Mom had tubes tied

[Cam-masta]

Please note that the question "Are you a parent" was addressed to 1KE-not you. I expressed my feelings to you in our private email exchange-an exchange i will be glad to post to this group if that is your desire.

My mistake for the 1st paragraph. The rest of the response works however. He stood up for me, and so now I am standing up for him.

 

[estesbob]

My mistake for the 1st paragraph. The rest of the response works however. He stood up for me, and so now I am standing up for him.

The fact he stod up for you does not make him (or you) right.

 

[estesbob]

My mistake for the 1st paragraph. The rest of the response works however. He stood up for me, and so now I am standing up for him.

There is nothing more to say-you came here for validation-not discussion.

 

[Cam-masta]

There is nothing more to say-you came here for validation-not discussion.

I came here to express what is on my heart, not to get into a debate. You on the other hand, very obviously came here to pick a fight like some bully in the playground. You have been meanspirited towards me without any good reason while others have been perfectly reasonable. You see, they understand the concept of CHARITABLE conversation. Everyone seems to know that this isn’t the time to provoke a debate, due to the sensitivity of the subject at hand and my reaction to it, except you.

 

[ThyKingdomCome]

Cam-masta,

I am in a similar position as you. I was my mother’s third living child (she also had an early miscarriage, which from what she’s told me, was not particular life-changing for her). However, some time after I was born (not immediately), she got her tubes tied. This was no secret, and she will tell anyone who asks here. She tells me that she did it because she had me when she was 36, and with her “advancing age” she was concerned about the higher risk of of downs syndrome and other various risks.

Since I knew about it as a child, I didn’t look at it as a bad thing - I was nicely indoctrinated by my parents (Catholic) to not respect Church Authority, and I really didn’t grow up understanding the concept of respect for life. I did, however, often have the feeling that I should have had a little brother. Who knows if I would have, if my parents had been open to life? But I was always a little disappointed that I was the last one.

When I changed my ways and became a faithful, obedient Catholic, I became alot more upset about the whole thing. Not so much that my mom would mutilate herself (she’s almost 70 & hasn’t had any complications so far), but that she knowingly deprived me of a potential sibling because she thought kids with Downs Syndrome etc… were not worth the trouble for her (I’m simplifying, I’m sure, but it comes down to that). Very selfish, and I do grieve somewhat at the loss of the sibling that never was. I also learned (in adulthood) that my parents almost decided to stop having children after their 2nd child. They felt guilty about adding to the population. But their desire for a 3rd finally won over and I was born. Imagining that my existence could have been cut out with a tubal had my parents’ environmental conscience been a little stronger is a little mind-numbing too.

It’s not just the tubal though, it’s the entire outlook on the culture of life, and the pro-choice mentality that is hard to take. As a mother myself, I find myself unable to fathom a reason to say abortion is ok. Yet my mom can come up with all sorts of reasons to say a child’s life isn’t worth living. It is hard to take. I’m sorry you are grieving. I suspect it will lessen with time. You may need to p(name removed by moderator)oint what specifically is bothering you about it - if you are angry with your mother, if you feel wronged by her (like I do about because I was denied a sibling). And then maybe you can work towards forgiving her.

God Bless,
TKC

 

[Cam-masta]

Cam-masta,

I am in a similar position as you. I was my mother’s third living child (she also had an early miscarriage, which from what she’s told me, was not particular life-changing for her). However, some time after I was born (not immediately), she got her tubes tied. This was no secret, and she will tell anyone who asks here. She tells me that she did it because she had me when she was 36, and with her “advancing age” she was concerned about the higher risk of of downs syndrome and other various risks.

Since I knew about it as a child, I didn’t look at it as a bad thing - I was nicely indoctrinated by my parents (Catholic) to not respect Church Authority, and I really didn’t grow up understanding the concept of respect for life. I did, however, often have the feeling that I should have had a little brother. Who knows if I would have, if my parents had been open to life? But I was always a little disappointed that I was the last one.

When I changed my ways and became a faithful, obedient Catholic, I became alot more upset about the whole thing. Not so much that my mom would mutilate herself (she’s almost 70 & hasn’t had any complications so far), but that she knowingly deprived me of a potential sibling because she thought kids with Downs Syndrome etc… were not worth the trouble for her (I’m simplifying, I’m sure, but it comes down to that). Very selfish, and I do grieve somewhat at the loss of the sibling that never was. I also learned (in adulthood) that my parents almost decided to stop having children after their 2nd child. They felt guilty about adding to the population. But their desire for a 3rd finally won over and I was born. Imagining that my existence could have been cut out with a tubal had my parents’ environmental conscience been a little stronger is a little mind-numbing too.

It’s not just the tubal though, it’s the entire outlook on the culture of life, and the pro-choice mentality that is hard to take. As a mother myself, I find myself unable to fathom a reason to say abortion is ok. Yet my mom can come up with all sorts of reasons to say a child’s life isn’t worth living. It is hard to take. I’m sorry you are grieving. I suspect it will lessen with time. You may need to p(name removed by moderator)oint what specifically is bothering you about it - if you are angry with your mother, if you feel wronged by her (like I do about because I was denied a sibling). And then maybe you can work towards forgiving her.

God Bless,
TKC

Thank you for sharing and I am sorry to hear of your mother. Woman today are targets for all kinds of garbage propaganda regarding the human person, including the ‘mother earth’ concept of environmentalism. As for feeling deprived of another possible sibling, I can definetly relate to that. I was thinking what it might be like to have another brother. I have one sister who will be 27 soon (she’s the greatest.) As for your existence having not happened had your folks been more ‘environmentally sensitive’ I can certainly understand how that could shake you. I often wonder why my mom had her tubes tied after I was born. Was she ‘planning’ on being pregnant with me? I don’t think I’d ever get an honest answer for that one so I will never ask. As for forgiveness, I can’t help but to love my mother and not hold anything against her. Even though I will always feel that was absolutely wrong and have negative feelings in relation to the action, I would never hold anything against her as a soul made in God’s image and as my own mother. God Bless.

 

[maryjk]

Can anyone relate to this in any way? Am I wrong to feel this way about a decision that didn’t involve me, but nonetheless hurts anyway? God Bless. Cameron

I came here to express what is on my heart, not to get into a debate. You on the other hand, very obviously came here to pick a fight like some bully in the playground.

You ask if you were wrong to feel this way. But then you claim that you came here to express what is on your heart. But I see it as you came here for validation for speaking to your Mother in what I would call an inappropriate manner.

Yes, I feel you are wrong to bring it up with her again. I also feel that it was wrong to tell others about it. Even though my mother does not tell me, “keep this a secret,” as an adult I know what things are private.

My husband and I lived together for almost two years before we got married. This is something that my son does not know. When we do tell him, it is really *not *his place to tell me that what I did was against God. I know that. I don’t need him telling me. Your mother does not need you to tell her that she did something wrong.

 

[aurora77]

Clearly it’s not a secret. She is the one who brought it up in the conversation. Unless she said, “don’t tell anyone” I don’t see where the OP is under any obligation to secrecy.

There’s a big difference between a mother/son discussion about family matters and sharing personal information with others who have no business knowing about it.

To the OP, I can see why this would trouble you, but don’t beat on your mom. There’s no reason for you to “suffer” over this, what’s done is done. She can’t change what she did. It didn’t do any harm to you, so there’s no reason to take it personally. Pray for her!

 

[OSUbride0708]

i understand how you feel a bit because my mother had her tubes tied also. both my brother and I were scary births for her, we both nearly died and she had only just turned 22 years old at the time. her catholic faith is of her own and she did not attend catholic school and was not taught catholic values by her parents, so i dont blame her and i dont think she realized what exactly she was doing at the time. for years she was very emotional about it and wanted another child but was 1. scared to have the reversal surgery and 2. scared of what might happen with a 3rd pregnancy after two close calls. i have talked to her about it and she has asked for forgiveness, even calling herself and my father selfish and we have talked about how i feel much different about the issue. i encourage you to keep talking to your mom about it without coming off as judgemental.

 

[kamz]

Hello,

Right now, I am going through a difficult time. I just found out a few weeks ago that my mom had her tubes tied after I was born. Her second child died of a rare condition days after the birth and the doctor told her that her risk of losing another child or doing harm to her own health were increased if she had any more children. She inadvertently mentioned this when I was talking about the evil of contraception. I brought it up a few days later to get some personal closure as to why she would mutilate herself. She got annoyed and said that it is none of my business, that I’ll never understand, and see everything “black and white.” Today, after morning devotions with my Catholic housemates, I asked them to pray for her, and found myself suddenly grieving. Can anyone relate to this in any way? Am I wrong to feel this way about a decision that didn’t involve me, but nonetheless hurts anyway? God Bless.

                                                               Cameron

Really, it is none of your business… you can’t understand what your mom went through until you yourself have lived it and really, how do you know that it is not a very painful situation to talk about for your mom? Instead of judging your mom, pray for her and love her even more, ask God to open your mom’s heart and leave it in his hands… this is between your mom and God and as a mom myself I know I would be very hurt if my child were passing judgement on me but I would be happy to know that my child loved me no matter what and was praying for me.

 

[kamz]

I hope the OP wasn’t thinking I was being harsh. I was just simply trying to explain what the situation looked like from a distance. And to ask her not to judge her mother, who is obviously in pain from this even after many years. She did not say in her first post that her mother was not Catholic. That does have bearing on this. Her mother made the choice operating under different rules than we operate under.

I know it’s difficult to have news like this dumped on you, and it hurts to think one’s mother made a wrong choice.

I think someday when the OP has children herself, she will come to view her mother with a little more understanding. Moms make mistakes, and most of them are not made out of viciousness or cruelty. I think the OP doesn’t yet understand how the thought of going through the illness and death of another child could cause her to do something like she did.

 

[kamz]

There is nothing more to say-you came here for validation-not discussion.

I agree with you estesbob:thumbsup:

to the original poster:
If you came to get this off your heart and ask for prayers… there is a forum for asking for prayer intentions and maybe you should have posted this at that forum.

When you start a thread all you do is start it… these boards are for discussion and it will not always be what you want to hear… your going to get different sides and opinions and if you don’t like that maybe you shouldn’t post.

View any forum and you’ll see everyone has a different view and that is what its all about… discussing… sometimes you’ll like what is said and sometimes you won’t.

 

[mesquite_magic]

I think it would be helpful to you, to just forgive your mom. She can’t change what happened. She’s not Catholic, so she doesn’t carry Catholic guilt. She did what the doctors told her would be best. Back then, not too many people argued with their doctors. She probably does carry a lot of guilt for the baby she lost, especially if the baby died because of a genitic problem. Mom guilt does some pretty ugly things to mothers.

Put it this way, if you were a carrier for Sickle Cell Anemia, and you fell in love with a woman who is also a carrier, the chances are huge that your child will be born with Sickle Cell Anemia. You have a few choices, don’t marry this woman, marry and don’t have children, or have children and risk them suffering from this painful condition. Now imagine that you didn’t know the two of you had these traits until you lost a child to the disorder. That makes the choices even harder. Twenty, thirty years ago your mom didn’t have the knowledge to make any choice but the one she did.

Forgive your mom. Move on. Life is too short to go on hurting about something you and she can’t change now.

Kim

 

[Nicole]

Just wanted to say I’m sorry for what you are going through. I can see, since you weren’t expecting it, that this could be upsetting and difficult to deal with on the spot, right in front of your Mom.

I’m sure that in an ideal world, you’d want time to think about the whole thing, perhaps find a way to express both your sorrow and your love for your Mom, etc. But it was impossible to do that on the spur of the moment.

My dh got a vasectomy after our third was born. We had no health issues personally, but had lost one child and felt it was responsible. Everyone agreed, no one said maybe we should wait. But, it was on our shoulders and eventually, thankfully, he got a reversal - which is not required - and we are pregnant.

Anyway, I pray that God would comfort you in this time and comfort your Mother and allow your relationship with her to heal. Yes, maybe God will help you express compassion for her, but maybe He will also show her how this did deeply affect you.

 

[beckers]

Hello,

Right now, I am going through a difficult time. I just found out a few weeks ago that my mom had her tubes tied after I was born. Her second child died of a rare condition days after the birth and the doctor told her that her risk of losing another child or doing harm to her own health were increased if she had any more children. She inadvertently mentioned this when I was talking about the evil of contraception. I brought it up a few days later to get some personal closure as to why she would mutilate herself. She got annoyed and said that it is none of my buisness, that I’ll never understand, and see everything “black and white.” Today, after morning devotions with my Catholic housemates, I asked them to pray for her, and found myself suddenly grieving. Can anyone relate to this in any way? Am I wrong to feel this way about a decision that didn’t involve me, but nonetheless hurts anyway? God Bless.

Cameron

There are a few things i can’t get over:

1.) You sound more angry with your mother over the fact of what she did to you then with what actaully happen. You are grieving over something that you didn’t even know about nor could you have effected the outcome. Can you imagine the grieving your mother has been going through for the last 20 something years? Your pain is nothing compared to hers. You should be there for her instead of judging her or being angry that she did something wrong.

2.) Did she know all of the ramfications of her decision when it happened? Sounds like she didn’t. Do some research on other threads and you will find that this area is not as black and white as you are making it seem.

3.) i can’t believe you told your housemates about your mom’s tubal ligation. There are things that should stay between family members only unless your mom is the one to tell them. Otherwise you fall into the trap of Christian Gossip like “Hey can you please pray for Mary because she is going through a divorce since her husband is having an affair”. You should have just stop at “Could you please pray for my mom” or “please pray for me as a deal with a family situation”. Think how you would feel if one of your sins or mistakes that still hurts is being spread around.

You have to remember that your mom is a person and has and will make mistakes just like you do. You have to forgive and let God heal all your wounds!

May the peace of Christ be with you and your family
Beckers

 

[kamz]

There are a few things i can’t get over:

1.) You sound more angry with your mother over the fact of what she did to you then with what actaully happen. You are grieving over something that you didn’t even know about nor could you have effected the outcome. Can you imagine the grieving your mother has been going through for the last 20 something years? Your pain is nothing compared to hers. You should be there for her instead of judging her or being angry that she did something wrong.

2.) Did she know all of the ramfications of her decision when it happened? Sounds like she didn’t. Do some research on other threads and you will find that this area is not as black and white as you are making it seem.

3.) i can’t believe you told your housemates about your mom’s tubal ligation. There are things that should stay between family members only unless your mom is the one to tell them. Otherwise you fall into the trap of Christian Gossip like “Hey can you please pray for Mary because she is going through a divorce since her husband is having an affair”. You should have just stop at “Could you please pray for my mom” or “please pray for me as a deal with a family situation”. Think how you would feel if one of your sins or mistakes that still hurts is being spread around.

You have to remember that your mom is a person and has and will make mistakes just like you do. You have to forgive and let God heal all your wounds!

May the peace of Christ be with you and your family
Beckers

Excellent post:thumbsup:

 

[Brenda_V]

There are a few things i can’t get over:

1.) You sound more angry with your mother over the fact of what she did to you then with what actaully happen. You are grieving over something that you didn’t even know about nor could you have effected the outcome. Can you imagine the grieving your mother has been going through for the last 20 something years? Your pain is nothing compared to hers. You should be there for her instead of judging her or being angry that she did something wrong.

2.) Did she know all of the ramfications of her decision when it happened? Sounds like she didn’t. Do some research on other threads and you will find that this area is not as black and white as you are making it seem.

3.) i can’t believe you told your housemates about your mom’s tubal ligation. There are things that should stay between family members only unless your mom is the one to tell them. Otherwise you fall into the trap of Christian Gossip like “Hey can you please pray for Mary because she is going through a divorce since her husband is having an affair”. You should have just stop at “Could you please pray for my mom” or “please pray for me as a deal with a family situation”. Think how you would feel if one of your sins or mistakes that still hurts is being spread around.

You have to remember that your mom is a person and has and will make mistakes just like you do. You have to forgive and let God heal all your wounds!

May the peace of Christ be with you and your family
Beckers

Well put Beckers!

Brenda V.

 

[mamacita]

1. My mom is an Anglican not Catholic.
2. I find both your comments to be honest, but at the same time lacking a charitable tone for something I am personally grieving (except the last comment)
3. I am disappointed that I would come to this forum and then be rebuked.

Should one have to silently suffer? I was not maliciously condemning her, but speaking my heart…that I am concerned for her well being and somewhat personally devastated that she had this procedure done after I came into existance. I told my housemates that she is a good woman, who does many good things for other people. Try to understand, I am not judging her as a soul made in God’s image, but judging an action which harmed herself, harmed me; a ‘medical’ action (so-called) which continues to devastate the very fabric of life which is the family. I am disappointed, and had it been you and not me, I would have chosen my words a little more carefully.

If I were you I would just let her know that you are upset because you could have had more siblings…obviously she is still upset over the loss of her child, which is completely understandable. But in a kind, loving letter or email just express that you aren’t angry (that would be a sin) but just hurt that future siblings of yours were prevented from entering this world…
By the way, You are not wrong for asking your Catholic housemates to pray for her. That is great of you!!! She probably needs the prayers especially if she is still struggling w/ the loss from years ago. Also, maybe when she had it done she was afraid adn thought that she “had” to listen to the docs. That’s a common problem with the medical world today. Unfortunately.

 

[Smber2c]

My husband and I lived together for almost two years before we got married. This is something that my son does not know. When we do tell him, it is really not his place to tell me that what I did was against God. I know that. I don’t need him telling me. Your mother does not need you to tell her that she did something wrong.

I would have to strongly disagree on this. I know there are many parents here and I’ll may just be ignored as another who “just doesn’t get it yet”, but truth is truth.

You are right, your son shouldn’t tell you living with your husband for 2 years was wrong because it sounds like you already understand that it is. But if you were oblivious to the actions moral character, like the OP’s mom was, then yeah a child knowing the truth should voice the truth in as meek a manner possilbe.

A child shouldn’t ever lecture their parents. At least as far a lecture has come to mean talk down, but a child has every right and as a Christian an obligation to share the truth with those in thier vicinity.

I’ve a similar situation with my parents, they told me about it and said it was wrong, so I don’t comment. Ocassionaly my dad will tell me about college days, getting drunk and driving around town. He glorifies it. So, my usual response is to say that sounds like a very foolish and dangerous thing to do. I’m his son, so what, it was wrong and he should realize that.

I don’t insult him. I don’t try to reverse the relationship and say I’m not the authority. But I am honest. How could it be right for me to be less than honest?

 

[estesbob]

There are a few things i can’t get over:

1.) You sound more angry with your mother over the fact of what she did to you then with what actaully happen. You are grieving over something that you didn’t even know about nor could you have effected the outcome. Can you imagine the grieving your mother has been going through for the last 20 something years? Your pain is nothing compared to hers. You should be there for her instead of judging her or being angry that she did something wrong.

2.) Did she know all of the ramfications of her decision when it happened? Sounds like she didn’t. Do some research on other threads and you will find that this area is not as black and white as you are making it seem.

3.) i can’t believe you told your housemates about your mom’s tubal ligation. There are things that should stay between family members only unless your mom is the one to tell them. Otherwise you fall into the trap of Christian Gossip like “Hey can you please pray for Mary because she is going through a divorce since her husband is having an affair”. You should have just stop at “Could you please pray for my mom” or “please pray for me as a deal with a family situation”. Think how you would feel if one of your sins or mistakes that still hurts is being spread around.

You have to remember that your mom is a person and has and will make mistakes just like you do. You have to forgive and let God heal all your wounds!

May the peace of Christ be with you and your family
Beckers

Exactly. I have noticed with some suprise comments in this thread that their Mother “denied them a sibling” Kind of makes it seem that a lot of this is about “me” rather than “her”