort of help in this situation.
 
VeiledVeronica said:
Monicad- Thank you for giving me some perspective. I guess my ego has taken enough of a beating over this that I wondered if giving him quickies would be “rewarding” his bad behavior, or if it would be below my dignity. **I guess it is very humbling to make love to someone knowing that they think all of these other women are prettier than me. Objectively, they are, but I am his and he chose me, so he should be happy with me. **
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Practically speaking, I would still like to hear from couples who might have tried this, and if it helped them. Obviously there is more to sins of lust than just having a physical desire met. Usually there is an emotional wound or communication problem, or even just plain narcissism and selfishness. In our case, it is probably a combination of having precious little waking time together to communicate, high stress, and not frequent enough sex. We are trying to work on all of these. To be frank, I never turn him down; it is more a matter of time and fatigue on his part.
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I can tell you from personal experience, as a married man, that this isn’t necessarily true. There is no excuse for a married man lusting after other women or looking at provocative images of other women - it is a grave sin plain and simple. That being said, it is a temptation that nearly all men struggle with at some point and it doesn’t necessarily imply that the man feels his wife isn’t beautiful or sexy enough. My wife is absolutely stunning. I couldn’t ask for a more beautiful, sexy wife. I am obviously biased, but I would say that most men would objectively find her to be very physically appealing. Yet even so, I have, to my shame, a couple of times succumbed to the temptation of looking at the sort of images you mentioned in your OP - usually during periods when my wife and I hadn’t been intimate for a while for whatever reason. It wasn’t that I thought these other women were more appealing than my wife…it was just the overwhelming temptation of satisfying those visual desires (remember men are very visual) in the moment. The need for some sort of release in that moment. Certainly, I would have much rather have been with my wife had it been possible. Its like giving in and eating the greasy McDonald’s hamburger in front of you in a moment of intense hunger even though you know you have a steak waiting for you at home. This doesn’t excuse it…but I think it is a mistake when women assume its because they aren’t beautiful enough. Men will be visually stimulated by the female form and tempted by it regardless of the circumstances.

I don’t know if “quickies” are the answer - that is a very personal matter. I do know that the more frequently my wife and I are together, the fewer temptations there are.
 
I have never been married, so take my advice from where it is coming.

I don’t think it is wrong for you to have a quickie once in a while if it will help your husband not look at other women. However, if the ratio isn’t at least 2 romantic evenings before sex, for every quickie, then I would no longer allow it. IE the quickies are the minority of the encounters.
 
After reading all of the responses, I still feel that only half of the story has been told here.

Lest my words be confused, I do not disagree with any of you that a man ought not indulge in fantasies about a woman he is not married to, nor use pornography nor masturbate nor blame his wife for any sins committed in this area. I do not believe any of that in the least.

But, and I hope this doesn’t come across as contradictory, but I don’t see how you can remove the wife from the equation as well. Most human beings (and men especially, apparently) desire sex. But that desire is pronounced in marriage. A husband craves that kind of intimacy and to set arbitrary demands as a “gatekeeper” is, frankly… cruel. It doesn’t make pornography/masturbation/adultery any less sinful, but for the love of God people, can we please stop acting like men are just wired all wrong and that their sexual desires are this huge burden and let’s treat them like little babies, etc.? Not talking to anyone in particular, just sayin: if all men who have masturbated need marriage counselors, then I better go ahead and switch careers right now!!!

No matter what all these “male headship” types keep saying, I firmly believe that husband and wife are both called to sacrificial love. Husband and wife are both called to get out of their comfort zone in aid to and out of love for their spouse.
 
I think you’re dealing with two completely separate issues. His looking at porn (whether it’s actual porn or just the swimsuit and lingerie photos, he’s using them to satisfy an inappropriate lustful desire) has nothing to do with you, your stretch marks or whether you have sex once a week, once a month or twelve times a day. Until he makes a serious effort to stop doing it, he’s going to keep doing it. Deal with that for what it is and deal with any intimacy issues as a separate problem.
 
VeiledVeronica said:
Longtime reader- first time poster here. Over the course of my marriage of 14 years, my husband has had problems with lust on occasion, usually during periods of high stress. He has a very stressful job and works the equivalent of two full time jobs. From the history on his phone, he was basically looking at pictures that would be similar to swimsuit or lingerie pics, but not pornographic videos as far as I can tell. Not being naïve, I can’t rule that out, but do not have evidence of it. Anyway, until last fall, he didn’t seem to get how hurtful this was to me. Well last fall was about my fourth round of discovering this activity and I after I confronted him, he went to confession, got rid of his laptop and switched from a smartphone to a flip phone, installed Covenant Eyes on the Computer, and gave me passwords to his email accounts in an effort to rebuild trust. We even have a USB internet modem that I disconnect and hide at night so that no one can get on the internet at night. I know that if he still wants to sin he will find a way, but the idea is to make it easier to be virtuous by removing some of the easy access.
Code: 
        My self esteem has taken a brutal beating. I have a good number of children with him, and I earned every stretch mark by saying yes to him and giving myself to him. To know that he (probably daily) desires to look at girls who have never had a child, let alone sacrificed the best of themselves to have his, infuriates me and makes me feel used up and discarded. To his credit, he seems to understand this now and at some level I think he hates himself for hurting me so deeply. I am trying to let go of my anger piece by piece, and trying to understand this typically male problem and have some compassion. 

    So my practical question is this: These sins usually took place in the morning when he was at work and had time to look at his phone. I know that testosterone is usually highest in the morning. Because of his job, our sleep schedules are not in sync and he usually falls asleep at night before we can be intimate. In the very early morning, though, he is quite amorous and I am usually still too tired for much after being up nursing at night. If I give him permission to have quickies with me in the early morning before he leaves for work, do you think this will help to stem some of his temptation that seems to occur most frequently in the morning? Or would this just contribute to me feeling like a means to an end? He is so tired already that I wonder if he would have any motivation to stay up and have proper lovemaking sessions with me at night if I was just a quick fix in the morning. I have always been apprehensive of quickies because they seem to be so utilitarian, but at the same time, I'd like to help my husband avoid potential mortal sins. Any suggestions from other married couples? Wives, has this helped or hurt your marriage? Husbands, have quickies helped to curb your lust, or just made it worse? 
    
     So, over and above counseling, is this something practical which would help?
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There is nothing wrong with a “quickie,” and from a man’s perspective, I do think it would probably help to ease his temptations. I don’t think married couples should expect that every intimate encounter is going to be perfect. Sometimes you will have lots of time, and other times you will have just a few minutes. Sometimes you will both be in the mood, and other times only one of you will be. But I don’t think that a husband and wife have to wait for everything to line up perfectly in terms of time or in terms of mutual desire in order for them to get together.

Think of it this way: Maybe right now you are hungry, but you don’t have much time, so you just grab some fast food. Fast food isn’t the tastiest or the healthiest food, but it will keep you from going hungry. And just because you had fast food for one meal doesn’t mean that your next meal can’t be a healthy and delicious home-cooked meal. You will have plenty of meals in your life, and some of them will be really great and memorable. But isn’t it better to have fast food from time to time, rather than eating only when you have time to make the meal perfect?
 
Dacinom said:
I used to believe this way too, but the same can be said for affection. Is it okay for a wife to “use” her husband for hugs and kisses when he doesn’t “feel” like it? I used to think it was different but now believe that all of these things are the same and essential to a healthy marriage: giving compliments, lovemaking and sex, giving hugs and kisses, showing affection, showing appreciation and in a covenant sometimes we have to do these things even when we don’t necessarily feel like it for the good of our marriage.
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When one spouse – expects from the other – to always be available to meet sexual needs (sex of demand) – without regard/taking consideration for the spouse ---- No – that is not a sign of a healthy marriage. And it is wrong – for a spouse to get all aroused oogling others – and come home and expect to finish up with the wife.
 
To clarify, my husband has not demanded quickies from me; it was something I was thinking about offering to help him. I know that he is responsible for his own sins, and he has been to confession about this. If I knew he was looking at women and then coming to me to take care of it, I would handle this differently I have no evidence of it happening since last fall, although I could be proven wrong. I think that he has made good progress in this area. I was just looking for something I could actively do to help him overcome this and hopefully stave off a relapse. Yes, talking and praying are always good, but it feels like waiting for the other shoe to drop wondering when/if it will happen again. I want something I can actively do to help instead of waiting and wondering if I’ll be hurt again. Really, the only thing I could think of was trying my best to have the children in bed much earlier so that we would have more time together, reducing the stress at home where I can, praying to St. Joseph, and trying to meet his physical desire during the time of the day when he seems most likely to fail. I can do what I can to help, but ultimately it’s up to him to make good decisions.

I really wanted some practical advice from those who have been here before. Thanks to those who are weighing in with personal experiences. If the statistics for men in general hold true for Catholic men as well, the majority of marriages have faced this at some point.
 
VeiledVeronica said:
I guess it is very humbling to make love to someone knowing that they think all of these other women are prettier than me. Objectively, they are, but I am his and he chose me, so he should be happy with me.
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I don’t want to sidetrack this discussion to far. And, I am sorry for going through this. I just want to point out that the above is not necessarily true. I know for a woman it feels like if a man is looking at pictures of women online, it is because he thinks they are “prettier” or more desirable. As a guy and talking to other guys, that is absolutely not true.

Men looking at women online is not about looking at women who they think are prettier or more desirable than their wives. There are a lot of factors that lead to this sin. The biological attractiveness of multiple sexually available partners, psychological conditioning that leads to addition, etc.

My point is not to bore with you all the biological, psychologically, spiritual explanations for this type of sin. Instead, even though I can understand that it would feel that way, men looking at pictures online is COMPLETELY UNRELATED to how pretty or how attracted to their wife they are. Men who are married to the most beautiful women in the world are as or more likely to be engaged in this kind of activity (and worse).

Don’t fall for the lie that because your husband has fallen into sin in the past that you aren’t beautiful or that he doesn’t find you beautiful. That’s just not how the male brain works.
 
phillylawyer said:
I don’t want to sidetrack this discussion to far. And, I am sorry for going through this. I just want to point out that the above is not necessarily true. I know for a woman it feels like if a man is looking at pictures of women online, it is because he thinks they are “prettier” or more desirable. As a guy and talking to other guys, that is absolutely not true.

Men looking at women online is not about looking at women who they think are prettier or more desirable than their wives. There are a lot of factors that lead to this sin. The biological attractiveness of multiple sexually available partners, psychological conditioning that leads to addition, etc.

My point is not to bore with you all the biological, psychologically, spiritual explanations for this type of sin. Instead, even though I can understand that it would feel that way, men looking at pictures online is COMPLETELY UNRELATED to how pretty or how attracted to their wife they are. Men who are married to the most beautiful women in the world are as or more likely to be engaged in this kind of activity (and worse).

Don’t fall for the lie that because your husband has fallen into sin in the past that you aren’t beautiful or that he doesn’t find you beautiful. That’s just not how the male brain works.
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Just to make a point, the woman Tiger Woods was married to was very beautiful. 🤷
 
Gordon_Sims said:
Until he makes a serious effort to stop doing it, he’s going to keep doing it.
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For what its worth, the OP’s first post stated that he made a serious effort. Got rid of smart phone, installed web filter, gave her all his passwords, and they turn off the internet at night. I think she is addressing phase 2, how to deal with intimacy going forward.
 
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