Moral Conundrum: Gay Adoption

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I guess I am just too much of a pragmatist to believe that her life with these two men will be worse than her life in poverty, chaos, neglect, and God knows what else. Love, as someone said, is never evil, and while this may not be the ideal situation…it is better than her alternatives were.
 
Tic_Toc said:
How exactly are two gay people going to hurt a kid? I mean, it’s not like they’re going to rape her. I guess that’s a possibility, but we’ve been told these parents love her very much.

Granted, since this girl is being raised by two men, perspective on homosexuality may be changed, and even to some extent, on gender roles (maybe). But outside influences affect us just as much as our parents do, and it’s up to us to shape who we are once we get to a certain age.

I don’t think these people would hurt her; at least not in the way you all seem to think. I mean, where’s some evidence, and not just “I know of this one girl” sort of thing.
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I heard some evidence of “damage” on Catholic Answers Live and I’ll do my best to explain what I heard:

There have been some preliminary studies done about how well children do in these situations. The studies claim that they do as well as children in straight homes.

However, if you read the fine print of these studies, the control group was single parent homes. Other studies state that the optimal situation for children is having 2 parents in the home.

So, by extension, one would speculate that the best setting for children is 2 parents of different gender, not one parent or two parents of the same gender
 
Obviously the best setting for children is being raised by their biological parents, so long as we aren’t talking about a situation of extreme abuse or something horrible like that.

However…millions of children don’t have that ideal situation. One parent. Grandparents. Foster parents. Extended family. Orphanages. Gay parent. Gay parents.

For this one little girl, her life situation–the one she was born into–was horrible. She was taken in by two people who will love and cherish her. She is going to be better off in every way that I can think of. The church teaches that this situation is a grave moral evil…but it seems to me that leaving her to rot in her circumstances would be a much greater evil. I would be hard to convince me that letting this girl live in utter deprivation and neglect is somehow better than letting two gay men raise her because she may end up with skewed morals.

And to be clear: this is an extreme case; it just happens to be one that I am familiar with.
 
Michaeljc4 said:
Obviously the best setting for children is being raised by their biological parents, so long as we aren’t talking about a situation of extreme abuse or something horrible like that.

However…millions of children don’t have that ideal situation. One parent. Grandparents. Foster parents. Extended family. Orphanages. Gay parent. Gay parents.

For this one little girl, her life situation–the one she was born into–was horrible. She was taken in by two people who will love and cherish her. She is going to be better off in every way that I can think of. The church teaches that this situation is a grave moral evil…but it seems to me that leaving her to rot in her circumstances would be a much greater evil. I would be hard to convince me that letting this girl live in utter deprivation and neglect is somehow better than letting two gay men raise her because she may end up with skewed morals.

And to be clear: this is an extreme case; it just happens to be one that I am familiar with.
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I reject the false choice, always presented, that it is either adoption by “gay” persons or some serious physical evil.

Additionally, why would poverty be worse than a grave moral evil?
 
I reject the false choice, always presented, that it is either adoption by “gay” persons or some serious physical evil.
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I’m sorry to hear that, but in this instance, that’s what it was.
Additionally, why would poverty be worse than a grave moral evil?
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Poverty kills the mind, the soul, and the body. This little girl’s new parents will do none of those things.

I don’t think homosexuality is a grave moral evil, but I realize I am in the minority in this regard on Catholic Answer Forums (and in the Church).

I have appreciated everyone’s taking the time to help me think about this. Perhaps we can all agree to pray for this little girl, and for my two friends. Parenting is hard, hard work. Parenting when you are the gay adopters of a little African-American girl will be harder still.

God bless you all.
 
Michaeljc4 said:
I’m sorry to hear that, but in this instance, that’s what it was.

Poverty kills the mind, the soul, and the body. This little girl’s new parents will do none of those things.

I don’t think homosexuality is a grave moral evil, but I realize I am in the minority in this regard on Catholic Answer Forums (and in the Church).

I have appreciated everyone’s taking the time to help me think about this. Perhaps we can all agree to pray for this little girl, and for my two friends. Parenting is hard, hard work. Parenting when you are the gay adopters of a little African-American girl will be harder still.

God bless you all.
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You could say homosexuality or any other grave matter could kill the mind, body and soul. 😉
 
I agree. Living in sin of any kind provides a spiriual poverty that cannot be measured.

I also believe that these 2 men are sincere in their attempt to parent this child. It seems to me that the answer is not to remove the parent or the child, it is to remove the sin.

Isn’t that always the case???
 
fix said:
It does?
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I agree with FIX’s “it does?”, for if I believed Michaeljc4 I then must be dead and don’t know it. My family lived with poverty (at times we were homeless) when I was a child. My siblings and I might not be rich, but, we are alive, faithful to our religions (not all of us are Catholic working on their return), and we all were able to study hard and have gone on to further education.
 
As a former foster parent… I have a few things to say.

  1. *]not all foster parents are bad… in fact there are some awesome ones out there.
    *]from personal experience, a kid that grows up with same sex parents will have some issues… it really depends on the kids personality and how well the parents can address this.
    *]Poverty is such a relative term. My own kids have grown up in material poverty but we are a very close loving family with good morals and work ethics… so I would say poverty in this respect can be a motivator.
    *]I do have experience with crack babies and FAS babies… from birth to about 15 yrs old… they have plenty of their own issues to deal with, adding to them would make matters worse.
    I have a friend who is a gay mom, living with her lover and her natural daughter. She sent her dd to Catholic Schools and did everything right as far as parenting is concerned… with the exception of setting the right example of family life. The girl seemed to be very well balanced and adjusted… in grade school she had lots of friends, was a good student and a star athlete. In HS it started out the same, but when she started dating, she did have issues. So far she has gotten a reputation for sleeping around and I suspect it is her way of “proving” her hetro-sexuality. She has gotten into a bunch of really bad situations… sneaking her boyfriend into the house at night for sex… he left just before dawn and ended up getting into a very bad accident because he was on a 4 wheeler and almost decapitated himself on a barbed wire fence. She has also had quite a few alcohol related incidents and again, promiscuity played a part in her actions… I love this little girl like my own and it pains me to see her making these choices. My oldest son called her mom and told her that he wanted to speak with her… so mom dropped her off at ds1’s house and he proceeded to tell her to straighten up and he said she cried and cried about it but only temporarily changed her ways. Now ds1 takes a big interest in who she is dating and what she is up to like a big brother… and she has stayed out of trouble for almost a year now. What she really needs is to see what healthy relationships between men and women are like imho.
 
This particular little girl was born into circumstances that–more likely than not–would have made her life incredibly difficult. If any of you are black, were born with cocaine and alcohol in your blood, born to a single mother who had already lost custody of her other children for neglect (then abandoned you in the hospital), and lived in an urban slum, please sound off. I’m dying to hear your story about how good morals pulled you through.

Once again: this particular instance, it seems to me, is a better set of circumstances for this particular child regardless of what the church says about the moral dangers of gay adoption. An ideal situation? Perhaps not. Better than the alternative? I’d have to say yes.
 
Michaeljc4 said:
This particular little girl was born into circumstances that–more likely than not–would have made her life incredibly difficult. If any of you are black, were born with cocaine and alcohol in your blood, born to a single mother who had already lost custody of her other children for neglect (then abandoned you in the hospital), and lived in an urban slum, please sound off. I’m dying to hear your story about how good morals pulled you through.
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So, you claim the only alternative is gay adoption?
Once again: this particular instance, it seems to me, is a better set of circumstances for this particular child regardless of what the church says about the moral dangers of gay adoption. An ideal situation? Perhaps not. Better than the alternative? I’d have to say yes.
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Which other types of relationships do you consider valid for raising children who may be in poverty? Do you consider material support to trump any type of living arrangements?
 
Michaeljc4 said:
Once again: this particular instance, it seems to me, is a better set of circumstances for this particular child regardless of what the church says about the moral dangers of gay adoption. An ideal situation? Perhaps not. Better than the alternative? I’d have to say yes.
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Do you truly believe that the condition of someone’s physical body is more important than the condition of their soul?
 
**All children have the NATURAL RIGHT to a family of mother (female) and father (male). **
 
So, you claim the only alternative is gay adoption?
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In this case, so far as I know, yes it was.
Which other types of relationships do you consider valid for raising children who may be in poverty? Do you consider material support to trump any type of living arrangements?
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I think that relationships where there is love for children, and commitment to their well being, are very important regardless of the sexual orientation of their adult care givers. It’s the relationship between child and parent, not between the adults, that seems to me to be the more important factor. Two gay men who are dedicated to the well being of their adopted daughter seems to me to be a better situation than the drug-addled biological mom who couldn’t take care of any of her children, and expressed no interest in doing so to begin with.

Again (and finally), this was an extreme case.
 
peary said:
**All children have the NATURAL RIGHT to a family of mother (female) and father (male). **
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So you naturally support the taking of children from a widow or widower.

Be careful how you state things.
 
Michaeljc4 said:
In this case, so far as I know, yes it was.

I think that relationships where there is love for children, and commitment to their well being, are very important regardless of the sexual orientation of their adult care givers. It’s the relationship between child and parent, not between the adults, that seems to me to be the more important factor. Two gay men who are dedicated to the well being of their adopted daughter seems to me to be a better situation than the drug-addled biological mom who couldn’t take care of any of her children, and expressed no interest in doing so to begin with.

Again (and finally), this was an extreme case.
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How does one care for the well being of a child by subjecting them to a situation where they are intentionally exposed to two same sex persons posing as a husband and wife. Not only is in confusing, but children have rights. They have the right not to be intentionally exposed to such strange experiments.
 
Fix, we’ll have to agree to disagree. I’ll leave it at that. I’ve already grown tired of the argument that ***I ***started. 😃
 
I posted this in another forum…in the Meeting I attend, there is a couple, who happen to be gay men, that have adopted a young girl with severe physical handicaps. She is also developmentally challenged…she is confined to a wheelchair and I believe she is about 6 years old.

These two men adopted her four years ago…the child was abandoned by her birth mother, who was also a drug addict, soon after birth.

This child was not likely to be adopted by a man and a woman. This child was a “cast off” from heterosexual society. These two men have been devoted parents. Both are professionals and have an income that I wouldn’t mind having…my life sure would be easier financially by far.

She has had the best medical care, love and attention from these two men that any child could ever hope for.

Perhaps a “mother” and a “father” would be the best thing…but this child was discarded by her “mother” and “father”…this child had little hope to be adopted by a “mother” and “father” as most peple want cute little babies or healthy toddlers…she is neither…God in His Mercy and Love answered the prayers of these two men and gave them a gift of this child into their care…and they do a fantastic job…

Those gay people, men and women, I know who have adopted, have adopted the “cast asides” of straight society…it might be their “natural right” for a “mother” and “father”, but while denied “natural right”…they were blessed by two dads or two moms…facing a life of institutional life or a childhood of abuse at their “natural parents” drug and alchohol dazed lives…I think they’d choose the “un-natural” family filled with love, support and safety…but of course that’s simply my humble opinion…life isn’t always so “black and white” in it’s offerings.
 
Once again: That’s irrelevant compared to a person’s soul. To intentionally place someone in a situation where their role models have a romantic relationship with sin does more damage to a person’s soul than could ever be done to their bodies.
 
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