Mary Worship

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doxiemom states:

“Sola Scripture isn’t in the bible. IT IS the Bible”

Absolutely … the Bible is the word of the living God and the only source that can be relied upon for truth
 
pablope said:

Well…your interpretations are what they are also…traditions of men…that you picked up…and doesn’t your intepretations generate error and confusion too?

How then can you assure us here catholics that your interprretations are free of error and do not generate confusion?

No … my interpretations of the Lord’s Word were not picked up from the “traditions of men” * … and the Bible is not confusing to me … have you read: Jesus said " I will sent the comforter [his holy spirit] and he will lead you into all truth"

You should try reading the Bible for yourself , before you buy in to the traditions of others

Turn to the Lord and ask Him to guide you in the study of His Word … He will withhold no truth from you contained in His Word

It takes initiative on your part to seek His truths, it takes time and effort, and your motive must be pure … study yourself approved

And the born again Christian is given spiritual eyes and ears to see and hear the Word of God … He speaks through His Word … the Bible

If you do this you will not be snared by the traditions of men … do not place your own fate in the hands others … seek the Lord and His salvation for yourself in spirit and in truth … you do not have to rely upon the traditions of others*
 
Church Militant said:

“Which is precisely why your errant doctrine is wrong. You cannot supply a single passage of scripture that lays claim to the final and ultimate authority that you say belongs to the Bible because, quite simply, it’s not there. Not even if you search the Catholic Bible with all 73 of the original books”

Now that is a very presumptuous statement to make … I can do just exactly what you claim that I cannot do

But if you have discarded His Word ascribed in the scriptures of the Bible, then it will make no difference what I present to you will it? … sounds like you simply refute the Bible as the ultimate word of the Lord … who does this and yet claims to be a Christian?

So why should I bother with you?

Believe that I can do what you tell not … but if you have rejected the Author of the scriptures of the Bible and its authenticity it will make no difference to you
 
You quoted from 1 Timothy, I shall do the same, not by my own interpretation, but that of which is the pillar and foundation of the truth

1 Timothy 3:15… the church is the pillar and foundation of the truth!
You wanted to know what the church teaches, and so that is what I have been trying to give you. It is not either/or, but both/and!
After all that I posted, can I get a straight answer from you…do you understand what the early church fathers understood about typology? Which I believe I satisfactorily brought to you via scripture.
Good morning Literalist, I was wondering if you had a chance to answer this question! Do you understand what the early church teachers understood and taught about typology?
 
Maryj

Yes I do understand the concept of typeology

There are of number of denominations of professing Christianity that use it to some degree particularly in relation to the inter pretation of the prophetic scriptures

The method used is to contrast and compare similar scriptures on various subjects, but I don’t believe the method shoud be taken too far … if it is, then the meanings can be skewed

There may be similarities and types, but it needs to be understood that each individual passage of scripture must many times stand on its own in order to render the correct interpretation … especially with regard to time lapse

Example: Daniel 11:21-35 speaks specifically about the rule of Antiochus IV over Syrio/Babylonia in the Middle East just before the first century, but Daniel 11:36-45 tells of a future ruler who has not emerged yet

… some make the mistake of thinking that this king is the same individual in both passages of scripture because their rules and actions were similar … so by using “typology” they come to this conclusion which is not an accurate interpretation

Excessive use of typology can lead to some very wrong conclusions with regard to the rendering of scripture

I am going to add a study of the prophetic scriptures to the forum soon after I leave this posting … I believe this study is essential for any student of the Bible

I don’t see a specific section on the post for this purpose, but will attempt to find the proper place for it

Please do not be offended by my (name removed by moderator)ut on your post … I do understand where you are coming from, but I have to respond with the truth about the subject at hand and have answered other related questions from other posters as well

When you get to the end and have nothing to show it is going to be all about who you know … Jesus Christ … nothing else matters
 
Sola Scripture isn’t in the bible. IT IS the Bible.
**Where is it then? I need a verse

Call no man Father- Then forget about calling your dad “dad” because “dad” in essence is the simpler version of "Father. Don’t call the American founding Fathers, the founding fathers because that is a violation as well. Don’t call the Church Fathers “Fathers” (Such as Augustine) because this is then a violation of Call no man Father. Don’t call Your Pastor “Reverend” because Only one PERSON could ever merit the title of Reverend and that is Our LORD. Don’t call Your Pastor “Pastor” because there is only one Shepherd and that is JESUS.

The True Presence of CHRIST in the EUCHARIST- Read John 6. Also read the account of the Last Supper. JESUS never said “This represents my Body” or “This is a symbol of my Body”, HE said 'THIS I]IS** MY BODY". HE then gave this command “Do this in rememberance of ME”. Hence the reason the Church does this every Sunday, and evn every day. To fulfill the Divine Command and to renew the New, Eternal and Saving Covenant written by the PRECIOUS BLOOD of CHRIST upon Calvary.

St. Peter as the First Pope- “Thou art Peter, and upon this rock, I shall build my Church”. The whole Petros vs Petras arguement doesn’t hold due to gender specific nouns. Also, Our LORD said to St. Peter "I Give YOU the keys to the kingdom of Heaven. “Whatever YOU bind on Earth shall be bound in Heaven, and whatever YOU loose on earth, shalt be loosed in Heaven”. Why on earth would Our LORD bother adressing Peter this way? Why does Peter always appear with John the Beloved and James? Why does Our LORD tell Peter to FEED MY SHEEP. Why wouldn’t Our LORD tell all the 11 that? Why did HE pull Peter aside and tell Him this, alone? Of course Peters faith faltered, but so does ours. Peter went out of this world on an upside down Crucifix. The Humility of St. Peter is astouding. He told His executioners that “I am not worthy to die in the same manner as my LORD”. When Our Humility becomes thus, then we can point fingers at how weak or strong someones faith is, even then we shouldn’t.

Sacrament of Confession- HE breathed on them and said “Recieve the HOLY SPIRIT. Whomevers sins YOU forgive are forgiven. Whomevers Sins ***YOU *** reatin, are retained”. Our LORD never gave us this command as laymen because we don’t have the authority to forgive sins. HE did give it to the assembled 11. Why did He bother saying this? Why would Our LORD apparently spit air for no reason? HE didn’t because HE gave His Apostoles and all those who would be ordained through the line of Apostolic succession the power to forgive sins in HIS NAME.

Holy MASS- Scott Hahn, a very, very sharp Catholic theologian once went to a Catholic MASS. As a Protestant, He thought this was THE ultimate act of blasphemy. However, curiosity drew him in. He attended and He was shocked at how Biblical the MASS was, and how often Catholics use the Bible at the MASS. Protestants use it for 2% of their Services. Catholics use it 26% (For reading) and this does NOT include the vast number of Biblical and Early Christian prayers during the MASS, e.g. at the Canon or the Eucharistic Prayer.

So which is more biblical? A Group that splintered from the Only True Church? Martin Luther should be accused of Dishonesty. Martin Luther added the word “Alone” to Romans 3:28. Dishonest Much? You know that the very Bible You use to slam the Catholic Church is the same Bible that the Catholic Church put together, and it is for this reason that You are able to hold one in your hands? (Albeit a chopped up, dishonest 7 book missing version) Our LORD had the Bible written for the Church, not the Church for the Bible.

Finally, Sacred Tradition is clearly stated by St. Paul in Thesselonians 2:15. "Therefore Brethren, hold fast to the Traditions! which YOU have been taught. There was no bible at this time remember. So what on earth could St. Paul have meant if not for the Traditions of the Church? Another fact to remember, the True Church of Our LORD is not divided. Protestantism is so divided that Protestantism alone (Not including baptists, lutheran, calvinists, pentecostals etc.) has 30,000 different spin-offs. Not only this, but to add to the confusion that each of these 30,000 ALL say that THEY are the ones who interpret the Bible correctly. So then which one? Because some of them agree to contradictory tenets (Depending on how conservative or liberal the group is). The True Church, the One, Holy,Catholic and Apostolic Church is one and undivided. We have held fast even against the Protestant reformation. We have held fast against everything thrown at us. We will continue to do so. For this reason, the Catholic Church is the Sole True Church, and the Only Church that can claim to be “Truly Biblical”.
 
pablope said:
Well…your interpretations are what they are also…traditions of men…that you picked up…and doesn’t your intepretations generate error and confusion too?
No … my interpretations of the Lord’s Word were not picked up from the “traditions of men” * … and the Bible is not confusing to me … have you read: Jesus said " I will sent the comforter [his holy spirit] and he will lead you into all truth"*

You said you are not affiliated with any religious org…well, your writings indicate SDA…but do correct me if I am wrong.

When you read writings of others…you picked up their traditions of understanding…though you may not want to see it as such.

You said you read writings of others even those who disagree with you…well here is one…and I do hope you read it:

calledtocommunion.com/2009/07/ecclesial-deism/

From which I will cite:

*He adopts a pick-and-choose approach. This approach attempts to avoid the dilemma raised above by methodologically, though not explicitly, counting as ‘traditional’ [as in “traditional Christian orthodoxy”] only whatever the Church said and did that agrees with or is at least compatible with one’s own interpretation of Scripture. ‘Tradition’ becomes whatever one agrees with in the history of the Church, such as the Nicene Creed or Chalcedonian Christology.

This pick-and-choose approach to the tradition shows that it is not the fact that an Ecumenical Council declared something definitively that makes it ‘authoritative’ for Mohler. What makes it ‘authoritative’ for Mohler is that it agrees with his interpretation of Scripture. If he encounters something in the tradition that seems extra-biblical or opposed to Scripture he rejects it. For that reason, tradition does not authoritatively guide his interpretation. His interpretation picks out what counts as tradition, and then this tradition informs his interpretation.*
and the Bible is not confusing to me … have you read: Jesus said " I will sent the comforter [his holy spirit] and he will lead you into all truth
Does the Holy Spirit only guide you? How can you explain the other thousands of different interpretations?

And how do you know it is indeed the HS that is guiding you?

And you have answered this question I asked: How then can you assure us here catholics that your interprretations are free of error and do not generate confusion?

So what is our assurance that it is indeed the HS, as you claim? In other words, test the spirit and prove your claim.
You should try reading the Bible for yourself , before you buy in to the traditions of others
How do you know I am not? And how do you know you are not following the traditons of others?
If you do this you will not be snared by the traditions of men … do not place your own fate in the hands others … seek the Lord and His salvation for yourself in spirit and in truth … you do not have to rely upon the traditions of others
Well, what you are now asking me is to believe you and follow your interpretation…your tradition…so why should I do that?

And how do you know you have not be snared by the traditions of men yourself?
 
doxiemom states:

“Sola Scripture isn’t in the bible. IT IS the Bible”

Absolutely … the Bible is the word of the living God and the only source that can be relied upon for truth
And how do you know this? Are you making an infallible declaration when you make this statement?

How do you know you are correct and error free in making this statement?

Where does the Bible say it is to be relied upon for truth solely? How come there are thousands of denoms that have different interpretations…so which one of them is truth?

Are there a thousand truths or only one truth?
 
And how do you know this? Are you making an infallible declaration when you make this statement?

How do you know you are correct and error free in making this statement?

Where does the Bible say it is to be relied upon for truth solely? How come there are thousands of denoms that have different interpretations…so which one of them is truth?

Are there a thousand truths or only one truth?
This!👍
 
doxiemom states:

“Sola Scripture isn’t in the bible. IT IS the Bible”

Absolutely … the Bible is the word of the living God and the only source that can be relied upon for truth
Providing you have an infallible interpreter since the Bible is the Infallible Word of God. Do you consider yourself to be an infallible interpreter of the Bible?
 
Sola Scripture isn’t in the bible. IT IS the Bible.
The bible actually said Sola Scripture is the bible? Says who? If you can’t show that it is in the bible, you are just making things up. Tomorrow you will say Sola Somethingelse is the bible. Saying it doesn’t mean it is so.
 
pablope said:

“You said you are not affiliated with any religious org…well, your writings indicate SDA…but do correct me if I am wrong”

You are absolutely wrong … I consider the SDA “church” to be a cult religion which is based upon Ellen G. White’s writtings and the SDA tradition

This “church” does have a degree of understanding the prophetic scriptures, but with some very serious flaws … and the organization is a religion of works like their Sabbath keeping dogma … there is no truth in this perverted idea

And quite frankly in response to your other questions … you will believe what you believe

Neither do I pick and choose among the scriptures, but incorporate them all

Remember this … when you get to the end and have nothing to show, it is going to be all about who you know … seek His truth and make certain that you are ready for the encounter
 
Literalist,are you by any chance the OP,InChristOnly? Just asking because the OP seems to be missing in action and you suddenly appeared with much the same MO.🤷
 
Tomster said:

“Providing you have an infallible interpreter since the Bible is the Infallible Word of God. Do you consider yourself to be an infallible interpreter of the Bible?”

I am not infallible, but the Word of the living God is … and it is possible for the follower of Jesus Christ to understand His written Word … no doubt about this
 
Jeanne S asked:

“Literalist,are you by any chance the OP,InChristOnly? Just asking because the OP seems to be missing in action and you suddenly appeared with much the same MO”

Absoultely not … I am not Maryj
 
Tomster said:

“Providing you have an infallible interpreter since the Bible is the Infallible Word of God. Do you consider yourself to be an infallible interpreter of the Bible?”

I am not infallible, but the Word of the living God is … and it is possible for the follower of Jesus Christ to understand His written Word … no doubt about this
As I have asked you…can you explain the thousands of different understandings of the written Word?

All claim to be from the HS? But how do you prove which one is truth? How do you prove your understanding is indeed the one truth, and not just one among many?
 
People, I think we are only :banghead: We’ve given the answer again and again and explained more than we needed to. We cannot convince others–that’s not our “job”. If Jesus couldn’t do it, why do we think we’re gonna? 😉 I’m unsubscribing from the thread. God bless you all.
 
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