Men please answer honestly

[ZDHayden]

I may be late in replying, but regardless, I hope my perspective on the matter is helpful. My girlfriend and I are 18. My girlfriend is a modest girl whose most revealing article of clothing is a black cotton t-shirt whose sleeves come halfway down the distance from her shoulders to her elbows. She wears generally denim skirts that come down to just an inch or two above her ankles. If she doesn’t wear a skirt, she wears jeans (which is rare). While she is independent, she respects proper authority. She doesn’t like receiving glory, but will fight to do what is expected of her. Though, as a non-Catholic, she doesn’t know it, she is built in the mold of our Lord’s most holy mother, Mary. To be honest, I wouldn’t want it any other way.

As for the feminist agenda, I have taken this semester a gender studies course that focused on feminist theory. While I agree with Cixous (men can’t write for women and women can’t write for men, as they have differing experiences, and thus both genders must find their own literary voice), the teachings of Kristeva and Wittig – especially Wittig – sicken me. Modern feminism is the combination of teachings from Cixous, Kristeva, Wittig, Roe v. Wade, and a reaction against the binary defined by Gilbert and Gubar. Modern feminism is not so much about gaining equality – which I fully support – but rather superiority and convenience (both of which corrupt).

 

[_Gandalf]

Ok, I have a question that would definitely become heated in a secular environment but I am hoping on a Catholic website men will be more comfortable anwering.

What do men really think about the way women carry on today? I mean by wearing provocative clothes, figthing to breast feed in public and getting mad at people who are against it. Being the ones to initate dates with men, using profanity, flirting (not innocently), being offended when men open doors and all the other stuff.

I have often been insituations were woman would do things in front of their husbands that I though was not nice and the man simply ignores it. For example, my uncles wife kept talking about her first husband, and then her second husband in front of him (he is her third husband). Personally, I found that was a put down to my uncle to have it in his face that she still though about them (ok, I know my uncle chose to be her third husband but that is beside the point). I think my uncle ignored it because he knew she wouldn’t stop and he had too much pride to admit his hurt.

Once a man told me when his girlfriend hits him, he laughs because he knows if he hits her back society would be totally against him. Is it possible it is not the physical pain that hurst the man but the emotional put down that would crush him?

Deep down, regardless of what society says, do men not want wifes, mothers and sisters that are respectable? Also, please list behaviours that feminist think woman should do but deep down men think are wrong.

The reason I ask is because as a woman I need to know it is OK to be old fashion. Since I can’t get the support from my female peers to be modest, can I please have some support from men

Thanks

CM

Well heres my take on the matter.

Firstly it depends on the guy. A good analogy I hear once was this:

“Women are like apples, the good ones are at the top of the tree and the bad ones are on the ground around it. Most men will not want to risk climbing the tree to get a good apple, so they settle for a second rate one on the ground. This makes the women on the top wonder if there is anything wrong with them because nobody has stopped to pick them. In reality though they have nothing wrong with them at all, they just need to wait for a man brave enough to risk falling”

That can sum it up pretty nicely. Cheap men like cheap women. If you want to get a low life scumbag who will probably be washing dishes at a diner for all of his life then use profanity, refuse acts of chivalry, and dress in a rather revealing manner. If you want a guy who is a man, and not a boy, then you need just the opposite. Men are attracted to women, so act like a women and you will attract men. Boys are attracted to girls, act like a girl and you will attract boys. Its just that simple (well its a bit more complex than that, but that is a good general idea).

 

[vera_dicere]

figthing to breast feed in public and getting mad at people who are against it.

Excuse me for jumping in here.

But seriously? Breast feeding is not only completely natural but best for baby!! A sexist male dominated society has created it so breasts have a “sexual” purpose only.

The main purpose of breasts is to feed baby, not to tantalise men.

The sooner we all realise that, the better off babies will be.

 

[Portrait]

Ok, I have a question that would definitely become heated in a secular environment but I am hoping on a Catholic website men will be more comfortable anwering.

What do men really think about the way women carry on today? I mean by wearing provocative clothes, figthing to breast feed in public and getting mad at people who are against it. Being the ones to initate dates with men, using profanity, flirting (not innocently), being offended when men open doors and all the other stuff.

I have often been insituations were woman would do things in front of their husbands that I though was not nice and the man simply ignores it. For example, my uncles wife kept talking about her first husband, and then her second husband in front of him (he is her third husband). Personally, I found that was a put down to my uncle to have it in his face that she still though about them (ok, I know my uncle chose to be her third husband but that is beside the point). I think my uncle ignored it because he knew she wouldn’t stop and he had too much pride to admit his hurt.

Once a man told me when his girlfriend hits him, he laughs because he knows if he hits her back society would be totally against him. Is it possible it is not the physical pain that hurst the man but the emotional put down that would crush him?

Deep down, regardless of what society says, do men not want wifes, mothers and sisters that are respectable? Also, please list behaviours that feminist think woman should do but deep down men think are wrong.

The reason I ask is because as a woman I need to know it is OK to be old fashion. Since I can’t get the support from my female peers to be modest, can I please have some support from men

Thanks

CM

Dear CM,

Cordial greetings and thankyou for the above.

First, allow me to reassure you that it is perfectly permissible to be ‘old fashioned’ with respect to being a woman, indeed it is an affirmation of authentic womanhood.

Second, there are myriads of men, Christian and non-Christian alike, who are utterly weary with the femenist agenda and its unwholesome stress on the emancipation of womanhood and the place of women outside of the home in every sphere of life which men occupy. This will probably be dismissed by some as blatant “sexism”, but I firmly believe that many chaps long for women to wholeheartedly accept their place in the family and devote themselves without reserve to fulfilling their function soley as wife and mother. Moreover, they are of the opinion that the notion that a woman has equal rights with a man to self-determination and is at perfect liberty to make herself a career as well as her husband (unless of course she is unmarried), has been the occasion of many social and economic ills.

Militant secular feminism has shamelessly and defiantly abandoned Christian teaching on the role of women and the hierarchical order within the home, with the consequence that many adverse results are now all too perceptible in our contemporary Western society.

The majority of respectable men are fed up to death with the modern brash woman who seems to take a perverse delight in denying her femenity and who is forever aggressively advocating women’s rights. You refer to women taking offence when men open or hold doors; I have actually been scowled at for doing that very thing. The secular femenist claim for all-round equality with men has made a very significant contribution to the extinction of what used to be termed, at least here in England, as ‘gentlemanly behaviour’. Alas, it is becoming less common now for chaps to open doors or offer their seat in a crowded train or bus to a woman as a woman, or to treat her with any special consideration as the weaker sex. If this is our brave new world then it is a very sad world indeed. It is hardly surprising that men long for a respectable and traditional woman who knows something of the true dignity of womanhood.

Popular notions of womanhood notwithstanding, no work is potentially more important than home building and being a mother. The hand that rocks the cradle still rules the world, and the disintegration of authentic family life is surely one of the great maladies of today’s so called progressive world.

Please go ahead and be the old fashioned type of women, for our crazy mixed up world urgently needs more woman of your calibre; there are many respectable chaps who would appreciate singularity and find your modesty a refreshing and welcome change.

Warmest good wishes,

Portrait

 

[Ponyguy]

Popular notions of womanhood notwithstanding, no work is potentially more important than home building and being a mother. The hand that rocks the cradle still rules the world, and the disintegration of authentic family life is surely one of the great maladies of today’s so called progressive world.

Please go ahead and be the old fashioned type of women, for our crazy mixed up world urgently needs more woman of your calibre; there are many respectable chaps who would appreciate singularity and find your modesty a refreshing and welcome change.

Warmest good wishes,

Portrait

I wholeheartedly agree. Portrait!

Our daughter-in-law breast-feeds our granddaughter, even when we sit in the first pew at church; d-i-l has a cape which she wraps around her neck and it completely covers her "milk jugs"and the baby. When “the meal” is finished, the baby gets pulled out from under the cape and “mama” puts herself back together. No problemo… and the world continues to rotate.

 

[Aetheria]

This will probably be dismissed by some as blatant “sexism”, but I firmly believe that many chaps long for women to wholeheartedly accept their place in the family and devote themselves without reserve to fulfilling their function soley as wife and mother. Moreover, they are of the opinion that the notion that a woman has equal rights with a man to self-determination and is at perfect liberty to make herself a career as well as her husband (unless of course she is unmarried), has been the occasion of many social and economic ills.

Well, that first bit isn’t necessarily sexist. Many women are happy, and the source of happiness for others, when they’re able to make being a good wife and mother their priority. I would even say that the majority are this way.

But when you get to the part about denying that “a woman has equal rights with a man to self-determination” - do you really mean to imply that women are intended to be servants or slaves? Because that’s certainly what it sounds like. What, I ask, is the value of being a wife and mother if one doesn’t choose that freely and out of love?

 

[Soutane]

I prefer women to dress modestly.Mygirlfriend is very curvaceous and extremely feminine.God has been very generous to her in the pulchritude department.She draws admiring glances from men in spite of dressing modestly and non-seductively.She is smart,creative,a professional,and has a great sense of direction on which I totally rely.She is demure but doesn’t suffer fools gladly.
I admire her tremendously for the life situations she has overcome.She is the anchor of her family,and her siblings all older look to her for reassurance and guidance.She is all woman and enjoys her femininity.I hate to use a cliche but she makes me want to be a better man.I am indeed fortunate that she has chosen to love me and I her.She is my equal in every aspect and far exceeds my knowledge in certain areas.She is my best friend,the love of my life and I am her greatest admirer.She is a serious Catholic and I have seen visible emotion on her face as she celebrates the mass.When I think of a feminine ideal,I think of her.Her modesty enhances her femininity and shows me a great deal of respect.

I saw a young woman the other evening with the front of one leg of her jeans cut away,deliberately exposing the top of her thigh to her ankle.She was all of 16 or 17 years old.It made me seethe at her lack of self respect and the blatant way she was advertising her goods.Men ultimately treat such girls and women with contempt.Leering and ogling are forms of contempt.When I was in Mexico on the beach I saw plenty of Canadian,American and European women completely topless and wearing only thongs.

Men are very visual creatures and our sexual response can be instantaneous.I had nothing but utter contempt for these women as they were provoking an emotional and physiological response in me that I did not want to experience with them.I deliberately turned my face from them as I did not want to give them the satisfaction of putting a metaphorical notch in their non-existant belts,or to express false outrage that a man would have the temerity to look at their naked bodies that were posed for intentional display.I did not see ONE Mexican woman degrade herself in such a manner.Other more modest women found it to be uncomfortable and intimidating and it showed a complete lack of respect by their husbands and boyfriends as they gawked and leered.

I have never seen so much rubber or silicone in my life.Once women degrade themselves to the level of men,it’s game over.Women are the glue of our societies and it is their restraint and self-control that has civilised we men.

My son is 15 and QUITE handsome.The phone does not stop ringing and girls are constantly at the door.Somehow he has maintained his virtue and is a devout Catholic,Pro-Life activist and is considering the priesthood.A lot of the the girls at his CATHOLIC highschool are in my opinion sexually predative as if it is liberated to act like a teen aged boy.The boys cannot believe their good fortune and sexual favours are demanded and eagerly given.There is no such thing as a chaste good night kiss any more.

He is in grade 10 and a stunning youing woman in grade 12 has asked him to the prom.Over my dead body-no hotel rooms,no drinking which is deriguer.I feel like a protective father of a 15 year old girl.

Look at the way women and young girls are bombarded by every form of media,and made to feel inadequate so that these hyenas can sell their wares to these insecure females.It is an absolute disgrace and until both women and men protest,nothing will be done.I admire the Muslim women who dress in such a fashion as to.be non-provocative-I am no fan of the Face covering or the body bags some are coerced into wearing by some husbands but primarily by tribalism.That form of dress is just as offensive as it reinforces the attitude that these women are chattels or belongings.

As far as breastfeeding in public,if done demurely I find it touching and beautiful and do not stare but we have to get over this misconception that female breasts are sexualised ALL the time.They are anything but and to expect a Mother to feed her child in a pristine or filthy public toilet is nuts.Would you eat dinner there of course not,At our local mall we have a picture of a baby being breast fed as a reminder that it is a completely natural function and most women do it in a completely non-ostentacious manner,Mary breast fed Jesus and I’m sure she didn’t do it in the outhouse.Let’s give women a break on this one.I am extremely conservative by the way,

 

[Portrait]

Well, that first bit isn’t necessarily sexist. Many women are happy, and the source of happiness for others, when they’re able to make being a good wife and mother their priority. I would even say that the majority are this way.

But when you get to the part about denying that “a woman has equal rights with a man to self-determination” - do you really mean to imply that women are intended to be servants or slaves? Because that’s certainly what it sounds like. What, I ask, is the value of being a wife and mother if one doesn’t choose that freely and out of love?

Dear Aetheria,

Cordial greetings and thankyou for your comments above.

First, let me say by way of reply that all women are, generally speaking, capable of being good wives and mothers and matrimony ought to be a matter having prior claim to their consideration for their future lives. The only exceptions would be a severe long term illness or a vow of “virginity for the kingdom of heaven’s sake” (see Catechism of the Catholic Church, paras. 1618-1620 cf. S. Matt. 19: 12). However, marriage must always be regarded as a “great good”, for “The vocation to marriage is written in the very nature of man and woman as they came from the hand of the Creator” (CCC, para. 1603). ‘Therefore a man leaves his father and his mother and cleaves to his wife, and they become one flesh’ (Gen. 2: 24). This will surely be the norm for the vast majority of fit and healthy men and women, for ‘God who created man out of love also calls him to love - the fundamental and innate* vocation of every human being’* (CCC para. 1604, emphasis mine). Moreover, ‘marriage helps to overcome self-absorption, egoism, pursuit of one’s own pleasure, and to open oneself to the other, to mutual aid and to self-giving’ (CCC para. 1609). Thus it is perfectly natural and normal for a woman to enter into wedlock and to do so out of love for her husband to be and in obedience to God’s will.

Second, my very sincere apologies if I conveyed the impression that the role of a woman is to be a slave or servant in some sort of servile or demeaning sense. However, I do believe that Sacred Scripture enjoins a woman to be submissive to her husband, which is quite another thing altogether. Thus St. Paul says, ‘Wives, be subject to your husbands, as to the Lord. For the husband is head of the wife as Christ is head of the Church, his body, and is himself its Saviour’ (Eph. 5: 22, 23), but St. Paul also says that men should love their wives and ‘not be harsh with them’ (Col. 3: 18), which obviously implies not treating them in a servile fashion (cf. I Cor. 11: 3; Col. 3: 18; Titus 2: 5; I Pet. 3: 1).

Third, the Christian faith actually emphasizes the dignity of womanhood, and it is an indisputable fact that the religion of Christ has elevated women in one country and society after another to a position that they did not occupy previously. Whereas in many of the world religions, not least in Judaism and Islam, women have a far lower position than men. Christianity emphasizes that men and women have a perfect spiritual equality, an equality which modifies and ennobles every aspect of possible subjection (see Gal. 3: 28).

However, in the context of the family, for its order and its unity, there must be leadership, and the responsibility of leadership is that of the husband an father, and his authority must not be challenged; families are not democracies. Moreover, for excellent reasons (see I Tim. 2: 13, 14) it has pleased God to assign to the husband the duty of being head of the wife. This is a very prudential arrangement for a home without a head is an invitation to anarchy (witness the all too many so called ‘dysfunctional families’ that abound nowadays); it spells both derangement and disaster, worse ever than that which results when a nation is without a ruler or an army without a commander.

If all of this sounds rather antiquated and discriminatory, then it is only because we have all been inure to a relentless secular femenism and a political correctness that has run wildly amok. Be that as it may it is wholly in accord with Sacred Scripture and the consistent teaching of the Church down through the vicissitudes of time.

Warmest good wishes,

Portrait

 

[inquiringmind]

Then let me inquire about this: Those of you men that answered about being visual and that women should wear modest clothes (which I whole-hearted agree on), does your wife/daughter/young lady friend see a male** doctor? If all men, including priests, are visual, then why is it okay for women to go to a male doctor for things obstetrical or gynecological? The doctor is not exempt from being visual, solely because he’s a medical professional…he’s first a man, then a doctor. Having been employed for a long time in health care, I’ve worked with some wonderful male doctors, but you cannot say in one breath that men are visual and easily swayed or distracted and then in the next breath say it’s okay for your wife to see a male OB just “because he was such a good doctor…”. These days, female OB/GYNs outnumber male OBs, so it’s not like there isn’t a choice for routine, scheduled healthcare. Any thoughts on that?

 

[Samantha79]

Then let me inquire about this:

Those of you men that answered about being visual and that women should wear modest clothes (which I whole-heartedly agree on), does your wife/daughter/young lady friend see a male doctor? If all men, including priests, are visual, then why is it okay for women to go to a male doctor for things obstetrical or gynecological? The doctor is not exempt from being visual, solely because he’s a medical professional…he’s first a man, then a doctor. You cannot say in one breath that men are visual and easily swayed or distracted by a women showing skin and then in the next breath say it’s okay for your wife to see a male OB just “because he was such a good doctor…”. These days, female OB/GYNs outnumber male OBs, so it’s not like there isn’t a choice for routine, scheduled healthcare. Also, let me be clear that I’m not speaking of refusing medical care in an emergency or because the physician on call happens to be male, but I’m referring to seeing a male gynecologist by choice. Any thoughts on that?

 

[Soutane]

Then let me inquire about this:

Those of you men that answered about being visual and that women should wear modest clothes (which I whole-heartedly agree on), does your wife/daughter/young lady friend see a male doctor? If all men, including priests, are visual, then why is it okay for women to go to a male doctor for things obstetrical or gynecological? The doctor is not exempt from being visual, solely because he’s a medical professional…he’s first a man, then a doctor. You cannot say in one breath that men are visual and easily swayed or distracted by a women showing skin and then in the next breath say it’s okay for your wife to see a male OB just “because he was such a good doctor…”. These days, female OB/GYNs outnumber male OBs, so it’s not like there isn’t a choice for routine, scheduled healthcare. Also, let me be clear that I’m not speaking of refusing medical care in an emergency or because the physician on call happens to be male, but I’m referring to seeing a male gynecologist by choice. Any thoughts on that?

I would prefer that she see a female OB for the reasons you stated.I am 100%hetero,extremely socially conservative man and I prefer having a female doctor as I do not like men touching me period.I would rather be examined by a female doctor any day as I am revolted by the idea of a man touching private areas of my body.
I much prefer a female doctor as I find them more willing to listen and not make an instant diagnosis and treat me as another slab of meat,for processing.My male doctor barely looks at me and has the bedside manner of a bat.There is nothing sexual; or erotic about being examined by a female physician but I just feel more comfortable BECAUSE I know she will be professional and courteous and EXPLAIN things as we go along.I also had a female pediatrician as a child and that could have a lot to do with it.I find male doctors more dictatorial whereas the female ones seem more collaborative.and explain their decision making process and involve me more in the making of the decision of treatment possibilities.

 

[Major_Minor]

I think these days both genders are behaving in ways that betray a complete lack of honor, dignity, morals, kindness and honesty (etc. etc. I.E. all the highest levels of behavior) and that both sides have cheapened their behavior down to a level of sub-human foolishness… as a society we are fundamentally immature and promote childish reactions as a norm.

All seemingly to prove how much “freer” we are than previous generations.

I remember a European band (“Air”) was interviewed and asked what they thought of American women and one responded and said they preferred feminine women! Of course they got all kinds of flak for it… but I remember reading it and looking around me thinking “Well, it’s not untrue that we encourage a masculine and aggressive way of behaving from our women”… I was at that time realizing how few genuinely feminine, graceful and kind women I knew…

And you can relax because my observation also includes men who have no dignity, chivalry, integrity or wisdom for that matter… I am most certainly NOT suggesting there is a one sided problem here… but I will suggest that pointing out many women have abandoned what is beautiful in feminine graces will result in outraged shrieking where pointing out that men have lost all kinds of decency and dignity will get you a sort of “Obviously”! type response.

Post modern thought has done little more than make everything uglier and more coarse.
It tends to strip meaning away from things rather than bring meaning -to- things.

Although after having said all that the one thing I would disagree being included with what the original poster said would be public breast feeding to be a bad thing. I think breast feeding is exactly how a baby should be fed and if a mother can’t get away to somewhere discreet to do it I’d rather the baby is fed than worrying about seeing a little cleavage.

 

[freerf]

Ok, I have a question that would definitely become heated in a secular environment but I am hoping on a Catholic website men will be more comfortable anwering.

What do men really think about the way women carry on today? I mean by wearing provocative clothes, figthing to breast feed in public and getting mad at people who are against it. Being the ones to initate dates with men, using profanity, flirting (not innocently), being offended when men open doors and all the other stuff.

I have often been insituations were woman would do things in front of their husbands that I though was not nice and the man simply ignores it. For example, my uncles wife kept talking about her first husband, and then her second husband in front of him (he is her third husband). Personally, I found that was a put down to my uncle to have it in his face that she still though about them (ok, I know my uncle chose to be her third husband but that is beside the point). I think my uncle ignored it because he knew she wouldn’t stop and he had too much pride to admit his hurt.

Once a man told me when his girlfriend hits him, he laughs because he knows if he hits her back society would be totally against him. Is it possible it is not the physical pain that hurst the man but the emotional put down that would crush him?

Deep down, regardless of what society says, do men not want wifes, mothers and sisters that are respectable? Also, please list behaviours that feminist think woman should do but deep down men think are wrong.

The reason I ask is because as a woman I need to know it is OK to be old fashion. Since I can’t get the support from my female peers to be modest, can I please have some support from men

Thanks

CM

I love my simple (not simplistic) old-fashioned wife. We’ve been married 8 years now. She is supportive, kind and loving. She allows me to lead the family and to “be the man” of the household. (No, for you feminists, that doesn’t mean she lets me walk all over her or that she doesn’t have a say. But yes, it does mean that i get the final say).

Of course, i provide well for the family so she doesn’t have to work, which, i think, makes it easier for her to assume an old-fashioned roll. she loves staying at home with the kids and i think it’s great for them too.

I know this about my wife: i’ll never want to leave her.

Some of these women’s comments on this forumn who control their husbands and are overbearing. . . well, i think it’s only a matter of time before their merriage breaks up.

i think if you enter a merriage with the mentality that you’ll stick it out through thick and thin, that you’ll let your husband lead (and still stick it out through thick and thin and even when he makes mistakes, which he will) i think you’ll have a very appreciative husband and a happy husband.

 

[Portrait]

I love my simple (not simplistic) old-fashioned wife. We’ve been married 8 years now. She is supportive, kind and loving. She allows me to lead the family and to “be the man” of the household. (No, for you feminists, that doesn’t mean she lets me walk all over her or that she doesn’t have a say. But yes, it does mean that i get the final say).

Of course, i provide well for the family so she doesn’t have to work, which, i think, makes it easier for her to assume an old-fashioned roll. she loves staying at home with the kids and i think it’s great for them too.

I know this about my wife: i’ll never want to leave her.

Some of these women’s comments on this forumn who control their husbands and are overbearing. . . well, i think it’s only a matter of time before their merriage breaks up.

i think if you enter a merriage with the mentality that you’ll stick it out through thick and thin, that you’ll let your husband lead (and still stick it out through thick and thin and even when he makes mistakes, which he will) i think you’ll have a very appreciative husband and a happy husband.

Dear freerf,

Cordial greetings and what a refreshing and welcome change to read a post such as yours - jolly good stuff old chap.

If there were more women of your dear wife’s calibre nowaday’s then I wager that our world would be a much better and happier place. The many social and economic problems that are now, alas, so common a feature in our crazy mixed up Western world can nearly all be traced to the refusal of men and women to submit to God’s order of things. If only women would accept the hierarchical model within the home and joyfully and obediently submit to their God ordained domestic duties (see Titus 2: 4,5).

Catholic men and women must dare to be different if they are to commend their Faith to the non-Christian society in which they now live and move and have their being. My plea is that we in our own small way seek to counteract the prevalent and misguided disparagement of women as wives and mothers.

Blessings abundant on you and your wife for setting such a good example in these times of very great stress.

Warmest good wishes,

Portrait

 

[KrazyKaiju]

Ok, I have a question that would definitely become heated in a secular environment but I am hoping on a Catholic website men will be more comfortable anwering.

You came to the right place.

What do men really think about the way women carry on today? I mean by wearing provocative clothes, figthing to breast feed in public and getting mad at people who are against it. Being the ones to initate dates with men, using profanity, flirting (not innocently), being offended when men open doors and all the other stuff.

Surprisingly, I haven’t really encountered women who are offended at having doors held for them or are fighting to publicly breastfeed. Hence, I can’t make a judgment on these.

At a glance, I don’t really see anything wrong with women initiating dates with men. Profanity is a little dirty, but that is tough to avoid nowadays, I suppose. My stance on flirting depends on how dirty the flirting is. Serious, clean flirting seems okay. Serious and dirty…not so much.

But I could probably spend quite some time talking about revealing female clothing. I’m just sick of the provocative clothes today. That stuff can get really distracting for a guy. Correct me if I’m mistaken, but didn’t Muhammed demand that women be covered from head to toe? Was that because of his lusts? I’m not saying that women should be forced to wear such attire, but they should just be aware that they’re setting off alot of hormones when they go for a stroll on a hot summer day. Granted, some women probably wear some revealing clothes because of their comfort (e.g. really short shorts), but I feel like something needs to be done (on either the men’s end or the women’s). I just don’t know what.

Oh, and try living on a college campus with 20-year-old girls sporting their thighs on a hot summer day! 'Nuff said.

I have often been insituations were woman would do things in front of their husbands that I though was not nice and the man simply ignores it. For example, my uncles wife kept talking about her first husband, and then her second husband in front of him (he is her third husband). Personally, I found that was a put down to my uncle to have it in his face that she still though about them (ok, I know my uncle chose to be her third husband but that is beside the point). I think my uncle ignored it because he knew she wouldn’t stop and he had too much pride to admit his hurt.

…She has issues. (I wish I could come up with a more constructive comment than that.)

Once a man told me when his girlfriend hits him, he laughs because he knows if he hits her back society would be totally against him. Is it possible it is not the physical pain that hurst the man but the emotional put down that would crush him?

No, I think his answer described everything he was thinking. Society has a bunch of constructs and double-standards that can drive a person nuts. The social stigma of a man hitting a woman is just one of those things.

Deep down, regardless of what society says, do men not want wifes, mothers and sisters that are respectable?

As a college kid growing up in a dorm environment, I think I can safely claim that some guys just want some tail. Others want a woman who is nice, prudent, and strong (not just physically strong, either). Think of such a woman as the feminine equivalent to the type of man a woman typically wants.

Also, I personally don’t want a woman who is completely lifeless, either. I’ve met some who wouldn’t hurt a fly, but…well…they were lacking some spirit.

Also, please list behaviours that feminist think woman should do but deep down men think are wrong.

I can’t speak for the feminist, since there are many types of feminism, and I haven’t acquainted myself with any feminist theories. In the worst case scenario, however, the feminist would want to flip the tables in such a way that the same kind of openly accepted sexism is being expressed against men.

The reason I ask is because as a woman I need to know it is OK to be old fashion. Since I can’t get the support from my female peers to be modest, can I please have some support from men

Just build up your character, and you’ll be fine. Aim to be such a person that you’d be a good example for your children. (I know I’m thinking WAAAAY ahead, but trust me. It’ll pay off).

It sounds like you’re on the right track. I hope you find someone special!

• KrazyKaiju

 

[Thoughtfulone]

Excuse me, but what does being provocative and immodest have to do with breastfeeding a child in public? Do you know that newborns need to be fed every 1.5 hours? If a woman is out with her baby, where should she go to breastfeed? Should she go and sit on a toilet in a dirty, disgusting public bathroom? Would you take your lunch into a public bathroom and sit on the toilet and eat it? Just because men have sexualized breasts to the point where you cannot see them as anything other than sex organs strictly made for a man’s pleasure instead of seeing them for what they really are (which is the most perfect food source for babies) does not mean that women should have to hide like criminals in bathrooms and behind dumpsters or be confined to their homes just to feed their children. It is this attitude that has shamed so many women into ceasing to breastfeed for fear of being “inappropriate” or “unattractive” and into using bottled formula, which is an inferior food source and doesn’t carry any of the antibodies of breast milk, leading to babies who are much less healthy than their breastfed counterparts. Men need to grow up and get over the whole breastfeeding thing. Sorry, but this issue bugs me.

 

[KrazyKaiju]

Excuse me, but what does being provocative and immodest have to do with breastfeeding a child in public? Do you know that newborns need to be fed every 1.5 hours? If a woman is out with her baby, where should she go to breastfeed? Should she go and sit on a toilet in a dirty, disgusting public bathroom? Would you take your lunch into a public bathroom and sit on the toilet and eat it? Just because men have sexualized breasts to the point where you cannot see them as anything other than sex organs strictly made for a man’s pleasure instead of seeing them for what they really are (which is the most perfect food source for babies) does not mean that women should have to hide like criminals in bathrooms and behind dumpsters or be confined to their homes just to feed their children. It is this attitude that has shamed so many women into ceasing to breastfeed for fear of being “inappropriate” or “unattractive” and into using bottled formula, which is an inferior food source and doesn’t carry any of the antibodies of breast milk, leading to babies who are much less healthy than their breastfed counterparts. Men need to grow up and get over the whole breastfeeding thing. Sorry, but this issue bugs me.

And I think that captures the essence of what I was trying to convey with that awkward Muhammad comment. Thanks, Thoughtfulone.

 

[freerf]

Dear freerf,

Cordial greetings and what a refreshing and welcome change to read a post such as yours - jolly good stuff old chap.

If there were more women of your dear wife’s calibre nowaday’s then I wager that our world would be a much better and happier place. The many social and economic problems that are now, alas, so common a feature in our crazy mixed up Western world can nearly all be traced to the refusal of men and women to submit to God’s order of things. If only women would accept the hierarchical model within the home and joyfully and obediently submit to their God ordained domestic duties (see Titus 2: 4,5).

Catholic men and women must dare to be different if they are to commend their Faith to the non-Christian society in which they now live and move and have their being. My plea is that we in our own small way seek to counteract the prevalent and misguided disparagement of women as wives and mothers.

Blessings abundant on you and your wife for setting such a good example in these times of very great stress.

Warmest good wishes,

Portrait

Thank you, sir!

Surprisingly, these outstanding virtues (meekness, charity, forgiveness, love) are even frowned upon among Christian women who see them as weak and ineffectual practiced within a marriage. I find far more often anger and hostility advised among these forums (women to women), with comments such as “men you need to get over it" or “he needs to learn to be a man” or “you deserve better” or “you have a right to fill in the blank”.

These attitudes can be supported well within a secular environment and at your local college. However, as a Christian they should be held up and examined by the light of Christ and Him Crucified. Here they dissolve into what they are: selfish pride and ego.

Now, I’m not saying men are not selfish and egotistical! We are by far the worse offenders when it comes to thorns of the flesh. However, I feel that something must be said! Saintly behavior within the marriage is just as beautiful as it is outside the marriage.

My own experience is that my wife has exerted far more influence in our relationship and in my heart through a Christ-like example of love and humility than through the raw exertion of selfish “rights” as is so often counseled on these forums.

God Bless

 

[freerf]

I’ve very rarely had any problems with women who breastfeed in public. My wife would do it in parks and stuff (not in resturants, i think). However, I think they should try to be modest and use a blanket to cover up. This is just a respectful thing to do. Because, like it or not, men are attracted to breasts so you will find men staring. Even your priest, who could be walking by, may be stumbled.

Frankly, women should relearn to be sensitive on this issue. Many men strive to remain pure (such as priests and unmarried/ married catholic men) and seeing your breasts flopping out of your shirt to feed a child can be a stumbling block, lead to lustful thoughts, and otherwise distracting conditions. That’s the man’s problem, you say? Get over it? etc. etc. Well, I don’t know how to answer. How do I argue convince someone that it’s good to be selfless? The benifits of self-sacrifice and modesty?

Similarly, young women need to be taught what kind of power they wield over men, and realizing this, start to dress more modestly, especially in Mass. It is a distraction. I feel very sorry for any Priest the way some of these girls dress.

 

[Samantha79]

I’ve very rarely had any problems with women who breastfeed in public. My wife would do it in parks and stuff (not in resturants, i think). However, I think they should try to be modest and use a blanket to cover up. This is just a respectful thing to do. Because, like it or not, men are attracted to breasts so you will find men staring. Even your priest, who could be walking by, may be stumbled.

Frankly, women should relearn to be sensitive on this issue. Many men strive to remain pure (such as priests and unmarried/ married catholic men) and seeing your breasts flopping out of your shirt to feed a child can be a stumbling block, lead to lustful thoughts, and otherwise distracting conditions. That’s the man’s problem, you say? Get over it? etc. etc. Well, I don’t know how to answer. How do I argue convince someone that it’s good to be selfless? The benifits of self-sacrifice and modesty?

Similarly, young women need to be taught what kind of power they wield over men, and realizing this, start to dress more modestly, especially in Mass. It is a distraction. I feel very sorry for any Priest the way some of these girls dress.

And this is exactly why I posted a comment inquiring if the men that responded on here insisted their wives see a female doctor for routine GYN and OB care…if a holy priest can stumble, a male physician most certainly can!!