Mass confusion (a setup of the Church by homosexual activists)

[tm30]

From California Catholic Daily:
A controversy over the refusal of a San Diego parish to hold a funeral Mass for the deceased owner of a gay bar was a “set-up” by homosexual activists, an associate pastor at Our Lady of the Rosary Church said at a midday Mass yesterday.
The parish’s associate pastor, Fr. Louis M. Solcia, spoke about the controversy during noon daily Mass yesterday, a parish insider told California Catholic Daily. Fr. Solcia minced no words in describing the uproar over a decision by priests at the parish to refuse a funeral Mass for John Sanfilippo, who owned the San Diego gay bar the SRO Lounge and had been involved in a long-term same-sex relationship before his death.
Sanfilippo died on June 24 and his family and “partner” of 30 years had sought to have a funeral Mass for him at the downtown San Diego parish. Initially, plans for the funeral Mass moved forward and it was scheduled for June 30. But when Mr. Sanfililppo’s “partner” telephoned the parish to discuss further details, priests determined that a Mass would be inappropriate, the parish insider reported.
That decision prompted homosexual activist Nicole Murray Ramirez to post a letter on the church’s front door addressed to San Diego Bishop Robert Brom, calling on him to clarify diocesan policy on the issue of funeral rites for homosexuals. Following a similar incident in 2005, Bishop Brom apologized to the loved ones of a man, also the owner of nightclubs catering to gays and a homosexual-rights activist, who had been refused a funeral Mass.
The parish insider said priests at the parish (the pastor is away) decided that burial services would be appropriate but not a Mass because it appeared that Mr. Sanfilippo had not received the Last Rites, had not gone to Confession and was not a practicing Catholic**.**
Compare this to the secular media coverage (also posted in this thread):
Local businessman and **devout Catholic **John Sanfilippo died last week after struggling with emphysema. Friends said Sanfilippo planned for the funeral mass to be held at Our Lady of the Rosary Catholic Church in Little Italy, where Sanfilippo had attended for decades. Friends said he even left the church a large sum of money in his will.
Would have sure been nice had News10 given a couple of details that appeared in CalCatholic. Like the fact that this Sanfilippo was the owner of a gay bar and that he was not a practicing Catholic…not to mention the fact that the parish offered a funeral service, just not a funeral Mass.

I guess it’s not reasonable to expect the MSM to ask the right questions…much less give honest reportage.

I warned yesterday that this was a Pandora’s box and the Bishop had better step carefully.

 

[tm30]

If God hates gay people, why does he keep on making them? btw Im straight. But I wonder what really motivated this thread.

Strawman. Does God hate pedophiles? There’s plenty of pedophiles who “discovered” their orientation while abusing younger siblings and neighbors.

Question: If God doesn’t like sin, why does He keep creating sinners?

God doesn’t create “gay” people. Homosexual orientation is a disorder as much as heterosexual polyamory. It’s a result of sin, not Natural Order, whether or not it’s discovered in youth or young adulthood or later in life. At some point, there is a choice to act on a disordered impulse and carried through. That’s where culpability comes to fruition. Promoting an abomination is diametrically opposed to God’s will.

BTW, I don’t deny the enormity of such a cross, and I feel compassion for those who struggle. There are, believe it or not, single heterosexual Catholics in adulthood who struggle with the desire for intercourse, but refrain out of respect for the institution of marriage and God’s will thereof. “I can’t help it” is not an excuse.

 

[laszlo]

So the Pastor was out of town at the time, and two other priests made the decision based on his not having last rites (is that a requisite to a Catholic funeral Mass?), not having gone to confession (how did they know - do we get registered each time we go to confession?), and not a “practicing Catholic” (again, what is the definition of a practicing Catholic - do we get attendance marks for each time we attend Mass?)

Everyone seems so delighted to jump all over this “homosexual” who just wants to stir stuff up, but it seems two priests who may not have all their facts in a row based a decision on fear of scandal.

The family who declared this man a “devout Catholic” might know more than two priests who might never have met or ministered to this man - especially in light of the fact that the pastor of the church was out of town?

For funeral one should go to a parish where he practiced his faith. The usual test is to require registration and weekly checks to the Church. These are recorded for tax reason. The person who do not do that is not practicing catholic, and the burial can be denied. Only practicing Catholics have rights to services. To require otherwise legally equals to the situation if someone would request to the fitness club, w/o paying membership fees.

 

[LemonAndLime]

For funeral one should go to a parish where he practiced his faith. The usual test is to require registration and weekly checks to the Church. These are recorded for tax reason. The person who do not do that is not practicing catholic, and the burial can be denied. Only practicing Catholics have rights to services.

I don’t submit weekly cheques to the Church. I donate cash amounts, and so do most others. Does this mean I’m not a practicing Catholic? You just said it does.

 

[Corki]

I don’t submit weekly cheques to the Church. I donate cash amounts, and so do most others. Does this mean I’m not a practicing Catholic? You just said it does.

Ask at your parish how they keep track. Some parishes do it by collection envelope. They want you to drop one in, even if it’s empty. There are other ways that parishes do the record keeping part but virtually all parishes have a system of some kind. If you want to be a Godparent, for example, your pastor writes a letter saying you are a parishioner in good standing. He has to have some way of determining that.

 

[LemonAndLime]

Ask at your parish how they keep track. Some parishes do it by collection envelope. They want you to drop one in, even if it’s empty. There are other ways that parishes do the record keeping part but virtually all parishes have a system of some kind. If you want to be a Godparent, for example, your pastor writes a letter saying you are a parishioner in good standing. He has to have some way of determining that.

The envelopes are only available to taxpayers. I don’t pay tax, I’m an unemployed university student.

 

[babylonsfalling]

I always read the posts. But dont also get chance to respond when busy.

I’ll try to be less disruptive. Sometimes you can send a comment without thinking.

That’s fine.
But since you’re now back anyway, how about answering the question…here is it again

Who in this thread said God hates gay people…anyone?

I don’t anyone would consider that to be disruptive.

 

[Corki]

The envelopes are only available to taxpayers. I don’t pay tax, I’m an unemployed university student.

Only tax payers give money in the collection. Must be a British thing.

The story in the OP is in the US, however, and no parish here would deny someone the ability to contribute to the collection and to have the deduction credited. But as I said:

1. your parish may have antoher method for counting who the active parishioners are. Envelopes is just one way, albeit a fairly common one.
2. there are two issues - being a parishioner in good standing and being a practicing Catholic. You can’t be the latter without also being the former but you could be the former without being the latter.

 

[Norminha]

If God hates gay people, why does he keep on making them? btw Im straight. But I wonder what really motivated this thread.

Does God create gays or gays “re-create” themselves?
Does God hate His own creation?
God hates the sin and loves the sinner because it is His image and likeness.
The motivation of this threat is to invite human beings to discuss it, according to the forum’s rules -in a civil and charitable manner.
All God’s creation was very good, said our Creator.

 

[manualman]

LnL,

Seriously? If you ask for an envelope, they’ll refuse you?

Rather different culture! Over here, they’ll give envelopes to 4th graders if you ask them to…

Our parish supports catholic school tuition (a portion only). This support is only for active parishioners. Yep, that’s measured by looking at how often an envelope shows up.

It’s a common metric on this side of the pond.

 

[sojo]

Ask at your parish how they keep track. Some parishes do it by collection envelope. They want you to drop one in, even if it’s empty. There are other ways that parishes do the record keeping part but virtually all parishes have a system of some kind. If you want to be a Godparent, for example, your pastor writes a letter saying you are a parishioner in good standing. He has to have some way of determining that.

That’s news to us! We had two baptisms, 4 including our own years ago, and we never had to submit a letter about the godparents. We were never even asked if any of them were Catholic, though we did make sure that we had that part covered.

Only a tiny percentage of our already itty-bitty church uses envelopes or checks - just baskets of cash at most services. My son had his first communion on Easter 2 years ago, and we haven’t even received the paperwork for that – I guess record keeping isn’t our church’s thing.

I also didn’t know about the last rites for famous sinners. Fr. Maciel refused (violently I understand) last rites and confession upon his death. I wonder if he had a funeral mass?

 

[sojo]

I do know that at one point we had more unclaimed boxes of envelopes than the total attendance at, say, Christmas or Easter. To save money, they eliminated all envelopes for 2 years, and then they had a sign-up for regular parishioners. Many never signed up, and since most folks don’t use checks that much anymore, its mostly a cash collection. This is California, by the way.

 

[Phemie]

That’s news to us! We had two baptisms, 4 including our own years ago, and we never had to submit a letter about the godparents. We were never even asked if any of them were Catholic, though we did make sure that we had that part covered.

It depends on the parish and on the Pastor. The parish down the road requires letters, our Pastor doesn’t.

Only a tiny percentage of our already itty-bitty church uses envelopes or checks - just baskets of cash at most services. My son had his first communion on Easter 2 years ago, and we haven’t even received the paperwork for that – I guess record keeping isn’t our church’s thing.

What paperwork are you expecting regarding your son’s First Communion? There is no paperwork involved.

I also didn’t know about the last rites for famous sinners. Fr. Maciel refused (violently I understand) last rites and confession upon his death. I wonder if he had a funeral mass?

 

[sojo]

Our first child’s baptism (sadly, her adoption was reversed after five years with us), we got a certificate of First Communion right after the big day. She also got a rosary from the Knights of Columbus, I think.

That was a different parish. Our current one doesn’t even have regular catechism classes, and our son has special needs, so we prepared at home during home school, and we made special arrangements for a “hopeful, but no guarantee” First Communion during Easter. He had texture issues, so it was problematic if he would throw a scene or such. So our priest allowed us to be in the front pew, and we quietly, with no fanfare, attempted - SUCCESSFULLY and then the announcement was made after Mass and everyone lined up to hug and shake hands. We had a picture taken with Father, and of course handed in our donation.

The parish secretary took a picture and said she would give us the certificate and a copy of the picture in a few weeks. But she only works about 6 hours a week, so she is hopelessly backlogged. I recorded the date in our family bible and sent announcements to family and friends (all out of town).

I was happy to learn here that the paperwork for a First Communion isn’t as mandatory as a Baptismal Certificate.

We are now working on how to adapt some sort of Confirmation program to a solo home school situation with a special needs child. I could kick myself for not asking in advance - I understand we could have petitioned the diocese to allow our son to be confirmed when he had First Communion. None of the normal confirmation program materials have turned out to be remotely adaptable for my son.

 

[empacae]

If God hates gay people, why does he keep on making them? btw Im straight. But I wonder what really motivated this thread.

The funny thing about gay people is that they keep multiplying without reproducing.