Married Priest?

[Volodymyr_988]

On the contrary, I believe that the “worker priest” should be seriously looked by the Church as an option.

Mike

I think this could work. But one would need about one priest per 100 families and therefore there would have to be about 10 worker priests per average Latin parish. It could work if each priest offers to take call once per week. But, the bishops affirmed at the last synod that the discipline is still for a celibate priesthood and episcopate.

 

[Volodymyr_988]

The Lord placed on him? More like the Roman Catholic Hierarchy!

Mike

I could also write that the Orthodox Hierarchy placed a cross on all the married priests who want to be bishops with that logic.

 

[wmlillie]

I could also write that the Orthodox Hierarchy placed a cross on all the married priests who want to be bishops with that logic.

And I would agree!!!

 

[mardukm]

Never let it be said that apostolic Christians of apostolic Churches wish to disobey the Scriptural exhortation:

“He who listens to you listens to me.”

Well…to the extent it does not violate divine law, that is.

Blessings,
Marduk

 

[Madaglan]

I could also write that the Orthodox Hierarchy placed a cross on all the married priests who want to be bishops with that logic.

Discerning one’s episcopal calling…

Must be new.



I don’t see the priesthood or the bishopric as to be desired or wanted. A man discerns not if he wants to become a priest but if God is calling him to become one.

 

[mardukm]

Discerning one’s episcopal calling…

Must be new.



I don’t see the priesthood or the bishopric as to be desired or wanted. A man discerns not if he wants to become a priest but if God is calling him to become one.

I agree with you regarding the bishopric. The ancient canons actually obligate a cleric to accept his nomination under pain of excommunication. So it really is a cross to bear.

However, I think your distinction between wanting to become a priest, and being called to become one is a bit sophistic. One would not want to become a priest without the call anyway. The two are notions are one and the same.

Blessings,
Marduk

 

[chrisb]

When we speak of Christian Perfection the Roman Catholic Church has spoken in it’s past concerning the evangelical law and it’s pursuit in degrees of procurement by the individual. It not only leads souls to justification, but to perfection.

Where Christian justice consists in the flight from evil and the practice of good; Christian perfection consists in the union of the soul with God by the bonds of perfect charity. This perfect charity requires that, free from everyone inordinate love of the world and of ourselves, we should love God alone in Himself and in our neighbors, and seek Him alone in all things.

The evangelical counsels of which we here speak consist in the practice of the three great virtues of voluntary poverty, perpetual chastity, and entire obedience. Our Lord proposes them as a more excellent way than the way of the commandments.

The Gospel shows us three ways of going to God. The first is that of the commandments, for all men must keep them to be savedl the second is that of the counsels, which consists in adding the evangelical counsels to the way of the commandments. Our Lord does not in any way make it obligatory, but He proposes it to generous souls who wish to consecrate their existence entirely to God. Such is religious life. The third way is that of celibacy, or of virginity, in the world.

We have thus three states of life - marriage, celibacy, and religious life. These states are all venerable and holy, but not equally perfect if considered in themselves, or as a means of salvation and sanctification. Celibacy is more perfect than marriage, and the religious life the most perfect of the three.

This was the teaching of the Roman Catholic Church in the 1890’s… is this how the Byzantine/Eastern Catholics understand the pursuit of Perfection? If so, how is it that Priest, who are, to pursue the surest way of Perfection engage in the married life?

I thought this might be interesting to discuss because I get the feeling that most Roman Catholics have not idea why their Priests are Celibate.

Thank you and Peace.

 

[Madaglan]

I agree with you regarding the bishopric. The ancient canons actually obligate a cleric to accept his nomination under pain of excommunication. So it really is a cross to bear.

However, I think your distinction between wanting to become a priest, and being called to become one is a bit sophistic. One would not want to become a priest without the call anyway. The two are notions are one and the same.

Blessings,
Marduk

To which canon do you refer?
Do the same canons prohibit a bishop from resigning?

I acknowledge that many men who experience a drawing towards the priesthood want to become a priest because they believe it is God’s desire and that it means fulfillment in their lives. However, that’s not the desire I intended. The post on which I commented concerned married priests wanting to become bishop. This desire is different from that involved in discerning one’s vocation. It is not uncommon for men, even otherwise pious men, to desire a position because of the prestige and/or sense of personal/social advancement it brings, without due discernment.

If a young Latin Catholic wants to become a priest but also wants to get married, does he therefore have a vocation
to both–i.e. being called to both marriage and the priesthood? If desire and calling are one and the same, I would have to say yes.

 

[mardukm]

To which canon do you refer?
Do the same canons prohibit a bishop from resigning?

Apostolic Canon 36 (37 in Greek).

Canon 17 of the Council of Antioch (A.D. 341).

Sorry I don’t have the time to type it out right now.

From what I’ve read, a bishop can resign only for impropriety (similar to when a job offers you the option of resigning or being fired).

Blessings,
Marduk

 

[Volodymyr_988]

Never let it be said that apostolic Christians of apostolic Churches wish to disobey the Scriptural exhortation:

“He who listens to you listens to me.”

Well…to the extent it does not violate divine law, that is.

Blessings,
Marduk

My thoughts exactly.

 

[Madaglan]

Apostolic Canon 36 (37 in Greek).

Canon 17 of the Council of Antioch (A.D. 341).

Sorry I don’t have the time to type it out right now.

From what I’ve read, a bishop can resign only for impropriety (similar to when a job offers you the option of resigning or being fired).

Blessings,
Marduk

Mardukm,

Thank you for the canons.

I have the Apostolic Canons before me. Canon 37 seems to refer to a bishop who already has accepted his duties as bishop in an ordination rite. I know that, at least in the present Latin rite of ordination, there is an examination of the candidate. I’m not so sure of other rites. Canon 17 of Antioch seems similar in nature. You are right in that a bishop who refuses to undertake his duties faces excommunication (until he undertakes them).

Impropriety definitely is the grounds for the vast majority of episcopal resignations. I don’t recall reading anything of voluntarily resignation, either for or against. Requested laicization comes closest to my mind–although I don’t know how this would apply to a bishop.

 

[mardukm]

I know that, at least in the present Latin rite of ordination, there is an examination of the candidate. I’m not so sure of other rites.

In the Eastern Churches, the Synod does the examination. For the Orientals, I can only speak for the Coptic Church - the Pope (Patriarch) does the examination.

Impropriety definitely is the grounds for the vast majority of episcopal resignations. I don’t recall reading anything of voluntarily resignation, either for or against. Requested laicization comes closest to my mind–although I don’t know how this would apply to a bishop.

Didn’t a Latin bishop somewhere in the Eastern U.S. resign recently because of the sex abuse scandal? During the Photian controversy, it seems (according to one version) Photius’ immediate predecessor was forced to resign because there were charges of irregularity in his ordination?

Blessings,
Marduk

 

[Madaglan]

In the Eastern Churches, the Synod does the examination. For the Orientals, I can only speak for the Coptic Church - the Pope (Patriarch) does the examination.

Didn’t a Latin bishop somewhere in the Eastern U.S. resign recently because of the sex abuse scandal?

Blessings,
Marduk

Thanks for the answer. I haven’t heard of any Latin bishop in the U.S. recently resigning (recent meaning past year). Anyone else?

 

[Madaglan]

In the Eastern Churches, the Synod does the examination. For the Orientals, I can only speak for the Coptic Church - the Pope (Patriarch) does the examination.

Didn’t a Latin bishop somewhere in the Eastern U.S. resign recently because of the sex abuse scandal? During the Photian controversy, it seems (according to one version) Photius’ immediate predecessor was forced to resign because there were charges of irregularity in his ordination?

Blessings,
Marduk

Gotta love your “according to one version”

 

[mardukm]

Gotta love your “according to one version”

Well, I wanted to be fair and politically correct about it . I didn’t want to say whose version was the correct one. As long as everyone agrees that Photius died in communion with Rome, I don’t care which version is correct.

Blessings,
Marduk

 

[Madaglan]

Well, I wanted to be fair and politically correct about it . I didn’t want to say whose version was the correct one. As long as everyone agrees that Photius died in communion with Rome, I don’t care which version is correct.

Blessings,
Marduk

The Mormon version, obviously.

 

[mardukm]

The Mormon version, obviously.

Oh, yeah! I forgot about that one — ALL the apostolic Churches lost apostolic succession.

… Tempting.

Blessings,
Marduk

 

[Volodymyr_988]

Oh, yeah! I forgot about that one — ALL the apostolic Churches lost apostolic succession.

… Tempting.

Blessings,
Marduk

That would make reconciliation between the Orthodox and Catholics easier.

“We’re right!”
“No, we’re right!”
“You’re both wrong. Unfortunately, there’s no coffee hour now that you’re Mormon.”

 

[bpbasilphx]

A Byzantine priest I know mentioned that in his next life, he’s coming back as a priestless Old Believer.

Icons, beautiful services, and you don’t have to fool with bishops!

 

[rinnie]

When we speak of Christian Perfection the Roman Catholic Church has spoken in it’s past concerning the evangelical law and it’s pursuit in degrees of procurement by the individual. It not only leads souls to justification, but to perfection.

Where Christian justice consists in the flight from evil and the practice of good; Christian perfection consists in the union of the soul with God by the bonds of perfect charity. This perfect charity requires that, free from everyone inordinate love of the world and of ourselves, we should love God alone in Himself and in our neighbors, and seek Him alone in all things.

The evangelical counsels of which we here speak consist in the practice of the three great virtues of voluntary poverty, perpetual chastity, and entire obedience. Our Lord proposes them as a more excellent way than the way of the commandments.

The Gospel shows us three ways of going to God. The first is that of the commandments, for all men must keep them to be savedl the second is that of the counsels, which consists in adding the evangelical counsels to the way of the commandments. Our Lord does not in any way make it obligatory, but He proposes it to generous souls who wish to consecrate their existence entirely to God. Such is religious life. The third way is that of celibacy, or of virginity, in the world.

We have thus three states of life - marriage, celibacy, and religious life. These states are all venerable and holy, but not equally perfect if considered in themselves, or as a means of salvation and sanctification. Celibacy is more perfect than marriage, and the religious life the most perfect of the three.

This was the teaching of the Roman Catholic Church in the 1890’s… is this how the Byzantine/Eastern Catholics understand the pursuit of Perfection? If so, how is it that Priest, who are, to pursue the surest way of Perfection engage in the married life?

I thought this might be interesting to discuss because I get the feeling that most Roman Catholics have not idea why their Priests are Celibate.

Thank you and Peace.

I am not sure I understand you post exactly. But speaking for myself a Roman Catholic, I know why my Priest is not married. He chose to give his FULL attention To the Church, to Christ. He gave up every physical and emotional need to have a wife, children and family of his own, and gave his full attention to Christ through his Church.