May 21, 2011

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NolePaul2011

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Hello,

Ive seen people with signs and literature about the end of the World being May 21, 2011. I know the Bible says the end will come like a thief in the night and that Jesus says only the father knows the time…

How should we Catholics dialogue with these people, as when you try to enter a discussion, they claim there is some code in the Bible?
 
Just say “give me call on May 22nd and we can discuss further as to why you were not raptured”. The first point would be that the idea of a rapture as they claim is completely un-biblical. “they were caught up with” does not mean, they dissipated from the face of the Earth instantly. Also, if I’m not mistaken the Bible clearly states that believers would be around when all the bad stuff happened - they would be sealed of course - thus not taking part in the “punishment” but existing in human bodies non the less.

If we should concern ourselves with this “prophecy” at all I believe we should look at it as an opportunity to share the faith through acts of love. When the rapture fails to occur you will be looking at thousands of people who, will know instantly, that they have been deceived. This will probably invoke fear in them and will cause them to question themselves and God in ways they never had done before. Let’s be ready not to say “I told you so” but rather say “You are always welcome here”. I doubt anyone who has put their faith in this prophecy will let go until the time has past. The reason being is because there will either:

A) Be a rapture
B) or Won’t be a rapture

and thus faced with the decision to:

A) Believe in the rapture
B) Disbelieve in the rapture

Thus the Combinations and their effect on May 21.
A and A → they are right - Raptured
A and B → The people risk not being raptured (Bad-huge loss)
B and A → Believed a lie (no effect)
B and B → We were right (no effect)

At this point they (in their minds) gain nothing by switching sides, but rather only risk losing taking part in the rapture.

However, since we know the rapture won’t happen, believing it will happen (option 3) means only that they are believing a lie. Just let time prove the falseness of the prophecy, saves us time which we can use to prepare further to defend our faith against more deceiving doctrines that actually appeal to logic. When all these people “wake up” to what they have been believing, blindly and falsely all this time, such defense will be important.
 
I’ve heard that the world will end December 12, 2012 (12/12/12), or 12/21/12, depends on who you talk to. That’s based on the ancient Mayan calendar ending on that date. I used to be terrified at the thought of end of the world, and global warming, and nuclear war, and pandemics, and peak oil, need I go on? God led me back to the Church I had abandoned more than 20 years ago. My fear of those things is gone, now. Being a good Catholic gives one so many things to do, there isn’t time to worry about such things.

I wouldn’t engage those people, lest I commit a sin against charity. Nothing is going to change their minds.

Edited because I can’t tell April from May. 😊
 
NolePaul2011 said:
Hello,

Ive seen people with signs and literature about the end of the World being May 21, 2011. I know the Bible says the end will come like a thief in the night and that Jesus says only the father knows the time…

How should we Catholics dialogue with these people, as when you try to enter a discussion, they claim there is some code in the Bible?
Click to expand...
Those who claim to know the end date make themselves superior in knowledge to Christ. By definition, they are false prophets. There has been an almost unending string of them, all of whom have failed in their predictions. I may doubt their judgment, but I do not doubt the strength of their egos.
 
po18guy said:
Those who claim to know the end date make themselves superior in knowledge to Christ. By definition, they are false prophets. There has been an almost unending string of them, all of whom have failed in their predictions. I may doubt their judgment, but I do not doubt the strength of their egos.
Click to expand...
I’d say that if that is all the time we have left, why are we wasting it fretting about the end of the world that we are powerless to stop anyway…

Really seems silly…
 
“But of that day and hour no one knows, neither the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but the Father alone.” (Matthew 24: 36-37).

Honestly, I don’t know how Jesus could be any clearer than that.
 
cargau said:
I’d say that if that is all the time we have left, why are we wasting it fretting about the end of the world that we are powerless to stop anyway…

Really seems silly…
Click to expand...
For about 100 generations now, the “end times” amounted to the day on which each individual drew their last breath. And, that is what we should focus on. Our Lord advised us to “watch”, not to speculate.
 
The group you are referring to are most likely the followers of Harold Camping. He is basically a crack-pot who has a history of failed prophetic claims. However he has a huge following. Here are some resources that explain what ‘Brother Harold’ is up to this time.
**Harold Camping - Family Radio Resource List
**
 
jonathanjlinn said:
Just say “give me call on May 22nd and we can discuss further as to why you were not raptured”. The first point would be that the idea of a rapture as they claim is completely un-biblical. “they were caught up with” does not mean, they dissipated from the face of the Earth instantly. Also, if I’m not mistaken the Bible clearly states that believers would be around when all the bad stuff happened - they would be sealed of course - thus not taking part in the “punishment” but existing in human bodies non the less.

If we should concern ourselves with this “prophecy” at all I believe we should look at it as an opportunity to share the faith through acts of love. When the rapture fails to occur you will be looking at thousands of people who, will know instantly, that they have been deceived. This will probably invoke fear in them and will cause them to question themselves and God in ways they never had done before. Let’s be ready not to say “I told you so” but rather say “You are always welcome here”. I doubt anyone who has put their faith in this prophecy will let go until the time has past. The reason being is because there will either:

A) Be a rapture
B) or Won’t be a rapture

and thus faced with the decision to:

A) Believe in the rapture
B) Disbelieve in the rapture

Thus the Combinations and their effect on May 21.
A and A → they are right - Raptured
A and B → The people risk not being raptured (Bad-huge loss)
B and A → Believed a lie (no effect)
B and B → We were right (no effect)

At this point they (in their minds) gain nothing by switching sides, but rather only risk losing taking part in the rapture.

However, since we know the rapture won’t happen, believing it will happen (option 3) means only that they are believing a lie. Just let time prove the falseness of the prophecy, saves us time which we can use to prepare further to defend our faith against more deceiving doctrines that actually appeal to logic. When all these people “wake up” to what they have been believing, blindly and falsely all this time, such defense will be important.
Click to expand...
Well, obviously, the rapture did not happen. Now they have come up with some nonsense that the rapture happened internally, but the end will be on October 21 (just to save himself from public humiliation). So my answer to this is B and B… We were right all along. Whenever you have some kind of worry about the end, know two things: NO ONE except the Father knows when it will happen, and even if you are a sinner, as long as you believe in Christ, you WILL be saved (John 3:16)
 
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