MERGED: How is someone who claims to be Christian yet aggressively promotes abortion and "gay marriage"?

[CMatt25]

Christ defined marriage as Adam and Eve (Matt. 19:4-6), and Saint Paul clearly condemns homosexual acts in Romans Chapter 1. So I don’t know how people can argue against Christ and still be Christian.

You don’t know how because you don’t share their understanding. They don’t believe they are arguing against Christ. They have a different understanding of Scripture than you do. They might see the Matt verses you cite as speaking of one type of marriage between heterosexuals of opposite genders and about divorce. Or for instance liberal Christians may not see the discussion of natural and unnatural in Romans 1 as condemning homosexual acts. But rather that it is unnatural for heterosexual men and women to have homosexual relations. And is just as unnatural for homosexuals to have heterosexual relations. That what is unnatural for the heterosexual is natural for the homosexual and visa versa. But continuing the discussion is fruitless because you don’t share their beliefs on these matters nor they yours. The discussion merely goes 'round and 'round in circles. Nevertheless they profess Christ their Lord and Savior. In the family of Christians united in Him the One most important of all. He Whom breaks down walls. God bless. Peace.

 

[MaryT777]

Maybe you should just worry about your own Christianity.

This is a message board to discuss issues.
It’s a valid question.
Mary.

Everyone worrying about their own Christianity has led to thousands of denominations.

 

[Jimmygill88]

Yes they are

 

[livingwordunity]

Or for instance liberal Christians may not see the discussion of natural and unnatural in Romans 1 as condemning homosexual acts.

That interpretation requires some serious mental gymnastics would be unheard of to all Christians up until only the past 10, 20, or 30 years ago. And I don’t know how anyone can interpret it that way when it says this “and the men likewise gave up natural relations with women and were consumed with passion for one another, men committing shameless acts with men and receiving in their own persons the due penalty for their error.” - Romans 1:27

 

[MaeganFlinchum1]

They are still Christians, but they are misguided in thinking God condones same sex “marriage”

 

[livingwordunity]

They are still Christians, but they are misguided in thinking God condones same sex “marriage”

Then where does one draw the line with heresy?

 

[gnosisofthomas]

Mormon theology and worship practice isn’t compatible with traditional Christian theology. But there are many politicians who aggressively promote abortion and same-sex “marriage” as a “right” yet say they are Christian (Catholic or Protestant). And even on CA forums, if anyone even suggests to doubt whether or not a politician such as this is in fact truly a Christian their account can be suspended for being uncharitable. On this website it’s okay to explain why Mormons aren’t Christian even though I’m sure many of them think that they are and will tell people that they are Christian. There are even apologetics tracts here on Catholic Answers that explain why Mormons can’t be considered Christian, and apparently this isn’t considered uncharitable. So why does there seem to be more tolerance for one over the other when we at least seem to have morality and family values in common with the Mormons while we can’t say the same for the other? By the way, there are a lot of Protestants who either don’t believe in baptizing someone or they do it only in the name of Jesus and not with the Trinitarian form.

I support marriage equality, and I’m a Christian. Honestly, none of us have any authority to decide what religion someone else is.

 

[J_Peterson]

What I’m trying to get at is I don’t know how someone can claim to have faith in God and reject two of God’s most basic commandments, one of which has to do with marriage which is at the core of our faith. Marriage is one of the seven sacraments and is directly related to the relationship with Christ and the Church. It is the key to understanding our relationship with God. So I think that’s just as important as the doctrine of the Holy Trinity. And abortion goes against God’s commandment not to murder and is also a sin against God’s plan for marriage. But it’s not just an individual committing a sin in private, it’s a growing number of people who are recruiting more and more into believing that sodomy and abortion are an exercise of one’s rights.

The two most basic commandments is to love God and love your neighbor.

 

[livingwordunity]

I support marriage equality, and I’m a Christian. Honestly, none of us have any authority to decide what religion someone else is.

I never denied that people have free will to choose what religion they want to be. Being a Christian means being a follower of Christ. Did you know that Jesus Christ defined marriage as being between one man and one woman (Matt. 19: 4-6)?

 

[livingwordunity]

The two most basic commandments is to love God and love your neighbor.

And what does it mean to love God and your neighbor? The answer can be found in the teachings of the Catholic Church. “…if he refuses to listen even to the church, let him be to you as a Gentile and a tax collector.” - Matt. 18:17

 

[gnosisofthomas]

I never denied that people have free will to choose what religion they want to be. Being a Christian means being a follower of Christ. Did you know that Jesus Christ defined marriage as being between one man and one woman (Matt. 19: 4-6)?

Did you know He’s talking about divorce?

 

[SteveVH]

Did you know He’s talking about divorce?

And therefore, marriage.

“Some Pharisees came to him, and to test him they asked, ‘Is it lawful for a man to divorce his wife for any cause?’ He answered, ‘Have you not read that the one who made them at the beginning “made them male and female”, and said, “For this reason a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh”? So they are no longer two, but one flesh. Therefore what God has joined together, let no one separate.” (Mt 19:3-6)

There is simply no support for same sex marriage in the Scriptures.

 

[gnosisofthomas]

And therefore, marriage.

"Some Pharisees came to him, and to test him they asked, ‘Is it lawful for a man to divorce his wife for any cause?’ He answered, ‘Have you not read that the one who made them at the beginning “made them male and female”, and said, “For this reason a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh”? So they are no longer two, but one flesh. Therefore what God has joined together, let no one separate." (Mt 19:3-6)

That’s a pretty weak argument. The Pharisees asked about a man divorcing his wife; Jesus responded talking about a man and his wife. The two becoming one flesh implies that divorce is impossible because you can’t separate the two when they become one. No one’s saying God didn’t make males and females – but He also made intersexed people, which this scripture doesn’t address either.

There is simply no support for same sex marriage in the Scriptures.

Except for David and Jonathan.

 

[livingwordunity]

Did you know He’s talking about divorce?

The subtopic of divorce comes under the topic of marriage, so Christ defined what marriage is (Adam and Eve) when asked about divorce.

Did you know that?

 

[gnosisofthomas]

The subtopic of divorce comes under the topic of marriage, so Christ defined what marriage is (Adam and Eve) when asked about divorce.

Did you know that?

I’ve heard that before… I don’t buy it. It’s flawed reasoning.

 

[livingwordunity]

The subtopic of divorce comes under the topic of marriage, so Christ defined what marriage is (Adam and Eve) when asked about divorce.

Did you know that?

I’ve heard that before… I don’t buy it. It’s flawed reasoning.

What is “flawed reasoning”? By the way, I like your Galatians 3:28 quote in your signature where St. Paul is talking about the topic of baptism.

 

[SteveVH]

That’s a pretty weak argument. The Pharisees asked about a man divorcing his wife; Jesus responded talking about a man and his wife. The two becoming one flesh implies that divorce is impossible because you can’t separate the two when they become one. No one’s saying God didn’t make males and females – but He also made intersexed people, which this scripture doesn’t address either.

A pretty weak argument? Christ goes right to the creation account. We we were created male and female for a reason and that reason is to become one. Two of the same sex cannot become one.

Except for David and Jonathan.

Oh please, do tell.

 

[livingwordunity]

A pretty weak argument? Christ goes right to the creation account. We we were created male and female for a reason and that reason is to become one. Two of the same sex cannot become one.

Two of the same sex can only role play and pretend. God often blesses heterosexual unions with children, but there is never this sign of blessing from God resulting from homosexual activity.

 

[CMatt25]

That interpretation requires some serious mental gymnastics would be unheard of to all Christians up until only the past 10, 20, or 30 years ago. And I don’t know how anyone can interpret it that way when it says this “and the men likewise gave up natural relations with women and were consumed with passion for one another, men committing shameless acts with men and receiving in their own persons the due penalty for their error.” - Romans 1:27

No it doesn’t. Not if one believes God is still speaking and they are open over time and years to perhaps a further understanding of what He spoke. Yes heterosexual men gave up natural relations with women. But I’m not going to keep responding to every point you make with a counterpoint which someone more towards the liberal end of the Christian spectrum could make. Christians could debate their differences and these things til He comes again. Everyone knows each end of the spectrum and inbetween have their views and beliefs and understanding. The most important is all are on one side. United in Christ Lord and Savior. And on some of the rest, Christians may simply have to agree to disagree until in faith He comes again. Peace.

 

[livingwordunity]

No it doesn’t. Not if one believes God is still speaking and they are open over time and years to perhaps a further understanding of what He spoke. Yes heterosexual men gave up natural relations with women. But I’m not going to keep responding to every point you make with the liberal counterpoint. Christians could debate their differences and these things til He comes again. Everyone knows each end of the spectrum and inbetween have their views and beliefs and understanding. The most important is all are on one side. United in Christ Lord and Savior. And on some of the rest, Christians may simply have to agree to disagree until in faith He comes again. Peace.

Do you believe that God can contradict himself?