Milk before meat, the mormons may have gotten it right!

[adstrinity]

Did you hear that everybody? IF WE IGNORE THEM COMPLETELY THEY’LL GO AWAY! J/K…Nothing but love for you Mormons…

 

[po18guy]

The only rising faith in Britain is Islam. The Church of England is also suffering from secularism. Mormons come here to defend their faith and not to do missionary work. If the catholics on this forum would not write strange things about mormonism and mormons, most mormons who post here would disappear from the forum.

We could quote directly from the BOM and it would sound, and be, exactly as strange.

 

[why_me]

We could quote directly from the BOM and it would sound, and be, exactly as strange.

I think that the book of mormon would make an interesting university class in comparative religion. If we take the position that the book was written by an individual, it would be interesting to discuss some of the religious concepts in the book itself in such a class.

 

[why_me]

Did you hear that everybody? IF WE IGNORE THEM COMPLETELY THEY’LL GO AWAY! J/K…Nothing but love for you Mormons…

Actually, on this section of the forum there are only a handful of antimormon catholics. Mormonism can never go away from this section because it now plays an important role in religious America.

 

[po18guy]

I think that the book of mormon would make an interesting university class in comparative religion. If we take the position that the book was written by an individual, it would be interesting to discuss some of the religious concepts in the book itself in such a class.

Actually, it would. It could be compared and contrasted to the philosophy of Buddha, Confusius, and many others.

 

[RC_Matt]

If the catholics on this forum would not write strange things about mormonism and mormons, most mormons who post here would disappear from the forum.

Dude, are the “strange things about Mormonsim” to which you refer topics like “seer” stones, god used to be a man, men can become gods, god lives on a planet near the star Kolob, father, son and holy spirit are separate and distinct entities (and the former two are corporeal beings), there are innumerable gods in existence, the Native Americans are really Jews who originally arrived from the middle east 4000 years ago in submarines, etc., etc., etc? While I certainly agree that this material falls well within the category of “strange things,” it comes from the four standard works of Mormon canon. You can’t accuse US of writing this stuff; all we do is provide the disclosure (MEAT) that you folks deliberately withhold from people until you already have your hooks in them.

Similarly, if “strange things about Mormons” include topics like Joseph Smith’s 33 wives, Brigham Young’s 50 odd wives, and quotes of Mormon prophets from Mormon sources (JoD for example), you can’t accuse us of anything other than providing some historical background facts that you folks don’t like to discuss for obvious reasons.

This stuff doesn’t come from us.

 

[ralphinal]

Was JS the forerunner of L. Ron Hubbard?

 

[zerinus]

Was JS the forerunner of L. Ron Hubbard?

Isaiah 9:

18 For wickedness burneth as the fire: it shall devour the briers and thorns, and shall kindle in the thickets of the forest, and they shall mount up like the lifting up of smoke.

zerinus

 

[ibkc]

Was JS the forerunner of L. Ron Hubbard?

There are definite parallels.

 

[scipio337]

+10

I still have no idea what “anti Mormon” means. Opposed to the teachings of JS? If there were misrepresentations of beliefs, I can understand, but I have yet to have seen any real misrepresentations, only giving out secre… excuse me… sacred information that most of the hoi polloi doesn’thave access to.

 

[ralphinal]

Isaiah 9:

18 For wickedness burneth as the fire: it shall devour the briers and thorns, and shall kindle in the thickets of the forest, and they shall mount up like the lifting up of smoke.

zerinus

I’ll take that as a no from the Mormon camp.

You must admit that as an outsider to both religions, they do seem to have similarities.

Not all doctrines openly taught, extra-terrestrial planitary life, humans able to become more than human…

 

[mfbukowski]

Anybody can write anything. He admits on p44-45 that his view is “blasphemous”.

 

[ralphinal]

Anybody can write anything. He admits on p44-45 that his view is “blasphemous”.

No he did not. This is the exact quote

The Kolob Theorem may fly in the face of several cherished and widely held beliefs about our Heavenly Father and His works. Some may feel that it is blasphemous to teach that God is limited in any way. However, from man’s point of view, Eloheim, our Father, is the Greatest, the Most Powerful, the Wisest, “and the extent of His doings none can find out” (Doctrine and Covenants 76:2). He possesses these attributes in their fullness and perfection. For us, in all the generations of the gods, we believe there to be none wiser or more important than He is to us.

He is not saying that it is, but that some may think it is. Big difference.
Here is another good quote

The Lord said to Enoch that He had created worlds without number (Moses 1:36). We should accept this statement from the point of view of men on this earth; it is to man that God’s creations are beyond counting. The Prophet Joseph Smith taught there are other deities, also. He said there are Lords many and Gods many and that he was not “scared to death of such a doctrine” (Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, p.373). These deities surely have creations and dominions comparable to our Heavenly Father’s, and thus, there are some remote worlds, stars, and creations that are not of our Father’s making.
However, in another sense, He is intimately tied and related to all the external Gods and galaxies of the global universe. Likely God is sealed by priesthood ordinances to His Fathers before Him,and they to their children, so that every galaxy with its presiding deity is probably linked in one vast eternal family of the Gods.

Is this polytheism?

 

[mfbukowski]

No he did not. This is the exact quote

He is not saying that it is, but that some may think it is. Big difference.
Here is another good quote

Is this polytheism?

I could start posting marginal catholic doctrine and ask “is this catholicism?” Ever seen people crucifying themselves on youtube?

 

[ralphinal]

I could start posting marginal catholic doctrine and ask “is this catholicism?” Ever seen people crucifying themselves on youtube?

So the citations given for the polytheistic quote of JS is false?

Does the LDS church teach that God lives on a planet? DId it ever?

Does it teach that God was once man? Did it ever?

Does it teach that men can become gods with their own worlds full of spirit children? Did it ever?

Does it teach that Jesus and Satan are brothers? Did it ever?

Does it teach that dark skinned people are cursed by God for being spiritually impure? Did it ever?

The question is not what people say their faith teaches but what it actually teaches. The Catholic CHurch has 100% of its teachings in the public domain. Does the LDS?

 

[mfbukowski]

So the citations given for the polytheistic quote of JS is false?

Does the LDS church teach that God lives on a planet? DId it ever?

Does it teach that God was once man? Did it ever?

Does it teach that men can become gods with their own worlds full of spirit children? Did it ever?

Does it teach that Jesus and Satan are brothers? Did it ever?

Does it teach that dark skinned people are cursed by God for being spiritually impure? Did it ever?

The question is not what people say their faith teaches but what it actually teaches. The Catholic CHurch has 100% of its teachings in the public domain. Does the LDS?

We have discussed all these issues before, my positions and the positions of all are documented

The answers to all your questions are “in a sense, yes, and in a sense, no” The keys to understanding the nuances are what it is all about.

In the meantime, tell me why these people are doing this?

youtube.com/watch?v=ps3ch-9IUns&NR=1

youtube.com/watch?v=WZQUvB14lcA&feature=related

youtube.com/watch?v=ZK0PkQI76fQ&NR=1

What is there about catholicism that makes people do these things? You speak of us being a cult, but this is really over the top. How can you tell me that these people are not brainwashed?

This is not normal human behavior.

 

[ralphinal]

We have discussed all these issues before, my positions and the positions of all are documented

The answers to all your questions are “in a sense, yes, and in a sense, no” The keys to understanding the nuances are what it is all about.

In the meantime, tell me why these people are doing this?

youtube.com/watch?v=ps3ch-9IUns&NR=1

youtube.com/watch?v=WZQUvB14lcA&feature=related

youtube.com/watch?v=ZK0PkQI76fQ&NR=1

What is there about catholicism that makes people do these things? You speak of us being a cult, but this is really over the top. How can you tell me that these people are not brainwashed?

This is not normal human behavior.

Well, can you point me to where I can study these teachings? In a sense yes and no is no answer, and I would like to see what nuances you speak of.

Now, those folks you linked to have issues. The Catholic Church has at various times spoken against this, and if I am not mistaken, they are prohibited from doing it. You cannot show me where the Church teaches that practice. You cannot even show me close to it that is a yes and no with nuances. Yes, I consider them mentally off.

 

[mfbukowski]

Well, can you point me to where I can study these teachings? In a sense yes and no is no answer, and I would like to see what nuances you speak of.

All is available in the standard works

scriptures.lds.org/

But why did your church have to come out with a pronouncement to stop this? Was it so wide spread that it was a serious problem?

Everyone has people who have “issues” but this seems to be a major deal in your church. It is not only happening in the Phillipines. What is it in your doctrine that causes this?

Isn’t it the whole belief that we can pay for our own sins by being punished-- like purgatory?

Jesus paid for our sins… We don’t have to! The atonement applies to all! We just need to repent, not whip ourselves.

But why do these guys do it?

 

[scipio337]

All is available in the standard works

scriptures.lds.org/

But why did your church have to come out with a pronouncement to stop this? Was it so wide spread that it was a serious problem?

Everyone has people who have “issues” but this seems to be a major deal in your church. It is not only happening in the Phillipines. What is it in your doctrine that causes this?

Isn’t it the whole belief that we can pay for our own sins by being punished-- like purgatory?

Jesus paid for our sins… We don’t have to! The atonement applies to all! We just need to repent, not whip ourselves.

But why do these guys do it?

Is the video of a strawman being knocked down?

The beliefs of your faith weren’t being so misrepresented, mf. Its intellectually dishonest to conflate the two.

 

[ralphinal]

All is available in the standard works

scriptures.lds.org/

I have looked and looked. I can find where BY and others said that the Father had sex with Mary, but it is not mentioned on the LDS homesite. I keep running into this same issue.

But why did your church have to come out with a pronouncement to stop this? Was it so wide spread that it was a serious problem

Nope. It was handled locally. Why did they speak against it? Watch the movie, man. These folks are not helping their own souls or others.

Everyone has people who have “issues” but this seems to be a major deal in your church. It is not only happening in the Phillipines. What is it in your doctrine that causes this?

I have never seen it in the US, Europe, or South America. TTHere is no doctrine for this. In Alabama, we call it pure crazy.

Isn’t it the whole belief that we can pay for our own sins by being punished-- like purgatory?

Jesus paid for our sins… We don’t have to! The atonement applies to all! We just need to repent, not whip ourselves.

But why do these guys do it?

As you seem to be intellegent and literate, I suggest that you read the Catachism of the Catholic Church. Purgatory is not about punishment but cleansing. 100% of our faith is out there. You can read it. By the way, 100% of our faith has not been changed from one pope to another. We enver taught that blacks were cursed and could not be priests until public opinion shifted (just an example).