Missing Mass Conflict!

[fix]

Would an all good, all loving God commit a person to hell because they missed a Mass without feeling any contrition or remorse?

Would a faithful man reject God? By committing a mortal sin one is rejecting God.

 

[onetimeposter]

Would a faithful man reject God? By committing a mortal sin one is rejecting God.

Not going to Mass is certainly not a rejection of God ( imo) and it was the Church that decided that missing Mass was a mortal sin. The Church could just as easily have decided that it was a venial sin.

 

[onetimeposter]

Would a faithful man reject God? By committing a mortal sin one is rejecting God.

Then back to my original point…so at Christmas, the Priests give the Eucharist to about 75% of the people present who rejected God all year and show up for their once a year Mass, with the majority of them not having gone to Confession…and even if they did go, likely an invalid confession at that, as the majority know that they will continue to regularly miss Mass!

You have in fact emboldened my point.

 

[Neil_Anthony]

Not going to Mass is certainly not a rejection of God and it was the Church that decided that missing Mass was a mortal sin. The Church could just as easily have decided that it was a venial sin.

It wasn’t the church that decided arbitrarily that missing Sunday mass is a mortal sin. This isn’t a discipline that the Church can change.

If you disagree, please provide some evidence that the church has ever changed this rule. I believe it is apostolic in origin.

 

[fix]

Not going to Mass is certainly not a rejection of God and it was the Church that decided that missing Mass was a mortal sin. The Church could just as easily have decided that it was a venial sin.

This is from Veritatis splendor:

In point of fact, man does not suffer perdition only by being unfaithful to that fundamental option whereby he has made “a free self-commitment to God”.113 With every freely committed mortal sin, he offends God as the giver of the law and as a result becomes guilty with regard to the entire law (cf. Jas 2:8-11); even if he perseveres in faith, he loses “sanctifying grace”, “charity” and “eternal happiness”.114 As the Council of Trent teaches, “the grace of justification once received is lost not only by apostasy, by which faith itself is lost, but also by any other mortal sin”.115

 

[fix]

Then back to my original point…so at Christmas, the Priests give the Eucharist to about 75% of the people present who rejected God all year and show up for their once a year Mass, with the majority of them not having gone to Confession…and even if they need, an invalid confession at that, as they know that they will continue to regularly miss Mass!

You have in fact emboldened my point.

How does the priest know the state of every person’s soul when they receive communion?

 

[surfinpure]

“But he that knew not, and did things worthy of stripes, shall be beaten with few stripes. And unto whomsoever much is given, of him much shall be required: and to whom they have committed much, of him they will demand the more.”

-Luke 12:48

Furthermore, this is your hypothetical, so in it, you have made yourself God and condemned the imaginary man to hell. In the real world, we have no idea (except in the cases of canonized saints) who goes to heaven or hell. Jesus desires to give us mercy, even if we wait until the moment of our death to call out for it. So, do not be worried or troubled. Jesus came to save sinners, remember. Trust in our Lord’s infinite wisdom, justice, and mercy.

Excellent reply, Kevin.

 

[surfinpure]

Not going to Mass is certainly not a rejection of God ( imo) and it was the Church that decided that missing Mass was a mortal sin. The Church could just as easily have decided that it was a venial sin.

This highlights a much larger issue at hand: If you have trouble accepting Church teaching on morals (which we hold to be infallible), then are you sure you want to be a Catholic?

 

[onetimeposter]

How does the priest know the state of every person’s soul when they receive communion?

That’s already been discussed.

 

[fix]

That’s already been discussed.

If it has been discussed then you know it is not possible to determine who is in mortal sin and who is not.

 

[onetimeposter]

This highlights a much larger issue at hand: If you have trouble accepting Church teaching on morals (which we hold to be infallible), then are you sure you want to be a Catholic?

I think it is rather normal to question ones Faith. Rather than answering my question with a question…why not try thinking it through.

If you are shocked that a Roman Catholic is questioning his faith…please don’t be…I think it’s healthy and very normal.

Would an all good, all loving, and all powerful God condemn someone to an eternity in Hell for deliberately missing Mass once and not having perfect contrition or having gone to confession prior to their death?

The Church clearly teaches one cannot go to Heaven having committed a mortal sin.

The Church clearly teaches that missing Mass is a mortal sin.

Who decided that missing Mass was a mortal sin?

 

[fix]

I think it is rather normal to question ones Faith. Rather than answering my question with a question…why not try thinking it through.

If you are shocked that a Roman Catholic is questioning his faith…please don’t be…I think it’s healthy and very normal.

Would an all good, all loving, and all powerful God condemn someone to an eternity in Hell for deliberately missing Mass once and not having perfect contrition or having gone to confession prior to their death?

The Church clearly teaches one cannot go to Heaven having committed a mortal sin.

The Church clearly teaches that missing Mass is a mortal sin.

Who decided that missing Mass was a mortal sin?

Why do you present the situation as if intentionally missing mass is not a gravely serious matter? Where does the notion come from that missing mass is only a minor issue?

 

[onetimeposter]

Why do you present the situation as if intentionally missing mass is not a gravely serious matter? Where does the notion come from that missing mass is only a minor issue?

That’s what I’m wondering!

In Canada, 75% of Canadians don’t go to regular Mass.

I’m wondering who decided that it would be a mortal sin ( condemnation to hell without perfect contrition or confession) and not a venial sin.

 

[Kevin42]

I think it is rather normal to question ones Faith. Rather than answering my question with a question…why not try thinking it through.

If you are shocked that a Roman Catholic is questioning his faith…please don’t be…I think it’s healthy and very normal.

Would an all good, all loving, and all powerful God condemn someone to an eternity in Hell for deliberately missing Mass once and not having perfect contrition or having gone to confession prior to their death?

The Church clearly teaches one cannot go to Heaven having committed a mortal sin.

The Church clearly teaches that missing Mass is a mortal sin.

Who decided that missing Mass was a mortal sin?

Ok, not to be picky, but missing mass is a grave sin, not necessarily mortal. (Grave and mortal are NOT the same thing.) And yes, an all good, all loving, all powerful, all just, and perfectly holy God would allow a person who has deliberately, and knowledgeably committed a grave sin (making it now mortal) to go to hell. This person has made it plain to God that they have pride where obedience and humility should be, places worldly things before heavenly things, and willfully has cut themselves off from God without remorse. This person who has committed a mortal sin and dies without calling out for mercy will go to hell by their own doing.

 

[fix]

That’s what I’m wondering!

In Canada, 75% of Canadians don’t go to regular Mass.

I’m wondering who decided that it would be a mortal sin ( condemnation to hell without perfect contrition or confession) and not a venial sin.

I am trying to grasp why you think missing mass would be anything but a grave matter?

 

[onetimeposter]

Ok, not to be picky, but missing mass is a grave sin, not necessarily mortal. (Grave and mortal are NOT the same thing.) And yes, an all good, all loving, all powerful, all just, and perfectly holy God would allow a person who has deliberately, and knowledgeably committed a grave sin (making it now mortal) to go to hell. This person has made it plain to God that they have pride where obedience and humility should be, places worldly things before heavenly things, and willfully has cut themselves off from God without remorse. This person who has committed a mortal sin and dies without calling out for mercy will go to hell by their own doing.

I found this…and sure the person goes to hell by their own doing, but hasn’t the Church made allot of the rules?

**
The requirement to attend Mass on Sunday and other holy days of obligation, rooted
in the Third Commandment and codified in Church law (cf. Code of Canon Law, canons 1246-48) is
a serious obligation for all Catholics. A Catholic who (a) is able to attend Sunday Mass (i.e., who is
not impeded by illness, lack of transportation, etc.), (b) knows the seriousness of this requirement, and
(c) nonetheless freely chooses to miss Mass, thereby commits a mortal sin (cf. Catechism, no. 2181).**

 

[onetimeposter]

I am trying to grasp why you think missing mass would be anything but a grave matter?

…because so many people miss Mass.

You think the Church would remind everyone constantly of this…maybe tell everyone this at Easter and Christmas, so that the once a year people will be aware of their Church’s understanding.

That way people will develop the full knowledge to decide if what the Church teaches is something they can live with.

I’m a bit disappointed that someone actually questioned whether or not I wanted to be a Catholic. I give my imperfect best, and sometimes, sadly less than that. To question me personally because of something I do not know…is a knee jerk judgment.

I am not alone in questioning…it is what people do and questions should not be treated with disdain or incredulity.

I found this very helpful passage…

cuf.org/FileDownloads/missingmassmortalsin.pdf

Missing Mass on Sundays and holy days of obligations is a common occurrence throughout the
world, much like grave sins such as cohabitation before marriage, contraception, homosexual activity, and
abortion. We must affirm that the frequency of occurrence does not lessen the gravity of the offense.
Rather, this points to the development of a culture that does not recognize the sovereignty of God, and it
also amplifies the need to provide better formation for the next generation of Catholics.

 

[fix]

…because so many people miss Mass.

You think the Church would remind everyone constantly of this…maybe tell everyone this at Easter and Christmas, so that the once a year people will be aware of their Church’s understanding.

That way people will develop the full knowledge to decide if what the Church teaches is something they can live with.

I’m a bit dissapointed that someone actually questioned whether or not I wanted to be a Catholic. I give my imperfect best, and sometimes, sadly less than that. To question me personally because of something I do not know…is a knee jerk judgment.

I found this very helpful passage…

cuf.org/FileDownloads/missingmassmortalsin.pdf

Missing Mass on Sundays and holy days of obligations is a common occurrence throughout the
world, much like grave sins such as cohabitation before marriage, contraception, homosexual activity, and
abortion. We must affirm that the frequency of occurrence does not lessen the gravity of the offense.
Rather, this points to the development of a culture that does not recognize the sovereignty of God, and it
also amplifies the need to provide better formation for the next generation of Catholics.

I agree more catechsis is needed. What I am not getting is why folks think missing mass is no big deal? The same holds true for fornication or contraception or any other serious sin.

In some of your posts you were asking why a, previously, faithful man should send himself to hell for missing one mass as if it were no big deal. My question is why on earth would we think it is not a big deal?

 

[surfinpure]

I found this…and sure the person goes to hell by their own doing, but hasn’t the Church made allot of the rules?

The requirement to attend Mass on Sunday and other holy days of obligation, rooted
in the Third Commandment and codified in Church law (cf. Code of Canon Law, canons 1246-48) is
a serious obligation for all Catholics. A Catholic who (a) is able to attend Sunday Mass (i.e., who is
not impeded by illness, lack of transportation, etc.), (b) knows the seriousness of this requirement, and
(c) nonetheless freely chooses to miss Mass, thereby commits a mortal sin (cf. Catechism, no. 2181).

1. Who wrote the Third Commandment? I’ll give you a hint … it wasn’t the Church Fathers.
2. The Church has authority given by Christ to instruct in matters of faith and morals. She is infallible in her teaching. Therefore, for the Church to change an infallible teaching to something else would be nonsense, and impossible. If a teaching is 100% right (infallible), and you change it to something else, you are not only no longer 100% right, but you are saying you weren’t right in the first place, which begs the question, how do you know you’re right *now? *See how circular it becomes? Once you take away infallibility of moral teaching, then no moral teaching can stand on its own merit, and the whole moral law crumbles. (And this is one of the main reasons I became a Catholic!!!)

 

[onetimeposter]

This highlights a much larger issue at hand: If you have trouble accepting Church teaching on morals (which we hold to be infallible), then are you sure you want to be a Catholic?

I’m a bit disappointed that you actually questioned whether or not I wanted to be a Catholic. I give my imperfect best, and sometimes, sadly less than that.

To question me personally because of something I do not know…is a knee jerk judgment on your part.

I am not alone in questioning…it is what people do and questions should not be treated with disdain or incredulity.

If everyone who had trouble accepting the Church’s teachings left the Church…it would be one lonely place indeed.