Matthew 24:34 and "This Generation"

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I found an old thread from CAF about what Jesus meant in Matthew 24:34. The abomination of desolation hasn’t come yet, and Jesus hasn’t returned yet, therefore the English in Matthew 24:34 “Truly, I say to you, this generation will not pass away until all these things take place.” must have been translated incorrectly, or I’m reading it wrong.

I came about this website which explains the Greek litteralchristianlibrary.wikifoundry.com/page/Matt.+24:34?t=anon

And was wondering if it has any validity? Essentially Jesus was saying, “This generation will not pass away until all of these things begin to come to pass”

Is this a proper translation? Is there any other way to explain Matthew 24:34 and Jesus’s use of “All these things”? And if the website has done well translating the Greek then why isn’t this a more common translation in our Bibles?

Thanks.
 
From the Haydock Commentary:

34 Amen I say to you, that this generation shall not pass, till all these things be done.

This generation; i.e. the nation of the Jews shall not cease to exist, until all these things shall be accomplished: thus we see the nation of the Jews still continue, and will certainly continue to the end of the world. T. — Then the cross, which has been a scandal to the Jew, and a stumbling-block to the Gentile, shall appear in the heavens, for the consolation of the good Christian. Hoc signum crucis erit in cœlo, cum Dominus ad judicandum venerit. — If it be to be understood of the destruction of Jerusalem, the sense may be, this race of men now living; if of the last day of judgment, this generation of the faithful, saith Theophylactus,[4] shall be continued: i.e. the Church of Christ, to the end of the world. Wi. — This race, I tell you in very truth, shall not pass away till all this be finally accomplished in the ruin of Jerusalem, the most express figure of the destruction and end of the world. V. — By generation, our Saviour does not mean the people that were in existence at that time, but the faithful of his Church; thus says the psalmist: this is the generation of them that seek the Lord. Ps. xxiii, v. 6. S. Chrys. hom. lxxvii.
 
The Haydock Bible Commentary says:
Ver. 34. This generation; i.e. the nation of the Jews shall not cease to exist, until all these things shall be accomplished: thus we see the nation of the Jews still continue, and will certainly continue to the end of the world. (Tirinus) — Then the cross, which has been a scandal to the Jew, and a stumbling-block to the Gentile, shall appear in the heavens, for the consolation of the good Christian. Hoc signum crucis erit in cœlo, cum Dominus ad judicandum venerit. — If it be to be understood of the destruction of Jerusalem, the sense may be, this race of men now living; if of the last day of judgment, this generation of the faithful, saith Theophylactus,[4] shall be continued: i.e. the Church of Christ, to the end of the world. (Witham) — This race, I tell you in very truth, shall not pass away till all this be finally accomplished in the ruin of Jerusalem, the most express figure of the destruction and end of the world. (Bible de Vence) — By generation, our Saviour does not mean the people that were in existence at that time, but the faithful of his Church; thus says the psalmist: this is the generation of them that seek the Lord. (Psalm xxiii, ver. 6.) (St. Chrysostom, hom. lxxvii.)
haydock1859.tripod.com/id42.html
 
I was under the impression that it meant the Church would be founded within that generation
 
From the Haydock Commentary:

34 Amen I say to you, that this generation shall not pass, till all these things be done.

This generation; i.e. the nation of the Jews shall not cease to exist, until all these things shall be accomplished: thus we see the nation of the Jews still continue, and will certainly continue to the end of the world. T. — Then the cross, which has been a scandal to the Jew, and a stumbling-block to the Gentile, shall appear in the heavens, for the consolation of the good Christian. Hoc signum crucis erit in cœlo, cum Dominus ad judicandum venerit. — If it be to be understood of the destruction of Jerusalem, the sense may be, this race of men now living; if of the last day of judgment, this generation of the faithful, saith Theophylactus,[4] shall be continued: i.e. the Church of Christ, to the end of the world. Wi. — This race, I tell you in very truth, shall not pass away till all this be finally accomplished in the ruin of Jerusalem, the most express figure of the destruction and end of the world. V. — By generation, our Saviour does not mean the people that were in existence at that time, but the faithful of his Church; thus says the psalmist: this is the generation of them that seek the Lord. Ps. xxiii, v. 6. S. Chrys. hom. lxxvii.
I originally liked this explanation until I searched around and found that there is nothing in the Bible that suggest Jesus was speaking of the “race” of the Jews or something of that sort. Do you have any evidence to back up your claim?

I ask because it would be greatly appreciated as this passage is currently on my conscience.
 
I just read the book " What Jesus had to say about the end of the world.

The authors claim is Jesus is using an ancient method called the inclusio. Essential Jesus mentioned generation twice indicating every thing his says after the first mention and the last mention pertain to a single historical event. The speech builds to a climax than gradually comes to an end. Points made prior to the climax have corresponding points on the downward side.
Everything within this statement pertains to the destruction of the temple.
This ended Judism as Jesus knew it.
 
I originally liked this explanation until I searched around and found that there is nothing in the Bible that suggest Jesus was speaking of the “race” of the Jews or something of that sort. Do you have any evidence to back up your claim?

I ask because it would be greatly appreciated as this passage is currently on my conscience.
The Catholic and Eastern Orthodox Churches have always relied on the totality of revelation, combined with the Apostolic authority which they have always possessed. Thus, they have never artificially restricted their body of God’s revelation to the partial, incomplete written record which we know as the bible. As much as I love scripture, as much as I peruse the many and varied bibles that exist, I found that the bible itself tells us in many places that it is not complete.

Non-Apostolic communities argue that the bible is “sufficient”, but nowhere does the bible make this claim! This is man’s claim. “Sufficient” does not and cannot answer all of our questions. Most of what God has revealed is not in the bible, and so can never be found there, as it was not intended to be there. But, one thing that I wonder about: If the bible is inspired, even though most of it makes no such claim, how can it be considered “sufficient” when it also makes no such claim about itself?

Paul exhorted us to hold fast to both the scriptures and the traditions, and sometimes our answer is in one, sometimes the other. That is why we must hold to both.
 
The Catholic and Eastern Orthodox Churches have always relied on the totality of revelation, combined with the Apostolic authority which they have always possessed. Thus, they have never artificially restricted their body of God’s revelation to the partial, incomplete written record which we know as the bible. As much as I love scripture, as much as I peruse the many and varied bibles that exist, I found that the bible itself tells us in many places that it is not complete.

Non-Apostolic communities argue that the bible is “sufficient”, but nowhere does the bible make this claim! This is man’s claim. “Sufficient” does not and cannot answer all of our questions. Most of what God has revealed is not in the bible, and so can never be found there, as it was not intended to be there. But, one thing that I wonder about: If the bible is inspired, even though most of it makes no such claim, how can it be considered “sufficient” when it also makes no such claim about itself?

Paul exhorted us to hold fast to both the scriptures and the traditions, and sometimes our answer is in one, sometimes the other. That is why we must hold to both.
I’m not looking entirely for Biblical evidence, but rather linguistic evidence of the term “Generation” being used to mean a group of Jews. Or something of that sort.
 
I’m not looking entirely for Biblical evidence, but rather linguistic evidence of the term “Generation” being used to mean a group of Jews. Or something of that sort.
Taken in light of verse 14, He was speaking of a generation which would yet exist at the end of time, not the “current generation” as we think of it. As well, at that time He was sent only to the lost sheep of Israel, and so was referring to them. He had not yet issued the commandment to preach to the gentiles, so at that point he was clearly speaking of the Hebrew people.

See also how He uses the Old Testament language (Deuteronomy 1:35) regarding this “evil generation” that “seeks a sign” before they would believe. Paul writes that the Greeks seek wisdom while the Hebrews demand signs (1 Cor 1:22). Pretty clear that our Lord was referencing the Hebrew generation (race).
 
This is one of the most difficult passages in the Bible. The preterist belief tries to fix it by pushing the events of revelation into that literal generation.

I haven’t shut out preterism, but I am inclined against it. I found this site to be very informative on rectifying that verse without using preterism.

thingstocome.org/whatgen.htm
 
2 Peter 1:20 “Knowing this first, that no matter of scriptural prophecy is of any private interpretation”

Private interpretation was a huge problem even in the 1st century! The bible says so. Why is this extremely important verse so casually discarded as though it was apocryphal?

The answer is not comfortable.
 
2 Peter 1:20 “Knowing this first, that no matter of scriptural prophecy is of any private interpretation”
20 Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.
21 For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.
If the catholic church has already declared the interpretation of that verse then just ignore me, but when you read the whole statement it sounds more like he is saying that the prophecies made by the prophets were not private interpretations of their own, but a revelation from God.
 
If the catholic church has already declared the interpretation of that verse then just ignore me, but when you read the whole statement it sounds more like he is saying that the prophecies made by the prophets were not private interpretations of their own, but a revelation from God.
Well, it is scriptural prophecy, and millions have privately interpreted it - arriving at different conclusions. Is our God really a God of confusion or murkiness? The problem is, that if we follow the letter of the bible, we must go to the Church, just as Paul did in Acts 15. BTW, the Church has not given a set-in-stone verse-by-verse interpretation, since prophecy is multi-layered in many cases.

Here is how it was understood by the early Church fathers. Excellent reading and reflection.
 
Sorry for the confusion, I was referring to 2 Peter 1:20-21.
 
Jesus made a similar statement just before this after giving a list of woes to the scribes and Pharisees:Mt. 23:36 Truly, I say to you, all this will come upon this generation.
I like St. Jerome’s commentary on the above verse: ** "The rule of the Scriptures is only to know two generations, one of good and the other of bad."**

A couple of examples from Scripture:
Generation meaning the bad/evil:
Luke 16:8 The master commended the dishonest steward for his shrewdness; for the sons of this world are more shrewd in dealing with their own generation than the sons of light.

Ps 12:7-8 Do thou, O LORD, protect us, guard us ever from this** generation**. On every side the wicked prowl, as vileness is exalted among the sons of men.
(This verse is also an example of the expression “sons of men” being used to denote the wicked.)

Generation meaning the good:
Ps 14:5 God is with the** generation **of the righteous
Ps 112:2 The **generation **of the righteous shall be blessed
 
I disagree with all of you who claim that Jesus didn’t mean those people He was speaking to at the time.

Because, to the High Priest who questioned Him about whether or not He was the Messiah, the Son of God, the Gospel says [Matt 26:64], "And the high priest said to Him, ‘I adjure You by the living God, that You tell us whether You are the Christ, the Son of God.’ 64Jesus said to him, ‘You have said it yourself; nevertheless I tell you, hereafter you will see THE SON OF MAN SITTING AT THE RIGHT HAND OF POWER, and COMING ON THE CLOUDS OF HEAVEN.’

That man, that High Priest, will experience the ressurrection [of the unrighteous?] and personally see what Jesus said he would.

So, “this generation” applies to those He was speaking to, perhaps also to others.
 
I think if ‘this generation’ means the same as it does in English then it is pretty good proof that the Gospel was written approximately around the contemporary generation of Jesus.

Disclaimer : i have little knowledge on translations from ancient Greek or on the use of Jewish idioms 2000 years ago.
 
I disagree with all of you who claim that Jesus didn’t mean those people He was speaking to at the time.

Because, to the High Priest who questioned Him about whether or not He was the Messiah, the Son of God, the Gospel says [Matt 26:64], "And the high priest said to Him, ‘I adjure You by the living God, that You tell us whether You are the Christ, the Son of God.’ 64Jesus said to him, ‘You have said it yourself; nevertheless I tell you, hereafter you will see THE SON OF MAN SITTING AT THE RIGHT HAND OF POWER, and COMING ON THE CLOUDS OF HEAVEN.’

That man, that High Priest, will experience the ressurrection [of the unrighteous?] and personally see what Jesus said he would.

So, “this generation” applies to those He was speaking to, perhaps also to others.
I want to revisit this, because after reading through I think that this is the best possible explanation. Jesus literally meant, “Those standing here today (this generation) will not pass away until these things happen”

A skeptic will argue that the generation has passed away, so often the Apologist will say, “Generation means the Jews, who still exist; so it’s reasonable for Jesus to say this.” Where I have come to the conclusion that Jesus literally meant the people he was talking to then and there and I’ll explain why.

Let’s look at some of the Prophecies that haven’t come true yet:

Matthew 24: 14 And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in the whole world as a testimony to all nations, and then the end will come.

22 “If those days had not been cut short, no one would survive, but for the sake of the elect those days will be shortened.

29 “Immediately after the distress of those days “‘the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light; the stars will fall from the sky,and the heavenly bodies will be shaken.’

30 “Then will appear the sign of the Son of Man in heaven. And then all the peoples of the earth will mourn when they see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven, with power and great glory.

34 Truly I tell you, this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened.

Let’s look at what Jesus said in verse 30 specifically: “And then all the peoples of the earth will mourn when they see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven”

Should we assume that Jesus is only speaking of the people living on earth at that time will see the Son of Man coming in the clouds? Or also those who have passed away but have not yet passed onto their second death? I believe the latter. Although the Generation of people who were talking to Jesus at that time have now died, they have not died eternally and that Generation (and every generation) will see the Son of Man coming in the clouds of Heaven.

2 Thes 1:8 He will punish those who do not know God and do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus. 9 They will be punished with everlasting destruction and shut out from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of his might 10 **on the day he comes to be glorified **in his holy people and to be marveled at among all those who have believed. This includes you, because you believed our testimony to you.

Again, here we have Paul speaking of those who have done evil will be punished with everlasting destruction on the day Jesus comes to be glorified. Is Paul also only speaking of those living on the Earth at that time, or is Paul speaking of all Generations, including the “This Generation” that Jesus mentions. Again, the latter. This is made clear when Paul says, “This includes you” but the people he wrote to have now passed away.

Revelation 20:12 And I saw the dead, great and small, standing before the throne, and books were opened. Another book was opened, which is the book of life. The dead were judged according to what they had done as recorded in the books. 13 The sea gave up the dead that were in it, and death and Hades gave up the dead that were in them, and each person was judged according to what they had done. 14 Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death. 15 Anyone whose name was not found written in the book of life was thrown into the lake of fire.

This is the second death, immediately after the return of Christ which will be seen by all including the Generation that Jesus spoke to in Matthew 24.

Jesus concludes His prophecy in Matthew 24:

35Heaven and earth will pass away, but my words will never pass away.

Contrast that with what Revelation says next:

21 Then I saw “a new heaven and a new earth,” for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and there was no longer any sea.

Also, I do believe the Prophecy has a double meaning with the destruction of the Jewish temple, but Jesus was right in a sense that these things will happen within the next 40 years, but they will also happen well into the future. “This Generation” refers to the generation living at that time before their first death and, “This Generation” refers to the generation living after their first death but before their second death.
 
The caveat here is that Jesus was prophesying, and we are not to privately interpret prophecy.

What did the Apostle Peter want us to know first of all?
2 Peter 1:20
New American Standard Bible (NASB)
But know this first of all, that no prophecy of Scripture is a matter of one’s own interpretation
Look at what immediately precedes Jesus’ comment about “this generation”:
“29 But immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light, and the stars will fall from [r]the sky, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken. 30 And then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in the sky, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of the sky with power and great glory. 31 And He will send forth His angels with a great trumpet and they will gather together His [t]elect from the four winds, from one end of the sky to the other."

I think we can ll agree that this has not come to fruition, can’t we?
 
The caveat here is that Jesus was prophesying, and we are not to privately interpret prophecy.

What did the Apostle Peter want us to know first of all?

Look at what immediately precedes Jesus’ comment about “this generation”:

I think we can ll agree that this has not come to fruition, can’t we?
No, it hasn’t happened yet but Jesus said it would happen to “This Generation.” And after what you quoted, Jesus says:

31 And he will send out his angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

See how those being gathered will be those of the generation Jesus was speaking to? As well as many other generations.
 
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